Is it a crime to finish a degree?

[SEMOSTLfan]

I figured this would be the best place to rant on this. Over the past college football season I have really observed just how shallow and pathetic the sports media is in this day and age, so much so that my good friend (Fightin' Irish 11 on the boards) is having second thoughts about pursuing his career as a sports journalist becuase he doesn't want to be associated with it. But I digress, the main reason for this rant is the extremely difficult decision that stands before Vince Young. I understand that his stock could not get any higher at this point and I understand all the positives of going pro. However, everywhere I look the media is calling this man every name in the book for considering returning to Texas. My question is since when is it a crime for a man to have the desire to finish his education and earn a degree before going pro. I think everyone should be giving VY a pat on the back if he decides to go back to school. On the Tonight Show this evening he said that he would like to earn his degree to make his mom proud. I'm sure whichever decision he makes he will be successful but i personally hope he goes back to school because that would be a great showing of his character as a human being. As for the media stop insulting a man that wants to be an educated human being, something that will last far beyond a 10 year football career. Thanks for listening to my rant, feel free to throw your collective hats in the ring.

[quantum]

There is really no reason for VY to risk injury in the college ranks. He'll definitely go top five, so there is no pressing need to stay in college at this point. He can finish his coursework either during or after his pro career.

He has a lot to risk staying in college. His degree can wait, his football career can't.

[SEMOSTLfan]

There is really no reason for VY to risk injury in the college ranks. He'll definitely go top five, so there is no pressing need to stay in college at this point. He can finish his coursework either during or after his pro career.

He has a lot to risk staying in college. His degree can wait, his football career can't.

That's all fine and good until he has a career ending injury in his first or second year or he's a draft bust and never takes off in the pro's and is left with nothing to fall back on. Sometimes I think people just need to look at the bigger picture.

[See Red]

There is really no reason for VY to risk injury in the college ranks.  He'll definitely go top five, so there is no pressing need to stay in college at this point.  He can finish his coursework either during or after his pro career.

He has a lot to risk staying in college.  His degree can wait, his football career can't.

That's all fine and good until he has a career ending injury in his first or second year or he's a draft bust and never takes off in the pro's and is left with nothing to fall back on. Sometimes I think people just need to look at the bigger picture.

You can always go back and get your degree.

Meanwhile, if he gets hurt in college and can never play again, he doesn't get that nice, multi-million signing bonus.

[eastcoasthusky]

It would be great if Vince Young came back and finish his degree in liberal arts (which is what it is, looked it up). But you know what, he doesn't need it right now. He can go get a 12-15 million signing bonus guaranteed and if he isn't a idiot with his money he would be set for basically for the rest of his life.

And then during the summer or at the end of his career he could finish his degree if he so wanted. Young's already 3/4 of the way there.

But he could also go back if he wanted like Leinart, like Tim Duncan. He can finish his degree now and also live the college life for another year. Heck, I do it if could for free.

But he does risk injury on the field. But he also risks injury walking down the street, so I think that's a wash.

[quantum]

There is really no reason for VY to risk injury in the college ranks.  He'll definitely go top five, so there is no pressing need to stay in college at this point.  He can finish his coursework either during or after his pro career.

He has a lot to risk staying in college.  His degree can wait, his football career can't.

That's all fine and good until he has a career ending injury in his first or second year or he's a draft bust and never takes off in the pro's and is left with nothing to fall back on. Sometimes I think people just need to look at the bigger picture.

You can always go back and get your degree.

Meanwhile, if he gets hurt in college and can never play again, he doesn't get that nice, multi-million signing bonus.

Exactly.

[FightinIrish11]

seriously, how many times has it happened in the past where someone has suffered a career ending injury by staying in college? if it's happened, i'd really like to hear some names...really, if you have any. i just cant recall any in recent memory. it's not like it's a complete gamble, the odds are in his favor. he's made it this far without getting hurt. i mean for god sakes people, the kid was hit by a car while riding his bike when he was 7 and suffered a ruptured intestine. but obviously it didnt stop him from blossuming into one of the most talented multi-dimensional college QB's i've ever seen (in my 15 years of watching football...i know thats not a long time). to be honest, everyone in this world needs to stop thinking about money for about 5 minutes.

