CCSLC Graphic Design Collective

[uniguy22]

Great idea, and best of luck to the venture.

While my design abilities range from mediocre to occasionally capable, I would have to recuse myself from active participation in submissions, as I am an MSPaint user, and I am not on a level with some of the better designers throwing their hats into the ring on this.

That said, I'd like to support in any way I could, even if I'd be relegated to fact-checking and obsessively-detailed critiques.  I don't know if that gets me title of Vice BiB, but that's what I am putting on my business cards. 

MS Paint user? That's not what it says in your sig. May I ask what program you're using for this autumn concept?

Ah, but it also says I didn't use AI or PhotoShop.

The program I used for the upcoming concept isn't a program at all (but I guess it does have a name, but that's personal! ). Everything you need to know is contained in the closing panel of my sig. And for the record, I will not be putting it up for critique, as I can not change it - and I already love the concept and consider it perfect.

Okay I feel like a tool now. Congrats Vitamin D.

[leggman01]

vitd - congrats...kids are a ton of fun once you realize you're never going to get a full nights sleep again...ever...for the rest of your life (or maybe it just feels that way since just about the time my then 2 1/2 year old started sleeping through the night, the 2nd one came along)

back on topic:

it was suggested that this collective begin by designing for high schools and small colleges, which is, in my opinion the proper market to begin with, but it poses some serious pitfalls, and business may be tough to drum up

i recently proposed a logo for a new high school opening in my hometown - granted, the logo wasn't nearly as good as ANYTHING this collective would come up with, but it's solid and better than about 75% of the high school logo's i see out there (most of which are rip-offs of college or pro teams) - i offered this set at a price lower than most designers hourly rate (along with some gear) - i proposed this set to the principal and AD in February or March, when the school announced it's mascot and colors...today i was notified that the school has decided to let a student competition winner design their logo - keep in mind, the school doesn't open until this fall - they are willing to go through a portion of the year without a logo (one that would have been very inexpensive and allowed them to sell some merchandise this fall) in order to have "student involvement" - now they may find some young, talented graphic artist in the making...or they might get crap - i hope they find the former - for those interested, here is the logo set i proposed

i think you'll find this type of thinking at a lot of other small schools, colleges included - chowan college in nc recently redesigned their logo, and went in-house with a graphic design faculty member...they got a nice illustration, but not a good logo - chowan logo

many of you probably saw that shaw university simply re-colored the drew rangers logo for their website (posted here recently)

even the school i work for has been somewhat reluctant to pull the trigger and hire a designer for a professional athletic logo, despite the fact that we currently use BAD clip art and many members of this community have proposed amazing (and affordable) designs

finding clients who see the big picture of athletic marketing and branding among high schools and small colleges will be difficult

[sbsofa06]

***

[toxicsoul]

Gee, thanks for again gracing us with your presence T O'G, mister sbsofa06. Aren't you the same one who wants to group a bunch a people to set the standards for the future of sports branding? What's so different, sometimes I really think you don't get it. Do you really think everyone you proposed your little project to believes in it the same way you do? Sad, very sad, do as I say not as I do.

[lost_limey]

I think this collective is a wonderful idea, although I'm all-to-aware that I don't have even the tiniest portion of the talent you guys display on a regular bais so I wouldn't be in it. However, likeleggman said, please make the evolution of the logo as public as possible so we can learn from your works.

[rmered]

How about this for an idea.

We post logos, with watermarks and set up a shop front type thing to allow people to purchase them.

Those who do the logos that get chosen, get paid.

Allow an option for people to request logos, which then becomes a competition.

Payment needs to go through, at least a deposit, which then goes to the chosen designer.

If the logos are aimed at fantasy sites and local sporting clubs, I would think there'd be enough interest for people to get paid.

A little like http://www.jamnart.com/products.htm

People select the logo they like (rather than a whole CD full) and download it for whatever is a fair price. Perhaps prices could be set by the designer.

[Mac the Knife]

As someone with a business bent might I suggest a few things?

First, a name. CCSLC Whatever is all well and good, but something more concise and less abbreviation-happy would be better. I suggest either CanUS Creative or CanUS Collective, particularly since (1) the bulk of the talent hails from either Canada or the U.S., and (2) those web domains happen to be available.

