Rockstar Matt

25 minutes ago, MJWalker45 said:

This sounds to me, that Gio is trying to to take the words said in regards to the Wales game and applying it to the entire tournament.  Regardless, that doesn't excuse slacking off in practice. 

What? The timeline in which Gio was acting disinterested was during the week before the Wales game. The reports specifically cite the friendly against the local Qatari club as one of the examples where Gio was slacking off before he was confronted about it. He apologized and was forgiven all before the Wales game. 

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And I don't believe any coach would automatically decide that he's not going to play someone that much going into a tournament, let alone tell that player this as well. 

I don't understand this statement. You don't have to believe it, we all saw it happen. There's no other reasonable explanation as to why Gio only played 50 minutes through 4 games. He's our best player and he's healthy. Gregg has done a lot of things that we wouldn't believe a coach would do. Hell, I wouldn't believe a coach who is actively trying to pursue club coaching opportunities in Europe would leak this to the media (or be so naive that he thought a reporter wouldn't report a story like this), but here we are. 

I don't understand this blind support for Berhalter, it's like he's immune to any and all criticism. 

19 hours ago, Digby said:

 

 

Athletic's got the gossip that Gio Reyna was being a petulant child at World Cup camp. Explains some things, though the more radical factions of the anti-Berhalter crowd are going to have some reckoning to do. https://theathletic.com/3991695/2022/12/11/gio-reyna-usmnt-gregg-berhalter/

Gio responded this morning.

Basically stating that Berhalter told him prior to the World Cup his involvement would be limited in the tournament (which is absolutely a ridiculous statement to make to arguably your best player), acknowledged he let his emotions get the better of him for a few days, apologized for it. He explains he's an emotional and passionate player, and was told he was forgiven for his few days of acting disinterested. States that some of the events that have been leaked are "highly fictionalized", in other words false. He was told by Gregg that in-house issues stay within the team, yet was surprised to see Gregg leak this to the media. People should read Gio's full statement. Comes off very professional and mature, taking accountability for his actions and behavior. 

We laud Gio for his passion and emotion, it's part of what makes him such a good player. He has that "eff you" mentality that we've sorely missed since Dempsey retired (who, mind you, once tore his hand open because he punched through a glass window when he found out he wouldn't be started in a Champions League semi-final match for Fulham). It's the managers job to do more than just X's and O's for a team, but also manage the ego's of those players. I'm failing to understand how can a manager go and leak what was suppose to be private to the media, especially when it's about a 20 year old kid. It also means Gregg was lying from the start. He stated that Gio was hurt, which is why he wasn't playing, but now we're finding out it's because Berhalter determined prior to the Word Cup that Gio wasn't going to play much if at all (which is a fireable offense, IMO). 

So who was acting like the petulant child here and who was acting like the adult? 

I don't know how Berhalter can remain as the USMNT manager after this. What player would trust him after he not only leaks private team matter to the media, but essentially throws one of his best players under the bus for reasons unknown.

34 minutes ago, WJMorris3 said:

Erm, the Vikings (today's loss notwithstanding)?

I do not buy into the Vikings at all. I doubt they win a playoff game, and if they do, they'd likely face San Francisco or Dallas in the next round where they'd be underdogs (even if they're hosting that divisional game). They're 10-3 with a negative point differential and a point differential that you'd see from a middling .500 team. I don't think anyone takes them serious as a contender especially now after they've played the two best teams in the conference and were out scored by a combined 64-10.

3 minutes ago, Cujo said:

Ah, the YoungGunz generation. Well just take my word for it, they've done this before.

 

And weren't SF and Dallas and among the NFC faves just last year?

They were kinda, but not like this year. Last year had 6 teams all with legitimate contender status (Packers, Bucs, Cowboys, Rams, Cardinals and to a lesser extant the 49ers (I do distinctly remember them being undervalued all year). This year it's clearly just the Eagles, Cowboys and Niners who are the contenders.

Maybe I should have worded my original statement differently saying I've never known a NFL with Dallas and San Francisco as favorites until these past two seasons. 

1 minute ago, Cujo said:

 

Remember how the 80s-90s Niners could just plug in any backup or third string QBs (Young, Bono, Grbac) and still not miss a beat? That's this squad.

