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Everything posted by FinsUp1214

  1. I get where you’re coming from here, but I think you might be missing the bigger picture. Yes, the Jazz haven’t officially made all of those colors co-existing primary colors, and yes, everyone has city uniforms and most have had classic editions. But in the Jazz’s case, all of those identities have unofficially co-existed anyways because of how much these different identities have either segmented the fan base or led some fans to assume it’s all official. The story Smith told about D-Wade’s mom not knowing what the actual colors are isn’t all that uncommon, really, even within the Jazz fan base. Fans outside of our CCSLC community generally don’t know the fine details like we do, and sometimes we have to step away from our lens to see the bigger picture and wider effect of these brand choices: if the team wears it, it’s going to appear official to most fans no matter what the designation is. Take it from someone who goes to multiple games every year, ALL of those colors are routinely worn to games as if they are all official in some capacity. And to be totally honest? Redrock and purple is worn more than the primary navy/gold/green, at least by my eye test. You still see it of course, but not so much that you’d assume it to be the primary scheme. This isn’t like the occasional Chicago flag color stuff in a sea of red and black at Bulls games. In short, I’ve yet to attend a single game in which fans showed up to the arena in one dominant, “primary” color scheme (not including shirt giveaway games). You see them all, and some more do than what the team seems as primary. Maybe the team hasn’t made all of those colors co-existing primary colors officially, but the fan base sort of unofficially has. BTW: I do agree with you that black/white/yellow isn’t the right solution either. I’d much rather them pick either of the purple schemes, stick with it, and reinforce the brand that way.
  2. They nearly did over the course of two seasons in which they wore classic editions, as they coincided with two seasons of the redrock set. While you’re correct in that they’ve never busted out EVERY color they’ve ever worn in one season, they just about did it over two with the exception of powder blue. In both seasons, they wore three color schemes per season: - Navy/Gold/Forest Green - Redrock gradient (includes black) - Purple/Gold/Kelly Green or Purple/Teal/Sky Blue/Copper Sure, that isn’t all of the color schemes they’ve ever worn, but it’s still too way much over the course of one or even two seasons. And…..it also says a lot that it still wasn’t all the colors they’ve ever worn, either.
  3. Yeah, all of this. Add into that the only rationale for double blue seemingly being “uh, well, it snows here.” Compared to the very Utah-centric color scheme that preceded it (as well as a similarly Utah-centric color scheme for the Salt Lake Olympics just two years earlier), the double blue came off as generic-cold-weather-team as it gets. Adding copper or orange to it would’ve made it better, but I still don’t think it’d have escaped the inevitable comparisons to Denver and Memphis either.
  4. The yellow the Jazz have been using to go along with the black and white roll-out has been a bit brighter, with a little bit of a highlighter yellow look to it: I kind of get Columbus Crew vibes from it, though it would remain to be seen of course if they’d use the yellow as much as they do.
  5. Oh boy. As I’ve said before, I really do think this general idea is coming from a good place, and I do appreciate that ownership understands there’s a been a bad branding problem for some time. That said, I just don’t think this was the right solution at all. Instead of doubling down on and re-emphasizing one of the previous color schemes and cementing the brand that way (a la the Padres), they’ve just added one more color scheme on top of many. Perhaps this color scheme could look good in a vacuum (and of course I hope the final product does look good) but in the grand scheme of things, I think this is going to add more to the problem than solve it overall. Now the spilled skittles bag that is the collection of Jazz gear worn to the arena won’t match anything. In another tangent of thought, I’m curious how much bees/beehive as a state symbol has influenced the supposed color scheme? The baseball Bees also wear black/gold/white, so there’d be some cohesion there as well. Just something that came to mind.
  6. Wasn’t the Knicks’ anniversary uniform going to be the city uniform? Or am I misremembering that? Seems like city and classic are one in the same for this year, at least that’s been my assumption (could absolutely be wrong though - it’s hard to keep track of the NBA’s system these days).
  7. The Mavs’ court tributes to every player in team history is an interesting feature in theory, but it’s naturally going to outdate itself very quickly with new acquisitions via trade, signings, etc. Unless Mark Cuban’s cool with a new court every single year, of course. Also, I’m sure #MFFL means something to Mavs fans, but it also sounds like an abbreviated version of something Samuel L. Jackson would say.
