2012 NFL Season Thread

[dfwabel]

Norv was 49-59-1 with Washington and 9-23 with Oakland. To be fair, he's been 52-34 with SD but why in the world would they hire a 58-82-1 coach to begin with? That's a dysfunctional organization.

While I don't like Norv Turner as a coach much, Bill Belichick's pre-Patriots head coaching record was 36-44. My dad always says "the best indication of future performance is past performance," but sometimes past performance doesn't tell the whole story.

That is a different issue for NFL coaches. The once fired NFL coach, who is considered a "retread", has won eight of the last 15 Super Bowls*:

Billichek-3

Coughlin-2

Shannahan-2

Dungy-1

*: Add a coach who resigned (Vermeil) and a coach who was traded (Gruden) and it is ten of the last 15 Super Bowl winning coaches who won titles at their second HC job. Outside of Gruden, each has a franchise QB which is damn hard to come by combined with the ramdoness of winning close playoff games in that Super Bowl season. When Colts were down 21-6 in the 2006 AFC title game at home to win was random.

In early 2010, ESPN The Magazine ran a story using independent data which other have collected on which attributes make an NFL coach and the top four attributes were:

1. They were between ages 41 and 49.

2. They had at least 11 years of NFL coaching experience.

3. They were assistants on teams that won at least 50 games over a five-year span.

4. They had only one previous NFL head-coaching gig.

if you do not have a hard copy, the full piece is now an ESPN Insider page only but they update it as a commentary here...

at 5-27, Marty Mornhinweg was the only guy who met all that criteria.

Norv wouldn't really make for a good offensive coordinator anymore either. The game has just passed him by. He's calling the same old slow-developing plays with five- and seven-step drops in an era of no-huddles and fast-paced offenses.

Your dislike of Norvell is like something we would hear on Finebaum, but his issue is not his inability to "call the TD play", I think it is deeper. It is hard enough to win games in the NFL, but it is even harder when the HC is also calling plays.

That is a unique skill which can be done well for a magical season, but over the course of a career, it does not work out to anything more than a .500 coach.

In last two seasons, the following guys called offensive plays: fired Jackson (OAK), fired Haley (KC), Garrett (DAL), Turner (SD), Gailey (BUF), Payton (NO), McCarthy (GB), Shurmur (CLE), Kubiak (HOU). Not a great list and Garrett leads it in late game sideline chaos even over the Raiders.

Defensively, Smith (CHI) and Ryan (NYJ) call plays.

It is hard to be the HC and also call plays, which is why only a collection of unique coaches can do it well.

[BlueSky]

That....that was something. I don't mean to descend into Lights Out territory but....Jesus this team just can't get its s*** together. Norv has to go, yes, but so do AJ and Rivers.

This whole thing just needs to be scrapped and rebuilt.

I still think Rivers could be successful if he had a real coach to work with. Norv Turner should never be anything but an offensive coordinator... if even that.

Proof:

I hate the 49ers but find it hard to root against Smith & Harbaugh. Smith because I think he was about 10 seconds from turning into the next David Carr or Matt Leinart and instead he stuck it out in SF and with Harbaugh, he's a legit NFL starter.

As I found out the hard way:

That was a fantastic play call...

[Kramerica Industries]

As it turned out, that playcall didn't even win the game.

Try Smith's excellent trajectory on the pass to Davis on the sideline, or Smith's excellent zip on the Davis TD. The same kind of passes Alex Smith piled up the incompletions on under previous coordinators.

[dfwabel]

BlueSky,

While Couch and Carr were #1 overall picks like Smith, Vick and Eli, both should be judged separately since they were chosen by expansion teams. The following 1st round picks in their next four years illustrate that both teams were not giving them talent on the offensive side of the ball to compete, less win.

Browns 1st rounders after Couch: Courtney Brown (DL), Gerrard Warren (DL), William Green (RB) with pre-draft issues, Jeff Faine (OL). Couch is benched by Butch Davis as draft Winslow (TE), followed by Edwards (WR) the next year.

Texans 1st rounders after Carr: Andre Johnson (WR); Dunta Robinson ( DB) and Jason Babin (DE); Travis Johnson (DT); mario Williams (DE) then he was gone.

They are not given talent to be protected or to get the ball to.

