SFGiants58

MLB: The Defunct Saga - St. Louis Browns Pt. II Added

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The Browns look great! The differences are subtle but are improvements. 

1 hour ago, KRZYBDGRZ said:

I think if you switched the tertiary and primary it would be perfect.

I agree with this. Another possibility would be to make the tertiary the primary but add the “Browns” wordmark under it if you would like to keep that.

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8 hours ago, NicDB said:

Love the monogram and scripts for the Browns.  Especially love the colors.  But the gold FDL is throwing this off for me.  I'd much rather see a predominantly brown FDL to match the scripts.  Maybe the gold is something we'd all be used to like the Dodgers numbers, but as it is, it kind of has the sore thumb effect.

Or maybe try making the StL monogram gold for some sort of symmetry?

 

I think its the shade of gold. Somehow to my eyes it seems a touch off. 

 

I'll also second the idea of using the tertiary as the primary. Also I'd consider keeping the red outlining on the FDL for the alternate cap as well. It looks a little bare without it. 

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Big fan of the Browns. However, might I suggest removing the tail from the scripts, but keeping the fleur-de-lis?

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Thanks for the C+C guys, I appreciate it!

 

On 6/12/2018 at 2:33 AM, NicDB said:

Love the monogram and scripts for the Browns.  Especially love the colors.  But the gold FDL is throwing this off for me.  I'd much rather see a predominantly brown FDL to match the scripts.  Maybe the gold is something we'd all be used to like the Dodgers numbers, but as it is, it kind of has the sore thumb effect.

Or maybe try making the StL monogram gold for some sort of symmetry?

21 hours ago, Carolingian Steamroller said:

 

I think its the shade of gold. Somehow to my eyes it seems a touch off. 

 

I'll also second the idea of using the tertiary as the primary. Also I'd consider keeping the red outlining on the FDL for the alternate cap as well. It looks a little bare without it. 

 

Thanks, guys! I did think about having a gold monogram on the cap, but it kind of messed with the color scheme I was going for (i.e., gold only on the fleur-de-lis and outlines within shields). I tried out the brown FDL, and it really didn't "stand out" enough. A red FDL looked far better because it worked well with the red bill on the hat.

 

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The gold insignia worked better than I thought it would.

 

uSxqLJG.png

 

In this update, I adjusted the shade of gold to be darker, so that it avoids standing out too much.

 

22 hours ago, MJD7 said:

The Browns look great! The differences are subtle but are improvements. 

I agree with this. Another possibility would be to make the tertiary the primary but add the “Browns” wordmark under it if you would like to keep that.

On 6/12/2018 at 8:56 AM, KRZYBDGRZ said:

I think if you switched the tertiary and primary it would be perfect.

 

Thanks! In this update, I'll do just that.

 

On 6/12/2018 at 3:16 AM, Cardsblues02 said:

Haha, the BFIB page LUCKILY doesn’t represent all Cardinals fans opinions. I’m not that bad, I swear. I just don’t like those Cubbies. 

 

The Browns look pretty great. I would genuinely buy that brown cap. The overall look is very pleasing and traditional, with is exactly what the Browns would (probably) look like today. I have one gripe though, the primary logo has so much going on. From the statue to the baseball to the StL to the script and the 5 fdl. Just a lot. Maybe thats just me. Other than that, this is my favorite set.

On 6/12/2018 at 8:16 AM, coco1997 said:

The Browns look gorgeous! There's just something really satisfying about that brown and red color scheme. 

 

I agree that the primary logo is a bit too busy. There's also a lot of negative space. I wonder if you could enlarge the statue-atop-the-baseball so it's closer to the FDLs, and move the "Browns" script so that's it's within the baseball?

 

Thanks! I've restructured that logo, adjusting it to be more of an homage to the 1940s-'50s shield logo (statue on top, baseball at center) with fewer FDL's (all gold now).

 

19 hours ago, Griffinmarlins said:

Big fan of the Browns. However, might I suggest removing the tail from the scripts, but keeping the fleur-de-lis?

 

Thank you! I tried it out, but I'm not sure if I like it that much.

 

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Anyway, here's the full update, with the recommended changes incorporated.

 

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I think that's an improvement over the previous edition. Thanks again, guys!

 

The alternate take should be up later today.

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On 6/12/2018 at 3:18 AM, SFGiants58 said:

 

Thanks! I was surprised when I heard about it during my research, given how ingrained they are within St. Louis.

 

 

Thanks! I figured that the different tertiary logos worked with the respective color balances of each team (Houston = red, Milwaukee = navy). I figured I shouldn't go crazy with additional stripes since the minimalism of the Cardinals' design is what makes the birds-on-bat work.

