Long lost Saints jersey style

[tBBP]

Archie wasn't drafted until 1971 and I'm certain they didn't wear the style he's pictured in before 1970 at the earliest. Interesting and rare pic of his one-bar mask, I think he only wore that style for one season.

I don't think they wore the Abramowicz-style jersey in 1969 either because it has black numbers. I guess my question could be re-phrased as when did they change from gold numbers to black?

1970 was the year the Saints switched the numbers from gold to black on the white jerseys. I have all of the NFL season highlight films from 1966-2005 on the NFL Films Super Bowl Highlights DVDs that started hitting the market a few years ago, not to mention some old This Week in Pro Football episodes I recorded off ESPN Classic. Two of the 1970 episodes have the Saints in white jerseys with black numbers. Some of the 1969 footage I've seen has the Saints with white jerseys and gold numbers, and I know it's 1969 because of the "NFL 50" patch all teams wore that year.

So yes, they were like the mock illustration, but they would have had the "NFL 50" patch. I'd have to go back and check for sure about 1968, but I'm pretty sure the Saints wore black at home in 1969. They wore white at home in 1967.

I should also point out I'm a big Saints fan.

Is there any way you could do a screen capture of a shot of the white jerseys from 1969? I've been trying in vain to find a photo online. Are they the same jerseys from '67-68 only with the 50th anniversary patch added, or are the sleeve stripes different? The photo below shows that in '69 the black jerseys were indeed the 2nd generation style, as were the socks, which means the mock illustration from earlier in the thread is wrong about the black set. I'm really interested to see what the white set actually looked like.

That is one BIG kicker...and I thought Sebastian Janikowski was too big to be a kicker!

EDIT: upon second view...that ain't Tom Dempsey, is it? I don't recall him being THAT big. But that kicking "boot" now has me curious.

[darkhaha]

Archie wasn't drafted until 1971 and I'm certain they didn't wear the style he's pictured in before 1970 at the earliest. Interesting and rare pic of his one-bar mask, I think he only wore that style for one season.

I don't think they wore the Abramowicz-style jersey in 1969 either because it has black numbers. I guess my question could be re-phrased as when did they change from gold numbers to black?

1970 was the year the Saints switched the numbers from gold to black on the white jerseys. I have all of the NFL season highlight films from 1966-2005 on the NFL Films Super Bowl Highlights DVDs that started hitting the market a few years ago, not to mention some old This Week in Pro Football episodes I recorded off ESPN Classic. Two of the 1970 episodes have the Saints in white jerseys with black numbers. Some of the 1969 footage I've seen has the Saints with white jerseys and gold numbers, and I know it's 1969 because of the "NFL 50" patch all teams wore that year.

So yes, they were like the mock illustration, but they would have had the "NFL 50" patch. I'd have to go back and check for sure about 1968, but I'm pretty sure the Saints wore black at home in 1969. They wore white at home in 1967.

I should also point out I'm a big Saints fan.

Is there any way you could do a screen capture of a shot of the white jerseys from 1969? I've been trying in vain to find a photo online. Are they the same jerseys from '67-68 only with the 50th anniversary patch added, or are the sleeve stripes different? The photo below shows that in '69 the black jerseys were indeed the 2nd generation style, as were the socks, which means the mock illustration from earlier in the thread is wrong about the black set. I'm really interested to see what the white set actually looked like.

That is one BIG kicker...and I thought Sebastian Janikowski was too big to be a kicker!

EDIT: upon second view...that ain't Tom Dempsey, is it? I don't recall him being THAT big. But that kicking "boot" now has me curious.

Yes, it's Tom Dempsey.

[BlueSky]

Archie wasn't drafted until 1971 and I'm certain they didn't wear the style he's pictured in before 1970 at the earliest. Interesting and rare pic of his one-bar mask, I think he only wore that style for one season.

I don't think they wore the Abramowicz-style jersey in 1969 either because it has black numbers. I guess my question could be re-phrased as when did they change from gold numbers to black?

1970 was the year the Saints switched the numbers from gold to black on the white jerseys. I have all of the NFL season highlight films from 1966-2005 on the NFL Films Super Bowl Highlights DVDs that started hitting the market a few years ago, not to mention some old This Week in Pro Football episodes I recorded off ESPN Classic. Two of the 1970 episodes have the Saints in white jerseys with black numbers. Some of the 1969 footage I've seen has the Saints with white jerseys and gold numbers, and I know it's 1969 because of the "NFL 50" patch all teams wore that year.

So yes, they were like the mock illustration, but they would have had the "NFL 50" patch. I'd have to go back and check for sure about 1968, but I'm pretty sure the Saints wore black at home in 1969. They wore white at home in 1967.

