Alt-History 1960's-70's Soccer as America's Pastime! Logos! Kits! 3D Stadiums! Thrills! (4/12-NYCFC done!)

[Guest darkpiranha]

Ugh!  This is the part of modern graphic design where it's a sickening embarrassment of riches.  So many amazing programs to learn the basics of, much less master.  And Adobe fixing to announce all their new versions in the next few days.   Make it stop!  Let me catch up!   SketchUp will be fun to learn.  

[Thazer]

It's not really about the programs or their freebies,  it's about the techniques. For example,  I dont bother modeling actual geometry when a good texture will do the job.  I mean the seats are just 3 solid planes: 2 arm rests and the backing. Put textures on, copy/paste that seat and boom you have thousands of seats. Or you could ignore armrests and still sell the illusion with just the seat backs. It's really about how much immersion you want the viewer to have. 

 

I could start a sketchup omnibus thread if there's actual interest. 

[Guest darkpiranha]

Here's a question.  Do any of you have any experience with exporting SketchUp models into a format like .obj?  I'd love to be able to bring a stadium model into Cinema 4D or some other 3D program and animate it using all the lighting and effects available to me in the more advanced programs.

[Guest darkpiranha]

1 minute ago, Commodore Crablegs said:

It's not really about the programs or their freebies,  it's about the techniques. For example,  I dont bother modeling actual geometry when a good texture will do the job.  I mean the seats are just 3 solid planes: 2 arm rests and the backing. Put textures on, copy/paste that seat and boom you have thousands of seats. Or you could ignore armrests and still sell the illusion with just the seat backs. It's really about how much immersion you want the viewer to have. 

 

I could start a sketchup omnibus thread if there's actual interest. 

 

I'd LOVE that.  What would be really cool is if you (and anyone else on here who knows a lot about a specific program) could hold a sort of live art session where you just stream working on it for an hour or so, explaining your process and perhaps taking questions from a chat room.  It could be called "Mockup Academy"

[lopernv]

11 minutes ago, darkpiranha said:

Here's a question.  Do any of you have any experience with exporting SketchUp models into a format like .obj?  I'd love to be able to bring a stadium model into Cinema 4D or some other 3D program and animate it using all the lighting and effects available to me in the more advanced programs.

 

I've imported geometry from SketchUp into Rhino as .obj. It triangulates the surfaces (like this) so it's not very editable, but the textures import with it. 

 

If you were using it to just manipulate lighting, I'm sure it would be fine.

[GeauxColonels]

2 hours ago, Commodore Crablegs said:

It's not really about the programs or their freebies,  it's about the techniques. For example,  I dont bother modeling actual geometry when a good texture will do the job.  I mean the seats are just 3 solid planes: 2 arm rests and the backing. Put textures on, copy/paste that seat and boom you have thousands of seats. Or you could ignore armrests and still sell the illusion with just the seat backs. It's really about how much immersion you want the viewer to have. 

 

I could start a sketchup omnibus thread if there's actual interest. 

How much time would you say you spent on the NYCFC stadium concept? It's absolutely gorgeous.

[Thazer]

Actual modeling time prob a few hours.  Overall maybe 30? It's really all about photoshopping textures. 

 

Better textures = better stadium! 

If I were to remove the textures you'd see the actual models are incredibly basic. 

[Bulldog]

Your output so far has been superb.  I would say, however, that America wouldn't name its stadiums after the street it's on.  There'd be some with names like, say, "Highbridge Park," but others would be named after owners or given generic names like "War Memorial Stadium."  This being the early 70's, there'd also be more places with names like "The Houston Dome" (Also, Houston must play in a dome), and a few would get corporate names (I'd go with Budweiser, Schlitz, and other brewers to start).  It is unlikely that most teams would stick with their original stadiums, as teams often moved because their 1900-1920 built stadiums were usually:

A. In some state of disrepair.

B. Located in the middle of crumbling ghettoes.

Also, I doubt many teams would go with "FC."  Most teams would end up being referred to by their nickname- it's good marketing.  Plus, mascots bring in kids/families, a demographic that American sports relied on more than their British counterparts during the 70's (and even today).

