bosrs1

On 1/27/2017 at 8:37 PM, LA_Angels said:

Hmmm San Diego, with no love for LAL, LAC, GS, or SAC......... How about the Suns? Great young team and within a days drive from SD.

Well I've got love for Golden State. My mom is a die hard and has been for over 10 years now (and it's my fault she is, I got her into the Warriors when I used to take her to Kings v Warriors games when I was a Kings fan). And I know the Warriors actually threw San Diego a little love in the early 70's in the wake of the Rockets leaving San Diego, which is the primary reason they're "Golden State" today instead of Oakland or San Francisco. My only reservation about rooting for Golden State is that I'd immediately be labeled a bandwagon jumper given how good they've been of late. And personally I can't stand bandwagon jumpers. If they were a mediocre team I'd probably have already made the move.

LAC as I said was my first choice until it occurred to me the Clippers screwed San Diego once upon a time just like the Chargers just did. I mean you can argue they didn't screw SD as badly seeing as they'd only been in town a few years and didn't have the biggest following in SD. But it still feels wrong just like rooting for the Chargers is now "wrong" in San Diego. That said being that I wasn't here at the time, so I wasn't hurt personally. And they're easy to follow being on local TV and SD being at the fringes of their flagship radio station's range.

Sacramento was the team I abandoned, and with good reason seeing as they were trying to move to Seattle. It wouldn't make much sense to go back to where I'd come from.

LAL have always been the "enemy". The Kings hate them, the Clippers hate them, Golden State hates them, and they're THE LA team so as a San Diego fan I'm predisposed to continue hating them even absent a team of my own. That said, they're the only NBA team that actively markets themselves to San Diego, even if only in limited fashion, playing an annual preseason game here, etc... and putting their games occasionally on San Diego radio.

Only other option I could consider reasonably would be the Celtics I guess. Like my NFL team, the Pats, the Celtics are my extended family's team including my grandmother. Downside being that they're an Eastern Conference teams so my ability to follow them is severely limited.

I mean given the options, who would you root for?

10 hours ago, BringBackTheVet said:

plus, doesn't Safeco remain open even when closed?  I thought it was more like a cover than an enclosed building.  Might be hard to make ice there.

Yep. Safeco is less a retractable dome than it is the world's biggest awning/umbrella. It's still totally open to the elements other than direct rain even when closed. It would be a "Stadium Series" game, every game.

2 hours ago, LMU said:

Knowing Bettman he'll gladly sacrifice the Islanders to French Canada in the name of protecting the still ongoing Raleigh experiment.

That was my thought as well. Considering the issues with putting them back at Nassau, the long road to a new arena which wouldn't be ready for 2018-19 anyway, I can see Bettman putting them in Quebec City.

So I've had a few changes in the last 6 years.

First I started following the San Diego Chargers as a "second" NFL team since I live a few minutes away from Qualcomm Stadium and most of my wife's extended family and my friends are Chargers fans so it was fun to go to games with them and such (though I would root against them when they'd come up against my Pats, much to pretty much everyone's chagrin). However that ended 2 weeks ago when they relocated to LA. Like most San Diegans, the relocation and it's accompanying fiasco means the Chargers are now dead to me and their owners can die of gonorrhea and rot in hell for moving to LA.

In early 2013 I stopped following the Sacramento Kings due to the attempted move to Seattle. The relocation and league drama leading up to it just completely turned me off to the team (noticing a pattern here?). They did end up staying in Sacramento but by the time Ranadive bought the team it was too late. Any passion I'd had left for them was gone. I've been an NBA free agent in the intervening years. I started gravitating towards the Los Angeles Clippers for a while due to relative proximity, their history in SD, and ease of access (their radio signal just reaches San Diego and they're on TV in SD). However, the Chargers relocation and the accompanying pain I've seen it engender in so many I know in San Diego made me realize I could never truly be a Clippers fan since they pulled the same BS on San Diego 35 years ago. And indeed family who lived through that relocation have the same feelings of hate toward the Clippers they now do for the Chargers. Which leaves me still searching for an NBA team. The Warriors would be the next logical option having grown up in the Bay Area, being NOT the Lakers, and my mom's favorite team, but they also feel like bandwagon hopping since they are so damn good right now. So the search continues... if anyone has any ideas?

