NFL Jaguars could be sold and moved

[BBTV]

Still, tarping up your unsellable seats to bolster attendance %? Er, ok. The A's do that. And let's be frank, it's a band-aid solution to a bigger problem.

You are totally wrong about the band - aid solution to a bigger problem. 3rd biggest stadium in the smallest market, what else are they suppose to do? Even after the cover up, They have a bigger stadium than Chicago, Dallas, and Pittsburgh. All three markets are way bigger. So no, I do not buy anything you say in this matter. Again, Do I have to say every game will be sold out this year? That is 100%. Of course ESPN will say 90%.

If your argument is that Pittsburgh is a much bigger market, then it's a pretty weak argument.

The Steelers have one of the biggest fan bases in all of sports. Someone said earlier that Pittsburgh's market is double the size of Jacksonville's. They aren't as big as Dallas' or Chicago's but they aren't as small as Jacksonville's or Minnesota's. To call it weak is weak on your part.

Pittsburgh is one of the smaller markets. That's a fact. If an area is looking up to Pittsburgh (or Buffalo, Jacksonv-(oops)) as a bigger market ("double the size") then the facts are against that area succeeding. Nothing against Jacksonville (yes, we know you're from there and love it, but look at it objectively for a minute) but it's not a big-league city. That's not to say that is isn't a fine town with lots of attractions, but in today's sports world, it's all about CSMA, which doesn't bode well for the Jags.

[Island_Style]

Still, tarping up your unsellable seats to bolster attendance %? Er, ok. The A's do that. And let's be frank, it's a band-aid solution to a bigger problem.

You are totally wrong about the band - aid solution to a bigger problem. 3rd biggest stadium in the smallest market, what else are they suppose to do? Even after the cover up, They have a bigger stadium than Chicago, Dallas, and Pittsburgh. All three markets are way bigger. So no, I do not buy anything you say in this matter. Again, Do I have to say every game will be sold out this year? That is 100%. Of course ESPN will say 90%.

Tarping seats is very weak, plus you have used Dallas in comparison meanwhile this is the final year in Texas Stadium. It a moot point as they are moving to a facility larger than the Gator Bowl (sorry, easier to type). Soldier Field could have been larger but it was decided to keep the existing facade. If the city expanded just for Florida/Georgia, then the city manager and council (or Duval County) should be fired or removed from office. That is so narrow minded, it basically sums up the area. Outside of CSX, is there any corporations there? Floridian's average income generally is not that high, combined with a bad economy and housing crisis makes it worse. The NFL wanted a one team town, but the town has not lived up to their end of the bargain. I just looked at the season ticket prices and they are still a bargain and well below the NFL average by 25%!

What's so weak about it? Tarping seats is a win for the Jaguars and for the UF/UGA game. 67,00 is still impressive by league standards. 73,000 is too much for this market right now. 10 years from now, maybe not. At least construction will not be needed for additional seats. Tarping seats is easy to do so how is it "narrow minded" for the city to look after it's most economically successful weekend of the year? Please tell me how that is narrow minded? Because we didn't settle on a smaller stadium we were able to lock up a Super Bowl. I know two things you don't do for a living, Run a business or run a city. Should be fired for looking after a goldmine? That is a pretty ignorant statement. Also, Jacksonville has more fortune 1000 companies than Miami, Tampa, or Orlando. So yes, outside of CSX there are corporations there.

How in the world have they not lived up to their bargain? They have still done pretty well in attendance. Cheap or not next year will be sold out. As far as comparison goes, why can't I use Dallas? I am comparing what I have in front of me. You know, the now and past. I cant go by numbers that do not exist yet. Try harder.

[Island_Style]

Still, tarping up your unsellable seats to bolster attendance %? Er, ok. The A's do that. And let's be frank, it's a band-aid solution to a bigger problem.

