Haslem: Worse than Alomar?

[NJTank]

The NFL, the NHL, and MLB have their delinquents, but the NBA has a higher percentage of delinquents and poor behavior skills from their players.

Got any numbers for that? Or just baseless generalizations?

Haslem was stupid. He apologized for what he did, but he deserved another game tacked onto that suspension. That being said, Joey Crawford is an ass--not that what Haslem did was justified.

I agree about Crawford him and Bennett Salvatore love getting into arguments with players becuase they think the game is about them it lieks give them pride to eject someone.

[bnick05]

This is absolutely not worse than the Roberto Alomar spitting incident.  Throwing a mouthgard in the direction of an official is disresptectful, however, I don't think it warrants an ejection.  A player can verbally abuse an official and get only a technical foul.  I can see how if the mouthgard made contact with Joey Crawford, Haslem should have been ejected. 

On a side note, Joey Crawford absolutely lives for this type of stuff.  He is the epitome of what is wrong with major sports officials.  In my mind an official should never be the reason for one team beating another.  They also should never try to draw attention to themselves during a game.

So, what you're saying is that Haslem should have gotten a slap on the wrist? A minor talking-to?

Wow.

I'm tired of people saying that the referees are the reasons teams lose. Referees don't shoot bricks. Referees don't make bad passes. Referees don't foul other players.

How can you possibly say that a referee, umpire, any other type of official doesn't affect the outcome of a game? The Duke-BC fiasco this season was a perfect example. Referees get fined and even suspended if the league feels they made a call that affected the outcome. Case in point is A.J. Pierzynski in last year's ALCS.

And regarding Haslem, if you take any marquee player in the NBA and have the same situation they're not getting suspended. The mouthguard wasn't even close to making contact with Crawford, it's just a case of every sports media outlet trying to make another Pacers Pistons brawl.

[Eye]

This is absolutely not worse than the Roberto Alomar spitting incident.  Throwing a mouthgard in the direction of an official is disresptectful, however, I don't think it warrants an ejection.  A player can verbally abuse an official and get only a technical foul.  I can see how if the mouthgard made contact with Joey Crawford, Haslem should have been ejected. 

On a side note, Joey Crawford absolutely lives for this type of stuff.  He is the epitome of what is wrong with major sports officials.  In my mind an official should never be the reason for one team beating another.  They also should never try to draw attention to themselves during a game.

So, what you're saying is that Haslem should have gotten a slap on the wrist? A minor talking-to?

Wow.

I'm tired of people saying that the referees are the reasons teams lose. Referees don't shoot bricks. Referees don't make bad passes. Referees don't foul other players.

How can you possibly say that a referee, umpire, any other type of official doesn't affect the outcome of a game? The Duke-BC fiasco this season was a perfect example. Referees get fined and even suspended if the league feels they made a call that affected the outcome. Case in point is A.J. Pierzynski in last year's ALCS.

And regarding Haslem, if you take any marquee player in the NBA and have the same situation they're not getting suspended. The mouthguard wasn't even close to making contact with Crawford, it's just a case of every sports media outlet trying to make another Pacers Pistons brawl.

Referee's in my opinion, are definitely not the reason why a team might lose a game. Ok, so they make a bad or questionable call down the stretch of a game that my determine the outcome. Well, the team that loses should stop bitching about it, and look in the mirror. If you put yourself in a situation where a bad or questionable call could decide the outcome of the game, it is YOUR fault that you lost. Look at Nets-Pacers game one. It was a questionable foul that got called on Nenad Krstic with 00.9 left. I thought that the call shouldn't have been made and it definitely was questionable. I was sort of mad when the Nets lost, partly because of that foul, but I could see it coming since the end of the 1st quarter, the Nets were letting the Pacers hang around. And what happens when you let a team hang around?? Usually you lose it in the end. The Nets lost that game because they put themselves in a situation where a bad or questionable call could cost them. So people shouldn't blame the refs, blame the players.

[HedleyLamarr]

The NFL, the NHL, and MLB have their delinquents, but the NBA has a higher percentage of delinquents and poor behavior skills from their players.

Got any numbers for that? Or just baseless generalizations?

Haslem was stupid. He apologized for what he did, but he deserved another game tacked onto that suspension. That being said, Joey Crawford is an ass--not that what Haslem did was justified.

