2009 NCAA Football Thread

[Jigga]

LSU fans are arguably the most delusional fans over the past 25 years. Granted, they have had talent and now more than ever, but they have rolled through seven coaches (+1 interim) in the past 25 years. SEVEN! The past five seasons have just fueled the fire much more. Fanboards are tearing him apart.

Honestly, I think he is a good coach, but not that good. In fact, I think he gambles way too much. He was a 7-8 win coach at OK State with that talent and now is a 9-10 win coach with LSU's talent and the 12 game schedule. If he went to Michigan, he would have still become a 8-10 win coach.

I think the Michigan faithful would give up their first born children for that right now (especially if they could beat tOSU).

I feel you though B-Rich...The Hat makes his fair share of bonehead moves (coaching hires among them).

[infrared41]

Given time and a patient fanbase and administration I think Rodriguez could put together a good program at Michigan. The problem is that he's not coaching at a school with that kind of time or patience. Michigan wants "their guy" and Rodriguez is just filling the seat until their guy becomes available. He's a dead man walking and everyone knows it.

You'd think a fanbase as smart as Michigan's would have learned from watching Notre Dame and Nebraska's struggles, but I guess not.

If Rodriguez were a "Michigan man" they would. Since he's an outsider he'd better start walking on water...and quick.

I have a question/curiosity about that.

I don't have a horse in this race, but wouldn't that type of mentality--having a "Michigan Man" lead the program--sort of box a program in a bit? Me, as an objective viewer from the outside, wonders if maybe the right guy to lead that program isn't a Michigan guy. I know Jim Harbaugh's name is being tossed out there, and yes, he's done a good job at Stanford...but Stanford ain't Michigan, and let's say Michigan gets their man in Jim Harbaugh...and then he, a "Michigan man" goes in there and craps the pot. Then what would the UM heads have to say? Me personally, I think that if they truly wanted to (re)build a winning program at Michigan and have the right guy lead them there, they would do a more expansive search for that right guy rather than boxing themselves in with self-imposed parameters (read: "Michigan men"). Is it a school pride/hubris thing or something? Just curious.

But...I know, the boosters/alumni ultimately run things there (and everywhere) cuz they got the $$$...but still, that's just something I often wonder about with "perennial powerhouse" programs such as Michigan and the like.

I agree with everything you said. Having to get a "Michigan man" makes no sense. It's just how they do things up there. All I know is that Jim Tressel isn't an "Ohio State" man but he's worked out pretty well for us. Was Urban Meyer a Florida guy? Etc. In any case, Michigan man or not, Rich Rodriguez is a bad fit for Michigan. They were desperate and they made a bad hire.

[slightly shotgunned]

Given time and a patient fanbase and administration I think Rodriguez could put together a good program at Michigan. The problem is that he's not coaching at a school with that kind of time or patience. Michigan wants "their guy" and Rodriguez is just filling the seat until their guy becomes available. He's a dead man walking and everyone knows it.

You'd think a fanbase as smart as Michigan's would have learned from watching Notre Dame and Nebraska's struggles, but I guess not.

If Rodriguez were a "Michigan man" they would. Since he's an outsider he'd better start walking on water...and quick.

I have a question/curiosity about that.

I don't have a horse in this race, but wouldn't that type of mentality--having a "Michigan Man" lead the program--sort of box a program in a bit? Me, as an objective viewer from the outside, wonders if maybe the right guy to lead that program isn't a Michigan guy. I know Jim Harbaugh's name is being tossed out there, and yes, he's done a good job at Stanford...but Stanford ain't Michigan, and let's say Michigan gets their man in Jim Harbaugh...and then he, a "Michigan man" goes in there and craps the pot. Then what would the UM heads have to say? Me personally, I think that if they truly wanted to (re)build a winning program at Michigan and have the right guy lead them there, they would do a more expansive search for that right guy rather than boxing themselves in with self-imposed parameters (read: "Michigan men"). Is it a school pride/hubris thing or something? Just curious.

But...I know, the boosters/alumni ultimately run things there (and everywhere) cuz they got the $$$...but still, that's just something I often wonder about with "perennial powerhouse" programs such as Michigan and the like.