You are totally wrong about the band - aid solution to a bigger problem. 3rd biggest stadium in the smallest market, what else are they suppose to do? Even after the cover up, They have a bigger stadium than Chicago, Dallas, and Pittsburgh. All three markets are way bigger. So no, I do not buy anything you say in this matter. Again, Do I have to say every game will be sold out this year? That is 100%. Of course ESPN will say 90%.

If your argument is that Pittsburgh is a much bigger market, then it's a pretty weak argument.

The Steelers have one of the biggest fan bases in all of sports. Someone said earlier that Pittsburgh's market is double the size of Jacksonville's. They aren't as big as Dallas' or Chicago's but they aren't as small as Jacksonville's or Minnesota's. To call it weak is weak on your part.

Pittsburgh is one of the smaller markets. That's a fact. If an area is looking up to Pittsburgh (or Buffalo, Jacksonv-(oops)) as a bigger market ("double the size") then the facts are against that area succeeding. Nothing against Jacksonville (yes, we know you're from there and love it, but look at it objectively for a minute) but it's not a big-league city. That's not to say that is isn't a fine town with lots of attractions, but in today's sports world, it's all about CSMA, which doesn't bode well for the Jags.

I kind of agree with you and I kind of don't. I do think Jacksonville can make and will make football work. I also know that is the only sport it can make work. No other league will survive here. I really think people are underestimating Jacksonville's ability for an NFL team. I believe this objectively. I will defend this as long as it takes. People see one thing that a lot of NFL teams go through and they scream failure. I think Jacksonville has an unfair disadvantage in public perception. I think a lot of people outside the area are suckered in to it, including you. Nothing personal but that is what I believe. I believe I am not the one looking at the subjectively but rather the people who expect Jacksonville to fail because they are small. I am not passionate about this subject because it is my home town. I am passionate about this because it is something I truly believe.

[dfwabel]

Still, tarping up your unsellable seats to bolster attendance %? Er, ok. The A's do that. And let's be frank, it's a band-aid solution to a bigger problem.

You are totally wrong about the band - aid solution to a bigger problem. 3rd biggest stadium in the smallest market, what else are they suppose to do? Even after the cover up, They have a bigger stadium than Chicago, Dallas, and Pittsburgh. All three markets are way bigger. So no, I do not buy anything you say in this matter. Again, Do I have to say every game will be sold out this year? That is 100%. Of course ESPN will say 90%.

Tarping seats is very weak, plus you have used Dallas in comparison meanwhile this is the final year in Texas Stadium. It a moot point as they are moving to a facility larger than the Gator Bowl (sorry, easier to type). Soldier Field could have been larger but it was decided to keep the existing facade. If the city expanded just for Florida/Georgia, then the city manager and council (or Duval County) should be fired or removed from office. That is so narrow minded, it basically sums up the area. Outside of CSX, is there any corporations there? Floridian's average income generally is not that high, combined with a bad economy and housing crisis makes it worse. The NFL wanted a one team town, but the town has not lived up to their end of the bargain. I just looked at the season ticket prices and they are still a bargain and well below the NFL average by 25%!

What's so weak about it? Tarping seats is a win for the Jaguars and for the UF/UGA game. 67,00 is still impressive by league standards. 73,000 is too much for this market right now. 10 years from now, maybe not. At least construction will not be needed for additional seats. Tarping seats is easy to do so how is it "narrow minded" for the city to look after it's most economically successful weekend of the year? Please tell me how that is narrow minded? Because we didn't settle on a smaller stadium we were able to lock up a Super Bowl. I know two things you don't do for a living, Run a business or run a city. Should be fired for looking after a goldmine? That is a pretty ignorant statement. Also, Jacksonville has more fortune 1000 companies than Miami, Tampa, or Orlando. So yes, outside of CSX there are corporations there.

How in the world have they not lived up to their bargain? They have still done pretty well in attendance. Cheap or not next year will be sold out. As far as comparison goes, why can't I use Dallas? I am comparing what I have in front of me. You know, the now and past. I cant go by numbers that do not exist yet. Try harder.

