Penguins to KC

[NickNickNick]

So Mario Lemieux basically opened the door to bidders on the Penguins today, by saying it's pretty much too late for a new arena in 2007, after the old Mellon one expires. The Pens can start entertaining offers in June, 2006.

Kansas City is apparently one of the frontrunners...any ideas as to who else could realistically get the team and what they'll be called.

No one say Scouts.

[Blue Falcon]

As a Pens fan, this really pi$$es me off. It's just unbelieveable that the tightwad city of Pittsburgh would allow this team to get away. I hope they leave the unis/colors/stats in P-burgh in case the NHL decides to expand again...or move the Blue Jackets.

[TBGKon]

As a Pens fan, this really pi$$es me off. It's just unbelieveable that the tightwad city of Pittsburgh would allow this team to get away. I hope they leave the unis/colors/stats in P-burgh in case the NHL decides to expand again...or move the Blue Jackets.

If the city of Pittsburgh cannot support the Pens, what's to say they'll support a relocated or expansion team?

[pooter]

As a Pens fan, this really pi$$es me off. It's just unbelieveable that the tightwad city of Pittsburgh would allow this team to get away. I hope they leave the unis/colors/stats in P-burgh in case the NHL decides to expand again...or move the Blue Jackets.

Why whould they want to move the Blue Jackets to Pittsburgh?

2001-2002

8 Columbus 41 743,576 18,136 100.0%

22 Pittsburgh 41 641,615 15,649 92.3%

2002-2003

11 Columbus 41 727,522 17,744 97.8%

25 Pittsburgh 41 604,728 14,749 87.0%

2003-2004

15 Columbus 38 658,897 17,339 95.6%

30 Pittsburgh 41 486,961 11,877 70.0%

Looks like the Jackets are doing just fine where they are.

If not, why not move Calgary Florida San Jose Phoenix Buffalo Atlanta Boston Anaheim New Jersey Washington NY Islanders Chicago Nashville Carolina, one of those there...They have lower attendance figures than Columbus.

[HatCityEnforcer]

Sorry, Pittsburgh...but I don't see the NHL bringing another team in if the Pens pack it in and move after the 06-07 season.

You guys have about as much chance as Winnipeg, Quebec, and Hartford of rejoining the NHL if it goes down like this....as much as folks there would love to see the NHL return (and trust me, I'd love to see a team back in Hartford), most are resigned to the fact that it's not coming back.

[Neon_Matrix]

Cough...

[Bouj]

FYI, the other front-runner is Houston.

If Crosby's the real deal, then some city is getting a superstar to build on.

[Neon_Matrix]

FYI, the other front-runner is Houston.

If Crosby's the real deal, then some city is getting a superstar to build on.

Could be interesting if they go to Huston...a BIG Stars/Whoever rivalry will occur...until the Stars pick up and move on out to Kansas City 4 years from now.

[TBGKon]

The list below are the cities I believe that have the best shot at courting the Pens:

Kansas City

Houston

Portland

Winnipeg?

I know Winnipeg is a longshot, but if any Canadian city will vie for the Pens, it'll surely be Winnipeg. If the team goes to KC, Houston, or Portland they should keep the Penguins moniker, but if they go to Houston they will surely choose a new name.

[CJR]

Anybody else remember one of Gary Bettman's lies about the new CBA being that it would allow all 30 existing markets to compete?

[Chief.]

Houston? I think KC makes more sense with it growing and expanding so fast (and I think they're building a new arena for the AFL team). But I wouldn't know since I'm not as familiar with Houston so correct me if I'm wrong.

[Grish]

Houston? I think KC makes more sense with it growing and expanding so fast (and I think they're building a new arena for the AFL team). But I wouldn't know since I'm not as familiar with Houston so correct me if I'm wrong.

Houston is the fourth largest city in the United States. I doubt Kanas City will the front rnner for the Pens.

Portland, Or. could make a run if Paul Allen decides he is interested again. The problem there is Allen likes to see his adventures become profit making and to be self substaining versus him having to continue to put $ towards suffering enterprise.

[Neon_Matrix]

Anybody else remember one of Gary Bettman's lies about the new CBA being that it would allow all 30 existing markets to compete?

Well this is a problem with the City of Pittsburgh, not with the team itself. So Bettman didnt lie since this is out of his hands...but he could try and put in more of an effort to help that team get a new arena from the city.