How often do you see NFL players entering the stands because of fan behavior? How often do you see MLB players throwing equipment into the stands because of an umpire's call? How often do you see NHL players whining and asking for stipends about a Dress Code? How many MLB players turn down a multi-million contract because "I got a family to feed"?

Why do you think a majority of the players who didn't go to college struggle and are out of the league?

Do you think there is a maturity problem in the NBA?

[nsentv]

How often do you see NFL players entering the stands because of fan behavior? How often do you see MLB players throwing equipment into the stands because of an umpire's call? How often do you see NHL players whining and asking for stipends about a Dress Code? How many MLB players turn down a multi-million contract because "I got a family to feed"?

Why do you think a majority of the players who didn't go to college struggle and are out of the league?

Do you think there is a maturity problem in the NBA?

How many times did an NBA player enter the stands? One. (and Antonio Davis doesn't count; he entered out of concern for his wife). How many brawls do baseball players get in per year? Benches clearing brawls? How many other leagues try to stifle their player's culture by instituting a dress code? (Why shouldn't NBA players complain about the dress code, when no other league has it? When MLB comes out with a dress code, then fine. When the NFL comes out with a dress code, then fine. But the fact that only the NBA--the league with the highest amount of black participation--has it makes it look a lot like a 'singling out' situation.)

And don't you dare tell me that there aren't selfish baseball and football players.

It seems to me like you have a bias against the NBA. You report your opinion as fact and pass judgment on the players and the league. You hate the NBA? Fine. So does 90 percent of white, middle class America. But it'd be pretty sad if you had nothing better to do with your day/week/life than to post in every single NBA-related topic and thrash the league, it's players, it's fans, and etc.

Like I said before. You've got no numbers, you've got no facts. You've got nothing but baseless, ignorant generalizations.

I agree about Crawford him and Bennett Salvatore love getting into arguments with players becuase they think the game is about them it lieks give them pride to eject someone.

The thing about Crawford (I never noticed about Salvatore) is that they're obsessed with themselves. Remember how much of an idiot Crawford was in 2003 Western Conference Finals? It's a safe bet that he lapped up all the attention he got for his 'confrontational' style. I'm not asking for passive referees, but I'm not asking for prima donnas either.

But still no excuse for Haslem. Especially on such a relatively insignificant play.

[VitaminD]

I can deny that, as I respectfully disagree. Plus you have to remember that the NBA plays five times the schedule of an NFL team, so proportionately, the NFL has many more immature acts than the NBA - it's not even an argument.

The NBA plays about 5 times more games than the NFL, but the NFL roster has about 5 times as many players on it than an NBA roster. Furthermore, an NFL game is 60 minutes of game time; an NBA game is 48 minutes. So not only are there more players to potentially perpetrate misdeeds in the NFL, but they also have longer games in which to commit these dastardly acts. The NBA also has the added burden of allowing younger people to enter their league. Immaturity is more noticeable on a team of 12 than on a team of 53. Finally, the NFL is still a management-run league, so the players are less able to step out of line without drawing heavy repercussions for damaging the league's image (why do you think you're bombarded with United Way ads every Sunday?). The NBA is more player-controlled; it's only recently that the owners attempted to reassert themselves with things like the dress code to "polish the league's image" because the numbers at the box office are cooling off.

So if, as you allege, the NFL has more immature acts being committed by its players, wouldn't the much larger roster be as much a mitigating factor as the discrepancy as the number of games a team plays, the length of a league game, and the age of the players involved? Can't win this one with selective facts alone, bro...

[NJTank]

The NFL, the NHL, and MLB have their delinquents, but the NBA has a higher percentage of delinquents and poor behavior skills from their players.

Got any numbers for that? Or just baseless generalizations?

Haslem was stupid. He apologized for what he did, but he deserved another game tacked onto that suspension. That being said, Joey Crawford is an ass--not that what Haslem did was justified.

How often do you see NFL players entering the stands because of fan behavior? How often do you see MLB players throwing equipment into the stands because of an umpire's call? How often do you see NHL players whining and asking for stipends about a Dress Code? How many MLB players turn down a multi-million contract because "I got a family to feed"?

Why do you think a majority of the players who didn't go to college struggle and are out of the league?

Do you think there is a maturity problem in the NBA?

NBA players get to run amok on their teams in the NFL players are in a much more structured enviorment and a player acts up he gets bounced just ask TO.