I agree with everything you said. Having to get a "Michigan man" makes no sense. It's just how they do things up there. All I know is that Jim Tressel isn't an "Ohio State" man but he's worked out pretty well for us. Was Urban Meyer a Florida guy? Etc. In any case, Michigan man or not, Rich Rodriguez is a bad fit for Michigan. They were desperate and they made a bad hire.

I don't know how true this is, but I've always thought that the term "Michigan man" meant someone that knew how big the OSU/Michigan rivalry is in the midst of all the talk about the SEC and Big 12 and OSU's bowl shortcomings and how beating Ohio State is the current number one priority of the program. Someone who understands that Michigan should not play second to Ohio State in the Big Ten. Again, I don't know if that's true. Just the conclusion I've always come to.

It should be anyone who understands, but I'm sure the alums and the AD in their infinite wisdom believe that only someone who's been in the program would understand. It makes no sense to me.

[Spammy]

Is anyone else hearing that Jim Harbaugh might go to Michigan or Notre Dame?

[dfwabel]

Is anyone else hearing that Jim Harbaugh might go to Michigan or Notre Dame?

The Harbaugh/Michigan rumor was even out two years ago.

Football Coach Scoop

Football Rumor Mill

[Spammy]

Ah... Sorry, just heard about it yesterday.

Oh and by the way. Western Kentucky has hired Stanford assistant Willie Taggart as its head football coach...

[tBBP]

Given time and a patient fanbase and administration I think Rodriguez could put together a good program at Michigan. The problem is that he's not coaching at a school with that kind of time or patience. Michigan wants "their guy" and Rodriguez is just filling the seat until their guy becomes available. He's a dead man walking and everyone knows it.

You'd think a fanbase as smart as Michigan's would have learned from watching Notre Dame and Nebraska's struggles, but I guess not.

If Rodriguez were a "Michigan man" they would. Since he's an outsider he'd better start walking on water...and quick.

I have a question/curiosity about that.

I don't have a horse in this race, but wouldn't that type of mentality--having a "Michigan Man" lead the program--sort of box a program in a bit? Me, as an objective viewer from the outside, wonders if maybe the right guy to lead that program isn't a Michigan guy. I know Jim Harbaugh's name is being tossed out there, and yes, he's done a good job at Stanford...but Stanford ain't Michigan, and let's say Michigan gets their man in Jim Harbaugh...and then he, a "Michigan man" goes in there and craps the pot. Then what would the UM heads have to say? Me personally, I think that if they truly wanted to (re)build a winning program at Michigan and have the right guy lead them there, they would do a more expansive search for that right guy rather than boxing themselves in with self-imposed parameters (read: "Michigan men"). Is it a school pride/hubris thing or something? Just curious.

But...I know, the boosters/alumni ultimately run things there (and everywhere) cuz they got the $$$...but still, that's just something I often wonder about with "perennial powerhouse" programs such as Michigan and the like.

I agree with everything you said. Having to get a "Michigan man" makes no sense. It's just how they do things up there. All I know is that Jim Tressel isn't an "Ohio State" man but he's worked out pretty well for us. Was Urban Meyer a Florida guy? Etc. In any case, Michigan man or not, Rich Rodriguez is a bad fit for Michigan. They were desperate and they made a bad hire.

I don't know how true this is, but I've always thought that the term "Michigan man" meant someone that knew how big the OSU/Michigan rivalry is in the midst of all the talk about the SEC and Big 12 and OSU's bowl shortcomings and how beating Ohio State is the current number one priority of the program. Someone who understands that Michigan should not play second to Ohio State in the Big Ten. Again, I don't know if that's true. Just the conclusion I've always come to.

It should be anyone who understands, but I'm sure the alums and the AD in their infinite wisdom believe that only someone who's been in the program would understand. It makes no sense to me.