No sir, I do not remember those teams. Hell, I wasn't even alive for some of those teams. I was too young. Earliest memory I have of the Niners is the last years of the Steve Young and Garrison Hearst teams. I was born in the early 90's so my first NFL season I can truly remember in earnest was the '97 season (though I have vague memories of Super Bowl 31).

I have never known a NFL with the Cowboys and 49ers both being among the NFC favorites.

I'm thoroughly confused on what is a catch and what isn't a catch in the NFL. It seems to change from game to game, hell even play by play at some points.

49ers are looking really dangerous. They look really good.

The Cowboys are lucky to escape with that win today. They were awful today. A better team than the Texans beats them. Credit to Dallas, I guess, for pulling out that win, but it was ugly. 

EDIT: But that win clinched the Cowboys' first back-back 10+ win seasons in 26 years. I'll take it.

13 hours ago, Germanshepherd said:

Qatar deserves none of the benefit of the doubt here, but Grant Wahl did post about not feeling well/health declining over the past week and press members saw him collapse. 
 

I’ve never planned an assassination before, but unless he was poisoned or there was somehow a bioweapon involved I don’t see when/how they could have killed him. 

I feel like this is the correct take.

While the timing is certainly suspicious, I think the speculation/insinuation that Qatar made a hit on Grant is dangerous. Wahl had been sick (hearing it was bronchitis) and recently recovered from Covid only a few months ago. It's not impossible that this current illness, combined with the long term adverse effects of covid could result in his passing.

It's also important to note here, that despite Qatar having abhorrent policies (and like you said they deserve none of the benefit of doubt) they are a massive ally of the United States. It doesn't make sense they'd risk ruining their diplomatic relationship with the US by assassinating a prominent member of US soccer media. Certainly, someone not associated with the Qatari government could have taken issue with Grant and done something about it, but that's just speculation with zero evidence. 

1 hour ago, LA Fakers+ LA Snippers said:

You hit the nail on the head. With a healthy Dak, the only team that can beat this team is themselves. The problem, however, is that Mike McCarthy is one of the worst desicion-makers in the NFL, and he doesn't even call plays. His clock management is among the worst in the league (see 2021 NFC WC vs SF) , he loves to go for it on 4th even well within FG range (see 2022 WK 10 @ GB), and I haven't seen him do anything that contributes to winning. 

I think this is an unfair statement. McCarthy's in-game management has always been suspect and those are valid criticisms, but I'm not sure how anyone can say he doesn't do anything that contributes to winning. He's 21-8 over the last two years, went 5-1 with a backup QB over that time span too. The Cowboys have shown a level of consistency that quite simply they haven't been able to do in 26-27 years. Dallas is about to have it's first consecutive double digit win seasons since the Clinton administration.

The team clearly buys into him as a coach and they're locked in. McCarthy has to get some credit for that. As 'red correctly pointed out, McCarthy is great in the regular season but it's the playoffs where the deficiencies and in-game mismanagement become more apparent. But he still deserves credit for winning consistently in the regular season with Dallas when they haven't been able to do that since the 72-win Chicago Bulls.

42 minutes ago, infrared41 said:

 

RE: Dallas - The Cowboys have looked great, but keep in mind that they are coached by Mike McCarthy. Packers fans are all too familiar with his bit; great regular season followed by complete flame out in the playoffs. Postseason Mike McCarthy is basically  discount Marty Shottenheimer. That said, the Cowboys are fun to watch and that defense just might be good enough to overcome the shortcomings of their head coach.

If you took this Cowboys team and put them in completely different uniforms/colors I think a lot of people (including myself) would have more belief in them. They have the best point differential in the league, the league's #3 offense (it's been the best offense since Dak returned scoring 35+ ppg, and that isn't including the defensive TD's; also to note the Cowboys had the league's 27th ranked offense when Dak came back), #2 defense (best in sacks, pressure rate, #2 in takeaways), best strength of victory of any playoff team in either conference and the most wins/best record versus current playoff teams.

But, because they are, unfortunately, the Cowboys we're all waiting for the yearly flame out in the playoffs. Despite all of those stats I just stated, I still don't fully trust this team to live up to their potential.