I should also point out I'm a big Saints fan.

Is there any way you could do a screen capture of a shot of the white jerseys from 1969? I've been trying in vain to find a photo online. Are they the same jerseys from '67-68 only with the 50th anniversary patch added, or are the sleeve stripes different? The photo below shows that in '69 the black jerseys were indeed the 2nd generation style, as were the socks, which means the mock illustration from earlier in the thread is wrong about the black set. I'm really interested to see what the white set actually looked like.

The Dempsey shot is from their game at Los Angeles in Week 3, 10/5/69. As explained earlier in the thread, they wore those for the first 5 games of 1969 then received a new shipment of jerseys. The manufacturer goofed though and made the stripes w-g-w-g-w on the new jerseys when the team had ordered them with g-w-g-w-g. The new ones had gold-on-white numbers. After the season the team received the correctly striped jerseys and for the 1970 season, dropped the gold on white numbers in favor of plain white. The NFL50 patch was not added to the Week 6-14 jerseys until several weeks after the Dallas game. Somebody earlier said neither team is wearing the patch in the Saints-Cowboys pic but that's inaccurate, or at least we can't tell, because neither Cowboys player's left sleeve is showing. Very confusing!

What's weird, and it must just be a trick of the light, is that the stripes in the Dempsey shot look reversed to w-g-w-g-w (like the 'wrong' jerseys in the shot vs. Dallas). In fact, the Dempsey pic stripes must be g-w-g-w-g as shown in the pic of Kilmer handing off vs. Baltimore. Look at #23 Joe Scarpati's left sleeve (on right as you look at the pic), in the shadow, and it looks more like g-w-g-w-g as we know it must be (like the shot vs. the Colts below).

So here's a rundown to try and sort this out.

1967-68, w-g-w-g-w stripes, g-on-w numbers

1969, Weeks 1-5, g-w-g-w-g stripes, plain white numbers

1969, Weeks 6-14, w-g-w-g-w stripes, g-on-w numbers

1970, g-w-g-w-g stripes, plain white numbers

And don't forget the 1968 fiasco where they decided to reverse the helmet and pants stripes to w-b-w for part of the season (pic vs. Cardinals).

Sorry I can't help with the '69 away jerseys, I'm also looking for a pic of those. I'm buying some DVDs that show those seasons and hope to post some screen shots soon.

As I said before, only those early Saints could fubar simple uni issues this many times in 4 years. There's a story that claims they got ready to start their first-ever practice in their first training camp in '67 only to discover that nobody had brought any footballs to the field. I have no doubt that it's true.

[darkhaha]

Here's another shot of Dempsey from that same '69 Rams game, which gives a better idea of the sleeve striping:

By comparison, here's a shot from 1970 (same jersey style as the pic of Abramowicz in the previous post). Note how the proportions of the sleeve stripes are different than the early 1969 set:

]

For what's it's worth, here's the Football Uniforms Past and Present listing for 1969:

I don't take this as gospel as I am aware that this site is riddled with inaccuracies. In this case, however, it is correct about the black uniforms (at least for the first 5 games of the season). I'm obviously still curious about the white jerseys, though. Do you suppose they had two sets of them, too? Here's a photo of the white Abramowitz jersey (from the Leland's auction I referred to earlier in the thread):

It seems as if this jersey could possibly be the counterpart to the late 1969 jerseys, as it has gold outlines on the black numbers.

[BlueSky]

Those Dempsey pics are also interesting in terms of the pants stripe. Never realized it was ever that thin. In fact, look at the guy sitting next to him, that's more of how I remember the stripes:

In the Past and Present graphics, note how it uses one gold above the waist and the original gold in the pants and socks. Weird.

[darkhaha]

Those Dempsey pics are also interesting in terms of the pants stripe. Never realized it was ever that thin. In fact, look at the guy sitting next to him, that's more of how I remember the stripes:

In the Past and Present graphics, note how it uses one gold above the waist and the original gold in the pants and socks. Weird.

Yeah, I've never understood why Craig (creator of the original FUPP site) did it like that, as it always seemed to me that the Saints did a pretty good job of matching the gold in the helmet and the pants -- back in the OLD days, anyway. We all know how unmatched they are today...

EDIT: Of course, once I posted the last comment I took another look at that pic of Dempsey on the bench. In that one, at least, the helmet and pants do look quite different, but just about every other color photo I've ever seen they look pretty similar.

[bigdub81]

From my research into the team this is what the team wore during their respective years with minor variations. These are designs that I'm putting together for a team uniform history forum.