But, these are quibbles.  Your uniforms and stadia look superb, and I hope you keep up the good work!  Next, to Boston! (I hope.)

[Bulldog]

Also, will we get to see the lower divisions down the road?  That would be really cool.

[OlavoP]

You just continue to impress me everytime. Waiting for more (Boston please)

 

[Thazer]

2 hours ago, Bulldog said:

Your output so far has been superb.  I would say, however, that America wouldn't name its stadiums after the street it's on.  There'd be some with names like, say, "Highbridge Park," but others would be named after owners or given generic names like "War Memorial Stadium."  This being the early 70's, there'd also be more places with names like "The Houston Dome" (Also, Houston must play in a dome), and a few would get corporate names (I'd go with Budweiser, Schlitz, and other brewers to start).  It is unlikely that most teams would stick with their original stadiums, as teams often moved because their 1900-1920 built stadiums were usually:

A. In some state of disrepair.

B. Located in the middle of crumbling ghettoes.

Also, I doubt many teams would go with "FC."  Most teams would end up being referred to by their nickname- it's good marketing.  Plus, mascots bring in kids/families, a demographic that American sports relied on more than their British counterparts during the 70's (and even today).

But, these are quibbles.  Your uniforms and stadia look superb, and I hope you keep up the good work!  Next, to Boston! (I hope.)

ooohh yeeeaaaahh!

dont take my about to be meticulous reply as being overly defensive, cause i enjoy discussing sports history and culture! and clearly you're giving this as much thought as i have.

 

2 hours ago, Bulldog said:

 I would say, however, that America wouldn't name its stadiums after the street it's on.

why not?

2 hours ago, Bulldog said:

There'd be some with names like, say, "Highbridge Park," but others would be named after owners or given generic names like "War Memorial Stadium."  This being the early 70's, there'd also be more places with names like "The Houston Dome" (Also, Houston must play in a dome), and a few would get corporate names (I'd go with Budweiser, Schlitz, and other brewers to start).

the generic names are almost exclusively tax funded stadiums. riverfront, 3-river, milwaukee county, oakland alameda, baltimore memorial etc..

sponsored names are interesting. for a long time the mlb banned naming stadiums after products. busch had to make a new line of beer named after himself to skirt that. wrigley obviously didnt have that issue. i may rename some of the less inspired-ly named stadiums after retro corps

pan-am field!

burger chef park!

AMC stadium!

....

why arent euro stadiums named after the owners?

 

2 hours ago, Bulldog said:

 It is unlikely that most teams would stick with their original stadiums, as teams often moved because their 1900-1920 built stadiums were usually:

A. In some state of disrepair.

B. Located in the middle of crumbling ghettoes.

actually addressing this, if there were no tax funded stadiums, the vast majority would have stayed:

of the original 16 mlb teams:

Braves Field (late 1915–1952) - moved to tax funded milwaukee county stadium

Fenway Park (1912–present)

Ebbets Field (1913–1957) - moved to LA chavez ravine, land seized by imminent domain and basically swapped given to the dodgers.

Comiskey Park (mid 1910–1990) - moved across the street to tax funded stadium

Wrigley Field (1914–present)

Crosley Field (1912-mid 1970) - moved to tax funded riverfront

League Park (1910–1946) - moved to tax funded cleve municipal

Tiger Stadium (1912–1999) - moved to tax funded comerica

Polo Grounds (mid 1911–1957, 1962–1963) - moved to tax funded candlestick

Yankee Stadium (1923–2008) - moved across the street to 50% tax funded stadium

Shibe Park/Connie Mack Stadium (1909–1970) - moved to tax funded veterans, moved to tax funded KC municipal

Forbes Field (mid 1909-mid 1970) - moved to tax funded 3 rivers

Sportsman's Park (1909-early 1966) - moved to tax funded busch(!), moved to tax funded baltmore memorial

Griffith Stadium (1911–1961) - moved to tax funded rfk

 

so pretty much in my alt universe, america isnt ridiculously hypocritical [whoa politics!] .......uh, its actually plausible.