[quantum]

The point is that a football career is worth too much to jeopardize if you don't have to. And frankly, what is the point of college? To have an education to earn a living. Well, pro sports will provide more money than a college degree will. Besides, an education is always available later on. The same cannot be said for pro sports.

I think a college education makes for a better person. However, if a pro sports career is a sure thing, you would be a fool to risk injury.

[Cyclopsis Joe]

Well all the points are good.

But personally, I'd rather get hurt in college and graduate than go pro, get drafted, beat up, and retire and end up doing endorsements or robbing people to make a living.

You guys act like if he flunks out of the NFL that colleges are gonna be knocking down his door for him again..they won't.

College is expensive, and I think it's smart to get it done while you have a scholarship.

[quantum]

College is expensive, and I think it's smart to get it done while you have a scholarship.

A few thousand dollars versus millions? If he has any level of intelligence, he'll have the bulk of his signing bonus in investments. Although a scholarship is great, it's peanuts compared to want he is in store for.

Besides, plenty of athletes finish school after they go pro.

[paynomind]

Allow me to first answer the question this topic proposed:

No, it certainly should not be portrayed as a crime, or stupid, or idiotic to decide to get his degree. It can be discussed, debated, covered, but it should not be looked at as a stupid decision, or a crime.

That said, I think he should go pro. Many reasons. Right now, it is assumed that he is worth several million dollars on draft day. Nothing he could do in another year of playing in college could change that much, in a positive way. Several things could affect in negatively. He could get hurt. (You want a name? Willia McGahee. Blew out his knee. He came back eventually, but it cost him years and thousands of hours of un-or under-paid rehabilitation) He could have an 'off year' and end up sliding into the second or third round.

Point being- he is a top 3 pick. Not much better he can do, but he risks a lot in staying. For what? A liberal arts degree? Other than the "pride of personal acheivement" part of that, it isn't worth much of anything. It gets him a 32k a year job. I'm thinking that a Texas alum might, just might, hire the guy who won them a National Championship whether he has that degree or not. Unless you are a doctor, lawyer, etc a college degree really doesn't do that much for you anyway. Who you know, and your experience matter far more.

Is it nice to have your mom proud of you for graduationg? Sure. It is worth rishing the 15 mil he is all but guaranteed, come draft day? Not even a little bit.

[gashouser27]

It definitely isn't a crime to earn a degree. Many athletes get degrees by taking summer classes..

But let's be realistic..The real crime is that to be a college athlete these days means you have to compromise your education anyway..

Most athletes think their "career" path will be as a professional athlete anyway..If you had a chance to make millions of dollars as an accountant or lawyer or teacher and you had to leave school a year early most people would do that anyway..Some of these guys are going to make more money in a year that we will in a lifetime..

Or you could take the Matt Leinert path and go back to school so you can take ballroom dancing and go to clubs with Lindsay Lohan and Hillary Duff..

For the Matt Leinerts and Vince Youngs there are no bad choices

The real crime involves the college athlete who isn't going to be a pro (which is like 99%) and get cheated out of a decent education by the same programs who give them scholarships and make millions of dollars off of them and leave them with nothing...There are plenty of stories like these

[Sterling84]

I could not agree more with what most repliers have stated. OF COURSE he should go pro.

Look, to have misgivings about a career path you've always dreamed about is one thing and valid. I'd always thought I wanted to do feature animation for Disney. I chose to not pursue that because my feelings about that company changed and that's acceptable.

So to rethink the hero-worship world of sports and to get turned off by all the money and greed is laudable. To not want to have to be a "personality" in your own right just to cover sports makes sense.