[WSU151]

I can deny that, as I respectfully disagree. Plus you have to remember that the NBA plays five times the schedule of an NFL team, so proportionately, the NFL has many more immature acts than the NBA - it's not even an argument.

The NBA plays about 5 times more games than the NFL, but the NFL roster has about 5 times as many players on it than an NBA roster. Furthermore, an NFL game is 60 minutes of game time; an NBA game is 48 minutes. So not only are there more players to potentially perpetrate misdeeds in the NFL, but they also have longer games in which to commit these dastardly acts.

So you're telling me that it's more probable and therefore, more excusable, that Jake Plummer gives a one finger salute to the fans than Udonis Haslem throwing a mouthpiece? That Jake's act is far more likely to happen because he has a larger team and a longer game? Is that what I'm reading?

The NFL may play longer games, but I see it this way...1 immature act by a NFL player in 960 minutes of play (length of NFL season in minutes) is about the same as 1 immature act by a NBA player in ~4,000 minutes of play. Approximately four times as many football players will play in a game as basketball players, so the minutes are pretty proportional. All 53 guys aren't going to play in an NFL game. All 15 guys on an NBA team won't play during a game. I figure the numbers are something like 32 NFL players a game, 8 NBA players a game...more or less a 4-to-1 ratio.

Immaturity is more noticeable on a team of 12 than on a team of 53.

I disagree. If we talk about one game, then one act of immaturity in an NBA game is just as noticeable as one act of immaturity in an NFL game, regardless of roster size. If we talk about an entire season, see above.

so the players are less able to step out of line without drawing heavy repercussions for damaging the league's image (why do you think you're bombarded with United Way ads every Sunday?).

Why am I bombarded with a bazillion "NBA Cares/Local NBA team Cares" ads whenever I watch a basketball game? The NBA cares about its image. They're not just letting the NBA players run around lawless without repercussions. It's just like the NFL - you do something stupid, you'll get suspended.

So if, as you allege, the NFL has more immature acts being committed by its players, wouldn't the much larger roster be as much a mitigating factor as the discrepancy as the number of games a team plays, the length of a league game, and the age of the players involved?

No! Age has nothing to do with it. Older NFL players often act just as immature as younger basketball players. The length of the game really has nothing to do with it - if basketball games went to 60 minutes, you really think you'll see a huge increase of immature acts???...I doubt it. You might have something with a larger roster, but it's questionable at best because all it takes is one player to act immature.

I know what you're getting at, that the NFL has far more chances of someone doing something stupid, but I think that many acts in the NFL are easily forgotten because it's a more popular sport. When something happens in the NBA it's just "Oh, they're a bunch of immature 19 year olds that are ruining the sport...the NBA sucks" but when it happens in the NFL, people are quick to defend or forget. Otherwise, how can you defend the countless immature acts that have happened in the NFL in the past 10 years? Sean Taylor assaulting guys with a gun, Ty Law running from the police in Miami, Randy Moss hitting a police officer, the Whizzinator, the Love Boat, Bill Romonowski, Sean Taylor spitting, Terrell Owens' shenanigans on and off the field, Ricky Manning, Jr., Mark Chmura trying to hook up with a teenager, the Cowboys' drug ring, Eugene Robinson trying to hire a prostitute, etc. etc. etc. The NFL isn't a bunch of pretty boys, folks.

[nsentv]

The NBA will continue to have an image problem, until all of its players get vitilago.

No offense, but the argument that NFL players have less of a 'maturity problem' than NBA players is weak at best and ridiculous at worst.

Why am I bombarded with a bazillion "NBA Cares/Local NBA team Cares" ads whenever I watch a basketball game? The NBA cares about its image. They're not just letting the NBA players run around lawless without repercussions. It's just like the NFL - you do something stupid, you'll get suspended.

Right. The NBA has been doing charitable acts for years, but people just love to conveniently ignore them. Besides? How can you criticize the NBA without having the luxury of saying that all the players are psychotic/thugs/criminals/rapists/evil?

[The_Admiral]

How many other leagues try to stifle their player's culture by instituting a dress code? (Why shouldn't NBA players complain about the dress code, when no other league has it? When MLB comes out with a dress code, then fine. When the NFL comes out with a dress code, then fine. But the fact that only the NBA--the league with the highest amount of black participation--has it makes it look a lot like a 'singling out' situation.)