 

In general though I'm creating the the alt-history that I'd want to see.

I'll not do something like...'this team once had an ornate victorian stadium in crack-town, and just recently replaced it with a concrete doughnut in the suburbs!'

Realistic? yes, fun? nope.

 

Its why i have a huge interest in englands football league. up until the mid 70s, or even up to hillsborough, the stadiums still retained their hodgepodge character and teams almost never moved. i'm imagining that here in the US. for me, there'd be no point to the alt universe if half the league was emirates stadium, gimme highbury! thats why i set it back in time. i guess if i wanted to be more consistent with the real universe i'd have set it in the late 60s.

 

whew....that was fun

[Bulldog]

6 minutes ago, Commodore Crablegs said:

 

ooohh yeeeaaaahh!

dont take my about to be meticulous reply as being overly defensive, cause i enjoy discussing sports history and culture! and clearly you're giving this as much thought as i have.

 

why not?

 

the generic names are almost exclusively tax funded stadiums. riverfront, 3-river, milwaukee county, oakland alameda, baltimore memorial etc..

sponsored names are interesting. for a long time the mlb banned naming stadiums after products. busch had to make a new line of beer named after himself to skirt that. wrigley obviously didnt have that issue. i may rename some of the less inspired-ly named stadiums after retro corps

pan-am field!

burger chef park!

AMC stadium!

....

why arent euro stadiums named after the owners?

 

actually addressing this, if there were no tax funded stadiums, the vast majority would have stayed:

of the original 16 mlb teams:

Braves Field (late 1915–1952) - moved to tax funded milwaukee county stadium

Fenway Park (1912–present)

Ebbets Field (1913–1957) - moved to LA chavez ravine, land seized by imminent domain and basically swapped given to the dodgers.

Comiskey Park (mid 1910–1990) - moved across the street to tax funded stadium

Wrigley Field (1914–present)

Crosley Field (1912-mid 1970) - moved to tax funded riverfront

League Park (1910–1946) - moved to tax funded cleve municipal

Tiger Stadium (1912–1999) - moved to tax funded comerica

Polo Grounds (mid 1911–1957, 1962–1963) - moved to tax funded candlestick

Yankee Stadium (1923–2008) - moved across the street to 50% tax funded stadium

Shibe Park/Connie Mack Stadium (1909–1970) - moved to tax funded veterans, moved to tax funded KC municipal

Forbes Field (mid 1909-mid 1970) - moved to tax funded 3 rivers

Sportsman's Park (1909-early 1966) - moved to tax funded busch(!), moved to tax funded baltmore memorial

Griffith Stadium (1911–1961) - moved to tax funded rfk

 

so pretty much in my alt universe, america isnt ridiculously hypocritical [whoa politics!] .......uh, its actually plausible.

 

In general though I'm creating the the alt-history that I'd want to see.

I'll not do something like...'this team once had an ornate victorian stadium in crack-town, and just recently replaced it with a concrete doughnut in the suburbs!'

Realistic? yes, fun? nope.

 

Its why i have a huge interest in englands football league. up until the mid 70s, or even up to hillsborough, the stadiums still retained their hodgepodge character and teams almost never moved. i'm imagining that here in the US. for me, there'd be no point to the alt universe if half the league was emirates stadium, gimme highbury! thats why i set it back in time. i guess if i wanted to be more consistent with the real universe i'd have set it in the late 60s.

