Cleveland Browns Unis

[pcgd]

Looking at SI today, and I saw the Kellen Winslow Jr. Article and noticed that the Browns have an AL on their left sholder, on the stripes. Anyone know what this is?

[Joshawaggie]

for the owner that died, last year, or the year before, Al Lerner, I think its gonna stay that way, like the Bears' GSH for Halas. Lerner was the one who brought back the Browns.

[pcgd]

Cool, that's what I figured. Damn, talk about quick service!

[Joshawaggie]

speedy delivery

[Lee.]

And that, my friends, is, sadly, the most eligible man in Fargo.

[Gothamite]

I think it's silly.

To compare Al Lerner to George Halas is absurd. Halas, as much as I hate the Bears, guided the franchise for decades. He built the team, and in no small part the NFL.

Lerner, on the other hand, only invested a bunch of money in a guaranteed, low-risk investment.

I have no beef with Lerner, hate Halas and respect the Browns, but you just can't compare the two.

[pcgd]

Hey! I hate the packers but I don't hate Lombardi!

[Gothamite]

I don't hate Lerner, I just think elevating him to this level is at best arrogant and at worst offensive to more important figures.

It's insulting to Halas to place Lerner on this level. It's insulting to Paul Brown. Heck, it's even insulting to Jim Brown, to have Lerner's "accomplishment" raised over theirs.

The Browns have a long and glorious history. They don't need to pretend that this guy was some great figure in their franchise's history.

What exactly was his accomplishment, except to sink money in a guaranteed investment?

Again, I don't hate him, I don't even dislike him. I do dislike what the Browns are trying to do, though.

[quantum]

I don't hate Lerner, I just think elevating him to this level is at best arrogant and at worst offensive to more important figures.

It's insulting to Halas to place Lerner on this level. It's insulting to Paul Brown. Heck, it's even insulting to Jim Brown, to have Lerner's "accomplishment" raised over theirs.

The Browns have a long and glorious history. They don't need to pretend that this guy was some great figure in their franchise's history.

What exactly was his accomplishment, except to sink money in a guaranteed investment?

Again, I don't hate him, I don't even dislike him. I do dislike what the Browns are trying to do, though.

I agree. A one-year tribute is good. But to treat it as if he was George Halas, that's just wrong.

Of course, based on this criteria, Paul Tagliabue should have his initials on the jersey when he passes. After all, if it wasn't for the NFL management and ownership group, we wouldn't even be talking about Cleveland.

[Gothamite]

Or the Mayor of Cleveland, who threatened legal action. Which was the real motivation in leaving the name behind.

I just don't get it. Any Browns fans want to tell me just what Lerner did to warrant comparing him to Halas?

[andrewharrington]

well basically its this, and keep in mind i am in no way putting him on the same level as george halas, but basically, art modell was a dick for moving the fottball team out of a football city, and then lerner was instrumental in assuring the city that a team would be coming back in less than 5 years and that it would retain the name, colors, and history od the original team. hes not a god-like figure like george halas, but hes important to football fans in a city where football is important. also aided by the fact that he died while in tenure. itd be a similar deal for rooney in pittsburgh im sure. i dunno. the patch doesnt bother me, but im not sure it should be permanent.

[Gothamite]

But Lerner wasn't any more responsible for returning the Browns to Baltimore any more than he was responsible for the original Browns leaving (the deal to move them was reportedly struck in Lerner's jet, after all).

The NFL took the name from Modell and reserved it for Cleveland not because of Lerner, but because of the dozens of threatened lawsuits, including one from the City of Cleveland. So it'd be as appropriate to honor trial lawyers as Lerner. Lerner was just the guy in the right place at the right time.

I maintain that all Lerner did was put money into a guaranteed investment. He might have been a swell guy and a great philanthropist, he was certainly worth honoring upon his passing, but to make his initials a permanent part of the Browns uniform is completely out of proportion to his relative contributions to the franchise.

[andrewharrington]

exactly, i dont think it should be permanent, and hes not being compared to george halas just cuz his initials appear on a sleeve. he was popular here. and no, he wasnt responsible for the colors and name staying, that was the city of cleveland and mayor mike white, but if he didnt invest then no, there would be no browns and yes, cleveland would still be pissed off and bitter and hate the ravens even more because we wouldnt have an opportunity to beat art modell on the gridiron

[Gothamite]

I see no reason to believe that Lerner's absence would have made one whit of difference in the City of Cleveland getting the Browns back. Quite the opposite. If Lerner hadn't invested, somebody else would have. Maybe they wouldn't have lived in Cleveland, but somebody would have invested. The money had a guaranteed return. It was a guaranteed investment. After the public relations fiasco of Modell leaving, there's no way that the NFL would let the new Browns fail.

If the Browns are going to keep his initials on the sleeve permanently, that is comparing him to Halas. That's an honor that only Halas had, until the Browns decided that Lerner ought to have it as well.

Let me say again that I admire the guy. I think the Browns should have honored him upon his death with a sleeve patch for the season. But I think it's just goofy to make his patch a permanent part of the uniform.

[habsfannova]

I see no reason to believe that Lerner's absence would have made one whit of difference in the City of Cleveland getting the Browns back. Quite the opposite. If Lerner hadn't invested, somebody else would have. Maybe they wouldn't have lived in Cleveland, but somebody would have invested. The money had a guaranteed return. It was a guaranteed investment. After the public relations fiasco of Modell leaving, there's no way that the NFL would let the new Browns fail.

If the Browns are going to keep his initials on the sleeve permanently, that is comparing him to Halas. That's an honor that only Halas had, until the Browns decided that Lerner ought to have it as well.

Let me say again that I admire the guy. I think the Browns should have honored him upon his death with a sleeve patch for the season. But I think it's just goofy to make his patch a permanent part of the uniform.

Now, not picking a fight or anything, do you think any other owners have earned the right to have their names on a teams sleeve?

[andrewharrington]

not "owners" per se, but there are plenty of other individuals who deserve their names on a sleeve, but their respective franchises are now defunct. (speaking of individuals who had a big hand in getting the league on its feet while playing for it. NOT speaking of current owners becasue no, there are none, unless you want to count art modell becasue he "created" the ravens and brought football back to baltimore. cough haha joke.) with the exception of the rooney family, the only other notable owners in the NFL right now are known mainly for their greed, perfectionism, temperamentality, or stupidity. people like jerry jones or al davis.

[IceCap]

was lerner in the right place at the right time? yes. however, in reality he was the one who made it possible for the browns to come back. the sleeve patch plays right into the browns-ravens rivalry. years from now browns fans can tell people how the evil art mondell stole the team away, but because of lerner, the browns are back, redy to kick some raven a$$. then they can say that because lerner brought back the browns, he is honerd with a permenent part of the uni.

[andrewharrington]

you said it, my man!

[IceCap]

you said it, my man!

thanx. i dont see how putting lerner's initials on the sleeve is compaqring hime to halas. people who know about both men know the difference between them, and those who dont could alsways look into football history.

[mjrbaseball]

Now, not picking a fight or anything, do you think any other owners have earned the right to have their names on a teams sleeve?

Perhaps Al Davis with the Raiders ... (Is he the last original AFL owner left?)