2 hours ago, GFB said:

@Rockstar Matt 

I think you’re spot on with most of your takeaways. You’re right in that the US made three really basic mistakes that would get any high school team reamed-out by their coach. Although, I don’t think those mistakes were necessarily due to being out of position in transition…. because they were in physical position to make the play and cut out the danger for each Netherlands goal, but it felt like the physical fatigue of the squad led to mental fatigue in those moments and the Dutch were ruthless and efficient in capitalizing on those lapses. 

I agree with this. I think the lack of quality depth really hindered the US in this game. I saw a stat that said the US players as a whole ran 38 km more than any other team. A testament to their work-rate but also the fact the US was forced to essentially use the same XI every game.

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However, I disagree with your assessment that the US was out-managed or need to change their system.  

 

And if you’re going to break down a team sitting in a defensive block, you have two ways to break them down: you can either go right at them with speed and skill by stringing together 2-3 consecutive moments of brilliance that unlocks the defense, or you can try to go around the block entirely by sending in crosses or taking shots from distance.  

See this is where I disagree. I'm not sure how you can disagree with my opinion that the US need's to change their system. I've said this way too many times on these boards, but the system doesn't suit our players. As you correctly stated, to break down a defensive block you need either speed and skill (which I'll interpret as technical ability) by connecting a couple key passes/individual brilliance or sending in crosses into box/long distance shots. We actually have the players who are able to run directly at the opponent, string together a few key line breaking passes/create moments of brilliance and create good scoring chances. Pulisic is at his best when doing that, we've seen him score and assist goals while doing this for Chelsea and Reyna, when healthy, has world-class potential as a central attacking midfielder. He has that elite line-breaking passing ability and ability to glide past defenders that this team desperately needed this tournament. 

But instead, we prefer to play wide and send in crosses to strikers who are not good at finishing those crosses (or even getting on the end of them aside from Sargent). What's even more baffling to me is that if that's the style Berhalter insisted on playing against quality teams in a defensive block, Pefok (who is no elite/world class player by any stretch of the imagination) is easily the best striker in the pool at finishing crosses sent into dangerous spots. McKinnie is also outstanding at arriving late to the box and scoring goals from crosses/late passes (which is exactly what Depay did against us). It's something that we have seen consistently from him at Juventus, yet in Berhalter's system, McKinnie is almost always out wide playing off the fullbacks or back tracking defensively in this system. This is just a few of the many examples we have of Berhalter playing our best players out of position.

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Putting myself in his shoes as manager, I’m not sure what Gregg could have done differently in how he set up the team for this game.  It’s clear that Reyna was struggling with form and/or fitness and wasn’t available to play a full 90, Sargent’s injury left the striker options ghastly thin (I’d have traded my kingdom for a healthy Brandon Vasquez), and you noted that the world-class talent of this team is only 7-8 players deep. While, like you, I have my quibbles with the back-end of the roster or the subs that GGG leaned on, I don’t believe that Pefok or Pepe or Scally or whichever “I would have taken this player over Christian Roldan” makes much of a difference against elite players like Virgil van Dijk, Memphis, Frenkie de Jong, etc…

I'm also in agreement that when it comes to personnel, the Dutch outclasses the US at basically every position, and even then I think only Pulisic and Reyna would see playing time as bench players for this Netherlands squad. Still though, I think the set-up was poor. The Americans were naive in thinking they were good enough to play "their" style and that would be good enough to win. It didn't help that I thought every one of our star players (aside from Reyna) arguably played their worst game of the tournament. But the US was set-up to fail. LVG even stated that the US never adjusted to what they were trying to do. 

The back end of the roster, with the right players, could have helped the US not gas out against the Netherlands by giving our stars proper time to rest. What's the point of bringing players (aside from keepers) who never got even close to seeing a second of playing time? Why bring Ferreria, who was so atrocious that he was subbed off in 45 minutes, instead of bringing a Pefok or Pepi? Why bring Roldan, Long and Morris instead of Tillman, Milhailovic and Brooks? 

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While I am disappointed with the result, I think the backlash against Berhalter is far too harsh and critical for a team that pretty much reached the heights they deserved. They got out of a decently tough group with 5 points, didn’t concede from open play, and the players were in position to make the necessary offensive/defensive plays to advance in the knockouts… it’s hard to ask for much more at this stage. And that’s not taking into account the successes in Concacaf/Gold Cup/Nations League and the struggles of other Concacaf teams in Qatar.  

