2009 NCAA Football Thread

[-(dp)-]

You don't blame Rich Rodriguez, yet it seems that just about every other college coach who comes into a big-time school by year two has improved the record of the previous year with his and the prior coach's players. It's always said that when a new coach wins, that he's winning with the prior coach's players and let's wait and see until his players come in. Well Rich Rodriguez has looked pathetic in two years. His offense and play calling is questionable. You say the talent level is bad, but have you ever thought that the coaching is just that bad? Rich Rodriguez dominated at Tulane and then left for West Virginia where he did pretty well in a second rate conference, but when he coaches in a big-time conference and the Big Ten isn't the best, he's proving that he's a second-rate coach at best. He is to Michigan what Gerry Faust and Ty Willingham are to Notre Dame, just a coach who is over his head.

Maybe. Coaching definitely hasn't won them any games. But can you name any NFL-caliber players on Michigan's offense or defense not named Brandon Graham in the last 2 years? I certainly can't. In my opinion, Michigan was going to have to go through a retooling no matter who they hired. After that 2006 season with that nasty defense (Lamaar Woodley, Leon Hall, David Harris, Alan Branch) Lloyd Carr's recruiting went in the absolute toilet. Not necessarily rankings wise, but if you look at the prospects, they would only hit on 4 or 5 guys out of 23 or 24.

I am indifferent to Michigan so as an outsider let me give you the biggest issue I see with Rich Rod. He is completely inflexible as a coach. I think the argument that one has to wait until he gets all the players in place to fit his system is complete bull . A good coach knows how to taylor a system (or use a different one) to fit the talent one does have. He didn't take over a poor team, outside the :censored:up at the beginning of the Applaichain State their other three losses were not bad and against good teams (Oregon, Wisconsin, Ohio State all finished ranked). They rebounded and went 9-4 including a bowl win over Tim Tebow and Florida (In between 2 Florida BCS champions, and maybe a third this year). That isn't a team that should be blownup and win 3 games the next year. Was it a bad year by Michigan standards? Yes. Did changes need to be made? Perhaps. Did everything need to be blown up? No. Instead they bring Rich Rod in, who leaves in the worst possible fashion from West Virginia, and he blows everything up chasing away much of the remaining talent that didn't graduate because of his inflexibility as coach. That leads to a 3 win season, and then a 5 win season (tied for last in the conference). On top of that he is probably going to bring sactions against Michigan for perhaps one of the dumbest reasons.

So from the outside I think Michigan should fire Rich Rod. Why? Because I just don't think he actually that good of a coach (and this is coming from someone who goes to a school Rich Rod destroyed at WV). There is no reason why one of the top historic football programs should go from 9 wins one season to 3 and 5 wins seasons in over the next two. A good coach would at least be able to scratch out 6 and 7 wins in the same situation.

Yeah, if only he took over that team with Chad Henne, Mike Hart, Jake Long, Mario Manningham, Adrian Arrington, Shawn Crable, all of whom were drafted, including Long, the #1 overall pick. Jamar Adams and Adam Kraus were also big pieces who graduated. I am pretty sure he would have been flexible then. You can not judge RR's first season on how the season went the year before, especially when you lose all of that talent. He had a walk on and RS Freshman at QB, and both were terrible. At RB, he mostly had to play freshman because the more experienced backs were injury prone. The leading receiver was a true freshman. This year, the offense was a huge improvement, but still made a lot of mistakes because they had a true freshman at QB, and were pretty young everywhere else as well. It had nothing to do with him being inflexible, he has run offenses that were pass heavy, and offenses that were run heavy.

This team is very inexperienced, and the defense is still low on talent, but the majority of the players are very young. They have made mistakes that young players make, that is not all on the coach. Look at today. Tate made a lot of mistakes, but I still think he will be a good player. Him and Denard are both true freshman. Now look at RB, Vincent Smith looks promising, he is also a true freshman. The receiver that has played the best the last few weeks of the season, Roy Roundtree, is a RS freshman. The offense will continue to improve drastically. With such a young team, you have to give more time.

So yeah, we can throw 2008 out the window. That team was bad, not because RR couldn't adapt to the talent he was left with, but because, um, he wasn't left with any. This year, a lot of his players were ready to play, and he had his first full recruiting class in there, but they were still young. There were noticeable improvements, and the talent is starting to show, but, as expected with a young team, there were a lot of mistakes. Mistakes that should start to disappear with experience. The defense looked terrible at times this year, but they looked good against OSU today. They lose some really good players on defense, but as with the offense, there are a lot of promising young players as well. More than there were a year ago. Firing him would make no sense, and from an outsider, 3-9 to 5-7 is not a large improvement, but believe me, there was.