Stifling their culture?!? Oh, man. Not this again. You get paid millions of dollars to play basketball, it's not asking too much to dress like a mature adult when you're representing your team off the court.

You hate the NBA? Fine. So does 90 percent of white, middle class America.

I don't think that's a fair assessment. If 90 percent of white middle-class America hated the NBA, they'd be out of business. But don't let that stop you from throwing down the race card.

[nsentv]

If MLB, NFL or NHL had a dress code, it would be fine. But they don't. Only the NBA does. It certainly seems to me like there's a singling out going on.

The NBA gets more undeserved criticism than any other league. Period. The NBA is also the league with the most black players. I don't know about you, but that seems fishy to me. I don't really have a problem with it--if someone wants to hate the NBA, go right ahead. Just don't come to me with unsubstantiated 'facts'.

[VitaminD]

So you're telling me that it's more probable and therefore, more excusable, that Jake Plummer gives a one finger salute to the fans than Udonis Haslem throwing a mouthpiece?  That Jake's act is far more likely to happen because he has a larger team and a longer game?  Is that what I'm reading?

First off, I never said anything about ANY of these actions being excusable or permissible. And for the record, I think while both leagues have their fair share of miscreants who embarrass the leagues they play in and tarnish their image, they're all about equal. And while the rates at which athletes embarrass themselves may be higher than people in other walks of life, it would take some serious research to conclude if the difference is statistically significant. We just hear about their screw-ups because our culture keeps tabs on these guys 24/7 - but there are jerks in every profession, at every workplace. But who cares about the nurse who curses out her co-workers, or the bank teller with a drinking problem on the national level?

My response was posted to directly dispute this quote of yours:

Plus you have to remember that the NBA plays five times the schedule of an NFL team, so proportionately, the NFL has many more immature acts than the NBA - it's not even an argument.

I guess it's my turn to manipulate the numbers to my convenience...

The crux of this statement appears to be that, proportionally, the NBA is better behaved because they play more games. My response calls attention to the facts you left out - length of time games are played, roster size, and so on. My point was that the potential for embarrassing moments is roughly equal. Assuming every individual has the potential to be offensive at every game (since when did you have to actually play in the game to be embarrassing? Guys are on the bench or sidelines even if they don't get into that particular game, right? Hell - AI and C-Webb created a firestorm at the 76ers' home finale, and they didn't even dress out for the game that night.),

NBA: 14 players per team x 82 games per year = 1148 player-games; 1148 x 48 minutes/game = 55,104 minutes of game action during which a player may do something stupid.

NFL: 53 players per team x 16 games per year = 848 player-games; 848 x 60 minutes of action = 50,880 minutes of game action during which a player may do something stupid.

And this doesn't even take into account the fact that players get in fights at clubs after games, destory hotel rooms, carry guns or drugs into airports, have children out of wedlock, assault their spouses at home after games, drive drunk in the offseason, or any of the other things that we hear about that DON'T happen during a game. If we're following these guys 24/7/365, it stands to reason that the NFL has a 4 or 5 times greater chance of having a player tarnish their league, by virtue of the number of players. So why then are so many basketball players making the wrong kinds of headlines, if there are so many fewer of them?

All I am saying, is that athletes are a cross-section of people of different races and socioeconomic backgrounds. To reach the elite levels that they do, many of these players are coddled and glorified from a young age that engenders a sense of entitlement and love of self that can often lead to a developmental failure to believe one is subject to laws and the rules of society. Whether they dribble a ball, throw a ball or hit a ball is really irrelevant. But just as there are these petulant miscreants in this field of work, so are there in all fields of work. I work with enough egomaniacal physicians to know. And just as there are jerks in all lines of work, there ar also decent people who function normally.

I don't condone the boorish behavior of athletes any more than I'd condone it from my salesman next-door neighbor. I haven't forgotten the NFL offenders any more than I forgot the NBA offenders, nor do I forgive either group. I really don't care about the personal lives of NBAers, NFLers or the rest. I think the NBA sucks because the quality of play has declined, even as players have pushed the bounds of athletic achievement higher than ever, irrespective of their race or ethnic background. It's a team game that has been bastardized by those seeking glorification of the individual, and that's why the NBA sucks. (Give me a good college or high school game, I'm there.)