 

Although I’m personally not in favor of Berhalter returning (eight years under one voice is too long, fresh perspectives and new ideas are needed), I think Gregg did a great job in all the important big-picture areas: re-establishing a healthy culture, acquiring and developing young talent, and winning games/trophies and he deserves a lot more credit/respect than the scorn a lot of US fans are giving him.

I'm sorry, but Berhalter did the bare minimum. 

The US was expected to get out of the group and that's something we should always expect our team to do. We've done the last 3 times we've made the WC, and 4 out of the last 6 dating back to '94. If we're going to celebrate his bare minimum accomplishments as some great achievement then the USMNT will always be stuck in mediocrity. The US was expected to qualify for the WC yet they backed into qualifying by goal difference, even though we have the most talented pool/team in the confederation.

Yes we beat Mexico in the Nations League and Gold Cup (who honestly cares about the GC), but this Mexico squad this cycle has proven to be their worst team in the modern era. Considering the talent level difference, we should be beating Mexico consistently (doesn't help Mexico that Tata is an even worse coach than GGG). He gets the scorn because it's apparent that these group of US players are the most talented in our history, yet he cannot get the most out of them or get them to play to up to their potential and beyond. Jurgen Klinsmen (a bad coach) got more out of worse 2014 US team, in a far, far tougher group than Greg did with a far more gifted roster. The US literally just suffered their worst knockout round loss in the modern era despite having it's most talented team.

His lasting legacy, and best accomplishments IMO, was his ability to recruit the excellent dual-nats that this US team counts among their core. I give him a ton of credit and props for that, which he deserves.

It might be harsh, or seem overly critical, but what do we want of our NT? To be stuck for the next 40 years as one of the 10-16 best national team's in the world like Mexico was? Or to actually become a world-power in football and one that's consistently going deep in international tournaments? 

I’m ready to be hurt again. I’m declaring that these Cowboys are officially good.
 

Are the Colts good? No, but the Cowboys have played really… meh tonight, made some dumb mistakes, d***ed around a bit and still blew the ever living crap out of the Colts. Don’t normally see this at the NFL level. Certainly not from Dallas. Not in my lifetime as a fan.

Will this translate into postseason success? It’s the Cowboys so probably not. But considering how the Cowboys season began with that awful loss to Tampa and seemed to be heading into a lost season without Dak, this team has certainly turned that around. 
 

Also, and this is hard to believe, but the Cowboys are now one win away from their first back-to-back seasons with 10+ wins since the 1995-1996 seasons. An impressive stretch of mediocrity IMO.

Really wish the Cowboys wouldn’t wear the French Tri-Color stripe again, but it’s pretty minor. Just wish they kept it for the bicentennial back in ‘76 and left it there. 

More thoughts now that I've had time to digest the game:

I think what disappoints me the most is that the US gave up 3 goals on basic, basic football 101 stuff. It wasn't moments of individual brilliance or even team brilliance on the Netherlands part, but simple, simple level stuff you learn as a child. The 2 first goals were essentially the same goal, with Adams not making the recovering defensive run that we've seen him make hundreds of times and Dest ball watching and letting Blind cross his face unchallenged. The final nail in the coffin was a defensive miscue and allowing Dumfries to be unmarked in the 6-yard box. Simple stuff that really came down to the US not getting back in transition.

I felt like some of those mistakes were simply fatigue on the USMNT's part. The players looked gassed and just simply didn't have it, but also it was Berhalter being decisively outcoached by LVG. The Dutch were quite content to let the US have the ball and try to get good opportunities in the final 3rd, while clogging up the mid-field neutralizing our talented mid-field and full well knowing the US doesn't have the personnel nor quality to be effective at that. The game stats are misleading, IMO.

Because of our system, the Dutch knew we'd be playing wide with overlapping full-backs, and sometimes those full-backs would push with the ball into the interior which forces our two 8's (McKennie and Musah) out wide to vacate that space and forces our FB's to be a playmaker. Dest can do that, but Robinson can't. The problem with this, and we should have adjusted after Depay's goal, is that if our fullbacks, while dribbling the ball into the midfield, turns the ball over all of the sudden our stout defensive midfield is out of position, and lets the Dutch carry a number advantage in the counter. The Netherlands scored all 3 goals doing this. Taking advantage of a US mistake, their fatigue and combined with being out of position due to our attacking tactics. 