[DarkJourney]

I would love to see Nebraska upset Texas and Clemson upset Georgia Tech in the Big 12 and ACC championship games to throw everything out of whack. Just to watch the voters cringe at maybe having a 12-0 TCU in the BCS championship game against Florida or Alabama.

By the way congratulations to the outright Ivy League Champion Penn Quakers

[charger77]

You don't blame Rich Rodriguez, yet it seems that just about every other college coach who comes into a big-time school by year two has improved the record of the previous year with his and the prior coach's players. It's always said that when a new coach wins, that he's winning with the prior coach's players and let's wait and see until his players come in. Well Rich Rodriguez has looked pathetic in two years. His offense and play calling is questionable. You say the talent level is bad, but have you ever thought that the coaching is just that bad? Rich Rodriguez dominated at Tulane and then left for West Virginia where he did pretty well in a second rate conference, but when he coaches in a big-time conference and the Big Ten isn't the best, he's proving that he's a second-rate coach at best. He is to Michigan what Gerry Faust and Ty Willingham are to Notre Dame, just a coach who is over his head.

Maybe. Coaching definitely hasn't won them any games. But can you name any NFL-caliber players on Michigan's offense or defense not named Brandon Graham in the last 2 years? I certainly can't. In my opinion, Michigan was going to have to go through a retooling no matter who they hired. After that 2006 season with that nasty defense (Lamaar Woodley, Leon Hall, David Harris, Alan Branch) Lloyd Carr's recruiting went in the absolute toilet. Not necessarily rankings wise, but if you look at the prospects, they would only hit on 4 or 5 guys out of 23 or 24.

I am indifferent to Michigan so as an outsider let me give you the biggest issue I see with Rich Rod. He is completely inflexible as a coach. I think the argument that one has to wait until he gets all the players in place to fit his system is complete bull . A good coach knows how to taylor a system (or use a different one) to fit the talent one does have. He didn't take over a poor team, outside the :censored:up at the beginning of the Applaichain State their other three losses were not bad and against good teams (Oregon, Wisconsin, Ohio State all finished ranked). They rebounded and went 9-4 including a bowl win over Tim Tebow and Florida (In between 2 Florida BCS champions, and maybe a third this year). That isn't a team that should be blownup and win 3 games the next year. Was it a bad year by Michigan standards? Yes. Did changes need to be made? Perhaps. Did everything need to be blown up? No. Instead they bring Rich Rod in, who leaves in the worst possible fashion from West Virginia, and he blows everything up chasing away much of the remaining talent that didn't graduate because of his inflexibility as coach. That leads to a 3 win season, and then a 5 win season (tied for last in the conference). On top of that he is probably going to bring sactions against Michigan for perhaps one of the dumbest reasons.

So from the outside I think Michigan should fire Rich Rod. Why? Because I just don't think he actually that good of a coach (and this is coming from someone who goes to a school Rich Rod destroyed at WV). There is no reason why one of the top historic football programs should go from 9 wins one season to 3 and 5 wins seasons in over the next two. A good coach would at least be able to scratch out 6 and 7 wins in the same situation.

Yeah, if only he took over that team with Chad Henne, Mike Hart, Jake Long, Mario Manningham, Adrian Arrington, Shawn Crable, all of whom were drafted, including Long, the #1 overall pick. Jamar Adams and Adam Kraus were also big pieces who graduated. I am pretty sure he would have been flexible then. You can not judge RR's first season on how the season went the year before, especially when you lose all of that talent. He had a walk on and RS Freshman at QB, and both were terrible. At RB, he mostly had to play freshman because the more experienced backs were injury prone. The leading receiver was a true freshman. This year, the offense was a huge improvement, but still made a lot of mistakes because they had a true freshman at QB, and were pretty young everywhere else as well. It had nothing to do with him being inflexible, he has run offenses that were pass heavy, and offenses that were run heavy.

This team is very inexperienced, and the defense is still low on talent, but the majority of the players are very young. They have made mistakes that young players make, that is not all on the coach. Look at today. Tate made a lot of mistakes, but I still think he will be a good player. Him and Denard are both true freshman. Now look at RB, Vincent Smith looks promising, he is also a true freshman. The receiver that has played the best the last few weeks of the season, Roy Roundtree, is a RS freshman. The offense will continue to improve drastically. With such a young team, you have to give more time.