 

whew....that was fun

Wow, interesting reply. I see where you're coming from now, with stadiums. Hell, if a few cities hadn't built 'em in the '50's, there might not be any. Hell, I wish we'd preserved more of these places. All that said, though, Houston should play in a dome.

[Bulldog]

On April 14, 2016 at 10:25 PM, Commodore Crablegs said:

the generic names are almost exclusively tax funded stadiums. riverfront, 3-river, milwaukee county, oakland alameda, baltimore memorial etc..

sponsored names are interesting. for a long time the mlb banned naming stadiums after products. busch had to make a new line of beer named after himself to skirt that. wrigley obviously didnt have that issue. i may rename some of the less inspired-ly named stadiums after retro corps

pan-am field!

burger chef park!

AMC stadium!

Good Idea.  Don't forget Schlitz Beer though.  Maybe a good name for Milwaukee.  Plus, Schlitz was on the same level as Bud and above Miller until it made some poor business decisions in the mid '70's.  There were a few "War Memorial Park" type things pre-public funding though, although those were more common in football.

Quote

why arent euro stadiums named after the owners?

Owners played a less active role, and there are a lot of Packers type teams.  That wouldn't be the case in USA.  Maybe name some fields after old-time owners, like Cominsky, Crosley, Connie Mack, and Griffith.  

Quote

In general though I'm creating the the alt-history that I'd want to see.

I'll not do something like...'this team once had an ornate victorian stadium in crack-town, and just recently replaced it with a concrete doughnut in the suburbs!'

Realistic? yes, fun? nope.

Yeah, I kinda agree.  20 concrete-astroturf donuts would get old fast, although one would be fun.  I think Houston, since the climate made their first stadium a mosquito-ridden hellhole.  Plus, knowing how the Yankees operate, there'd be enough police to make the stadiums islands of suburbia in the middle of crack-town.

Quote

 

Its why i have a huge interest in englands football league. up until the mid 70s, or even up to hillsborough, the stadiums still retained their hodgepodge character and teams almost never moved. i'm imagining that here in the US. for me, there'd be no point to the alt universe if half the league was emirates stadium, gimme highbury! thats why i set it back in time. i guess if i wanted to be more consistent with the real universe i'd have set it in the late 60's.

Well, then the unis would be boring.  The English stadiums were distinct until the 90's, when people realized that TV makes money and that nobody will go to a crumbling cesspit filled with thugs if watching TV is an option, so they either cleaned up their old fields or tore 'em down.  This wouldn't be an issue in the US, where we like tradition and security is a priority.

[Bulldog]

Top Division

1989- Dir. David S. Ward

Cleveland F.C. "The Tribe" hasn't won a title since the 40's, and now yo-yos between the First and Second division.  The new owner, Rachel Phelps, in hope of cutting costs to maintain her extravagant lifestyle, fires her manager and replaces him with Lou Brown (James Gammon), longtime manager of the fourth division Toledo Mud Hens F. C.  She also sells her stars, mandating Brown build a new team on the cheap.  Brown signs striker Ricky Vaughn (Charlie Sheen), a felon from the California Penitentiary League, who has a blazing shot but lacks accuracy, and George Taylor (Michael Caine), an aging British striker with knee problems (Caine was happy to play a deconstruction of the various "aging team captain" roles he'd been typecast in throughout the decade).  The only returning player from the previous season is Marcel Dorne (Christopher Lambert), an arrogant French goalie who worries that an injury will damage his endorsement opportunities.  Desperate for new blood, Brown holds an open tryout where he recruits "Willie Mays" Hayes (Wesley Snipes), a speedy midfielder with a weak shot.  Rounding out the team is Eddie Harris (Chelcie Ross), an aged evangelical Christian who relies on a number of elaborate flops to stay in the game, and Pedro Cerrano (Dennis Haysbert), a voodoo worshipping Haitian with a superb shot and complete inability to dribble..... (You all know where it goes from here).

Any thoughts?  Anyone want me to do any other movies?