When the big time NFL fan sees a tarped up Gator Bowl, the impression is that it is the only way which they have a chance to sell out; therefore it was an economic mistake to have a facility so large to begin with. How many more households win No. Florida will be necessary in ten years justify the larger capacity now? Another Super Bowl in the next decade will not occur, period.

It is even more glaring as the average ticket price is below the NFL average by 25%! If it is a goldmine, why cannot they sell out without tarping? Holding a three day event, Cocktail Party, is no reason to expand a stadium and thus place your ten event holder in jeopardy.

Personally, I would like the team to stay, but I find it hard to believe that Weaver is losing money on this venture with revenue sharing and I love hearing Czban rip JAX. Dallas is sold out this season, granted in a smaller stadium, but with a higher average ticket price. (BTW, the deadline for existing season ticket holders to purchase similar seats at the new stadium in relation to their current location was today). When you use Fortune 1000 over Fortune 500, I know you are reaching.

Just curious, do you have season tickets and helping the cause?

[Island_Style]

One more thing I would like to add. Brian in Boston is really helping me out in me not looking like a homer. He is posting very educated posts supporting my rational. Now, I am not saying I am right or wrong because of it, but it is nice to see someone on the outside back me up so to dismiss my homerism. He is backing up a lot of what I am trying to say.

Does the Jacksonville market face challenges playing host to a major-professional sports franchise? Sure. That said, many municipalities and/or metro areas in the United States do. Bottom line? The NFL's future in Jacksonville is not as dire as some people would make it out to be.

[Island_Style]

When the big time NFL fan sees a tarped up Gator Bowl, the impression is that it is the only way which they have a chance to sell out; therefore it was an economic mistake to have a facility so large to begin with. How many more households win No. Florida will be necessary in ten years justify the larger capacity now? Another Super Bowl in the next decade will not occur, period.

WHat does impressions of a "big time NFL fan" have to do with a damn thing? Really, how does outside impressions by another NFL team correlate to an economic mistake? You really have to go in to more detail with that one. Makes no sense.

The last two sentences made no sens but I will try. Jacksonville is one of the fastest growing regions in America. What I am saying is demand for tickets 10 years from now could be greater so all they have to do is pull the tarps. If not, they stay on, no big deal. As far as getting another Super Bowl, it was huge just to get one. If we dont get another, so be it. Again, to get one is amazing in itself. How many other cities can say that?

It is even more glaring as the average ticket price is below the NFL average by 25%! If it is a goldmine, why cannot they sell out without tarping? Holding a three day event, Cocktail Party, is no reason to expand a stadium and thus place your ten event holder in jeopardy.

Read again, the goldmine I was referring to was the UF/UGA game. The money that game brings to the city is nuts. All the surrounding cities feel the cash flow. Fernandina Beach is packed with fans that weekend. That October weekend sees more action than a summer weekend on this island. That says a lot. That makes the statement above you wrote totally worthless. Please, try again.

When you use Fortune 1000 over Fortune 500, I know you are reaching.

Still major companies. My point is valid. There are more outside CSX.

Just curious, do you have season tickets and helping the cause?

Yes, I do.

[dfwabel]

Thank you for making sure that you are a homer. Especially as this comes from a denied report about a potential full sale. Wayne Weaver is basically calling this a rumor, but you are acting like Chicken Little. I will just act as an enabler to do more research to support your ideal.

We look at tarps and laugh at it. Believe me when I take people to A's games, even my mother asked, "What is all this?" If it was a mall with boarded up store fronts, what inpression does that make? Tarped seats: Major US Stadium :: Boarded up Storefront : Local Mall

I realize that the tarped stadium is less than 4,000 seats from becoming sold out. And that 115 people move to Jacksonville every day, however, JAX is unlike all other cities you mentioned in that it is one team town with no major college team locally. plus, you lost the ACC title game due to lack of support too. The University of Florida and Florida State had a foothold on the market before 1992, but still if the area is constantly growing, then why reduce capacity, especially when your average price is below average. There are about 1.2 million residents of the Duval, Clay, Nassau, and St. Johns County area and while many may have seats for the Gators or Seminoles, but there is still a lot to draw from and they appear not to be working hard enough (like the Culverhouse Buccaneer years).