So yeah, we can throw 2008 out the window. That team was bad, not because RR couldn't adapt to the talent he was left with, but because, um, he wasn't left with any. This year, a lot of his players were ready to play, and he had his first full recruiting class in there, but they were still young. There were noticeable improvements, and the talent is starting to show, but, as expected with a young team, there were a lot of mistakes. Mistakes that should start to disappear with experience. The defense looked terrible at times this year, but they looked good against OSU today. They lose some really good players on defense, but as with the offense, there are a lot of promising young players as well. More than there were a year ago. Firing him would make no sense, and from an outsider, 3-9 to 5-7 is not a large improvement, but believe me, there was.

But when 4 of the wins are against Eastern Michigan, Western Michigan, Deleware State and a last second win vs Indiana all at home is it really that impressive?

[jkrdevil]

You don't blame Rich Rodriguez, yet it seems that just about every other college coach who comes into a big-time school by year two has improved the record of the previous year with his and the prior coach's players. It's always said that when a new coach wins, that he's winning with the prior coach's players and let's wait and see until his players come in. Well Rich Rodriguez has looked pathetic in two years. His offense and play calling is questionable. You say the talent level is bad, but have you ever thought that the coaching is just that bad? Rich Rodriguez dominated at Tulane and then left for West Virginia where he did pretty well in a second rate conference, but when he coaches in a big-time conference and the Big Ten isn't the best, he's proving that he's a second-rate coach at best. He is to Michigan what Gerry Faust and Ty Willingham are to Notre Dame, just a coach who is over his head.

Maybe. Coaching definitely hasn't won them any games. But can you name any NFL-caliber players on Michigan's offense or defense not named Brandon Graham in the last 2 years? I certainly can't. In my opinion, Michigan was going to have to go through a retooling no matter who they hired. After that 2006 season with that nasty defense (Lamaar Woodley, Leon Hall, David Harris, Alan Branch) Lloyd Carr's recruiting went in the absolute toilet. Not necessarily rankings wise, but if you look at the prospects, they would only hit on 4 or 5 guys out of 23 or 24.

I am indifferent to Michigan so as an outsider let me give you the biggest issue I see with Rich Rod. He is completely inflexible as a coach. I think the argument that one has to wait until he gets all the players in place to fit his system is complete bull . A good coach knows how to taylor a system (or use a different one) to fit the talent one does have. He didn't take over a poor team, outside the :censored:up at the beginning of the Applaichain State their other three losses were not bad and against good teams (Oregon, Wisconsin, Ohio State all finished ranked). They rebounded and went 9-4 including a bowl win over Tim Tebow and Florida (In between 2 Florida BCS champions, and maybe a third this year). That isn't a team that should be blownup and win 3 games the next year. Was it a bad year by Michigan standards? Yes. Did changes need to be made? Perhaps. Did everything need to be blown up? No. Instead they bring Rich Rod in, who leaves in the worst possible fashion from West Virginia, and he blows everything up chasing away much of the remaining talent that didn't graduate because of his inflexibility as coach. That leads to a 3 win season, and then a 5 win season (tied for last in the conference). On top of that he is probably going to bring sactions against Michigan for perhaps one of the dumbest reasons.

So from the outside I think Michigan should fire Rich Rod. Why? Because I just don't think he actually that good of a coach (and this is coming from someone who goes to a school Rich Rod destroyed at WV). There is no reason why one of the top historic football programs should go from 9 wins one season to 3 and 5 wins seasons in over the next two. A good coach would at least be able to scratch out 6 and 7 wins in the same situation.

Yeah, if only he took over that team with Chad Henne, Mike Hart, Jake Long, Mario Manningham, Adrian Arrington, Shawn Crable, all of whom were drafted, including Long, the #1 overall pick. Jamar Adams and Adam Kraus were also big pieces who graduated. I am pretty sure he would have been flexible then. You can not judge RR's first season on how the season went the year before, especially when you lose all of that talent. He had a walk on and RS Freshman at QB, and both were terrible. At RB, he mostly had to play freshman because the more experienced backs were injury prone. The leading receiver was a true freshman. This year, the offense was a huge improvement, but still made a lot of mistakes because they had a true freshman at QB, and were pretty young everywhere else as well. It had nothing to do with him being inflexible, he has run offenses that were pass heavy, and offenses that were run heavy.

This team is very inexperienced, and the defense is still low on talent, but the majority of the players are very young. They have made mistakes that young players make, that is not all on the coach. Look at today. Tate made a lot of mistakes, but I still think he will be a good player. Him and Denard are both true freshman. Now look at RB, Vincent Smith looks promising, he is also a true freshman. The receiver that has played the best the last few weeks of the season, Roy Roundtree, is a RS freshman. The offense will continue to improve drastically. With such a young team, you have to give more time.