There uniforms for the 1967-68 season. Notice the difference in the serif on the '3' on the away jerseys TV #'s, it's like that if you see the SI photo of Jim Taylor. I also added the white/black/white stripe to the helmet that the team used during these years. I forgot to add the pants with the same stripe but I will later. In the photo of Jim Taylor on the SI cover they have a single white stripe on the helmet which I don't know if it was used in actual play but if so I can add that one as well.

Here are the uniforms that the team wore from 1969-1974. The black helmet was worn for the pre-season only because the team did not get permission from the NFL to change it so they went back to the gold domes ever since.

Here are the late 1969 uniforms when the team switched to the 'suppose' '67-'68 style. The stripe pattern on the sleeve is explained in an earlier post that I made.

[BlueSky]

Nice illustrations, BigDub. The '67 jerseys had two fonts. It's kind of an unexplained oddity, why they wore a mix of number fonts in '67. Jim Taylor's jersey is like the SI cover but look at #54 on the ground (that's Joe Wendryhoski for you Saints trivia fans...). He has the narrower numbers that most players wore, like the ones in the football card pics below.

Always liked that original narrow number font, it's different and looks good. Anybody know what it's called?

[tBBP]

Nice illustrations, BigDub. The '67 jerseys had two fonts. It's kind of an unexplained oddity, why they wore a mix of number fonts in '67. Jim Taylor's jersey is like the SI cover but look at #54 on the ground (that's Joe Wendryhoski for you Saints trivia fans...). He has the narrower numbers that most players wore, like the ones in the football card pics.

Always liked that original narrow number font, it's different and looks good. Anybody know what it's called?

Looks like a super narrow version of the block #s The Jaguars wore during their first two or three years. I don't think it has a specific name, but I do believe that either Varsity Block C or D in eriqjaffe's font pack is pretty close.

(And, I see, you've found yet another excuse to post that Jim Taylor picture. )

[bulldogbarks55]

I'm doing a uniform history concept for the Saints on another board and I have researched this topic so here's your answer.

The jerseys in those pics are the ones they wore for the final nine games of the 1969 season. They used the correct color sequence from 1967-68 season which was white/gold/white/gold/white but the order was for a reversal of the color pattern of the '69 stripes which in that year had been switched by using a metallic gold base stripe with two white stripes outlined in black placed on top. When Sand Knit sent the jerseys to the team and the mistake was pointed out, John Meacom the teams's owner at the time, didn't see the need to re-do the jerseys again just for nine games so he let the team go ahead with them. As you can see in the pic of Billy Kilmer vs Dallas the team didn't even bother to go back to wearing the '67-'68 style socks. They just switched jerseys and went on to play! Also, the team didn't start wearing the NFL 50th Anniversary patch until two weeks after the game versus Dallas. The game against the 49ers on 11-23-69 is when they were placed onto the uniforms.

Hope this helps and yes those jerseys look great!

Man, that's great historic info. But a little suggestion. Make your sentences shorter. And use commas. Long, drawn out sentences are harder to read. And harder to understand. If your project is to be published anywhere, have a proofreader go over it. This will make it more enjoyable for everyone. Good Luck!

[BlueSky]

Nice illustrations, BigDub. The '67 jerseys had two fonts. It's kind of an unexplained oddity, why they wore a mix of number fonts in '67. Jim Taylor's jersey is like the SI cover but look at #54 on the ground (that's Joe Wendryhoski for you Saints trivia fans...). He has the narrower numbers that most players wore, like the ones in the football card pics.

Always liked that original narrow number font, it's different and looks good. Anybody know what it's called?

Looks like a super narrow version of the block #s The Jaguars wore during their first two or three years. I don't think it has a specific name, but I do believe that either Varsity Block C or D in eriqjaffe's font pack is pretty close.

(And, I see, you've found yet another excuse to post that Jim Taylor picture. )

Guilty as charged.

[darkhaha]

Here are the late 1969 uniforms when the team switched to the 'suppose' '67-'68 style. The stripe pattern on the sleeve is explained in an earlier post that I made.

I love all your graphics, especially this last one. Do you have a game photo of this white jersey? I've never seen a pic with the gold numbers and the sleeve pattern with white space between the black and gold stripes.

[bigdub81]

I love all your graphics, especially this last one. Do you have a game photo of this white jersey? I've never seen a pic with the gold numbers and the sleeve pattern with white space between the black and gold stripes.