[Island_Style]

Thank you for making sure that you are a homer. Especially as this comes from a denied report about a potential full sale. Wayne Weaver is basically calling this a rumor, but you are acting like Chicken Little. I will just act as an enabler to do more research to support your ideal.

Until a move is official why would I act like one is happening. Right now the only thing said about this whole situation by the owner is that it is not happening. Until something in stone surfaces you have no choice but to believe this. That does not make me a homer.

We look at tarps and laugh at it. Believe me when I take people to A's games, even my mother asked, "What is all this?" If it was a mall with boarded up store fronts, what inpression does that make? Tarped seats: Major US Stadium :: Boarded up Storefront : Local Mall

Comparing 6,000 tarped seats in a stadium that holds a NFL franchise to a bordered up mall is not a good comparison. Apples and oranges. You act like we have to impress other NFL fans. That don't mean jack squat. It is all about Jaguars fans, that is it. Tarps or no tarps it is still a beautiful stadium. The Tarps have no effect on that. Does this look like a boarded up mall to you?

Pretty full stadium. That was the last Jaguar game played at home.

I realize that the tarped stadium is less than 4,000 seats from becoming sold out. And that 115 people move to Jacksonville every day, however, JAX is unlike all other cities you mentioned in that it is one team town with no major college team locally. plus, you lost the ACC title game due to lack of support too. The University of Florida and Florida State had a foothold on the market before 1992, but still if the area is constantly growing, then why reduce capacity, especially when your average price is below average. There are about 1.2 million residents of the Duval, Clay, Nassau, and St. Johns County area and while many may have seats for the Gators or Seminoles, but there is still a lot to draw from and they appear not to be working hard enough (like the Culverhouse Buccaneer years).

1.2 million people is still small. Small enough be considered one of the smallest markets in all of pro sports. 67,000 stadium is fine for that. Ask Indianapolis why they didn't make their new stadium bigger and they will tell you the same thing.

[dfwabel]

Thank you for making sure that you are a homer. Especially as this comes from a denied report about a potential full sale. Wayne Weaver is basically calling this a rumor, but you are acting like Chicken Little. I will just act as an enabler to do more research to support your ideal.

Until a move is official why would I act like one is happening. Right now the only thing said about this whole situation by the owner is that it is not happening. Until something in stone surfaces you have no choice but to believe this. That does not make me a homer.

We look at tarps and laugh at it. Believe me when I take people to A's games, even my mother asked, "What is all this?" If it was a mall with boarded up store fronts, what inpression does that make? Tarped seats: Major US Stadium :: Boarded up Storefront : Local Mall

Comparing 6,000 tarped seats in a stadium that holds a NFL franchise to a bordered up mall is not a good comparison. Apples and oranges. You act like we have to impress other NFL fans. That don't mean jack squat. It is all about Jaguars fans, that is it. Tarps or no tarps it is still a beautiful stadium. The Tarps have no effect on that. Does this look like a boarded up mall to you?

Pretty full stadium. That was the last Jaguar game played at home.

I realize that the tarped stadium is less than 4,000 seats from becoming sold out. And that 115 people move to Jacksonville every day, however, JAX is unlike all other cities you mentioned in that it is one team town with no major college team locally. plus, you lost the ACC title game due to lack of support too. The University of Florida and Florida State had a foothold on the market before 1992, but still if the area is constantly growing, then why reduce capacity, especially when your average price is below average. There are about 1.2 million residents of the Duval, Clay, Nassau, and St. Johns County area and while many may have seats for the Gators or Seminoles, but there is still a lot to draw from and they appear not to be working hard enough (like the Culverhouse Buccaneer years).

1.2 million people is still small. Small enough be considered one of the smallest markets in all of pro sports. 67,000 stadium is fine for that. Ask Indianapolis why they didn't make their new stadium bigger and they will tell you the same thing.