So yeah, we can throw 2008 out the window. That team was bad, not because RR couldn't adapt to the talent he was left with, but because, um, he wasn't left with any. This year, a lot of his players were ready to play, and he had his first full recruiting class in there, but they were still young. There were noticeable improvements, and the talent is starting to show, but, as expected with a young team, there were a lot of mistakes. Mistakes that should start to disappear with experience. The defense looked terrible at times this year, but they looked good against OSU today. They lose some really good players on defense, but as with the offense, there are a lot of promising young players as well. More than there were a year ago. Firing him would make no sense, and from an outsider, 3-9 to 5-7 is not a large improvement, but believe me, there was.

What happened to the recruits that were supposed to come in? You can't blame that big of a drop off because of seniors graduating and guys leaving for the NFL because that happens every year. That leaves me with the impression that he chased away guys Carr was recruiting and failed to bring in some of the guys he was recruiting at West Virginia. If I also remember right several Michigan players transferred after Rich Rod comes in, that is on the coach in that situation. That goes back to my point of chasing guys away. If you know you have a soft recruiting class coming in, you damn well make sure you keep many of the players still in the program.

[rams80]

You don't blame Rich Rodriguez, yet it seems that just about every other college coach who comes into a big-time school by year two has improved the record of the previous year with his and the prior coach's players. It's always said that when a new coach wins, that he's winning with the prior coach's players and let's wait and see until his players come in. Well Rich Rodriguez has looked pathetic in two years. His offense and play calling is questionable. You say the talent level is bad, but have you ever thought that the coaching is just that bad? Rich Rodriguez dominated at Tulane and then left for West Virginia where he did pretty well in a second rate conference, but when he coaches in a big-time conference and the Big Ten isn't the best, he's proving that he's a second-rate coach at best. He is to Michigan what Gerry Faust and Ty Willingham are to Notre Dame, just a coach who is over his head.

Maybe. Coaching definitely hasn't won them any games. But can you name any NFL-caliber players on Michigan's offense or defense not named Brandon Graham in the last 2 years? I certainly can't. In my opinion, Michigan was going to have to go through a retooling no matter who they hired. After that 2006 season with that nasty defense (Lamaar Woodley, Leon Hall, David Harris, Alan Branch) Lloyd Carr's recruiting went in the absolute toilet. Not necessarily rankings wise, but if you look at the prospects, they would only hit on 4 or 5 guys out of 23 or 24.

I am indifferent to Michigan so as an outsider let me give you the biggest issue I see with Rich Rod. He is completely inflexible as a coach. I think the argument that one has to wait until he gets all the players in place to fit his system is complete bull . A good coach knows how to taylor a system (or use a different one) to fit the talent one does have. He didn't take over a poor team, outside the :censored:up at the beginning of the Applaichain State their other three losses were not bad and against good teams (Oregon, Wisconsin, Ohio State all finished ranked). They rebounded and went 9-4 including a bowl win over Tim Tebow and Florida (In between 2 Florida BCS champions, and maybe a third this year). That isn't a team that should be blownup and win 3 games the next year. Was it a bad year by Michigan standards? Yes. Did changes need to be made? Perhaps. Did everything need to be blown up? No. Instead they bring Rich Rod in, who leaves in the worst possible fashion from West Virginia, and he blows everything up chasing away much of the remaining talent that didn't graduate because of his inflexibility as coach. That leads to a 3 win season, and then a 5 win season (tied for last in the conference). On top of that he is probably going to bring sactions against Michigan for perhaps one of the dumbest reasons.

So from the outside I think Michigan should fire Rich Rod. Why? Because I just don't think he actually that good of a coach (and this is coming from someone who goes to a school Rich Rod destroyed at WV). There is no reason why one of the top historic football programs should go from 9 wins one season to 3 and 5 wins seasons in over the next two. A good coach would at least be able to scratch out 6 and 7 wins in the same situation.

Yeah, if only he took over that team with Chad Henne, Mike Hart, Jake Long, Mario Manningham, Adrian Arrington, Shawn Crable, all of whom were drafted, including Long, the #1 overall pick. Jamar Adams and Adam Kraus were also big pieces who graduated. I am pretty sure he would have been flexible then. You can not judge RR's first season on how the season went the year before, especially when you lose all of that talent. He had a walk on and RS Freshman at QB, and both were terrible. At RB, he mostly had to play freshman because the more experienced backs were injury prone. The leading receiver was a true freshman. This year, the offense was a huge improvement, but still made a lot of mistakes because they had a true freshman at QB, and were pretty young everywhere else as well. It had nothing to do with him being inflexible, he has run offenses that were pass heavy, and offenses that were run heavy.