I've also added the AHL's San Diego Gulls since they started play in the intervening time.

San Diego Padres - picked them up as my NL team when I started visiting my future wife during the summer in SD. Fate seemed to agree because we eventually moved to SD and I started going regularly. Fell in love with the team and their ballpark which was a breath of fresh air after seeing MLB games primarily at the Oakland Coliseum my whole life.

New England Patriots - I'm from the Bay Area, but the Raiders were in LA when I was growing up, and again SF teams hold no appeal. Grandma is a Pats fan.

San Jose Sharks - I'm from the Bay Area.

San Jose Earthquakes - Again, Bay Area's MLS team...

San Diego Gulls - Local AHL team.

Oakland A's - I'm from the Bay Area and have always disliked San Francisco and its teams. That and dad was a former 30 year Red Sox fan who threw in the towel after Buckner in 86 and switched allegiance in to the A's in 87. Have also enjoyed being contrary to everyone outside my family that I know who are almost all Giants fans, particularly after 2010.

Lake Elsinore Storm - Padres' single A team who I regularly drive up to see play.

Santa Clara Broncos basketball - my alma mater

California Golden Bears football - my in-laws team which I adopted since my school was sans football by the time I got there.

San Diego State Aztecs football - fill a local in person viewing need and they're fun to watch.

San Diego State Aztecs baseball - started going after I moved to SD. Love watching Tony Gwynn's team.

AFC Wimbledon - English side that I started following after hearing their story which paralleled the Earthquakes story some (ie: team being stolen and replaced with an inferior team. Luckily the Dons have had a better go of regaining their former glory.)

Yomiuri Giants - Dad brought back a Yomiuri cap from a trip when I was a kid and I started following from afar which has gotten easier thanks to the web. Irony of ironies that my favorite NPB team shares their name with my most hated team in all of sports the, SF Giants.

BC Lions - Have always loved Vancouver (I'd like to retire there someday). And is my closest CFL team. ESPN3 has made following them so much easier.

I have a crapload of teams that I follow regularly. But what can I say, I like sports.

33 minutes ago, the admiral said:

Wouldn't be surprised to see the Rangers swap Hartford for Albany now that UConn hockey is up and running.

Do you think the Wolfpack would do better in Albany then they're doing in Hartford? I mean Albany has been a consistently worse market compared to Hartford over the last decade by a significant margin even with UConn up and running. And Hartford is closer to NYC too compared to Albany.

14 hours ago, BeerGuyJordan said:

Here's the full article on the potential move to Binghamton, for the A-Devils.

 

http://www.timesunion.com/sports/article/Sources-Albany-Devils-leaving-for-Binghamton-10884403.php

 

 

So moving from the lowest attended AHL market to the second lowest attended AHL market...

55 minutes ago, Sodboy13 said:

Albany's been in the attendance dumper ever since the Devils came to town, though. New Jersey's as good at tanking minor-league markets as Calgary.

Calgary hasn't exaclty tanked Stockton. Stockton's attendance last season (their first in the AHL with Calgary) was a few people better on average than their last year in the ECHL.

And while Stockton is down a few hundred this year, Stockton's attendance has been in a steady decline since they lost their ECHL affiliation with the Sharks in 2012. In this case it's not so much Calgary's fault as it is the fact that they're no longer affiliated with the closest NHL team and the luster of "hockey" has worn off since the ECHL debut in 2004-05. And of course that's a problem that predates both the AHL and the Flames ownership.

It's harder to appeal to a market when the vast majority are all fans of another NHL team, the Sharks. That's an issue Ontario and San Diego for example don't have as Ontario is in the Kings extended market, and San Diego was more or less an open market where everyone just wanted to watch hockey live (both those that are extended market Ducks fan, and the majority who are simply displaced fans of other NHL teams (transplants)).

Looks like we have our first off season casualty to the bloated list of bowls. Surprised it was the Poinsettia Bowl to go down first given it always had decent attendence. But it definitely won't, nor should it be the last to fold.

http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/sports/aztecs/sd-sp-poinsettia-0126-story.html

When there are 40 bowls with many hosting losing record teams it's time to pare them back.