49ers 1st rounders since Alex Smith: Vernon Davis (TE); Patrick Willis (LB)/Joe Staley (OL); Kentwan Balmer (DT); Michael Crabtree (WR); Mike Iupati and Anthony Davis (OL); Aldon Smith (DE/LB)

Smith is surrounded by five, first round offensive starters. Those other were not.

They had offensive talent prior as Warner illustrated, but here are the Cardinals 1st rounders since Leinert:

Levi Brown (OL), Dominque Rodgers-Cromartie (DB); Beanie Wells (RB).

Look at how the Colts drafted before Manning (Harrison and Tarik Glenn) and immediately following they hit on four of the next five 1st rounders: Edge James (RB); Ron Morris (LB); Reggie Wayne (WR); Dwight Freeney (DE); Dallas Clark (TE).

[NEW.ERA]

Anyone with the NFL Network. Don't forget tonight's "A Football Life" about Steve McNair. One of my all time favourite players, and one of the greats at the Quarterback position.

[CS85]

Dolphins looking to trade for Dwayne Bowe.

[TheOldRoman]

The Dolphins just traded away a top-5 receiver in Brandon Marshall for a pair of third round picks this past offseason. If the report is true, they will now trade a pair of third round picks, a pair of second round picks and a top-ten first round pick for a receiver who is slightly worse?! What a horrible organization.

[NJTank]

Marshall was traded because he is an instable personality

[TheOldRoman]

Marshall was traded because he is an instable personality

There was certainly that, but he was still putting up huge numbers on a horse team for much less than they are going to have to pay Bowe. And why blow your load on a receiver when you don't have a QB to throw to him, especially when they might lose Jake Long this offseason? They would get two first rounders back for Long if someone outbid them (and I think a certain team wearing navy and orange will try its best to do so), but this still makes no sense for the Dolphins.

[CS85]

Jason Cole ‏@JasonColeYahoo

Just to clarify something: I'm NOT reporting the KC and Miami are talki g trade over Bowe. Not yet, at least. Misunderstanding by someone

[Kramerica Industries]

At this point in time, Russell Wilson is a terrible NFL quarterback.

Now tell me why I'm wrong.

[TrueYankee26]

Huge game for the Jets coming up against the *barf* Patriots.

[NJTank]

At this point in time, Russell Wilson is a terrible NFL quarterback.

Now tell me why I'm wrong.

At this point in time, Russell Wilson is a terrible NFL quarterback.

Now tell me why I'm wrong.

You are wrong, he is a rookie he has led two fourth quarter comebacks against teams that last year were the #1 seed in each conference. Today hel lost a road game to a great defense on a Thursday Night all tough positions for a rookie.

[dfwabel]

Wilson is just a QB. He is better than Flynn, but still just a QB.

Even last year, SEA had an idea on how to win after their 7-9 NFC West win in 2010.

1- Know that you have eight games in CenturyLink Field, where noise is great and you should go at least 7-1 or 6-2 (in an bad year).

2- Build your defense up to make that crowd impact the game.

3- Try to steal 2 or more road games. (They already have 1 in @

Michael Lombardi gave us this blueprint before the NFL season started. He thought they would make the playoffs.

Their road schedule is :

@DET

@MIA

@CHI (week after @MIA)

@BUF

Home games are:

MIN

NYJ (back to back from MIN)

AZ

SF

STL (Week 17 with SF a week before)

[BlueSky]

BlueSky,

While Couch and Carr were #1 overall picks like Smith, Vick and Eli, both should be judged separately since they were chosen by expansion teams. The following 1st round picks in their next four years illustrate that both teams were not giving them talent on the offensive side of the ball to compete, less win.

Browns 1st rounders after Couch: Courtney Brown (DL), Gerrard Warren (DL), William Green (RB) with pre-draft issues, Jeff Faine (OL). Couch is benched by Butch Davis as draft Winslow (TE), followed by Edwards (WR) the next year.

Texans 1st rounders after Carr: Andre Johnson (WR); Dunta Robinson ( DB) and Jason Babin (DE); Travis Johnson (DT); mario Williams (DE) then he was gone.

They are not given talent to be protected or to get the ball to.

49ers 1st rounders since Alex Smith: Vernon Davis (TE); Patrick Willis (LB)/Joe Staley (OL); Kentwan Balmer (DT); Michael Crabtree (WR); Mike Iupati and Anthony Davis (OL); Aldon Smith (DE/LB)

Smith is surrounded by five, first round offensive starters. Those other were not.

