Terrell Owens--where to start?

[Jigga]

Donovan McNabb acted like a bitch. He's not a leader, he's a damn good player, but he's no leader.

T.O. got played by the Shark, straight up. I keep hearing on ESPN Radio that "T.O. is no fool" or "T.O. isn't stupid" or things like that. That's bull . He's not only a fool, he's a weak minded fool that allows other people to pull his strings like Papa Gepetto did to Pinocchio.

Teammates or not, they are both still men. Men should "handle it" instead of letting things fester. Don't resort to petty name calling and hurt feelings. Discuss it, deal with it, hell, fight if you have to, but resolve it. McNabb and T.O. both are at fault for that. Neither wanted to meet the other even a step, let alone halfway. Both are selfish, both are weak minded, and both felt that they were bigger than the team.

[The Squish]

paynomind, Fred T. Jane, jpslapshot22,

How dense are you guys?

Seriously.

Owens singlehandedly completely and utterly destroyed the cohesion and chemistry of two NFL franchises, the 49ers and the Eagles. It turns out that the real reason he wouldn't go to Baltimore is that if he'd tried the kind of he pulled in San Fran and Phily Ray Lewis would have taken him outside for a little "discussion" which would not have involved talking.

The 49ers were a good playoff quality team until Owens started ripping Garcia and calling him a and a queer, all without a shred of proof.

And for those who are claiming that Owens is the best receiver in the league and that he was indespensible to the Eagles, how come they managed to get through the playoffs and to the Super Bowl without him, and yet in the Super Bowl, when he did play, the Eagles lost.

And if you're going to blame anyone for the Eagles loss in SB XXXIX, lay that blame squarely at Freddie Mitchell's feet.

That assjack bleated and squealed all week about how he was going to rip the Patriots secondary apart and when it came time to actually put up or shut up, Mitchell got his ass handed to him.

But I digress.

No matter how good a team is, no matter how many all stars or pro bowl quality players they have, if they don't have good chemistry, the team doesn't go anywhere.

Look at the Buccaneers the year after they won the Super Bowl. Keyshawn Johnson was bleating endlessly to and about Gruden and it destroyed the teams chemistry. If Johnson had kept his friggin' mouth shut, the Bucs would very likely have repeated.

As other posters have pointed out, Owens is a cancer.

He destroys the chemistry on every team he plays for.

And yes, I understand that all of the good receivers in the league have a selfish, "Throw me the damn ball!!!" attitude.

But comparing Randy Moss to Owens is laughable and makes no sense.

Moss got along with everyone in Minnesota, it was a management and money decision to trade him, not because he was a cancer.

Chad johnson trash talks, but do you ever hear him ripping Carson Palmer or other teammates or the organization?

Frig no.

Bottom line, Owens is a selfish, self absorbed whiny scumbag who has destroyed every team he has played for.

If it had just happened with one team, that could be seen as an acicdent or misunderstanding.

But to happen twice?

Uh-uh.

That shows a clear and unmistakable pattern of :censored:ry.

gregjigga5

Get over yourselves, your smary-ass, I'm-better-than-him attitudes.  Bitches.

I am better then Owens.

Am I a better football player?

Christ no.

Am I a better human being?

Am I a nicer human being?

Oh hell yes.

And as for your calling us "Bitches," I would like to think that the moderators would look at that post and at the very least demand that you apologize and perhaps temporarily ban you.

Jackass.

And as for your claim that McNabb refused to meet Owens halfway, stop spreading lies.

In both Sports Illustrated and ESPN the Magazine articles about the whole affair, it wasd amde quite clear that McNabb made numerous attempts to reach out to Owens and Owens acted like an and refused to even acknowledge McNabb's prescence.

[fiasco!]

moderator here.

squish...i understand you don't like being called a "bitch", but you fought back with "jackass".

no action taken.

good day.

[Shmee]

paynomind, Fred T. Jane, jpslapshot22,

How dense are you guys?

Seriously.

gregjigga5

And as for your calling us "Bitches," I would like to think that the moderators would look at that post and at the very least demand that you apologize and perhaps temporarily ban you.

Jackass.

See, I think you're right about Owens being a team-killer.

But your argument style is so lame and your inability to recognize your own hipocrisy makes me want to clear something up.

You obviously haven't read the thread titled 'The Moderating Team is Fully Capable" or you'd know that suggesting, or calling for, punishments against other posters is generally one of those things that's highly discouraged here. Good work.

Also, don't call out another poster for using the word "bitches" to describe you if you start your reply asking about just how dense a set of three very well respected poster are and then continue to directly call one member a jackass.