  8. To be honest, as a Jazz fan myself, I’m going to come to Wade’s defense here. I haven’t seen anything myself that alludes to him making ego-driven decisions. He did tweet a couple of months ago (in response to another tweet asking about purple, I think) something about “new fire” coming for the Jazz down the road, but didn’t specify if that was a future alternate, a future rebrand, or if it was uniform related at all. He also never - as far as I’ve seen - has alluded that anything has been his sole decision or influence, either. I think that tweet paired with the black and white stuff slowly coming out is giving the impression he’s behind it all, but I honestly think it may be him and Smith together. The Smith tweet pointing out the color scheme mess lends me to believe this approach is meant to be thier solution to a branding problem, and nothing ego-driven or “change for change’s sake”. Now granted, I don’t agree at all with the black and white solution (if it’s really a thing) and think going back to one of the classic purple schemes is the better route to go. That said, I’m not in the least worried about any sort of ego-trip or stranglehold going on from ownership. I genuinely believe they’re trying to tackle the Jazz’s branding problems and that it’s all coming from a good place. I’m very stoked to have Wade and Smith as owners, and the good they’re already doing with the team and community is absolutely worth any branding directions they take, regardless of whether or not I’ll like the aesthetic result.
  9. Ransom note-ing a word mark is one thing (and a bad thing, too), but ransom note-ing jersey numbers? Awful, awful idea. Wouldn’t that pose some legibility problems? I feel like I’d have to double-take all the time to see what number is what in action.
  10. The “UTAH JAZZ” wordmark at the practice facility seems to be new, as well - I don’t think I’ve seen that font before. Seems interesting to me that a completely different font would be used prominently at the practice facility now. Paired with that Ryan Smith tweet and D-Wade hinting at some new “fire” or whatever he tweeted a couple months ago, I’d say this *could be* a soft lead in to another rebrand for possibly 2022-23. If so, then I’m not sure how I feel about this. I do really like black and white in a vacuum, but I also struggle to see how it would theoretically improve the Jazz brand in any way, or represent Utah in any fashion. I’m very glad that Ryan Smith is indeed aware that the Jazz’s current brand is an absolute circus, I just don’t think simplifying to black and white is the right answer. It’s just going to add one more scheme and convolute the historical brand further. I’d much rather them settle back on the original colors or mountain scheme, never wear navy or redrock again, and solidify the brand that way. Preferably the mountain scheme to tie stronger to Utah’s geography. Granted, I do like black and white enough that the right branding could possibly sway me, but for now I just don’t think that’s the answer. We’ll also have to see if it actually happens, too.
  11. 100% agree that green matches the area well (lots of forests all across the state), but as I’ve said before, I feel like the redrock only represents a part of the state rather than the whole thing. The color scheme looks very out of place when compared to the Wasatch Front, and it’s one of the reasons it has never really meshed with me (and this is coming from someone whose father’s family hails from southern Utah - I have lots of ties to the region and love it). One of the reasons I really loved the color scheme of the Finals teams was that it looked like it represented the whole state - purple, sky blue, and teal evoked the mountains, snow, and forests well, and copper was a great “catch all” color that evoked the deserts well (in addition to nodding to the state’s copper industry). You could argue too that the color scheme’s similarities to the early Diamondbacks gave the scheme a versatility that allowed it to look “mountain” and “southwest” all at once. I think if the Jazz are going to truly represent the state in color and brand, they have to strike a balance like the 90’s scheme did. Doesn’t necessarily have to be the same exact colors, but the approach needs to cater to the diverse geography of the state rather than a part of it. The double blue color scheme that followed suffered from being much more “generic cold weather team” than its predecessor and excluding southern Utah, and the redrock color scheme suffers a similar problem in reverse: a scheme that, while referencing redrock country, is still somewhat generically “hot” and excludes the Wasatch Front.
  12. This is precisely what I see when I go to games, and it irritates me to no end. Crazy to think it really wasn’t that long ago that the Jazz were an unmistakably purple team; now I really couldn’t tell you what they are, even as a fan! Good grief.
  13. The Jazz likely just finished thier offseason moves by trading a 2nd rounder to Golden State for Eric Paschall. If they are indeed finished, then I think they’ve done an excellent job altogether. They kept the main core together and got a whole lot more versatility and depth in addition. As for concerns over the Jazz’s ability to play small ball, they’ve addressed it now: And for opponents/lineups with more traditional bigs? Whiteside can take on the Gobert role very well off the bench. Having the small ball rotation context in clear view now helps the Whiteside signing make a lot of sense now. All in all? The Jazz really seemed like they had a specific plan to address thier weaknesses and seem to have executed it well. Of course we’ll see how it translates during the season, but so far I’m really thrilled and satisfied. Can’t wait! (Also low key very glad I don’t have to change my avatar now)
  14. I don’t understand Oregon’s insistence on the helmet wings. The “O” is a much stronger (and iconic) mark for the helmet, in my opinion. The wings, however, have never lost that “gimmicky” look to me over the years.