[nsentv]

It's a team game that has been bastardized by those seeking glorification of the individual, and that's why the NBA sucks. (Give me a good college or high school game, I'm there.)

Spurs v. Pistons. Seven games. Second lowest ratings ever.

No individuals there. Two teams built on the fundamental, team game. And still nobody watched. So I find that argument to be generally hypocritical. As the playoffs every year for the last three years have shown, the team that plays like a team always comes out on top. The last time a 'star-studded' team won the NBA Finals was 2002. Four years ago.

Who's been the MVP two years in a row? Steve Nash. Ultimate team player.

Last three champions? 2003 Spurs, 2004 Pistons, 2005 Spurs.

Teams in the Finals since 2002? Spurs, Pistons, Nets, Lakers. The only team out of that four based on individual play? The Lakers.

Ratings for the four Finals with fundamental teams? 10.2, 6.5, 11.6, 8.2. With the exception of 2004, three of the lowest rated Finals ever.

If people hate the individual game so much, why don't they watch when the fundamental teams play?

[VitaminD]

Spurs v. Pistons. Seven games. Second lowest ratings ever.

No individuals there. Two teams built on the fundamental, team game. And still nobody watched. So I find that argument to be generally hypocritical. As the playoffs every year for the last three years have shown, the team that plays like a team always comes out on top. The last time a 'star-studded' team won the NBA Finals was 2002. Four years ago.

Who's been the MVP two years in a row? Steve Nash. Ultimate team player.

Last three champions? 2003 Spurs, 2004 Pistons, 2005 Spurs.

Teams in the Finals since 2002? Spurs, Pistons, Nets, Lakers. The only team out of that four based on individual play? The Lakers.

Ratings for the four Finals with fundamental teams? 10.2, 6.5, 11.6, 8.2. With the exception of 2004, three of the lowest rated Finals ever.

If people hate the individual game so much, why don't they watch when the fundamental teams play?

That's a rather glib and self-serving assessment.

For one, I watched the Finals. Just because the national trends say otherwise, this individual watched the Finals. To call my argument hypocritical is just wrong. National trends don't speak for me; I do. And I'd rather watch a team like the Pistons playing as a team than watch Kobe shamelessly try to do it by himself while his teammates stand around and watch.

As for the players in the Finals: Tim Duncan's not a big name? Manu Ginobili? Rip Hamilton? Chauncey Billups? Ben Wallace? None of them may be the second coming of Wilt or Kareem, but they're not half bad - good enough to make national teams or All-Star teams at the very least...

Any chance that the ratings are down because many basketball fans are fed up with the overall quality of the game, and wouldn't watch the Finals no matter who was playing? Any chance that people watch less because any hope a playoff series had of developing some momentum is lost due to the NBA's drawn-out playoff schedule, where it takes 2 weeks or more to play the first round alone, and the playoffs seem to last forever?

[WSU151]

I guess it's my turn to manipulate the numbers to my convenience...

Good post, except coming across as a jackass right there...

[nsentv]

I should have specified that I didn't necessarily mean you when I said that the argument is generally hypocritical. The fact is, a lot of people make the argument you made and then turn around and skip the Finals--even when two teams who represent what they want to see are playing.

Any chance that the ratings are down because many basketball fans are fed up with the overall quality of the game, and wouldn't watch the Finals no matter who was playing? Any chance that people watch less because any hope a playoff series had of developing some momentum is lost due to the NBA's drawn-out playoff schedule, where it takes 2 weeks or more to play the first round alone, and the playoffs seem to last forever?

As for the first question, anyone who would skip an NBA Finals between the two best teams (not only in the league, but the world) isn't a fan of good quality basketball anyway. Secondly, I do understand that David Stern's ludicrous schedule (the NHL started their playoffs the day before the NBA's and they're already onto Game 3) makes a lot of fans angry.

About the quality of play--I think its great. I personally don't see how college or (God forbid) high school ball is even close to as good as NBA basketball.

[HedleyLamarr]

How many times did an NBA player enter the stands? One. (and Antonio Davis doesn't count; he entered out of concern for his wife). How many brawls do baseball players get in per year? Benches clearing brawls? How many other leagues try to stifle their player's culture by instituting a dress code? (Why shouldn't NBA players complain about the dress code, when no other league has it? When MLB comes out with a dress code, then fine. When the NFL comes out with a dress code, then fine. But the fact that only the NBA--the league with the highest amount of black participation--has it makes it look a lot like a 'singling out' situation.)