But to take that feeling, and extrapolate that Vince Young is a victim of something and shouldn't be leaving college is taking your rationale too far. College is overrated. 99% of the benefit of college is learning to live on your own, balance your time on your own, money on your own etc. It's about learning that there is a big world outside your hometown, meeting new and incredibly varied people and listening to different viewpoints. In terms of knowledge toward a career, you learn much more in an old-fashioned apprentice relationship. You learn by doing. The transition from read - review - test to real world productivity is a serious jump and most grads relearn what they need to on the fly anyway once hired.

If you wanted to be a logo designer, and in your second year of college SME saw your portfolio and wanted to hire you on the spot for big bucks. Well then, you're ready.....you take it. No questions. If college is to "prepare you" for the next phase of income-earning life then it's served it's purpose for Vince Young.

While the college athletics system is every bit as corrupt and athlete-using as you feel it is, let's be honest. Let's treat Vince like every other person on the planet. He can pick up 20 some odd credits at any point for pride and graduate. He's one of the lucky ones. College HAS given him a leg up professionally. He'll make more in signing bonuses in one day next spring than you or I will ever have. And while money isn't everything and athletes make too much of it, he'll suddenly have freedom to follow any path he wants later in life.

In this case, nothing is rotten in Denmark.

[Michigan Dave]

I think I have a rather unique perspective on this myself- not that I was remotely close to ever having that decision- but I played with and was friends with guys that have made those choices. First, for me, college football is #1. I'm a person not motivated by money, but I've also never had money a year away that would put my entire family into immediate retirement. So there's that issue. But, being said, I graduated from UM in 2002, and not a day goes by that I don't wish I could go back and run through the tunnel one more time, go through one more season, and just live the college life again. And I'm very happy with where I am at in life. I work a side gig with the NFL, and am involved in the lockerroom, on the field and sidelines of games, and it is VERY different. At Michigan, we played with our hearts, for pride and for the team. There was a heavily vested emotional angle that really isn't there in the pros. Especially on high level teams. My greatest moment in sports, bar none, was being on the Orange Bowl winning team. It was so high, and I can't imagine how players on our 1997 National Championship team, or Vince Young, must feel. Yes, VY can get his degree anytime, and money is important. But he only has one more chance to walk around campus with the "T" on his jacket, as Vince M-F---ing Young. Being a college athlete is very rewarding and fun. The NFL lifestyle is much different, and it's a big part of why the NFL is able to holdup the 3 year rule, aside from the physical differences.

[Grish]

First let me say I understand your point, about commending him if he stays in school.

However, as many have already stated, a college degree can be gained at any point in our life.

I, in rare cases, get to discuss this very issue with local baseball players and their parents. My recommendation is if you can secure the $ to go to school by going pro then do so. You can always go back to school. No one says you have to go to college and earn a degree by a certain age. However, being a pro athlete is something available only to a small % of individuals. If however you have a scholarship and the $ for going pro does not offset the cost of college for 5 years then you should go to school and get your degree.

Lets look at the worse case sernio for VY. He goes the draft, ends up in the top 5 picks. He will receive a signing bonus anywhere from $15-$20 million dollars. This is his, regardless of his yearly salary or if he is a bust. This is the only money in the NFL guaranteed. If he gets hurt do you not think, that he can go back to Texas, finish his degree and still not work about working.

To me, if I were is parents or advisor it would be a simple decision. Go to the draft, buy yourself a sensible house and car. Then wait, make good decision and be wise in who you associate yourself with. When your career is over, go back to school, get your degree and make your parents proud. Set yourself up for life. FYI- you don't have to be a top 10 pick to make your life easier, if you make the right choices.

I guarantee you that parents are just as proud of kids without degrees who are good people and make good choices as the are with the kids who have degrees and are good people.

Remember the reason why some want him to stay in school is for the money he earns them. Coaches make more money because they win. Univesities make big money on football, especially winning football, as well as conferences, networks and etc.

Also consider why people go to college, you go in hopes you can transcend or climb to a certain level of sucess. He has opened that door and not saying it would not open again, but as they say, "Seize the day".

That being said, if he stays in school versus going to the NFL. Well that his is choice.

--------------------

Media is Media, but just because you are in the business does not mean you act in the same manner as everyone else. Maybe your friend needs to focus on being a solution, rather then worrying about what he might be associated with. If that makes sense.