This team is very inexperienced, and the defense is still low on talent, but the majority of the players are very young. They have made mistakes that young players make, that is not all on the coach. Look at today. Tate made a lot of mistakes, but I still think he will be a good player. Him and Denard are both true freshman. Now look at RB, Vincent Smith looks promising, he is also a true freshman. The receiver that has played the best the last few weeks of the season, Roy Roundtree, is a RS freshman. The offense will continue to improve drastically. With such a young team, you have to give more time.

So yeah, we can throw 2008 out the window. That team was bad, not because RR couldn't adapt to the talent he was left with, but because, um, he wasn't left with any. This year, a lot of his players were ready to play, and he had his first full recruiting class in there, but they were still young. There were noticeable improvements, and the talent is starting to show, but, as expected with a young team, there were a lot of mistakes. Mistakes that should start to disappear with experience. The defense looked terrible at times this year, but they looked good against OSU today. They lose some really good players on defense, but as with the offense, there are a lot of promising young players as well. More than there were a year ago. Firing him would make no sense, and from an outsider, 3-9 to 5-7 is not a large improvement, but believe me, there was.

What happened to the recruits that were supposed to come in? You can't blame that big of a drop off because of seniors graduating and guys leaving for the NFL because that happens every year. That leaves me with the impression that he chased away guys Carr was recruiting and failed to bring in some of the guys he was recruiting at West Virginia. If I also remember right several Michigan players transferred after Rich Rod comes in, that is on the coach in that situation. That goes back to my point of chasing guys away. If you know you have a soft recruiting class coming in, you damn well make sure you keep many of the players still in the program.

1. I'm under the impression that at least some of the better ones were redshirting this year. Which makes excellent sense if you are looking at a different perspective than "win 6 games now damnit!"

2. As for the otherwise existing "talent" Carr left on defense, well...Michigan gave significant playing time to at least one walk on this year, and he wasn't the worst guy out there. That speaks volumes right there. The distinct impression I have had is that senior class that graduated when Carr retired was the last class he actively recruited and tried to build. Over the next three years Michigan tried to limp along using that class to mask slowly growing fundamental issues until nothing was left when they left; a collapse is inevitable in such situations, and indeed the act of putting it off tends to make the crash much worse.

If you want to see an NFL example, look at the St. Louis Rams post 2005. One of the overall worst things that happened to the franchise was the 3 game win streak that the Rams had to close out 2006. This streak, narrowly built against teams that had nothing to play for at the time, enabled the Rams to finish at a deceptive 8-8 and be in the playoff hunt into the last week of the season. This in turn convinced the Rams ownership that the franchise was still on the right track and that a major rebuild was not yet in order.

Fast forward another 2 and a half seasons, and the Rams have won but 6 games in that time and only embarked on the rebuilding process to start the 2009 season.

3. Mallet was gone the second Carr announced his retirement. Not a whole lot any coach could do in that situation.

[Bmac]

Big 12 North champions!

[GFB]

But when 4 of the wins are against Eastern Michigan, Western Michigan, Deleware State and a last second win vs Indiana all at home is it really that impressive?

Well, those were losses last year.

What happened to the recruits that were supposed to come in? You can't blame that big of a drop off because of seniors graduating and guys leaving for the NFL because that happens every year. That leaves me with the impression that he chased away guys Carr was recruiting and failed to bring in some of the guys he was recruiting at West Virginia. If I also remember right several Michigan players transferred after Rich Rod comes in, that is on the coach in that situation. That goes back to my point of chasing guys away. If you know you have a soft recruiting class coming in, you damn well make sure you keep many of the players still in the program.

Go back and read my post on the previous page. Carr left the cupboard absolutely empty. Rodriguez was hired very late and had to try to "save" Carr's recruiting class and almost pulled a coup to get Terrelle Pryor to AA...

I mean, do you want to turn AA into a prison? With the change in system, change in coaches, change in philosophy, players were bound to leave. But outside of Mallett (who was going to transfer even if Carr stayed, as Carr did not like him) and Boren, no one transferred out who would have given a legitimate contribution. The fact is they had a ton of overrated recruits that never amounted to anything.