Not that I disagree with the poster here, because I don't. But that bolded part yet again illustrates more of that boxed-in mentality I alluded to in my previous post. Yes, I know in the minds of fans and alumni, the ultimate measure of success is being able to beat your biggest rival--or at least that seems to be the thinking both at Michigan and at Notre Dame. I don't know...maybe I just have a more holistic point of view of all this. But I just think that programs that base their success on things such as "having their own kind lead them to glory" and/or "beating their biggest rival" really begin to sell themselves short. And oh by the way...why must it be some big name guy that gets tapped to come in to resurrect a program? I think these people should understand that even the biggest coaching names were nobodies at some point. Case in point: find the candidate that has that true deep-down burning fire, desire, and passion not only to build a winning program, but really commit and dedicate himself to that goal. And it very well might be that some lesser-known name guy out there are probably hungrier than the big names and thus would be more likely to really pour himself into the effort.

But...that kind of thing...the interview process to find that guy, as well as the building process (or in this case, resurrection process) takes patience. We've already seen that Michigan and Notre Dame (and alums and fanbases at large) ain't got that kind of patience, if any at all.

[infrared41]

I don't know how true this is, but I've always thought that the term "Michigan man" meant someone that knew how big the OSU/Michigan rivalry is in the midst of all the talk about the SEC and Big 12 and OSU's bowl shortcomings and how beating Ohio State is the current number one priority of the program. Someone who understands that Michigan should not play second to Ohio State in the Big Ten. Again, I don't know if that's true. Just the conclusion I've always come to.

It should be anyone who understands, but I'm sure the alums and the AD in their infinite wisdom believe that only someone who's been in the program would understand. It makes no sense to me.

Nope. A "Michigan Man" is a guy who has actual ties to the school. Their first preference is always a "Michigan Man." That's why they were so hot for Les Miles last season. Personally, I think it's kind of cool that they like to "keep it in the family" but it's hardly the most effective method of selecting a coach.

Hell, those old enough to remember saw that very philosophy in action during the 1989 NCAA Basketball Tournament. Right before the tournament started Bill Frieder announced he was leaving Michigan for Arizona State as soon as the season was over. Bo told him to go ahead and hit the road immediately. Bo said that a Michigan team should be coached by a Michigan man and that Frieder was an Arizona State guy at that point. The rest is history. Steve Fisher coached them through the tournament and Michigan won it all that season.

[dfwabel]

I don't know how true this is, but I've always thought that the term "Michigan man" meant someone that knew how big the OSU/Michigan rivalry is in the midst of all the talk about the SEC and Big 12 and OSU's bowl shortcomings and how beating Ohio State is the current number one priority of the program. Someone who understands that Michigan should not play second to Ohio State in the Big Ten. Again, I don't know if that's true. Just the conclusion I've always come to.

It should be anyone who understands, but I'm sure the alums and the AD in their infinite wisdom believe that only someone who's been in the program would understand. It makes no sense to me.

Nope. A "Michigan Man" is a guy who has actual ties to the school. Their first preference is always a "Michigan Man." That's why they were so hot for Les Miles last season. Personally, I think it's kind of cool that they like to "keep it in the family" but it's hardly the most effective method of selecting a coach.

Hell, those old enough to remember saw that very philosophy in action during the 1989 NCAA Basketball Tournament. Right before the tournament started Bill Frieder announced he was leaving Michigan for Arizona State as soon as the season was over. Bo told him to go ahead and hit the road immediately. Bo said that a Michigan team should be coached by a Michigan man and that Frieder was an Arizona State guy at that point. The rest is history. Steve Fisher coached them through the tournament and Michigan won it all that season.

I remember Bo saying that and to a degree what quote is what his legacy at Michigan became in a nutshell since his record in the Rose Bowl was not that great and he never concentrated in trying to win a national title. Those days are for those who are over the age of 50 and want to talk about the old days an promoting from within. Bo to Moeller to Carr was internal; Freider to Fischer to Ellerbee was hoops internal. Even the the university president was basically internal until 2002 and Bill Martin's connection to the university is in booster form only; he was not a graduate or prior employee, just a successful Ann Arbor resident and booster.