  15. Other reports say the deal is two years, around $12 mil. Sounds like that was their TPMLE target, and they got him! I like this deal and I like what the Jazz are doing so far. Between drafting Butler, shedding some salary, and signing Conley and Gay, they’re addressing thier needs well. Gay’s older, yes, but what he’s got in the tank can still make a difference where we need it. Now, the Jazz need to get a backup center who can stretch the floor. The well’s running a bit dry right now, but still some serviceable options out there. Maybe they even take a swing at someone like Jock Landale? He’s been great these Olympics. EDIT: They signed Whiteside…guess that means Gay will play some stretch 5 then when needed!
  16. Oh I 100% understand that, I get the approach for sure. I don’t think a monochromatic ad is going to blend in as much as some companies must feel, though. Player close-ups on broadcasts happen all the time; free throws, interviews, after the whistle, instant replay, etc. A monochromatic ad would still be very visible and readable in those cases, without the need for large white backgrounds or starkly contrasting colors. So while I completely understand where the approach is coming from, I also don’t think it’s as necessary as it’s made out to be.
  17. I really love the way New Zealand incorporated the silver fern into their kits this go-round:
  18. Oh man, that new Rockets patch is bad. Looks more like a sticker or button. I get that some of these companies likely want to express thier branding to the fullest when used as jersey ads (keeping the patch in brand colors), but it’s hard for me to believe there aren’t monochromatic white or black logo versions that could’ve been used instead.
  19. If the Cubs have relinquished the loveable losers role, the Mariners can swoop in to fill thier place; a usually average-to-bad squad of pretty likeable guys and occasional stars who are champions of being trade bait for prospects and nothing else, and haven’t been in the playoffs since Savage Garden was still together. Also usually run by the lethal combination of cheap ownership and (recently) a GM who looooves to trade until the team actually has a shot to make a wild card run with the right moves, at which point the clock strikes the midnight before the trade deadline and he turns back into a pumpkin.
  20. It’s weird; the Angels have worn thier current set for nearly 20 years, won a ring in it, and is the essential uniform of one of the greatest players of this generation. And yet? These throwbacks still somehow look more “right” than the current set does. I don’t know why. I think I blame Rod Carew for rocking them so well. (Some minor differences in number font and sleeve stripe thickness, yes, but still)
  21. Let’s agree to disagree at this point, then. I still don’t believe the playing field is as consistently level as some are making it out to be, but I genuinely do respect and admire the optimism some of you have in the league as a whole. I don’t quite have that level of optimism myself, but maybe it’ll get there eventually. The cautious level I do have - especially lately - is still some optimism nevertheless, and more so than I’ve had in a while.
  22. Darn, that’s too bad we’ll never see it! I was looking forward to it because I figured there’d be a good chance it would’ve been purple (or even green). Oh well. Maybe they’ll whip something up and finally let go of the red rocks for the 100th anniversary!
  23. I completely get it. Teams like Sacramento and Minnesota crap the bed routinely (a point I already agreed to upthread). Fans of those kinds of teams should channel thier frustrations towards inept management above all. But acting as if every small-market team is Sacramento and Minnesota is a broad brush to paint with. There’s others who, despite not being perfect by any means, have done a good job of keeping competitive, making good decisions, and progressively getting better with what they have. Sometimes those same teams watch thier star(s) take off, despite thier best efforts to keep them. HeIl, Toronto won a title and still couldn’t keep Kawhi from bolting to LA. If those front offices don’t necessarily warrant the kind of frustrations the Kings and Wolves do, then what should those fans do? Where should thier frustrations in falling short go? Fate? Should they just shrug thier shoulders and go “oh well!” again and again? That’s not something that is so easy to deal with or just shrug off. From my perspective as a small-market fan, moves in this era like LeBron leaving for Miami (and again for LA), Durant to Golden State, and Kahwi to LA among others has set a sort of expectation and fear that stars will always find a greener pasture than your own team, sooner than later. That’s not always fun to have in the back of your head when rooting for your team, and it’s a tough pill to swallow and come back from when it does happen. Add to that the level of difficulty and years involved in successfully rebuilding organically - especially when your market isn’t necessarily an attractive one - and it explains pretty well why small-market fans get jaded and frustrated. This, again, doesn’t mean big markets are evil for capitalizing on the opportunities freer player movement affords. It also, however, doesn’t mean small-market fans don’t have the right to vent thier frustrations and feel that title hopes are harder to reach, especially if thier front offices ARE trying to build something, but it doesn’t work out.
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