[infrared41]

Might as well add my 2 cents to the Rodriguez/Michigan debate. My opinion is that Rodriguez is a good coach at a school that is a bad fit for him. His offense worked at WVU because top to bottom The Big East isn't as big and physical as The Big Ten. He didn't need the top tier players to compete consistently in that conference. He could get by with "second choice" guys. In other words, the guys that The SEC didn't want. The best speed and size players are going to The SEC first and everywhere else second. The more Michigan loses, the harder it's going to be to get the top tier guys to play there. Add to the mix that Michigan's academic standards are higher than WVU's and you can see that there may be some problems turning it around quickly at Michigan.

Then of course there's the fact that it's Michigan. To say that expectations at Michigan are higher than they are at WVU would be really under selling it. Rodriguez is not a "Michigan man" and that alone is going to give him less room to work than Les Miles would have gotten or Jim Harbaugh will get if he ends up as their coach. Rodriguez was Michigan's second choice. I believe that the main factor in his hiring was that he had turned it around quickly at his previous stops. Michigan wanted a "Michigan man." When they couldn't get one they decided to roll the dice on a guy with a shady reputation in hope of a quick turnaround. If it worked then no one would care. If it didn't, well you see the results.

In the final analysis the question isn't whether or not Rodriguez can put it together and make Michigan good again. The question is will Michigan be willing to show the patience it's going to take to get there and the answer to that is no. Short of a Big Ten title and a BCS bowl next season, Rodriguez is done. Michigan didn't really want him in the first place and he has failed on the one thing they hired him to do which was turn around the program in his second season. He'll get one more season but let's not kid ourselves. One more season of Rodriguez has more to to with the current AD at Michigan moving on than it does with the school actually believing he needs more time. Michigan just wants to make sure it's next AD isn't stuck with a new coach that AD didn't pick.

Given time and a patient fanbase and administration I think Rodriguez could put together a good program at Michigan. The problem is that he's not coaching at a school with that kind of time or patience. Michigan wants "their guy" and Rodriguez is just filling the seat until their guy becomes available. He's a dead man walking and everyone knows it.

[NEW.ERA]

New Top 25

1 Florida (36) 11-0 1463 1

2 Alabama (13) 11-0 1428 2

3 Texas (11) 11-0 1425 3

4 TCU 11-0 1309 4

5 Cincinnati 10-0 1245 5

6 Boise State 11-0 1218 6

7 Georgia Tech 10-1 1138 7

8 Pittsburgh 9-1 1041 8

9 Ohio State 10-2 1016 9

10 Oregon 9-2 983 11

11 Oklahoma State 9-2 793 12

12 Penn State 10-2 773 13

13 Iowa 10-2 766 15

14 Virginia Tech 8-3 675 16

15 Clemson 8-3 609 18

16 Oregon State 8-3 541 20

17 LSU 8-3 409 10

18 Brigham Young 9-2 399 19

19 Miami (FL) 8-3 347 21

20 Mississippi 8-3 333 NR

21 California 8-3 263 NR

22 Utah 9-2 249 23

23 North Carolina 8-3 237 NR

24 USC 7-3 225 22

25 Houston 9-2 199 24

Dropped from rankings: Stanford 14, Wisconsin 17, Rutgers 25

Others receiving votes: Stanford 169, Nebraska 126, Wisconsin 40, Temple 32, Navy 24, Texas Tech 11, West Virginia 3, Northwestern 3, Nevada 2, Auburn 2, Kentucky 2, Arizona 1, Central Michigan 1,

[Seadragon76]

In the BCS Standings, the Top 7 teams remain the same while Oregon jumps to 8th thanks to their win over Arizona.

Now, let's get to the BCS Bowl Picture.

BCS National Championship Game: Florida (#1) vs. Alabama (#2)

Rose Bowl: Oregon (Pac-10 Leader) vs. Ohio State (Big Ten Champion)

Fiesta Bowl: Texas (Big 12 Champion) vs. Boise State (At-Large)

Sugar Bowl: Iowa (At-Large) vs. Cincinnati (Big East Leader)

Orange Bowl: Georgia Tech (ACC Leader) vs. TCU (At-Large)

Also in the At-Large Pool: Pittsburgh, Penn State, Oklahoma State, Virginia Tech

Now, the loser of the Florida-Alabama game in two weeks will more then likely land in the Sugar Bowl because of it's tie-in to the SEC. Also, if Oklahoma State wins next week against Oklahoma, the Cowboys might get an At-Large bid and go to the Fiesta Bowl to keep the tie-in with the Big 12.

[rams80]

Given time and a patient fanbase and administration I think Rodriguez could put together a good program at Michigan. The problem is that he's not coaching at a school with that kind of time or patience. Michigan wants "their guy" and Rodriguez is just filling the seat until their guy becomes available. He's a dead man walking and everyone knows it.