[CJR]

So when Bettman said 30, he meant 29?

The fact that the team sucked so bad for so many years because of all the bad business they did in the early 90s (overpaying for players then means they couldn't afford to ice better than an AHL team in the late 90s and early this decade) had no effect on their attendance? That, in turn, had no effect on their bottom line?

The team is not at fault for its current position, it's all the city's doing? How dare the government not use tax dollars to subsidize a failing business!

From a chat with Scott Burnside after the lockout ended:

... part of the point of the lockout is that Gary Bettman insists the 30-team NHL can be a success. Teams will get a chance to succeed. But is it possible Nashville will decide they aren't a hockey town? Yes. Then a place like Winnipeg could be an option. But that's not why the CBA got done the way it did, so Winnipeg can get a team. It was done so teams can stay where they are.

I didn't support the owners during the lockout because I don't think the league should prop up a team, I don't think that the city should either. The league got a system that it said would allow all 30 (not 29) teams to compete and the Penguins say that's not enough.

[WSU151]

When you say success...do you mean success in terms of financial statements, or in terms of won/loss record?? Because the Pens certainly tried to get players this offseason who will give them success on the ice - did that come to fruition? No. But that's not Bettman's fault. And don't blame Bettman if the Penguins have a terrible arrangement at Mellon Arena. If they can't get any revenue from the arena, it's not Bettman's fault.

[CJR]

I'm not blaming Bettman for the Penguins' issues, I'm saying that he lied about the new CBA allowing the 30 existing teams to compete.

[WSU151]

I'm not blaming Bettman for the Penguins' issues, I'm saying that he lied about the new CBA allowing the 30 existing teams to compete.

But that's what I'm asking you...compete how? On the ice, or financially? Because with the new salary cap, all 30 teams have the opportunity to compete. It's on each franchise to decide if they want to compete. The Caps don't want to compete this year, but I'm sure they're making a bundle of cash. All 30 teams are better off financially now than they were two years ago.

[Brian in Boston]

... I'm saying that he lied about the new CBA allowing the 30 existing teams to compete.

No, he didn't. All 30 of the NHL's franchises can compete under the new CBA. They can all potentially compete for players and they can all potentially put together competitive rosters within the parameters of the new CBA.

Where the Penguins fail to compete with their fellow NHL brethren is in the area of generating revenue through a reasonable lease with a state-of-the-art facility. The CBA has nothing to do with whether or not an NHL franchise can successfully put together a profitable arena deal. That's the responsibility of the Penguins as a franchise. It's a question of the Penguins being able to negotiate effectively with municipal, county, state and independent business partners in the hopes of securing a deal for a new facility.

[CJR]

All of the teams can compete as long as you ignore a major chunk of their financial situation. So Bettman didn't lie, he's just ignorant. I guess that makes sense, too.

I can't find Bettman's exact quote so I'll have to keep using Burnside's "success." I take that to mean both on and off the ice. Every team currently in the NHL has the chance to both make money and win games. Washington is ignoring their chance to win games and Pittsburgh blew theirs by signing the wrong players. The new CBA was supposed to prevent teams from destroying themselves.

Pittsburgh's lease situation is undoing their chance for financial success but it didn't come up in the last year, it was known before the new CBA was signed. If the CBA wasn't enough to save Pittsburgh, Bettman shouldn't have said anything about the 30 existing markets.

[WSU151]

Every team currently in the NHL has the chance to both make money and win games. Washington is ignoring their chance to win games and Pittsburgh blew theirs by signing the wrong players. The new CBA was supposed to prevent teams from destroying themselves.

The CBA cannot regulate whether teams have the right players. That's not Bettman's fault that the Penguins signed the wrong players and the Caps signed pretty much no one. You cannot blame that on the CBA.

Pittsburgh's lease situation is undoing their chance for financial success but it didn't come up in the last year, it was known before the new CBA was signed.  If the CBA wasn't enough to save Pittsburgh, Bettman shouldn't have said anything about the 30 existing markets.

Rome wasn't built in a day, and I'm sure Pittsburgh knew that they'd still be in a mess with lendors even with a new CBA. Pittsburgh's situation was so messed up that it would have probably taken three or four years for the team to finally see black at the bottom line. But again, that is not the CBA's fault, nor is it Bettman's fault.