Nice photo, but it is "full" since they cover seats. Upper deck corners on both sides and that endzone to the right are covered looks just like a mall which lost "ExpressMen" or "GapKids". Capacity is what you should shoot for, bot one which should fit your needed revenue stream as this seems. If it is all about JAX fans, then there are apparently now enough to fill the full capacoty of the stadium, which was publically funded. The Census Bureau said this, "In 2003, Jacksonville, FL MSA had a household population of 1.2 million - 597,000 (52 percent) females and 558,000 (48 percent) males. The median age was 36.0 years. Twenty-six percent of the population were under 18 years and 11 percent were 65 years and older."

If you are growing by 100+ people/day since then, why not take the tarps off and be act like the rest of the NFL as you have the population? There are 31 others teams who do not cover up even when they could, but when a major rival comes in, they want the total gate..

Bro, I know that this thread is what you will react to (and I like that), however, Indianapolis looks at things with a little bit more sensability. You should also be happy that I provided figures to this board information about JAX which you have not done in terms of community size.

From a former conventioneer, who has also been too 26 of the 32 active NFL stadiums (inc. JAX, TP and MIA) and a person who has gone to games in Indy is "an event town"...they does know more about hosting than JAX. The same thing can be said for MSP, good event towns Hotel rooms aside, the Black Expo is there annually along with major and mid-level conventions, the Indy 500, Brickyard 400 and events in Olympic Sports as will as the home of the NCAA. JAX has The Players, the Jaguars, and Cocktail Party and is the Gator Bowl even used for The Players? Using your UF/UGA analogy, Lucas Oil Stadium would be build for a larger capacity for the Colts as a primary tenant but tarps would be removed the Circle City Classic, the Black College football game during the Black Expo, which used to sell out, but now has 150,000 people in town for the weekend and hotels are sold out, but only 40,000 go to the game.

JAX should be able to succeed even with the lower wages which Florida pays in general (but companies get hooked into the lack of state income tax), but if the population is increasing, whi din't they market the only team in town towards more folks? It is not like the old Sun Belt Conference is there and Jacksonville U. was a good team or that UNF has D-1 football. Sadly, this board just looks at teams and not any economic issues which might be underneath.

Basically, there are many posters here who won't look at a newspaper, news site, or financial site which may talk about sport and ESPN.com is all they may look at. Those who do, you know who you are, and i probably sent you a PM before. Kids, use the net to your advantage! With that said, I accept you are a homer and don't worry, InBev shouldn't shut down A-B's JAX plant if they do take over, but the Cartersville (GA) plant is newer and more modern. If this should continue, while other poster may like this, it would be better it we decide to continue to just PM me as I have stated my point. Good night now!

[BlueSky]

Finally, NFL Shop tells it like it is:

[Island_Style]

Oh man, you sure are full of yourself, aren't you? Lets see, where to start?

Nice photo, but it is "full" since they cover seats. Upper deck corners on both sides and that endzone to the right are covered looks just like a mall which lost "ExpressMen" or "GapKids". Capacity is what you should shoot for, bot one which should fit your needed revenue stream as this seems. If it is all about JAX fans, then there are apparently now enough to fill the full capacoty of the stadium, which was publically funded. The Census Bureau said this, "In 2003, Jacksonville, FL MSA had a household population of 1.2 million - 597,000 (52 percent) females and 558,000 (48 percent) males. The median age was 36.0 years. Twenty-six percent of the population were under 18 years and 11 percent were 65 years and older."