You'd think a fanbase as smart as Michigan's would have learned from watching Notre Dame and Nebraska's struggles, but I guess not.

[infrared41]

Given time and a patient fanbase and administration I think Rodriguez could put together a good program at Michigan. The problem is that he's not coaching at a school with that kind of time or patience. Michigan wants "their guy" and Rodriguez is just filling the seat until their guy becomes available. He's a dead man walking and everyone knows it.

You'd think a fanbase as smart as Michigan's would have learned from watching Notre Dame and Nebraska's struggles, but I guess not.

If Rodriguez were a "Michigan man" they would. Since he's an outsider he'd better start walking on water...and quick.

[tj4eck]

Rose Bowl: Oregon (Pac-10 Leader) vs. Ohio State (Big Ten Champion)

Ohio St. will play the WINNER of the Civil War (Oregon v. Oregon St.)

[WJMorris3]

In the BCS Standings, the Top 7 teams remain the same while Oregon jumps to 8th thanks to their win over Arizona.

Now, let's get to the BCS Bowl Picture.

BCS National Championship Game: Florida (#1) vs. Alabama (#2)

Rose Bowl: Oregon (Pac-10 Leader) vs. Ohio State (Big Ten Champion)

Fiesta Bowl: Texas (Big 12 Champion) vs. Boise State (At-Large)

Sugar Bowl: Iowa (At-Large) vs. Cincinnati (Big East Leader)

Orange Bowl: Georgia Tech (ACC Leader) vs. TCU (At-Large)

Also in the At-Large Pool: Pittsburgh, Penn State, Oklahoma State, Virginia Tech

Now, the loser of the Florida-Alabama game in two weeks will more then likely land in the Sugar Bowl because of it's tie-in to the SEC. Also, if Oklahoma State wins next week against Oklahoma, the Cowboys might get an At-Large bid and go to the Fiesta Bowl to keep the tie-in with the Big 12.

I like, except I think that Oklahoma State or Pittsburgh would get a bid over Boise State.

[ninersdd]

Anybody hear about a Duck cheeleader getting popped with a water bottle after the Arizona game?

[Seadragon76]

Rose Bowl: Oregon (Pac-10 Leader) vs. Ohio State (Big Ten Champion)

Ohio St. will play the WINNER of the Civil War (Oregon v. Oregon St.)

A-hem... Notice that it said 'Pac-10 Leader'. I know the winner of the Oregon-Oregon State game earns the bid, but right now it would be Oregon.

[tBBP]

Given time and a patient fanbase and administration I think Rodriguez could put together a good program at Michigan. The problem is that he's not coaching at a school with that kind of time or patience. Michigan wants "their guy" and Rodriguez is just filling the seat until their guy becomes available. He's a dead man walking and everyone knows it.

You'd think a fanbase as smart as Michigan's would have learned from watching Notre Dame and Nebraska's struggles, but I guess not.

If Rodriguez were a "Michigan man" they would. Since he's an outsider he'd better start walking on water...and quick.

I have a question/curiosity about that.

I don't have a horse in this race, but wouldn't that type of mentality--having a "Michigan Man" lead the program--sort of box a program in a bit? Me, as an objective viewer from the outside, wonders if maybe the right guy to lead that program isn't a Michigan guy. I know Jim Harbaugh's name is being tossed out there, and yes, he's done a good job at Stanford...but Stanford ain't Michigan, and let's say Michigan gets their man in Jim Harbaugh...and then he, a "Michigan man" goes in there and craps the pot. Then what would the UM heads have to say? Me personally, I think that if they truly wanted to (re)build a winning program at Michigan and have the right guy lead them there, they would do a more expansive search for that right guy rather than boxing themselves in with self-imposed parameters (read: "Michigan men"). Is it a school pride/hubris thing or something? Just curious.

But...I know, the boosters/alumni ultimately run things there (and everywhere) cuz they got the $$$...but still, that's just something I often wonder about with "perennial powerhouse" programs such as Michigan and the like.

[Jigga]

Anybody hear about a Duck cheeleader getting popped with a water bottle after the Arizona game?

I'm sure most of the Duck cheerleaders got "popped" with something after the Arizona game...and the Wildcat cheerleaders, too.

Had I been around them, I know for certain there would have been been a tremendous amount of "popping" going on.

[B-Rich]

If I was an LSU fan, I would've thrown a table. Seriously, Verne's reaction to that game is probably 1/16th of how some random LSU fan may have felt watching that game.

That'd be me.