It's clear to me that the US needs to completely change their attacking system. We need someone like Reyna playing as the 10 creating opportunities centrally. As good as the MMA midfield is in defense, they lack the clinical technical ability that's needed to create good chances in the final 3rd. It's also clear to me that the US needs better depth. Way better depth. These players looked gassed today. Essentially played 4 games in a week and a half with the same starting lineup. We have those depth players that could have really helped, but Gregg chose to bring players like Roldan, Ferreria and Morris instead. 

The good news is that in addition to this talented young core who will be in their prime with World Cup experience in 2026, there are boatloads of other promising, talented and technical young players breaking through in their respective clubs right now. Just need a better international manager to fully unlock the talent of this team and to get them to play greater than the sum of their parts. 

Netherlands were just too clinical. The US really only made a few mistakes but the Dutch made them pay with a goal every time. That’s the mark of a really good team. 
 

The US desperately needs a good striker. We missed Sargent in this game. This team needs to get more technical going forward too. They have the players in the pool to do so, and hopefully they’ll be good enough in 4 years. This will be a great learning experience for this young team. A lot of positives to be taken from this WC.
 

While Berhalter did a good job in the group stage (and great job with his starting lineups, first halves and defensive gameplan), tonight showed why he isn’t the right coach to fully unlock this young team going forward. Certain players he called into the WC just aren’t good enough at this level (Ferreira, Zimmerman, Morris and Yedlin) and tactically the US needs something different to improve the attack. Playing wide and sending in crosses while not having a striker good enough to capitalize has never made sense to me. 
 

All in all, a good WC from the US, a good showing and hopefully in 4 years this team will be ready.

6 hours ago, Digby said:

 

Candidly, I've been lukewarm on Berhalter previously, but I think he's done well gameplanning this World Cup and I am failing to see the obvious egregious mistake he's made at all in the World Cup. They gave up zero goals from open play with a goalkeeper who was (gasp) MLS until 5 months ago and (double gasp) went to noted global football powerhouse Fairfield U. Three games against stout opposition, zero losses, the only goal was a penalty kick off an individual dumb decision. 

I think Berhalter has done an outstanding job with his starting lineup choices, the team's overall defense and general first half play in all 3 games. In the first half of every game, the US has looked tactically sound and confident. He's gotten that 100% right. Against England, I thought Gregg out coached Southgate and the US was a bit unlucky to not walk away with a win. Our defense has been remarkable for pretty much all 3 games, save for one mistake against Wales. Have to give Gregg a ton of props there. 

For me, Berhalter's subs have been atrocious and his ability to make in game adjustments to the other teams adjustments have been abysmal (which is, quite unbelievably, the reverse of what we saw from him in WCQ). Aside from the England game where he brought on the right subs, his substitutions and the timing of those substitutions have, or nearly, cost us the game against both Wales and Iran. Today, his hand was forced with some of the subs because of Pulisic and Sargent injuries, but what has Haji Wright or Shaq Moore shown so far in these 3 games to deserve more playing time especially with Reyna and Scally on the bench?

I felt like today was a repeat of sorts of the first game with Wales, except the US went into a more defensive shape to preserve the win and Iran still had a great chance to tie it up. This game should have been over early in the 2nd half, but with the changes Gregg made to go defensive nearly cost us. We had Iran on the ropes, just like we did with Wales. Had Iran scored, the US had essentially no ability to go back on the offensive and get another goal. That won't work against the Netherlands. I still hate that despite having talented attacking players who are fully capable of playing some fun and aggressive attacking football, our offense is really stagnant and too reliant on overlapping runs from our fullbacks/wingers and sending in crosses to the box. I feel it's a misuse of talent. We've scored just 2 goals. 

This team could be more dangerous and borderline or top 10 in the world, but we're held back by a coach with poor offensive tactics.

And I feel the need to go on record, I don't hate the MLS (LAFC is literally my favorite club) or MLS players on the NT, but what I don't like is playing MLS players who are clearly inferior to others on the roster.  I think more than half of our European guys, and particularly the majority of the players we consider our star young players, were developed in the MLS either through their academies or playing their way onto the first team. I just don't like playing players like Jordan Morris, Shaq Moore or Yedlin over vastly more talented players.