They had offensive talent prior as Warner illustrated, but here are the Cardinals 1st rounders since Leinert:

Levi Brown (OL), Dominque Rodgers-Cromartie (DB); Beanie Wells (RB).

Look at how the Colts drafted before Manning (Harrison and Tarik Glenn) and immediately following they hit on four of the next five 1st rounders: Edge James (RB); Ron Morris (LB); Reggie Wayne (WR); Dwight Freeney (DE); Dallas Clark (TE).

A nice analysis but I mentioned Carr and Leinart, not Couch, and was only making a superficial comparison to #1 pick QBs (not necessarily #1 overall picks) who turned out to be busts, i.e. that Alex was very close to being a wasted pick. Of course, his play lately suggests the jury may still be out and I doubt he'll ever be elite.

[OnWis97]

At this point in time, Russell Wilson is a terrible NFL quarterback.

Now tell me why I'm wrong.

At this point in time, Russell Wilson is a terrible NFL quarterback.

Now tell me why I'm wrong.

You are wrong, he is a rookie he has led two fourth quarter comebacks against teams that last year were the #1 seed in each conference. Today hel lost a road game to a great defense on a Thursday Night all tough positions for a rookie.

I think it's undecided. Rookies are not usually good, but right now, he should be riding the bench. In fairness to him, his numbers would not have been so bad if his receivers did not drop pass after pass last night. But that interception was brutal. In college (at least the one year I watched) he never made bad choices like that. If he can catch up to the speed of the game, I think his leadership, intelligence, and athleticism could make him a very viable backup for a solid decade. As it is now, Flynn should be starting. He's been around more. They have a great defense and they should not waste it on a rookie QB.

[CS85]

Chargers director of PR is tired of wishy-washy fans:

What’s with you people?

Yes, Monday night’s loss was bad. Horrible. Embarrassing.

Ok…enough already. No mas. I get it.

Now get over it. It was a loss. One loss.

Listening to some of you out there, you’d think Monday night was “win or go home” and the Chargers are now packing their bags.

“The Chargers are finished. Done,” said one scribe.

Another wrote, “Bye, bye Chargers. Put a fork in them.”

Sometimes I think Twitter was invented to give people a chance to puff out their chests and talk big, saying things they never would say to someone’s face.

And talk radio … don’t get me started. The old adage your mom used to preach – “If you don’t have anything good say, don’t say anything” – seems to have evolved to “if you don’t have anything good to say, call sports talk radio.”

Some of those folks are probably the same ones who called for former Head Coach Bobby Ross’ job when his first Chargers team started the 1992 season 0-4. I still remember the self-proclaimed experts saying Bobby was “in over his head”. The Chargers went on to win 11 of the next 12 games that year, along with a 17-0 victory in the first round of the playoffs.

A few of the more recent Chargers teams have been declared dead by quacks, only to awaken in good health. The 3-3 Chargers of 2004 won nine of their final 10 games. The ’06 Chargers won their final 10. The ’07 Chargers started 1-3 before winning 10 of their last 12. The ’08 Chargers won their final four in a row and the ’09 team won its last 11 games.

Time to take a chill pill. No one knows what will happen this season, yet alone the next game. That’s the beauty of the National Football League. I don’t know, you don’t know, no one knows what’s going to happen.

If you want these players and coaches to succeed, then support them. Don’t tear them down. What you want and what we all want, including your team, is to know people believe in them.

Look at it this way. We want our loved ones to succeed, and we’ll do whatever it takes to help them. But when they make mistakes, like we all do, we would never criticize or belittle them publicly.

Your team is 3-3, tied at the top of the division, and has 10 games to play. If the Chargers are your team, get behind them and stay behind them. We’re all at our best when we know others believe in us.

[Sport]

FIRE NORV will be the overwhelming response to that letter.

At this point I just want them to fire Norv so Chargers fans will shut up.

[rams80]

Chargers director of PR is tired of wishy-washy fans:

Well, after that little "circle the wagons" speech, I believe the Chargers' Information Minister deserves a pejorative nickname. How does "San Diego Sam" grab you? Or "Charger Chuck?"

[NJTank]

San Diego Bob