First off, you throw in numbers at the bottom like that is suppose to make you sound smarter. We already know the size of the market. We have been over that. Second, Those numbers tell the tale of a small market. I know, it is hard to fathom, but true. Something I have been trying to tell you. All 1.2 million people are not Jaguar fans. Plus they all werent born here. The people who move here are still fans of the teams they were cheering for before they left to move here. The fan base comes from fans who were kids when the Jags arrived. People like me. That fan base is starting to show. It takes time. Switching team allegiance does not happen like a switch. I have already been over why the stadium is it's size and why they tarp it. You didn't understand it the first time, why go over it again. Go back and read for yourself. You say it isn't economically sound because "big time" NFL fans see it as an eyesore. "Big time" NFL fan's opinions means nothing to the dollar Wayne Weaver is trying to earn from this team. The fact that you think there is a correlation is down right embarrassing. It is all about avoiding black outs.

If you are growing by 100+ people/day since then, why not take the tarps off and be act like the rest of the NFL as you have the population? There are 31 others teams who do not cover up even when they could, but when a major rival comes in, they want the total gate..

Oh my god, again. OK, you say why not lift the tarp when a major NFL rival comes to get to full capacity? Before the beginning of the NFL season you have to tell the NFL what the capacity of your stadium is. Jaguars the the NFL 67,000 rather than 73,000. Once that is said the tarps can not come up for any reason. 67,000 is the total and even with the tarps once the attendance reaches 67,000 it is a sellout. Those tarps seats are not for sale and can never ever be for sale for the season. By tarping up those seats we do look like other NFL teams. In the NFL 19 of the 32 teams has their stadium capacity under 70,000. Like I said, I already explained to you why it was originally built to it's big size. It's the city's stadium, not just the Jags. Now, we could tear down the corners in the upper deck to make it "look better" but would lose the UF/UGA game. That game is the biggest money maker by far for the area. I already been over that.

Bro, I know that this thread is what you will react to (and I like that), however, Indianapolis looks at things with a little bit more sensability. You should also be happy that I provided figures to this board information about JAX which you have not done in terms of community size.

I called Jax one of the smallest markets in pro sports. You put up some winded numbers that everyone already knew. It backed what we already knew. It is funny how you use that as a way to make yourself think you got me. I disagree with you about the sensibility. I have been over and over why.

From a former conventioneer, who has also been too 26 of the 32 active NFL stadiums (inc. JAX, TP and MIA) and a person who has gone to games in Indy is "an event town"...they does know more about hosting than JAX. The same thing can be said for MSP, good event towns Hotel rooms aside, the Black Expo is there annually along with major and mid-level conventions, the Indy 500, Brickyard 400 and events in Olympic Sports as will as the home of the NCAA. JAX has The Players, the Jaguars, and Cocktail Party and is the Gator Bowl even used for The Players? Using your UF/UGA analogy, Lucas Oil Stadium would be build for a larger capacity for the Colts as a primary tenant but tarps would be removed the Circle City Classic, the Black College football game during the Black Expo, which used to sell out, but now has 150,000 people in town for the weekend and hotels are sold out, but only 40,000 go to the game.

What??? What does this have to do with the economic impact of the UF/UGA game? You said I was reaching earlier, you just babble and don't make sense. Stipulations are different. With a smaller stadium the game will be moved. It is in the contract to have the stadium a certain size. They also have to add on temp seats to get over 80k. It has nothing to do with what you wrote above. More proof that you know nothing of situations down here even though you like to pretend you do. Go ahead, throw out some numbers if it will make you feel better. You don't get it at all and that paragraph was proof.

JAX should be able to succeed even with the lower wages which Florida pays in general (but companies get hooked into the lack of state income tax), but if the population is increasing, whi din't they market the only team in town towards more folks? It is not like the old Sun Belt Conference is there and Jacksonville U. was a good team or that UNF has D-1 football. Sadly, this board just looks at teams and not any economic issues which might be underneath.

They do and it shows. Sales aren't as dire as you think, even with the tarps. I have already explained why. With your logic Dallas should have made their stadium over 100k. Their market is way bigger than Jacksonville's which should be able to sell 73,000k easily, according to you. All they have to do is advertise and the people there, which there is a lot, will come. You know how stupid that is? It is hilarious how all over you are.