And don't you dare tell me that there aren't selfish baseball and football players.

It seems to me like you have a bias against the NBA. You report your opinion as fact and pass judgment on the players and the league. You hate the NBA? Fine. So does 90 percent of white, middle class America. But it'd be pretty sad if you had nothing better to do with your day/week/life than to post in every single NBA-related topic and thrash the league, it's players, it's fans, and etc.

Like I said before. You've got no numbers, you've got no facts. You've got nothing but baseless, ignorant generalizations.

He still went into the stands. If the players want the fans' respect of staying off the court, then the players should give the same respect by not going into the stands, no matter what is going on. That's why we have security on hand....it's their job to handle disturbances in the stands, not the players.

Bench-clearing brawls, shoving matches on the court....both happen routinely in both MLB and the NBA, as well as the NFL and NHL. Don't you dare tell me the NBA never has any of these shoving and pushing incidents on the court.

The NHL requires the players to wear suits. MLB doesn't have a league-wide dress code, but they leave it up to the teams' choice, which is usually casual or business casual. I haven't seen John Smoltz and Brian Jordan show up to team events in oversized T-shirts and baggy shorts. I believe the NFL shares MLB's views oon a dress code. I'll have to find that article later.

The way I see it, it is a way to look like a professional at team events. If you owned a business and you think wearing T-shirts and sandals impresses others to want to do business with you, you're living in a dream world. The reason why NBA players opposed it so heavily is because their me-first attitude, which is reflected nightly in their play, will never die.

I work for an NBA team (as well as an NHL team). I believe I have a little background in knowing how selfish most NBA players are. I'm not relying on Stephen A. Smith's (Appropriate initials, just not in the right order) nightly tongue-licking of the player's genitals to know how the "poor players" feel. Boo hoo, they're required to wear professional clothing. If they don't like it, they can go into a different line of work that better "suits" them. I'm not sure about you, but I don't have a say in what my boss tells me to do. I don't see how a multi-million dollar contract changes that.

The only ignorant generalization is you thinking the actions of NBA players are cherubic compared to MLB, NFL, and NHL.

[nsentv]

The way I see it, it is a way to look like a professional at team events. If you owned a business and you think wearing T-shirts and sandals impresses others to want to do business with you, you're living in a dream world. The reason why NBA players opposed it so heavily is because their me-first attitude, which is reflected nightly in their play, will never die.

I work for an NBA team (as well as an NHL team). I believe I have a little background in knowing how selfish most NBA players are. I'm not relying on Stephen A. Smith's (Appropriate initials, just not in the right order) nightly tongue-licking of the player's genitals to know how the "poor players" feel. Boo hoo, they're required to wear professional clothing. If they don't like it, they can go into a different line of work that better "suits" them. I'm not sure about you, but I don't have a say in what my boss tells me to do. I don't see how a multi-million dollar contract changes that.

The only ignorant generalization is you thinking the actions of NBA players are cherubic compared to MLB, NFL, and NHL.

Very funny. I never said all NBA players were angels. I'm not stupid. What I'm saying is that NBA players are no worse than baseball, football or hockey players. You seem to think that NBA players came from the gutter and are the worst people in all of sports.

The very idea that you can think that most NBA players are selfish and then pass that off as some kind of fact is amazing. It's an opinion, not a fact. It's a misguided perception by the media, not fact.

And by the way, have you watched the NBA? Like I said before, who's won recently? Who are the best teams? Your me-first argument holds no water in my view, because what teams are doing the best in the NBA? Just because the Portland Trailblazers and New York Knicks have a majority of selfish players doesn't mean the whole league does. And what were the records for Portland and New York by the way? They finished dead last in their respective conferences. Who's winning? Detroit and San Antonio.

And what was the motivation for the dress code? How do we measure what 'professional' dress is? Why should I assume that a suit and tie is 'right'? What ever made a suit and tie the object of perfection? Clothes don't make the man, and unfortunately, too many people in this country are too ignorant to realize that. Because of what NBA players wear--because they dress 'black'--people rejected them. Seems ridiculous to me at best.

Like I said before, hate the NBA. Go ahead. You'll have lots of company. But don't come to me with baseless generalizations. It's just a little fishy to me that you hate the NBA so much that you can't stop talking about it.