[Thazer]

....

 

semi-pro.

[Bulldog]

Haven't seen that in its entirety.  Any others?

[Bulldog]

Moneyball

2011- Dir. Bennett Miller

The year is 2002.  Billy Beane (Brad Pitt) is manager of Oakland Oaks FC, a cash strapped First Division team.  He is faced with the impending loss of star players Johnny Damon, LaDanian Tomlinson*, and Jason Isringhausen to transfers and free agency.  He visits Cleveland FC to try to find a replacement for Damon, to no avail.  While there, he meets Peter Brand (Jonah Hill), who suggests that Beane can build a team using objective statistical analysis to find undervalued players.  To replace Damon at midfield, Beane signs David Justice (Stephen Bishop), a past-his-peak former star from FCNY.  To replace Tomlinson, one of the most productive strikers in the league, Beane uses Milan Rapaic (Anton Yelchin), a star from the Croatian league (as Brand puts it "The most undervalued league in the world").  At goalie, Beane signs Scott Hatteberg, whose frequent injuries are the result of the astroturf he played on with Houston FC.  During the transfer window, Beane sells Norberto (Bruno Gagliasso), an overrated Brazilian (an overvalued nationality according to Brand) striker on a temporary hot streak, to South Boston FC in exchange for Ray Durham, a consistently talented striker who Beane will be able to sell for twice as much the next season.  Beans also becomes the first manager in the league to hire re-location consultants to help adjust players to their new homes, which helps increase player productivity.  In the end, the Oaks win the US Open cup and the National Championship, but are ignored by the football establishment because of an embarrassing loss to Boca Juniors in the semifinal of the Copa Libertadores.  Soon, however, Beane receives an offer from Boston Towne**.  Beans turns this down, reassured by the fact that teams are learning from his success.  Text before the credits show that using Beane's methods, Boston Towne won the Triple Crown in 2004, part of that award their first National Championship since 1918.

*No way in hell Giambi has the speed to play soccer.

**Which, by the way, should be your name for the first division Boston team.

[Bulldog]

By the way, as a native Bostonian, I can see three teams in the Greater Boston Area.

Boston Towne (First Division)

Founded- 1901

Stadium- Fenway Park

Nickname- The Red Sox

Team Anthem- "Tessie" a Traditional Fan Chant.

Supporters Group- The Royal Rooters

Colors- Red and Blue

Other Notes- The biggest and most popular team in the area.  Fans spread evenly throughout Greater Boston Area.

South Boston FC (First Division)

Founded- 1925

Stadium- Little Dublin

Nickname- The Irish, Southie

Team Anthem- "Shipping up to Boston" by The Dropkick Murphys (The Boondock Saints Theme is played after every win)

Supporters Group- The Celts

Colors- Green, White, and Orange

Other Notes- Though only a mid-table team, South Boston has a deeply loyal fanbase in the working-class, predominantly Irish areas of Charlestown and South Boston.

Boston City (Second Division)

Founded- 1871

Stadium- Braves Field

Nickname- The Braves, the Bees, the Bulldogs

Team Anthem- "Dirty Water" by the Standells

Supporters Group- the Beaneaters

Colors- Blue and Red

Other Notes- Popular among some in the suburbs, thanks to easy access from the highway, but a smaller club that mostly bounces between the Second and Third Divisions.

[Dan O'Mac]

I can't wait to see you give Wrigley the Soccer treatment.

[Thazer]

ill be honest. i burned the hell out!

i was knee deep in soccerfenway but fenway's unique stadium footprint demanded a custom wonky design....and i was cutting corners and being sloppy. i was recycling parts of other stadiums ive done and just was gonna slap a green monster concept on it and call it a day. thats why i wasnt posting process work!

 

but eff that. no excuses for lameness. ill take a break*.

if any of you peeps have stadium ideas, totally share them here!!!!

 

 

 

 

 

 

* a basketball break.......