Was it out of place for Greg to use that word? Perhaps, he's a friend of mine and I don't hesitate to tell him when I think he's causing trouble, but you're in no place to act like a better person than him when you call out people the way you do.

You're entitled to your opinion, Chris has made the decision that this is a public forum that anyone can join and post in. If you're going to be a beligerent douche though, please keep quiet.

[paynomind]

paynomind, Fred T. Jane, jpslapshot22,

How dense are you guys?

Seriously.

Owens singlehandedly completely and utterly destroyed the cohesion and chemistry of two NFL franchises, the 49ers and the Eagles. It turns out that the real reason he wouldn't go to Baltimore is that if he'd tried the kind of he pulled in San Fran and Phily Ray Lewis would have taken him outside for a little "discussion" which would not have involved talking.

The 49ers were a good playoff quality team until Owens started ripping Garcia and calling him a and a queer, all without a shred of proof.

And for those who are claiming that Owens is the best receiver in the league and that he was indespensible to the Eagles, how come they managed to get through the playoffs and to the Super Bowl without him, and yet in the Super Bowl, when he did play, the Eagles lost.

And if you're going to blame anyone for the Eagles loss in SB XXXIX, lay that blame squarely at Freddie Mitchell's feet.

That assjack bleated and squealed all week about how he was going to rip the Patriots secondary apart and when it came time to actually put up or shut up, Mitchell got his ass handed to him.

But I digress.

No matter how good a team is, no matter how many all stars or pro bowl quality players they have, if they don't have good chemistry, the team doesn't go anywhere.

Look at the Buccaneers the year after they won the Super Bowl. Keyshawn Johnson was bleating endlessly to and about Gruden and it destroyed the teams chemistry. If Johnson had kept his friggin' mouth shut, the Bucs would very likely have repeated.

As other posters have pointed out, Owens is a cancer.

He destroys the chemistry on every team he plays for.

And yes, I understand that all of the good receivers in the league have a selfish, "Throw me the damn ball!!!" attitude.

But comparing Randy Moss to Owens is laughable and makes no sense.

Moss got along with everyone in Minnesota, it was a management and money decision to trade him, not because he was a cancer.

Chad johnson trash talks, but do you ever hear him ripping Carson Palmer or other teammates or the organization?

Frig no.

Bottom line, Owens is a selfish, self absorbed whiny scumbag who has destroyed every team he has played for.

If it had just happened with one team, that could be seen as an acicdent or misunderstanding.

But to happen twice?

Uh-uh.

That shows a clear and unmistakable pattern of :censored:ry.

gregjigga5

Get over yourselves, your smary-ass, I'm-better-than-him attitudes.  Bitches.

I am better then Owens.

Am I a better football player?

Christ no.

Am I a better human being?

Am I a nicer human being?

Oh hell yes.

And as for your calling us "Bitches," I would like to think that the moderators would look at that post and at the very least demand that you apologize and perhaps temporarily ban you.

Jackass.

And as for your claim that McNabb refused to meet Owens halfway, stop spreading lies.

In both Sports Illustrated and ESPN the Magazine articles about the whole affair, it wasd amde quite clear that McNabb made numerous attempts to reach out to Owens and Owens acted like an and refused to even acknowledge McNabb's prescence.

I'm certainly not dense, Jackass.

I happen to believe that a player with a clean personal record, who is in good shape, practices hard, blocks on runnig plays, runs crisp routes, learns and works out in the off season, and has an incredible number of catches and touchdowns per game is immesurably valuable.

I'd take him on my team, Jackass.

Comparing TO to Moss is laughable? Moss has been arrested, doesnt block on running plays, runs sloopy routes, and admitted he takes plays off, cause some plays dont matter. You are right, Jackass, they cant be compared: TO is the better player.

I dont care if everyone makes out before and after every game. They can arrgue and fight. But if the guys in question do their football jobs, they are welcome on my team. if they aren't welcome on yours, I'll certainly take them, Jackass.

TO didnt destroy SF, ownership did. They fired a good coach, released the QB in question, didnt resign the WR in question, never found an RB, and generally didnt work to improve the team.

Point is, Jackass, I dont understand why we cant have a differing opinion. I dont think TO's tendancy to question his QB when he isnt throwing it to the best WR on the team is all that big of a crime.

McNabb owns the Eagles. He didnt appreciate being questioned, and woudlnt admit he was wrong. TO held him to it, so McNabb and he never made nice. Didnt matter, they could still play football and proved it.

TO is by far the best receiver in the game.

Period.

Jackass.