Second, a business structure - limited liability company, established under Nevada law. Why Nevada? Well, because (1) its simple, and (2) they're actually better than the famed Delaware. I volunteer my services in setting the thing up if someone in Nevada over the age of 18 is willing to serve as our Registered Agent there. But why LLC as opposed to a corporation? Read on...

Third, a business model - anyone can be a member of CanUS, and members could at least in theory come and go as they wished; though I suppose it'd be the desire of those involved that a "once out, stay out" policy would prevail.

In my suggestion there are different types of membership, each with its own financial obligations (to start any business, you do need money) and/or potential rewards. I suggest that CanUS have three types of members: (1) Charter Members, consisting of those folks that Mr. Creamer feels are, say, the most elite of the elite in their abilities (in terms of artistic talent and/or ability to retain clients), (2) Associate Members, consisting of anyone else who has artistic talent and wishes to participate, and (3) Managers, business types such as myself who might not be artistic, but can help with the kinds of things creative folks would rather not bother with (i.e., taxes, sales, etc.)

Fourth, a management style - CanUS would be governed by a 9-person Board of Managers, with 3 coming from each group of members. One person could be designated "Managing General Partner" if CanUS needed a figurehead, along with VP's or whatever.

Potential clients could be acquired from any source, with the scope of work ("SOW") being laid out for all members of CanUS to review. Designers wishing to do the work can submit their design(s) to the Board of Managers - which in turn takes the designs received and whittles the choices down to a select few that would be shown to the client.

If a design is selected, the designer receives a commission for the effort of 65% of whatever price is negotiated by the Board of Managers, payable upon receipt of payment from the client.

The remaining 35% is retained by CanUS, for covering expenses (particularly taxes, which on a venture like this would be higher than normal due to nominal ongoing operating expenses) and/or distribution to its members at the end of each year. Profits at the end of each year, with some money retained for future operations, would be distributed to the members: 35% to the Charter Members in collective, 35% to the Associate Members in collective, and 30% to the Managers in the collective.

If my numbers are off so be it, but does anyone think the concept's full of ?

[Jigga]

but does anyone think the concept's full of ?

Not at all, dude. You've pretty much nailed a framework.

[paynomind]

OR....

What this really seems all about to me is the talent around here to get an opportunity to design for the leads that Chris gets every day.

Why dont we make this whole damn thing easier on everyone, and chris can create a forum that he opens up for trusted members, where he can post a lead, designers can post comp tries at it, that Chris can deliver to the requestor to look at and choose.

Then, the chosen designer follows through, giving Chris a share.

Anyone think something that simple woudlnt work?

[Mac the Knife]

Anyone think something that simple woudlnt work?

No, but for only three reasons:

(1) Chris may not want to be burdened with such a thing on his own, and/or it may be seen by some whom he deals with (i.e., MLB, NHL, etc.) as a conflict of interest. Some might see this venture as breaching the non-commercial barrier.

(2) It'd create a separate class of members here for which there are potential financial benefits, and while I personally couldn't care less about such a thing I'm sure there are those who would be pissed about such a thing.

(3) Trust. Or more to the point, the lack of it. A number of us would trust others here with just about anything, but let's be realistic - friendships and business are a dicey mix, particularly when everything isn't spelled out in as much detail as possible.

An "open" (in terms of membership) but "closed" (in terms of having a formal, legal structure) arrangement such as what I've proposed is perhaps the only logical way to do it, both for sake of fairness and considering the number of people that could potentially be involved.

An artist under your idea who submits 25 designs and gets picked for none is going to ultimately blame Chris for something - but one who submits 25 concepts and gets picked as a finalist for none by a board of nine is going to ask where he can improve his skills.

[Brian in Boston]

I suggest either CanUS Creative or CanUS Collective, particularly since (1) the bulk of the talent hails from either Canada or the U.S., and (2) those web domains happen to be available.

Might I suggest CanAm Creative, instead? CanUS Creative sounds as though the design collective is asking potential clients to fire it before they've even gotten started.

Thanks for putting so much thought into a potential structure, Mac.

[Brian in Boston]

And, yes... domains are available for CanAm Creative.