AHL to Austin, Abbotsford and Glens Falls

[BBTV]

Wouldn't a team in Allentown cause territorial problems with Wilkes-Barre/Scranton?

Doubt it. The Scranton WB Yankees and Lehigh Valley Ironpigs don't have any trouble.

Simpler solution is to find another arena to play in Phila., or south Jersey.

That, or get the Hershey Bears back.

[Sodboy13]

It seems to me there's a bit of an internal divide in the AHL's front office. On one hand, you have this clamor to return to a so-called "heritage" market in Nowhere, New York; on the other, you have the footprint being expanded to far-flung outposts, like Austin and - I still can't believe it - Abbotsford.

I'm positively dumbfounded that the Abbotsford deal has cleared. That ownership group must have offered a hell of a lot more to the league than just covering all travel expenses. (BTW, does that cover round-trip travel for visiting teams? I would think it would have to, otherwise that's still going to hurt every opponent financially.) This move is destined for nothing but failure. I think the local group in Abbotsford has been given some delusional notions of grandeur when, in fact, they'll be operating a franchise with a flawed business model from the get-go. Someone doesn't realize that this team will automatically be playing second fiddle to Chilliwack, and will be dealing with tons more expenses, and likely significantly higher ticket prices. Then, there's the matter of the Calgary influence. The Flames have, over the past 4 seasons, treated their minor-league club like Josef Fritzl treated his daughter. They've killed off teams in two well-regarded minor-league markets in short order with their "This isn't a team, this is a developmental program" philosophy, and those "knowledgeable Canadian fans" aren't likely to be rushing through the turnstiles for it, either. I say two years is the threshold here, but I wouldn't be shocked if the league's running this team by the end of season one.

And I think rams80 is right - while a lot of people are looking toward Springfield for the Austin franchise, they should be gazing off northwest, instead. I'd hazard a guess that come '10-'11, there won't be a team in Abbotsford or Springfield, but there will be one in Oklahoma City.

Oh, and for those of you longing for the Atlanta "A" returning as a crest on a jersey (and I'm in that group): Even if that beauty of a crest comes back, it'll just get slapped on Calgary's current abortion of a jersey. Oh well, that'll save a lot of people $120.

[deked73]

During one of the last games of the Wolves season Billy Gardner the Wolves' color commentator said that it is a 24 hour bus ride from Winnipeg to Abbotsford. Calgary should just put their minor team in Calgary play at the Saddledome and not really worry about them being a franchise. Maybe just put them in the Flames practice rink, paint people on the walls and pipe in crowd noise for effect to make it feel like a real game.

With Texas coming on board to the West div. would the Abbotsford club be tossed into the North div. If so what are those North Divison teams gonna do when they gotta go to Abbotsford 4 or 5 times a year like Syracuse and Rochester, the Wolves played back to back nights in Winnipeg the last few years to cut travel expenses.

The should have thought of trying to get into Okla City and taking over the CHL Blazers and elevating them to the AHL. The name could have been the same, a nice fit for the franchise OKC Blazers and Calgary Flames and you would not have to compete with an established junior team with a strong following much like the problem back in Omaha. The Ak-Sar-Ben Knights had to compete not only the USHL Omaha Lancers (junior tier 1) and the Univ. of Nebraska-Omaha Mavericks.

The new Abbotsford team will be on the move again in 2 years or less.

The Texas Stars should just change the name and logo and Dallas should actually put some creative effort into it for once.

[Dante_X]

they are trying to lure Victoria into the AHL also (seen that in the blog on the Abbotsford AHL Team blog on their website)

[rams80]

they are trying to lure Victoria into the AHL also (seen that in the blog on the Abbotsford AHL Team blog on their website)

With what franchise are they going to lure Victoria into the AHL? The only vacant one is Edmonton's, and it is very much understood that Edmonton will be setting that team up in Oklahoma City once their affiliation deal is up in Springfield. Anyway, why would Victoria want to team up with one of the more unstable AHL affiliates in recent history?

It looks like the Abbotsford crew has a shockingly low grasp of the realities of the situation here. Good wishes and optimism only "works" in the ABA.

[OMMF]

Oh, and for those of you longing for the Atlanta "A" returning as a crest on a jersey (and I'm in that group): Even if that beauty of a crest comes back, it'll just get slapped on Calgary's current abortion of a jersey. Oh well, that'll save a lot of people $120.