Also, just because you move to Jax doesn't make automatically make you a Jags fan. If I moved to Indianapolis I rather sit at home and watch the Jags than go to a Colts game.

Basically, there are many posters here who won't look at a newspaper, news site, or financial site which may talk about sport and ESPN.com is all they may look at. Those who do, you know who you are, and i probably sent you a PM before. Kids, use the net to your advantage! With that said, I accept you are a homer and don't worry, InBev shouldn't shut down A-B's JAX plant if they do take over, but the Cartersville (GA) plant is newer and more modern. If this should continue, while other poster may like this, it would be better it we decide to continue to just PM me as I have stated my point. Good night now!

It's funny how you try to pump yourself up. I have used a lot of facts outside of sports websites. You just put up facts we already know. We all know Jacksonville's size. That is all you put up. Arguing with you is very painful. You aren't as smart as you would like to think you are.

No, you have never PMed me and I have never PMed you. In fact, the only PMs I have been involved with is thanking someone for a sig they made me (Fred Taylor beauty below) and asking someone else if they would make me a FSU sig which they have accepted. You are the one looking more and more foolish. I can only imagine what you are like in real life.

[Island_Style]

Finally, NFL Shop tells it like it is:

Nail on the head. This guy may be totally out the league two years from now.

[BlueSky]

Finally, NFL Shop tells it like it is:

Nail on the head. This guy may be totally out the league two years from now.

It's a shame they wasted a #1 on this clown.

[Cujo]

Finally, NFL Shop tells it like it is:

Nail on the head. This guy may be totally out the league two years from now.

It's a shame they wasted a #1 on this clown.

Does Del Rio even know that IDIOT is supposed to be playing quarterback?

[Brian in Boston]

Outside of CSX, is there any corporations there?

Outside of CSX, are there any corporations there?

Yes, as a matter of fact, there are. Jacksonville is home to the headquarters of four Fortune 500 companies: CSX, Winn-Dixie Stores, Fidelity National Financial and Fidelity National Information Services. Additionally, another three Jacksonville-headquartered corporations are ranked in the Fortune 1000: Landstar System, MPS Group and PSS World Medical.

[Brian in Boston]

When you use Fortune 1000 over Fortune 500, I know you are reaching.

No, not at all.

Fortune 500 Company Headquarters by Municipality

Jacksonville: 4

Miami: 3

Orlando: 1

Tampa: 0

Fortune 500 Company Headquarters by Metro Area

Jacksonville, FL: 4

Miami-Fort Lauderdale-Pompano Beach, FL: 4

Orlando-Kissimmee, FL: 1

Tampa-St. Petersburg-Clearwater, FL: 2

Fortune 1000 Company Headquarters by Municipality

Jacksonville: 7

Miami: 5

Orlando: 3

Tampa: 1

Fortune 1000 Company Headquarters by Metro Area

Jacksonville, FL: 7

Miami-Fort Lauderdale-Pompano Beach, FL: 10

Orlando-Kissimmee, FL: 4

Tampa-St. Petersburg-Clearwater, FL: 4

As you can see, it is only by using Fortune 1000 and/or Metro Area measuring criteria that Miami or the Miami-Fort Lauderdale-Pompano Beach MSA is able to equal or surpass Jacksonville's totals. It could be said that Miami is "reaching".

[njmeadowlanders]

There are 31 others teams who do not cover up even when they could, but when a major rival comes in, they want the total gate..

Well, maybe some should:

(OK, so that's before two 4-win teams were about to take the field in week 17...)

But that being said, if they are going to cover up seats, there has to be a better way. Maybe cover up the side that isn't seen on broadcast TV, or maybe take the top couple of rows "off" of the whole upper deck rather than just blocking off sections so it doesn't look as bad. I don't know.

However, if Green Bay can have a team, what makes Jacksonville so terrible? I know you'll all say Green Bay is a special case--but it helps GREATLY that it is an NFL team. If it were an NBA market, they would've left 40 years ago. An NFL team could work in a LOT of places that other sports couldn't...