As an alum of the Michigan (Class of 96), "Michigan Man" is just the lasting legacy of the Big 3, especially GM and it's thinking. It strikes of the inability to truly innovate, expand , and develop greater knowledge. It's the, "Well, we've always done it this way" mentality. I know many people who work in the Athletic Department who have been there since I was a student, the mentality prevails as nobody wants to "break the code" or change things. Heck, when the grandkids of former coaches believe they need to chime in on university business, it is somewhat alarming. (This does not include the former involvement and "jobs" of Shemmy Schembechler about a decade ago.

There is a recent article in Fortune Magazine about the auto bailouts written by the former Car Czar, Steven Rattner, which makes an analogy which I find equal to the Michigan Athletic Department.

Everyone knew Detroit's reputation for insular, slow-moving cultures. Even by that low standard, I was shocked by the stunningly poor management that we found, particularly at GM, where we encountered, among other things, perhaps the weakest finance operation any of us had ever seen in a major company. In my relatively few interactions with chairman and CEO Rick Wagoner, I found him to be likable, dedicated, and generally knowledgeable. But Rick set a tone of "friendly arrogance" that seemed to permeate the organization.

Certainly Rick and his team seemed to believe that virtually all of their problems could be laid at the feet of some combination of the financial crisis, oil prices, the yen-dollar exchange rate, and the UAW.

Then again, while I was born in the midwest, I grew up in Florida and went back to school.

Regardless, I recommend that you read the backstory on the Obama Administration of the Auto Bailouts:

Steve Rattner on Auto Bailout

Just to keep it NCAA related, here is a Fortune story in October on Auburn Trustee/Booster, Bobby Lowder, the guy who headed those secret flights to undermine Tommy Tubberville:

Auburn Trustee/booster Bobby Lowder and his personal mess

[infrared41]

Then again, while I was born in the midwest, I grew up in Florida and went back to school.

You left Florida to come back to the land of eternal overcast and 9 month winters? How am I supposed to take you seriously now that I know that? You're clearly out of your mind...or at least you were.

[bigmike]

Urban Meyer got all choked up about Tebow and the Seniors, can't blame him, Florida's Senior class might be on their way to their 3rd Nat'Champ. He also vowed to never leave Florida as long as they want him around, I honestly would love to see him go to Notre Dame but it wouldn't be very smart.

I think Michigan should keep Rich Rod, although I enjoy seeing him do bad since he turned down Alabama .

[dfwabel]

Then again, while I was born in the midwest, I grew up in Florida and went back to school.

You left Florida to come back to the land of eternal overcast and 9 month winters? How am I supposed to take you seriously now that I know that? You're clearly out of your mind...or at least you were.

I think I covered it in the topic 2= years ago about "what schools were you accepted to". In short, my parents did not want my older brotter and I to stay in Florida and "expand our minds". My bro went to Gainesville, and since I hated FSU growing up as a Miami fan, Miami did not really meet the folks list of acceptable schools. Heck, when age nine, I remember when everybody wanted to go to the "winnin" schools, wink wink. Switzer, Pat Dye, Danny Ford... all schools who won. I remember I wanted to go to OU at one point in time. USC made the list since my folks had to go to LA yearly on business then and were not afraid of the neighborhood (since we're black). My Mom loved USC, but back then she also loved the Trojans, Ricky Bell, Mike Garrett, Charles White, and of course...OJ!

[Jigga]

Urban Meyer got all choked up about Tebow and the Seniors, can't blame him, Florida's Senior class might be on their way to their 3rd Nat'Champ. He also vowed to never leave Florida as long as they want him around, I honestly would love to see him go to Notre Dame but it wouldn't be very smart.

I think Michigan should keep Rich Rod, although I enjoy seeing him do bad since he turned down Alabama .

Y'all should be ecstatic that Double R turned down the 'Bama gig. Otherwise, y'all would be 5-7 or 6-6 every year. Sorta like y'all were during the Shula years.

[infrared41]

Urban Meyer got all choked up about Tebow and the Seniors, can't blame him, Florida's Senior class might be on their way to their 3rd Nat'Champ. He also vowed to never leave Florida as long as they want him around, I honestly would love to see him go to Notre Dame but it wouldn't be very smart.