I would hope they'd put the BC flag on the shoulder, at least.

[The_Admiral]

I knew having Milwaukee, Rockford, Rosemont, Moline, and Peoria was too good to be true. Have fun paying out the ass for minor league travel costs, Calgary Flames! Who needs Mike Cammalleri when you can have a farm team in the middle of nowhere that plays second fiddle to junior hockey?

[Lee.]

Sadly, they let it be known yesterday on the radio that the team will not be called the Flames, and that there will be a "name the team" contest.

No Atlanta jerseys for us.

Calgary has killed hockey in New Brunswick, the midwest, and soon the Fraser Valley. They're running out of places to kill minor hockey, unless they'd care to give Saskatoon a shot and try to oust the Blades, since they've already pissed off the Western Hockey League no end.

[NEW.ERA]

Sadly, they let it be known yesterday on the radio that the team will not be called the Flames, and that there will be a "name the team" contest.

No Atlanta jerseys for us.

Calgary has killed hockey in New Brunswick, the midwest, and soon the Fraser Valley. They're running out of places to kill minor hockey, unless they'd care to give Saskatoon a shot and try to oust the Blades, since they've already pissed off the Western Hockey League no end.

I wouldn't say they've gone and completely killed hockey in those markets and I'm sure one of the reasons of them moving from Moline is that attendance was very poor averaging a little more than 3000 fans per game and it really doesn't help that the Flames poor draft rate doesn't help the situation out much when they can't put a good product of hockey on the farm and that's precisely how you build a championship winning team at the big level. (see Detroit Red Wings)

In the end it doesn't matter where the team is playing the only thing that matters is how successful the farm team does.

[kiwi_canadian]

My bad posting this as a new topic. I saw the release today while I was on break at work on the AHL website...didn't have time to look for this one.

Saw in the Times Colonist (Victoria newspaper) today an article about moving the Salmon Kings to the AHL and apparently RG Properties, who owns them< are happy with their team in the ECHL. However, the article did go on to saw that over the past 53 years when the old Memorial Arena was around it housed around 4 or 5 different teams in various minor pro and junior leagues...basically what the guy was saying was that we can expect the Salmon Kings up into the AHL in the next few years, most likely if the Moose affiliation with the Canucks isn't renewed.

The WHL won't be in Victoria any time soon either because for some reason they hate the capital city.

[rams80]

Sadly, they let it be known yesterday on the radio that the team will not be called the Flames, and that there will be a "name the team" contest.

No Atlanta jerseys for us.

Calgary has killed hockey in New Brunswick, the midwest, and soon the Fraser Valley. They're running out of places to kill minor hockey, unless they'd care to give Saskatoon a shot and try to oust the Blades, since they've already pissed off the Western Hockey League no end.

I wouldn't say they've gone and completely killed hockey in those markets and I'm sure one of the reasons of them moving from Moline is that attendance was very poor averaging a little more than 3000 fans per game and it really doesn't help that the Flames poor draft rate doesn't help the situation out much when they can't put a good product of hockey on the farm and that's precisely how you build a championship winning team at the big level. (see Detroit Red Wings)

In the end it doesn't matter where the team is playing the only thing that matters is how successful the farm team does.

The attendance was poor because Calgary, in their finite wisdom, decided to remove a team identity that had strong name recognition (the Mallards) for the generic "Flames". Calgary compounded these errors by not exactly trying to promote the team, and, yes, putting a crap product out on the ice-in a market that had been used to winning.

My bad posting this as a new topic. I saw the release today while I was on break at work on the AHL website...didn't have time to look for this one.

Saw in the Times Colonist (Victoria newspaper) today an article about moving the Salmon Kings to the AHL and apparently RG Properties, who owns them< are happy with their team in the ECHL. However, the article did go on to saw that over the past 53 years when the old Memorial Arena was around it housed around 4 or 5 different teams in various minor pro and junior leagues...basically what the guy was saying was that we can expect the Salmon Kings up into the AHL in the next few years, most likely if the Moose affiliation with the Canucks isn't renewed.

The WHL won't be in Victoria any time soon either because for some reason they hate the capital city.

You mean the one they renewed last month?

And that ignores the whole "where will the franchise come from?" question.

[kiwi_canadian]

Yes I was meaning that one. I know they renewed it recently with the Moose...who knows though, we could see Winnipeg in the NHL after the 2011-12 season anyways which would pave the way for the AHL in Victoria.