10 minutes ago, Wings said:

Other options for the San Jose Barracuda:

 

Stockton

Unfortunately this is Calgary's affiliate unless a deal is made

 

Oakland

Oracle Arena will need dates to fill after the Warriors leave for SF in 2019. Return of the Oakland Seals anyone! Oracle does seat 17,200 for hockey.

 

Daly City

History of minor league hockey and the Sharks for 2 seasons but the Bay Area doesn't support minor league sports that well. 

 

-The Golden 1 Center in Sacramento wasn't built for hockey I believe and I'm not sure if the Chase Center in SF will. 

Chase Center is going to be basketball only like Golden 1 Center.

Oracle is also mainly basketball so you'd similarly need an off center set up like Barclay's Center and would need to reinstall the ice plant. Now the off kilter arrangement might work for an AHL team given the smaller crowds and it would be cool to see the Seals return. But I just don't see it happening.

Stockton would have made the most sense if Calgary hadn't beat them to the punch.

Daly City (ie: the Cow Palace) is where minor league hockey teams go to die. I wouldn't recommend it. No one goes there for very good reason, it's in one of San Francisco's roughest neighborhoods and it's a pit that charges WAY too much for rent.

39 minutes ago, ECUFan25 said:

You guys are lucky, my town doesn't even have a flag. Here's our logo. If we had a flag it would probably just be that same thing but the tree is at the bottom and bigger.

I wish my own city would ditch the city seal and simply use the tricolor they have, or ditch the full seal and maybe just go with the image and the year instead.

14 hours ago, Mockba said:

Are you calling me loose?

The SD Sports Arena is definitely an older building, but they've done a good job with what they have available.

Second time in a week I've done that. Channeling my inner Dan Quayle...

15 hours ago, Mockba said:

Huh.  A friend offered me a ticket for that game, but I was feeling the need to stay in and chill.

Snooze you lose?
 

In all honesty this was only their second true sell out since opening day last year. But they've had quite a few 10,000+ games so far. It's a great time for a good price. To the Gulls credit, they know they're in a "major league" city (even if less so since last week), and they run the franchise as close to an NHL squad as they can.

1 minute ago, mcj882000 said:

That's good to see. Of all of the California AHL relocations I think San Diego was the only one I was fully, 100% on-board with. I'm glad to see it's going so well.

To be fair Ontario has been doing quite well too and are only a couple of spots below San Diego on the attendance chart. The only clear mistake so far is San Jose who despite their attendance number are doing terribly (their attendance number is HIGHLY inflated). Tucson also isn't exactly inspiring, but to be fair it's still only halfway through their first year. But I wonder how long those two will last before their parents consider other options.

17 minutes ago, dfwabel said:

Granted, I've not been at the SD Sports Arena since 2005, but what happens if/when they ask for facility improvements?

Seeing as the Gulls spent several million improving the place when they moved in including new locker rooms, new dasher boards, new scoreboards, new sound system, new club area, new suite areas and new concessions... As well as improvements right before they moved in such as new lower half of the lower bowl seating I'd imagine they're quite pleased with it for now.

San Diego continues to prove it was a good idea. 

A sellout of 12,920 tonight vs San Jose

27 minutes ago, Ferdinand Cesarano said:

 

Yes.

 

The Soviet Union liberated Estonia and the other Baltic states from the Nazis after Germany had violated the non-aggression pact by invading those countries.  (This should be no surprise, as the Soviet Union ultimately saved the entire world by defeating the Nazis.)

 

Even though the Soviet Union descended into autocracy in the late Stalin period, and later further degraded into cronyism, it was on the whole a liberating and civilising force.  It was the first state not based on any of the traditional evils of crowns, gods, or property, but on self-government by the workers -- by the people who create all value apart from the natural.

 

In this centennial year of the Soviet Union"s founding, class-conscious proletarians reflect on its proud legacy.  This is a legacy which reverberates globally, as the Revolution and the successful decades immediately thereafter inspired workers to unite and to work for our collective interests.  Every worker-protection law in the world can ultimately be traced back to social movements that were energised and inspired by the victory of workers in seizing state power in the Soviet Union.

 

The founding of the Soviet Union as the world's first workers' state will forever stand as the high point in human history.  This is why I proudly fly the Soviet flag at home and at work.  (In both cases next to the Esperanto flag and the flag of New York City.)