I think Michigan should keep Rich Rod, although I enjoy seeing him do bad since he turned down Alabama .

Y'all should be ecstatic that Double R turned down the 'Bama gig. Otherwise, y'all would be 5-7 or 6-6 every year. Sorta like y'all were during the Shula years.

They sure should be. Just ask Michigan.

[GFB]

I don't know how true this is, but I've always thought that the term "Michigan man" meant someone that knew how big the OSU/Michigan rivalry is in the midst of all the talk about the SEC and Big 12 and OSU's bowl shortcomings and how beating Ohio State is the current number one priority of the program. Someone who understands that Michigan should not play second to Ohio State in the Big Ten. Again, I don't know if that's true. Just the conclusion I've always come to.

It should be anyone who understands, but I'm sure the alums and the AD in their infinite wisdom believe that only someone who's been in the program would understand. It makes no sense to me.

Nope. A "Michigan Man" is a guy who has actual ties to the school. Their first preference is always a "Michigan Man." That's why they were so hot for Les Miles last season. Personally, I think it's kind of cool that they like to "keep it in the family" but it's hardly the most effective method of selecting a coach.

Hell, those old enough to remember saw that very philosophy in action during the 1989 NCAA Basketball Tournament. Right before the tournament started Bill Frieder announced he was leaving Michigan for Arizona State as soon as the season was over. Bo told him to go ahead and hit the road immediately. Bo said that a Michigan team should be coached by a Michigan man and that Frieder was an Arizona State guy at that point. The rest is history. Steve Fisher coached them through the tournament and Michigan won it all that season.

I consider the "Michigan Man" to be a dying breed. The idea is only held by the boosters who do nothing but sit on their hands and turn the Big House into a library. Younger Michigan fans such as ~dp and myself realize that Rome wasn't built in a day, especially when there wasn't even a foundation to start building! As I have said before, Michigan was going to go through this period with or without RichRod. Would it have been such an awful 2 years with another coach? Probably not. Is there potential for these 2 years to be the underlying foundation for a USC/Florida/Alabama type program? Absolutely. Whether or not the old farts at Michigan will give RR the full 1-2 years that it would take remains to be seen.

I'm still on board the RR plan, at least up until this point where 6-6 is no longer acceptable with the talent at Michigan. If we have another 4-7 or even 6-6 year next year, then I will be ready for the RR experiment to be over, as long as they continue to look into the spread offense. Brian Kelly (Cincinnati) or the Chris Petersen (Boise State) would be #1 and #2 on my list at that point.

[DarkJourney]

NCAA FCS Division I Championship

First Round

South Dakota State at Montana

Eastern Washington at Stephen F. Austin

Elon at Richmond

South Carolina State at Appalachian State

Holy Cross at Villanova

New Hampshire at McNeese State

Eastern Illinois at Southern Illinois

Weber State at William & Mary

[NEW.ERA]

Good to see the Eagles from Eastern Washington made it to the Playoffs, I was good friends with a few of their players.

[DarkJourney]

Northeastern University is ending its football program after 74 seasons because the investment required to make it competitive was too high.

[bigmike]

Urban Meyer got all choked up about Tebow and the Seniors, can't blame him, Florida's Senior class might be on their way to their 3rd Nat'Champ. He also vowed to never leave Florida as long as they want him around, I honestly would love to see him go to Notre Dame but it wouldn't be very smart.

I think Michigan should keep Rich Rod, although I enjoy seeing him do bad since he turned down Alabama .

Y'all should be ecstatic that Double R turned down the 'Bama gig. Otherwise, y'all would be 5-7 or 6-6 every year. Sorta like y'all were during the Shula years.

They sure should be. Just ask Michigan.

Oh Yeah I am ecstatic about it, if we had gotten him we would have never got Saban, I'm just saying I still like to see him do bad since he turned us down although I am alot happier without him.

[Jigga]

I get what you're saying, but it's kind of like holding resentment to some girl you liked in high school who 5 years later has packed on a hundred pounds, is addicted to meth, has a van full of bastard kids, and works at the drive thru window at Sonic, while you wound up with that hot cheerleader from college who comes from money...