[TFoA]

Hm...to add on to that, the guy said he destroyed the chemistry of the Ravens. I understand that he refused to play for the Ravens in the middle of the summer, but how did that destroy their chemistry when he never played a down for Baltimore??? The reason why Baltimore wasn't as good as before is that their horrible crappy terrible deplorably absurdly bad offense finally caught up to them, and people finally found a way how to block Ray Lewis. T.O. had nothing to do with the Ravens, other than shooting down a trade in the middle of June.

Another thing, I know this has been brought up a few times in the past, but has T.O. ever been in the news in something akin to that of the Gangbengals? So yeah, if the guy just wants to get paid, and is a loudmouth who wants attention, that doesn't make him the scourge of all football. He's just extremely talented, he knows it, and wants to make sure everyone else knows it and allows him to be his incredibly talented self so he can, ultimately, help the team. For anybody who doesn't know what I'm talking about, would the scourge of all football, this cancer to his team and teamates work his ass off and come back a month later to play in the SB (quite admirably, I might add.) from an injury that would've ended the SEASON of most. Hell no, he probably would've packed it in, and started clamoring for contract negotiations right then and there, and blame everybody and their mama for his injury, and the Eagles would've gotten destroyed by the Patriots, instead of just coming 3 pts short, IIRC. Of course this'll step on some toes, but if T.O. is such a teamkiller, then who was the one performing all erratic-like while the McNabb-Owens feud was going on? Everyone else on the damn Eagles. The whole time this feud was going on, Owens was still performing while McNabb wasn't. You can't tell me that if they had kept Owens, they wouldn't have finished at least 8-8, and won a game in their division. But unfortunately, everyone had to focus on T.O. being honest about how he felt about McNabb, and the fact that he was tweaked about his 100 TD. While the latter was ridiculous, he was dead-on with McNabb. Any other QB in the NFC (save for Joey Harrington and Kyle Orton) would've nailed that SB win down, and we'd be talking about how dissappointing this season was for the defending Super Bowl Champs. So you can't say T.O. ain't tellin the truth, because that is a fact. McNabb choked, T.O. points it out, and his reputation gets the best of him.

So who is at fault?

1) T.O. for tellin the truth and being flamboyant while doing so. Apparently being blunt about such traditional things as your QB failing in the clutch is frowned upon.

2) McNabb for being a bitch about it. Anybody else would've seen that as motivation, instead that's an attack on his reputation, which was already bad in the clutch since they lost 3 straight NFC Title Games.

3) The media for making this front page news in July, and people buying into this nonsense about him killing teams when he was only given the proverbial knife after the stabbing was done.

I will be glad when the Cowboys beat the Eagles sometime this year and this topic shalt be put to damn rest.

Falcons for Super Bowl XLI.

Vick for Mayor.

[Fred T. Jane]

paynomind, Fred T. Jane, jpslapshot22,

How dense are you guys?

I wont speak for the other guys, but when I exhale, I'm about 57lb/ft^3 (That's about 945 kg/m^3 for you metric guys out there)

[tajmccall]

Wow...heated.

Listen, the people who don't want T.O. on their team are the people who watch ENTIRELY too much sportscenter and not NEARLY enough of the actual games. The guy changes defenses. Same with Moss. Moss isnt a bad guy either, they both just are extremely competitive, immature men at a position that depends on somebody else in order to perform. Listen, the pressure is on guys like TO and Moss to be the best every year...Randy has had the luxury (until his stay with Oakland) of having wonderful QBs throwing the 'skin. TO has had some good QBs too, but not the most prolific of passers ever.

I would never condone his actions, but they make a demon out of him on ESPN because morons continue to slop it up like its warm cream of wheat.

[slapshot]

Evidently "The Squish" must be the sound heard when the remnants of your brain rattle off the insides of your skull.

Owens > Moss.

When on the field, Owens makes his teams better.

When on the field, Moss may make his team better, if he decides to participate in the play.

[Jigga]

I would never condone his actions, but they make a demon out of him on ESPN because morons continue to slop it up like its warm cream of wheat.

Sean, have you ever had cold Cream of Wheat. It's nasty! Warm CoW > Cold CoW.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

As for my bitches comment...sorry if I ruffled feathers. Maybe what I should have said was "crybabies." However, where I'm from we don't say people sound like crybabies, we say they sound like bitches.

You got tweaked with me calling you a bitch (though I never said Squish, you're a bitch), yet you say that you are a better human being that someone else. Which is worse? I didn't agree with your points, but I don't think I'm a better person.

If anyone should be ashamed of what he said, it should be you.