 

 

On January 6, 2017 at 10:23 AM, Ferdinand Cesarano said:

 

That's what happens when one proceeds from such a faulty premise.

Which faulty premise is that? That the Soviets were oppressors?

On 9/4/2016 at 6:49 PM, Ferdinand Cesarano said:

 

 

 

This is a great shot. I would have to concede that this justifies the departure from vexillological guidelines.

 

Though I would be morally remiss if I did not suggest one fanciful improvement to the flag of this place that was for a long time a part of the Soviet Union:

 

Not sure the Estonians would go for putting their former oppressors primary symbol on their flag.

2 hours ago, Marcos Flamengo said:

From the '81 SCF until the '94 SCF, local networks were allowed to broadcast the games. However, Mr. Comissioner Gary Bettman benefited the national television exclusivity of the Stanley Cup starting a year later in '95. Seriously, this isn't fair and it undermines regional sports networks that still can do pre-game and post-game coverages of the Stanley Cup playoff games but aren't allowed to broadcast live playoff games from second round onwards. It is unfair to see that regional sports networks aren't allowed to broadcast playoff games from second round onwards on local television because the teams' TV announcers calls the games on radio, and honestly, I don't know which year the national exclusivity will end.

 

But I hope that this American coverage policy that benefits national exclusivity to the Stanley Cup will end it sooner or later!.

 

What do you think?.

I think it's a great idea. But I also think it's not worth discussing because it's never going to happen. The finals will be national TV deal like all the major sports. It's just the reality of the situation.

12 hours ago, the admiral said:

Is Fort Collins still in the ECHL? That could work for Calgary, as could Salt Lake City. Maybe one and then the other considering the Flames and their AHL PATH OF DEATH AND DESTRUCTION

Well hopefully something is worked out long term. Because San Jose is not sustainable where they are currently I'm sorry to say. I mean to illustrate the difference between a healthy Pacific market and a not healthy one, here is that weekend shot from San Jose compared with last night's (Tuesday) Gulls game in San Diego. And for reference the San Diego shot is from the busier press/penalty side of the arena looking toward the less full bench side (the upper red seat area just to the left edge of the shot an off camera is nearly full). San Jose by comparison is from the emptier bench side looking toward the busier press/penalty side.

San Jose (weekend game) - Announced attendance 4322

San Diego (Tuesday night game) - Announced attendance 6112

9 minutes ago, BeerGuyJordan said:

Bakersfield and Stockton are doing well enough, as I understand it. I've talked to a few people who've been, as traveling away fans, and they generally described attendance as follows: 

 

San Jose: Sad

Stockton and Bakersfield: Decent

Ontario: Good

San Diego: Nuts, one guy said it's on par with Hershey.

 

It's still early, though. The Reign and Gulls have the advantage of being a pipeline to a "local" team. The novelty of hockey may wear off, in a few seasons, for the Condors and Heat.

 

San Jose really is just for convenience sake. In such a large MSA, I think it'd be crazy for the Sharks to not move their team somewhere else, in the Golden Gate area, eventually. That way, you keep the convenience, but can still sell some tickets. 

 

The Moose are actually an instance of the "in house feeder team" being a good call. With only 15,000 able to go to Jets games, there's still a big demand for Moose tix.

 

As far as Worcester goes, it's the ECHL's gain.

How has it been down in Tucson in this inaugural year? The Roadrunners I'd presume have the similar leg up the Gulls and Reign do being relatively close to their parent club without stepping on its toes like the Barracuda apparently do.

And I agree, the Moose are an example of where the doubling up can work in large part because the Jets arena is the smallest in the NHL in a fairly enthusiastic market who could likely support a bigger NHL arena's capacity. But at the same time, the Sharks are running at 100% capacity too, and their ticket prices would make most people gag (I really wanted to go Saturday but I couldn't justify paying $70 for nosebleed seats), so you'd think they'd similarly get overflow. But apparently that's not the case as you friend's description of their attendance being sad is pretty accurate. I hope in coming years they explore other options in either the Bay Area or NorCal. Maybe work something out with Calgary to take over Stockton and move the Heat somewhere closer to Calgary. Particularly if Vancouver moves their AHL team west.