17 minutes ago, BrySmalls said:

 

That's a fair nitpick. To be fair, those past advancements have never been in convincing fashion as it came down to goal difference (2014) or winning their final match (2010 and 2022).

 

Guess what I really wanted to say is that I hope one day that the US convincingly wins in the group stage so we don't have to worry about tiebreakers.

I'm with you there. This team has the talent to do so. With a better coach this team easily advances. Hell, had Zimmerman not made that awful mistake against Wales, the US qualifies tied with England on points. 

20 minutes ago, BrySmalls said:

Overall, I'm glad that we got out of the group stage for once. 

Going to nitpick here, but the US have only failed to get out of the group stage once this century (2006). This is the 3rd straight WC we've gotten out of the group stage and 4th out of the last 5 WC's that we've qualified for.

Way way way too nervy there. Gregg again, had the perfect starting lineup, perfect first half, and then the subs at the end nearly ruined it. Don’t understand going into a 5-3-2 there at the end, but it worked. 
 

Hope Pulisic and Sargent are okay to go! We need Pulisic Saturday. Hopefully we finally see Reyna too. Going to need him especially if Pulisic cannot go. 
 

Don’t expect to beat the Netherlands but let’s just go for it and see what happens!

4 hours ago, BrySmalls said:

 

I fully agree with you on these points. Zimmerman isn't making sound decisions right now. I don't watch too mich MLS but not sure how he'd won best defender in 2020 and 2021.

 

I was concerned he would have coughed up the ball to Kane at a critical moment during the match. Fortunately, that didn't come to fruition.

 

Ream and Robinson have impressed me the most so far. I'm glad they're on the squad.

Zimmerman is really good in the MLS and lower level international competition. He’s been really good. He’s been a deserving of winner of the best defender award in MLS. The knock on him has been he’s not the best CB with the ball at his feet, struggles to pick out good passes that aren’t long balls and that gets amplified when the competition level increases. There’s a reason why he’s in his prime but still playing in the MLS.

Some additional thoughts:

- Zimmerman is fine when defending, but he’s been bad to atrocious picking out passes to the midfield. He looks a little timid or even scared, at times. I thought he almost cost us again. 

- Ream has been outstanding. So glad to have him out there. It seemed like he’s provided a veteran calming presence for the team. He clearly isn’t intimidated by anyone. He and Robinson have been great on the left side. Really really strong. 

- I missed the start, but did the US come out in a 4-4-2? It looked like that at times defensively.  I thought that did wonders for our midfield. They were very strong and dominant for large stretches. Adams was sensational again, McKinnie looked way better than he did in the first game (I know he wants that chance in the box back) and Musah showed the word why the US, Valencia and England are so high on him. Only 19 years old.

- Didn’t really have a problem with the subs today just wish they came sooner, although I don’t understand the point of bringing in Joe Scally if he isn’t the first full-back off the bench. He’s clear and away the best full back on the bench. 
 

- Pulisic looked good again, and his set piece deliveries were really good. Far improved over the Wales match. That’s a main criticism of him, but tonight they were very very good. 
 

All in all, the US are quite good and you can see the clear quality they possess. Individually, they’re easily the most talented and technical team we’ve ever sent to a World Cup. I sometimes forget this is still a young team and all of these players are playing in their first World Cup. By 2026, especially with it being at home, the US could make something special happen. 

The US played really well today. Had the better of the chances, in my opinion. Was dominant in the midfield at times, which was completely unexpected. 

Got to beat Iran to advance. We can do this. If this US team shows up against Iran, they’ll beat them. 
 

EDIT: England still has never beaten the US in the World Cup.

Cowboys playing with expectations and pressure of a contender only to play like absolute crap under said pressure/expectation is match unrivaled in the NFL.

It’s like clockwork.

Really wish the Giants didn’t get rid of the grey away pants. This uniform matchup would be gorgeous. 
 

I’m really thrilled to see the throwbacks again. Always loved these.

This Serbian keeper is single handedly keeping this game from being an absolute blowout. Props to him. Remarkable Brazil hasn’t scored considering how many chances they’ve gotten.