No I was just assuming that, that's what they would have looked like to replicate the '67-'68 uniforms. Given that the manufacturer messed up the sleeve stripes on the home jersey by not reversing the pattern, it may as well have been possible that the team never switched the away jerseys to gold numerals with black trim. Maybe they just kept the away jersey the same as when they started the 1969 season off and just 'threwback' the home.

[Sc8b]

1967-68, w-g-w-g-w stripes, g-on-w numbers

And don't forget the 1968 fiasco where they decided to reverse the helmet and pants stripes to w-b-w for part of the season (pic vs. Cardinals).

I was really confused for a second, the first player I looked at in that pic was 78(?) in the lower left corner and he has the old b-w-b stripes on his pants...

[bigdub81]

Here is an updated illustration of their 1967-1968 set. I switched the '8' to the varsity classic block and added the pants with the white/black/white stripe.

1975-1982

1983-1985

1986-1995

[bigdub81]

1994 75th Anniversary Year

1996-1998

1999

2000-Present

[cheo25]

Archie wasn't drafted until 1971 and I'm certain they didn't wear the style he's pictured in before 1970 at the earliest. Interesting and rare pic of his one-bar mask, I think he only wore that style for one season.

I don't think they wore the Abramowicz-style jersey in 1969 either because it has black numbers. I guess my question could be re-phrased as when did they change from gold numbers to black?

1970 was the year the Saints switched the numbers from gold to black on the white jerseys. I have all of the NFL season highlight films from 1966-2005 on the NFL Films Super Bowl Highlights DVDs that started hitting the market a few years ago, not to mention some old This Week in Pro Football episodes I recorded off ESPN Classic. Two of the 1970 episodes have the Saints in white jerseys with black numbers. Some of the 1969 footage I've seen has the Saints with white jerseys and gold numbers, and I know it's 1969 because of the "NFL 50" patch all teams wore that year.

So yes, they were like the mock illustration, but they would have had the "NFL 50" patch. I'd have to go back and check for sure about 1968, but I'm pretty sure the Saints wore black at home in 1969. They wore white at home in 1967.

I should also point out I'm a big Saints fan.

Is there any way you could do a screen capture of a shot of the white jerseys from 1969? I've been trying in vain to find a photo online. Are they the same jerseys from '67-68 only with the 50th anniversary patch added, or are the sleeve stripes different? The photo below shows that in '69 the black jerseys were indeed the 2nd generation style, as were the socks, which means the mock illustration from earlier in the thread is wrong about the black set. I'm really interested to see what the white set actually looked like.

Sorry it took me so long to get to this. Been busy the past few days. Here's Danny Abramowicz in the '69 whites. The NFL logo is a bit hard to see, but it's on the left arm.

[bigdub81]

Great find cheo25! Now it completes my uniform history as being correct that they did switch back to the gold numerals.

[cheo25]

Great find cheo25! Now it completes my uniform history as being correct that they did switch back to the gold numerals.

Just sorry it took a few days for me to sit down and make the screencap that BlueSky requested. BTW, BigDub, I like your uniform graphics a lot. Good job on those.

BlueSky, I realize now that you asked if the Saints' 1969 sleeve striping was the same as '67 and '68. The screencap of Abramowicz shows a black/gold stripe with the cut sleeves. I'll try to go back to my DVD this afternoon (I'm at work now) to check other players to confirm, but based off Abramowicz, I'd say the sleeve striping did not change in '69.

[BlueSky]

Great find cheo25! Now it completes my uniform history as being correct that they did switch back to the gold numerals.

Just sorry it took a few days for me to sit down and make the screencap that BlueSky requested. BTW, BigDub, I like your uniform graphics a lot. Good job on those.

BlueSky, I realize now that you asked if the Saints' 1969 sleeve striping was the same as '67 and '68. The screencap of Abramowicz shows a black/gold stripe with the cut sleeves. I'll try to go back to my DVD this afternoon (I'm at work now) to check other players to confirm, but based off Abramowicz, I'd say the sleeve striping did not change in '69.

Awesome screenshot, thanks for doing that. Interesting that Danny's still wearing the reversed '68 pants stripes but the helmet stripes are back to the '69 b-w-b, especially since they played the hated Falcons only once and it was late in the season, in Atlanta on 12/7/69.

BTW, if the guy in the parka looks downcast, it's because the Saints are getting their a**es handed to them, 45-17.

Can I ask another favor as long as you're looking at the '69 footage? Are there highlights from the game vs. Pittsburgh? If so, are the Saints wearing black or white? That was the first game I ever attended and it's been so long ago I can't remember, seems to me they were in black but I'd love to get that confirmed because it has a bearing on which color custom throwback I'll order. Thought it would be cool to get what they were wearing the very first time I saw them play in person.