This was, without a doubt, the worst example of coaches failing the players as I've ever seen. And by coaching I mean both head coach Les Miles and offensive coordinator Gary Crowton.... And the worst clock management EVER....

The folks down here are not happy. And I'm sure we all will be hearing more about this game, and the fate of Gary Crowton and perhaps Les Miles, in the days to come.....

You have GOT to be kidding me. Somebody put some crazy pills in y'all's jambalaya? Don't get me wrong, it was horrible clock management. However, if y'all want to run The Hat, then y'all deserve nothing better the second coming of Gerry DiNardo or Curley Hallman. The Lord will not have mercy on your souls, and neither will the SEC.

Despite the fact that Les Miles absolutely lost his football mind by with his playcalling on that final drive and then ultimately (and stupidly) calling a spike with ONE SECOND ON THE CLOCK, I agree with jigga. Like Mangino, IMO, has earned career amnesty in Kansas for winning an Orange Bowl at freakin' Kansas, the Hat gets at least gets a pass for this based on the fact that the man's won 2 national championships there, compared to before he got there, which was IIRC one since 1958. I mean, his mistake today was damn near indefensible...but he shouldn't be fired for it, hell naw.

But yet and still..wow, that was godawful coaching at the end. If people raise hell for a week about Belichick's 4th and 2 decision, they had better just run all sorts of stories about how Les Miles wanted to spike the ball with 1 second left.

Jigga, T of A, let me clarify a few things....

1) T of A, Miles won 1 national championship (2007 season). The other was won by Nick Saban (2003 season) which leads into another point:

2) Jigga, personally, I know exactly of what you speak. That's why I said, "the folks are not happy" and it was an observation. I'm 45, and have been a student and fan through the following coaches: Jerry Stovall, Bill Arnsparger, Mike Archer, Curley Hallman, Gerry DiNardo, Nick Saban, and now Les Miles. Unlike a lot of the youngsters around here who don't remember, or the old timers who who have bad memory, I well remember the "Reign of Error" under Hallmann, who never had a winning season. I remember being happy as a clam when DiNardo in his first season took us to a 6-5 winning record and a trip to the Weedeater Bowl (where his team beat Nick Saban's team).

But too many "fans" here have short memories. It all begins and ends with Saban. Saban brought LSU back to respectability, brought the team a bowl season every year, and a national championship. During his tenure here, there was no second-guessing, and he never had to contend with any "ghosts" or memories. Les has never been afforded that opportunity, it seems, by so many lSU fans. I've read posts and heard people say that he is lucky, that he is stupid, that he really can't coach, etc. And they just can't get over Saban, probably because Saban LEFT LSU, and probably because Sabn now coaches hated Alabama: "Miles won his championship with Saban's players, this (insert situation) would never have happened under Saban, etc."

It drives me nuts.

When you look at it objectively, it's like this:

Saban:

2000 - 8-4, Peach Bowl win

2001 - 10-3, SEC champions, Sugar Bowl win

2002 - 8-5, Cotton Bowl loss

2003 - 13-1, SEC Champions, Nat'l Championship

2004 - 9-3, Capital One Bowl Loss

Miles:

2005 - 11-2, SEC West champions, Peach Bowl win

2006 - 11-2, Sugar Bowl win

2007 - 12-2, SEC Champions, Nat'l Championship

2008 - 8-5, Peach Bowl win

I just don't get it. Miles is just as good, if not better, than Saban, but no one cuts him any slack.

That being said, the buck DOES stop with Miles. But just as in last year, when he cut the dual defensive coordinator approach and brought in John Chavis, at the end of this year he needs to drop Gary Crowton and bring in someone else. It's apparent that Miles lets his coordinators do much of the decision making, and in addition to the boneheaded moves at the end of the game last week, Crowton has our offense ranked 106 out of 120-some-odd teams. That will not fly in the SEC. It's telling that we're in some of these games because of special teams and defensive scoring (the blocked field goal returned for a TD in the Ole Miss game, the Cutrera interception for a TD early in the Washington game, the Trindon Holliday return near the end of the Georgia game, etc..

[dfwabel]

LSU fans are arguably the most delusional fans over the past 25 years. Granted, they have had talent and now more than ever, but they have rolled through seven coaches (+1 interim) in the past 25 years. SEVEN! The past five seasons have just fueled the fire much more. Fanboards are tearing him apart.

Honestly, I think he is a good coach, but not that good. In fact, I think he gambles way too much. He was a 7-8 win coach at OK State with that talent and now is a 9-10 win coach with LSU's talent and the 12 game schedule. If he went to Michigan, he would have still become a 8-10 win coach.