[VitaminD]

Thus far, this thread (non-namecalling division) has been populated by people who appear to be fans of teams other than the 49ers and the Eagles. That said, it's easy as hell to be enamored with TO. I do not disagree for one second that he's an incandescent talent who may be, pound for pound, the most talented receiver in the NFL. He is a complete package of speed, height and strength, and he must be accounted for at all times on the football field. Moreover, he plays every play hard, he lives cleanly and within the bounds of the law.

HOWEVER... it comes at a price. The facts speak for themselves. He has left 2 teams in ruins. While he didn't do it by himself, he is the common denominator in the situations in San Francisco and in Philadelphia. He is a combustible addition to any team's chemistry, and teams will pay for his services dearly in the long run.

Everyone thinks Parcells can contain TO. Funny thing is, everyone said the same about Andy Reid.

Everyone thinks, "This time will be different. He won't want to make the same mistakes he made at his last stop, and prove he's an all right guy." Funny thing is, we all said the same thing when he came to Philadelphia.

I'm not ashamed to admit I was ecstatic when TO signed with the Birds. He was the missing piece that would have us lining Broad Street for a parade with the Lombardi Trophy. And as I said before, he didn't act alone. But what do you think will happen when Bledsoe doesn't get him the ball, or when Parcells screams at him? And do you really think it'd be a better situation in Atlanta, with a QB who can't throw downfield against NFL defenses with any regularity and prefers to run out of the pocket whenever he can?

Seriously, I know how it feels to be on "that side" of the situation. I watched the mess in San Francisco and couldn't believe the Eagles' good fortune. Now that I am on "this side" of the situation, I can tell you all that you don't know what you're asking for. And none of this has anything to do with comparing him to convicted felons, wife-beaters, drug abusers or sociopaths, so don't make it about that. You can live clean and work hard and still be a bad fit for an organization.

[The Squish]

hello, my name is The Squish, and i have nothing intelligent to bring to this conversation.

yes, this was edited by joel_fiasco....if you have a problem with it, find the PM button and we'll take care of it.

never, ever, bring up the way a person was raised....you might be opening up a bag of worms that you can't handle.

[Jigga]

My attitude towards women? I love the bitches.

[slapshot]

Wow. You are so polite and respectable to those who disagree with you.

Lots of great players don't have Super Bowl rings. Dan Marino doesn't have one. Wasn't he a great quarterback? Barry Sanders doesn't have a Super Bowl ring. Wasn't he a great player? What about Jim Brown? No Super Bowl ring there either.

I don't know what a fabulopus is, so I really don't know if TO is one or not.

I do know that if he took every snap himself, he wouldn't be able to get open to catch touchdown passes. Which, as a wide receiver, is his primary job description.

Get off your high horse. Accept the fact people like Owens as a player.

[Fred T. Jane]

Wow. You are so polite and respectable to those who disagree with you.

Lots of great players don't have Super Bowl rings. Dan Marino doesn't have one. Wasn't he a great quarterback? Barry Sanders doesn't have a Super Bowl ring. Wasn't he a great player? What about Jim Brown? No Super Bowl ring there either.

I don't know what a fabulopus is, so I really don't know if TO is one or not.

I do know that if he took every snap himself, he wouldn't be able to get open to catch touchdown passes. Which, as a wide receiver, is his primary job description.

Get off your high horse. Accept the fact people like Owens as a player.

jp, you don't realise the value of a Super Bowl ring. I mean, once you win one, you're better than anyone who's never won one, which means John Fuqua is twice as good than Barry Sanders could ever hope to be, as is Matt Cavanaugh when compared to Dan Marino. I can't beleive that you don't realise that!

[leopard88]

Wow. You are so polite and respectable to those who disagree with you.

Lots of great players don't have Super Bowl rings. Dan Marino doesn't have one. Wasn't he a great quarterback? Barry Sanders doesn't have a Super Bowl ring. Wasn't he a great player? What about Jim Brown? No Super Bowl ring there either.

I don't know what a fabulopus is, so I really don't know if TO is one or not.

I do know that if he took every snap himself, he wouldn't be able to get open to catch touchdown passes. Which, as a wide receiver, is his primary job description.

Get off your high horse. Accept the fact people like Owens as a player.

jp, you don't realise the value of a Super Bowl ring. I mean, once you win one, you're better than anyone who's never won one, which means John Fuqua is twice as good than Barry Sanders could ever hope to be, as is Matt Cavanaugh when compared to Dan Marino. I can't beleive that you don't realise that!

Don't forget Norm Bulaich, Golden Richards and Trent Dilfer. Golden Richards is obvious worlds better than Terrell Owens.

[ninersdd]

As a niner fan I would take him back any day to fix this team