[Michigan Dave]

First let me say I understand your point, about commending him if he stays in school.

However, as many have already stated, a college degree can be gained at any point in our life.

I, in rare cases, get to discuss this very issue with local baseball players and their parents. My recommendation is if you can secure the $ to go to school by going pro then do so. You can always go back to school. No one says you have to go to college and earn a degree by a certain age. However, being a pro athlete is something available only to a small % of individuals. If however you have a scholarship and the $ for going pro does not offset the cost of college for 5 years then you should go to school and get your degree.

Lets look at the worse case sernio for VY. He goes the draft, ends up in the top 5 picks. He will receive a signing bonus anywhere from $15-$20 million dollars. This is his, regardless of his yearly salary or if he is a bust. This is the only money in the NFL guaranteed. If he gets hurt do you not think, that he can go back to Texas, finish his degree and still not work about working.

To me, if I were is parents or advisor it would be a simple decision. Go to the draft, buy yourself a sensible house and car. Then wait, make good decision and be wise in who you associate yourself with. When your career is over, go back to school, get your degree and make your parents proud. Set yourself up for life. FYI- you don't have to be a top 10 pick to make your life easier, if you make the right choices.

I guarantee you that parents are just as proud of kids without degrees who are good people and make good choices as the are with the kids who have degrees and are good people.

Remember the reason why some want him to stay in school is for the money he earns them. Coaches make more money because they win. Univesities make big money on football, especially winning football, as well as conferences, networks and etc.

Also consider why people go to college, you go in hopes you can transcend or climb to a certain level of sucess. He has opened that door and not saying it would not open again, but as they say, "Seize the day".

That being said, if he stays in school versus going to the NFL. Well that his is choice.

--------------------

Media is Media, but just because you are in the business does not mean you act in the same manner as everyone else. Maybe your friend needs to focus on being a solution, rather then worrying about what he might be associated with. If that makes sense.

I disagree. College assists in building responsibility and more than anything I learned in class, I learned my life lessons in college. I wouldn't trade it for all of the riches I could earn. I understand that some people don't have the same priorities as I do, and some weren't as fortunate as I was to have the assistance from my family to make sure I had a good quality of life in school. Some kids truly need to go pro, and help out. I get that. But, one thing he'll never be able to get back is that final year at UT. A lot of my friends that went pro still talk about how much more fun the college game was. You live with your teammates, you go to class, it's just a better environment. I identify with Leinart for sticking around.

[rams80]

seriously, how many times has it happened in the past where someone has suffered a career ending injury by staying in college? if it's happened, i'd really like to hear some names...really, if you have any. i just cant recall any in recent memory. it's not like it's a complete gamble, the odds are in his favor. he's made it this far without getting hurt. i mean for god sakes people, the kid was hit by a car while riding his bike when he was 7 and suffered a ruptured intestine. but obviously it didnt stop him from blossuming into one of the most talented multi-dimensional college QB's i've ever seen (in my 15 years of watching football...i know thats not a long time). to be honest, everyone in this world needs to stop thinking about money for about 5 minutes.

I don't remember if he had decided to come back for a senior year in Miami or was a junior, but Willis McGahee pops into mind as a guy who lost some money through injury (and almost lost a lot more).

[Grish]

First let me say I understand your point, about commending him if he stays in school.

However, as many have already stated, a college degree can be gained at any point in our life.

I, in rare cases, get to discuss this very issue with local baseball players and their parents. My recommendation is if you can secure the $ to go to school by going pro then do so. You can always go back to school. No one says you have to go to college and earn a degree by a certain age.  However, being a pro athlete is something available only to a small % of individuals.  If however you have a scholarship and the $ for going pro does not offset the cost of college for 5 years then you should go to school and get your degree. 

Lets look at the worse case sernio for VY. He goes the draft, ends up in the top 5 picks.  He will receive a signing bonus anywhere from $15-$20 million dollars. This is his, regardless of his yearly salary or if he is a bust. This is the only money in the NFL guaranteed.  If he gets hurt do you not think, that he can go back to Texas, finish his degree and still not work about working.  