Also agree that ECHL was smart to pounce on Worcester. I think the California move by AHL was the right one, but at the same time most of the AHL markets that lost teams didn't deserve to be sans any team like Worcester was initially.

46 minutes ago, the admiral said:

What a dick move it was for the Sharks to take their farm team out of a perfectly good AHL town like Woostah and have them play in an empty NHL arena. I think the endgame is to have them play in the same practice complex The NHL's Best Rec League will use.

I agree, Worcester got hosed for little return. I mean it was jarring for me as a Gulls season ticket holder. Gulls games have a feeling of being NHL lite. By that I mean the crowd is generally fairly large (we're averaging 8000 a game and I'd estimate that's not an exaggeration) but beyond that they're also really into it. We watched it happen over the first few month last season, fans who'd show up in other NHL jerseys eventually traded them in for Gulls gear (or in the case of the guy who sits behind me a Gulls kilt, war paint, and wig along with his jersey) regardless of their NHL loyalties. It's primarily an adult crowd who tend to take the game and its results relatively seriously (more so than Padres and Chargers fans do at any rate).

The "crowd" such as it was in San Jose seemed to consist primarily of families and Sharks fans looking for a cheap ticket (for example I got my seats for $6 off Stubhub and the team had $10 tickets available for purchase directly at the door for the comparable sections to my Gulls season tickets which face value at $27 each). And no one seemed particularly invested in what was going on ice. No one really got overly excited until the Barracuda had scored a goal or the shirt toss started. My NHL loyalties have been with the Sharks since their founding when I was in middle school so it pains me that they've done this to their AHL team.

One thing to consider is how are the California teams really doing off ice for their NHL owners? I mean by all accounts San Diego and Ontario are doing great attendance wise and presumably financially. Besides that of course to some extent the NHL teams subsidize the AHL teams they own in the direct ownership model that all the California teams use even if they don't break even on their own. But how are the other 3 really doing in Stockton, Bakersfield and particularly San Jose?

I mean I'd not attended any San Diego Gulls away games until this past weekend in San Jose and I was shocked at how empty the SAP Center was for the game. The Sunday game in particular the Barracuda are claiming 4322 were in attendance. But unless about 3900 of them were in the bathroom at the very same time for all 3 periods that number has got to be tickets distributed (ie: given away). Which means they're not making any money off of them. Now San Jose is in a unique situation in that they're really in the same building for convenience and their own fans are likely not that important to them, and if that's the case and they're willing to eat any losses associated with them so be it. But it just seems such a damn shame. I mean they have the upper deck curtained off and almost the entire home goal line area tarped off. And even then the crowd such as it was was very very sparse. In fact you can count it in some of the photos I took such as this one mid way through the first.

But what of Stockton and Bakersfield? How are they actually doing as going concerns?

3 hours ago, MBurmy said:

I wonder how good of a hockey venue the Golden 1 Center is?

Since it has no ice abilities I'd say it's a pretty poor one.

Moda Arena in Portland does however have an ice plant. Only issue there is the same as Victoria, WHL already has the Winterhawks in town.

Fresno has an ice capable arena, but it may be Vegas' choice for their AHL team.

Seattle has Key Arena of course which can host hockey and no competing WHL team in the building. Issue there is the a fore mentioned potential NHL team however. That and the WHL is again already in town out in Kent. And I get the feeling these towns prefer the WHL to the AHL for whatever reason based on Victoria and other's reaction to WHL over ECHL or AHL.

2 hours ago, kiwi_canadian said:

That's the entire reason the WHL is back in Victoria. Goes back to the Jets coming back to the NHL. The rumor was that the Canucks would set up their AHL team in Victoria but the WHL didn't want to lose Victoria as a market. RG Properties number one goal when they built SOFMC was that they wanted a WHL tenant. Once the Chilliwack Bruins became available RG jumped at them and applied to move them to Victoria right away. Once the WHL approved the move, they folded the Salmon Kings of the ECHL. If the WHL blocked the purchase or move of the Bruins, then Victoria would have the AHL. I think the best move was the WHL because of what was said before with Canadians more supportive of the CHL rather than an NHL affiliated team.

I agree, it would make more sense to "join the California fray" or perhaps look at Portland? I mean Seattle would make sense to look at too if not for the persistent rumors of them getting their own NHL team.