Honestly though, I'd prefer the WHL over minor pro any day.

[Sodboy13]

who knows though, we could see Winnipeg in the NHL after the 2011-12 season

No, no we won't. Now stop this.

[The_Admiral]

who knows though, we could see Winnipeg in the NHL after the 2011-12 season

No, no we won't. Now stop this.

Look at it this way: if they get the ball rolling RIGHT NOW, 2012 is just enough time to plan, design, approve, and erect the NHL-calibre facility that Winnipeg failed to build like four years ago or whatever. Meanwhile, 2012 is not enough time for the cash-bleeding loan-sucking Phoenix Coyotes to become popular, profitable, or good. If everything falls into place, we can realize the dream and put hockey back in a town where there's nothing else to live for.

[Sodboy13]

Look at it this way: if they get the ball rolling RIGHT NOW, 2012 is just enough time to plan, design, approve, and erect the NHL-calibre facility that Winnipeg failed to build like four years ago or whatever. Meanwhile, 2012 is not enough time for the cash-bleeding loan-sucking Phoenix Coyotes to become popular, profitable, or good. If everything falls into place, we can realize the dream and put hockey back in a town where there's nothing else to live for.

This is a different kind of "shovel-ready" project, isn't it?

As for the last part of your statement, I thought Detroit already had a hockey team.

[kiwi_canadian]

Well I could see the MTS Centre being reovated for another couple of thousand seats to bring it up to NHL seating capacities. It's pretty new so it shouldn't really be a problem...

However, take a look at the Wikipedia topic on the MTS Centre and what it says under NHL tennents:

MTS Centre

[Seadragon76]

I remember the rumors a couple of years ago about Dallas wanting their AHL team closer to home and last year, they ended their deal with Iowa (This allowed Anaheim to come in and the team became the Chops). Having a team in Austin works well for the Stars since they'll have their farm team close to home and you also get an instant in-state rivalry with San Antonio and Houston.

Glens Falls is one that came out of left field for me. But, the AHL has some great history of having strong teams from that area. Plus, you don't really screw up much in terms of realignment.

Abbotsford is the big shocker. My question is why? I know attendence has been an issue at Quad Cities (and even in Omaha... hell, I bet you that even when Calgary had this team in St. John's, they had attendence issues as well), but that's no excuse to move a team to what some may consider to be the middle of nowhere. Despite it's location (Near Vancouver) this team won't do well and the Flames may end up moving this team again to... Oh, I don't know. What city hasn't had an AHL franchise in a long time?

[NEW.ERA]

I remember the rumors a couple of years ago about Dallas wanting their AHL team closer to home and last year, they ended their deal with Iowa (This allowed Anaheim to come in and the team became the Chops). Having a team in Austin works well for the Stars since they'll have their farm team close to home and you also get an instant in-state rivalry with San Antonio and Houston.

Glens Falls is one that came out of left field for me. But, the AHL has some great history of having strong teams from that area. Plus, you don't really screw up much in terms of realignment.

Abbotsford is the big shocker. My question is why? I know attendence has been an issue at Quad Cities (and even in Omaha... hell, I bet you that even when Calgary had this team in St. John's, they had attendence issues as well), but that's no excuse to move a team to what some may consider to be the middle of nowhere. Despite it's location (Near Vancouver) this team won't do well and the Flames may end up moving this team again to... Oh, I don't know. What city hasn't had an AHL franchise in a long time?

How about a city that has never had an AHL Team, Grand Rapids, North Dakota not an astronomical distance between the two cities there Hockey crazy in North Dakota and the Ralph Engelstad Arena is far big enough.

[rams80]

Well I could see the MTS Centre being reovated for another couple of thousand seats to bring it up to NHL seating capacities. It's pretty new so it shouldn't really be a problem...

However, take a look at the Wikipedia topic on the MTS Centre and what it says under NHL tennents:

MTS Centre

It's ing wikipedia. That article (now) also mentions that they keep beelzebub in the storm cellar. I assume that's true as well.

[rams80]

How about a city that has never had an AHL Team, Grand Rapids, North Dakota not an astronomical distance between the two cities there Hockey crazy in North Dakota and the Ralph Engelstad Arena is far big enough.

So you would put it toe to toe with a very popular major college team. That has financial disaster written ALL over it.