To me, if I were is parents or advisor it would be a simple decision. Go to the draft, buy yourself a sensible house and car.  Then wait, make good decision and be wise in who you associate yourself with. When your career is over, go back to school, get your degree and make your parents proud.  Set yourself up for life. FYI- you don't have to be a top 10 pick to make your life easier, if you make the right choices.

I guarantee you that parents are just as proud of kids without degrees who are good people and make good choices as the are with the kids who have degrees and are good people.

Remember the reason why some want him to stay in school is for the money he earns them. Coaches make more money because they win. Univesities make big money on football, especially winning football, as well as conferences, networks and etc.

Also consider why people go to college, you go in hopes you can transcend or climb to a certain level of sucess.  He has opened that door and not saying it would not open again, but as they say, "Seize the day".

That being said, if he stays in school versus going to the NFL. Well that his is choice.

--------------------

Media is Media, but just because you are in the business does not mean you act in the same manner as everyone else. Maybe your friend needs to focus on being a solution, rather then worrying about what he might be associated with. If that makes sense.

I disagree. College assists in building responsibility and more than anything I learned in class, I learned my life lessons in college. I wouldn't trade it for all of the riches I could earn. I understand that some people don't have the same priorities as I do, and some weren't as fortunate as I was to have the assistance from my family to make sure I had a good quality of life in school. Some kids truly need to go pro, and help out. I get that. But, one thing he'll never be able to get back is that final year at UT. A lot of my friends that went pro still talk about how much more fun the college game was. You live with your teammates, you go to class, it's just a better environment. I identify with Leinart for sticking around.

Colleges and Universities are not the only place you can learn responsibility.

Otherwise you are saying that people who don't go to school have no concept of responsibility. As well as you are saying that those who go to college know something others have no perception of, and that is not reality.

When and how you learn responsibility is different for each person. I would argue that most of your learning of the concept of what is to be a responsible person comes from your family, friends and those you come in contact with throughout life. As you move on through life you are asked to exhibit your understanding of responsibility into the context of your community.

I could argue to, that the college campus is the one of the most irresponsible segments of community and actually can hamper the transition of individuals to act as their greater community wishes them to within the value of their definition of responsibility. Let us keep in mind, college/university campuses are riddled with some of the most hideous behavior: criminal and childish alike.

Many people love their college/university experience and don?t want to leave it. Just as some look at their high school experience and wish things had not changed. But, at some point you need to move on and take the next step in life. If that means delaying your degree to take advantage of a rare opportunity that will change your life and possibility your families for a life time, then you have to consider it and in some cases take advantage of it.

I would find it hard to believe that if someone put a check in front of a college junior for $20 million under the condition that you leave school today and return for your senior year sometime after 5 years that, that student would not cash that check.

[blueclad]

One of the few things that really frustrates me with the public's perception of higher education is its credulous stress on job placement. I collect university prospectuses partly for an interest in public relations and graphic design, but in critiquing them, it's impossible not to notice the lack of respect for a well-rounded liberal arts education.

At regional institutions like Binghampton, Grand Valley, and Montana State, they feel like the only way to recruit top-line students is by luring them through job placement. Even at slightly pretentious Mt. Holyoke, I had to thumb through four presentations of the same graduate-career statistics before finding anything about their scholastic programs.

On a campus visit to the University of Minnesota this summer, I had only a small opportunity to conflict my girlfriend's father's opinion that classes like "The Psychology of the Color Red" are useless in the business world. That opportunity arose from the school's motto, engraved on Northrup Auditorium.

"Founded in the Faith that Men are Enobled by Understanding.

Dedicated to the Advancement of Learning and the Search for Truth.

Devoted to the Instruction of Youth and the Welfare of the State."

I, too, believe that enlightenment preludes success. Maybe success doesn't come in the business world, and I'd be happier if it didn't, but any understanding of language, arts, societial implications and thier causal factors furthers that possiblity.

[CC97]

I think he should do what he wants to do