 

 

Thanks, guys!

 

 

Thanks! Both felt weird to me, as the Cardinals have such a long history of beating up on the Brewers and the Astros. Also, @NicDB, you forgot the most important link of all: the BFiB twitter page. While it's not an entirely fair assessment of Cardinals fans, it is both hilarious and disturbing at times.

 

 

Thank you! I really liked the powder blues for this one, even though I'm not big into neck-to-mid calf powder blue. The cap logos, no matter how good they are, still look weird to me. It's like I'm looking at Cardinals affiliates rather than the team itself.

 

 

Spoilers: both will appear, although I'll be starting from scratch with the Arrows. I really don't like the proposed design.

 

 

Thank you! A big goal of this series is to be a teaching aid for baseball history. A lot of little nuggets of obscure history will pop up here.

 

Anyway, (summons Regular Car Reviews' dirty voice) it's brown time!

 

ST. LOUIS BROWNS, PT. I -  Louie Louie, Oh Brownie!

 

(Disclaimer: since this is a modified version of a concept I posted in Project 32, I repeat much of what I said in that thread)

 

Do you want to know why this team moved? Well, here is the St. Louis Browns experience, as presented by the seminal Irish comedy series Father Ted:

 

HZJk9jT.gif

 

The Browns were a largely incompetent, underfunded organization that lost any leverage they had in the market when the Busch family bought the Cardinals. They barely survived their time in St. Louis (a short recap by Hardball Times writer and fellow board member @pmoehrin here, and a cool website designed by @STL FANATIC here) and there's no way that the city could have ever supported two teams in the long-term. However, what if the Browns had survived to the modern age? What would they look like? Well, here's the answer.

 

The most obvious change from the original Browns is the color scheme. Gone is orange, and in its place is red. I did this for two reasons. The first reason is that brown/orange is too associated with the other two teams named "Browns" (the team that's now the Ravens and the record book-ignoring doofuses), and I wanted the baseball Browns to carve their own aesthetic path (let's presume they added red sometime in the late-60's/early-70's). The second reason is that I wanted to try out the color scheme, as I've grown to like its application on Indians concepts and the NHL Panthers.

 

The second change to differentiate the team from the NFL Browns is the deletion of Brownie the Elf. I've never liked the logo. The identity now focuses on St. Louis' history (as part of New France from late-seventeenth to mid-eighteenth centuries - here's a good book on New France) and the city's namesake Saint Louis (King Louis IX of France, from 1226-70). The real team referenced this connection in their 1936-51 primary logo. It was from this point that I drew my inspiration.

 

The new primary logo, to go along with the Louis IX theme, is now a shield, redone from the original. The logos feature the color "Champagne Silver," from the USFL's Michigan Panthers. I thought the name and color fit with the brown/red pairing and the city's ties to France. In one section is a modernized version of the '39-'51's rendering of the Apotheosis of St. Louis statue, commissioned for the 1904 World's Fair/Louisiana Purchase Exhibition/Anthropology Days/Olympic Games and therefore connected to the wackiest Olympic marathon ever). Here is a comparison with the original logo.

 

The (thankfully) less cluttered primary logo features fleur-de-lis sourced from the 1945-53 alternate logo (in a pattern that mimics the Île-de-France flag and heraldry, the home region of Louis IX). The bottom of the logo features a baseball with the cap logo, while the team script and a line divide the sections. It's a far cleaner design than the original concept.

 

The secondary/cap logo is based around the 1946-53 cap logo, with alterations to make it look less like the contemporary Cardinals cap logo. I gave it spurs (a la the Cardinals' 1900-19 primary logo - per Cooperstown Collection), and adjusted the height/spacing/serifs of the letters to better accommodate an outline. Here is a comparison. The tertiary is a quarter-divided shield with the sock stripes, Apotheosis rendering, cap logo, and fleur-de-lis. There are also new wordmarks, using the 2014 NBA All-Star Game font, as it fit the "New France" look.

 

ZPgYSmX.png

 

The uniforms emulate the 1952-3 set, AKA "The Padres can totally do brown/white/grey" look. I tweaked the scripts to clean up inconsistent line weights, standardized the tails, and widened the letter kerning to accommodate outlines (a tip for fellow concept artists, adding outlines to scripts necessitates wider kerning). Here is a comparison. The fleur-de-lis takes the place of front numbers (now with red outline), while the tertiary and primary logos grace the sleeves of the home and road uniforms, respectively. The barberpole sock stripes give way to a white outlined in red tri-stripe design, while the red-billed hat remains. I used black cleats to enhance the "retro" aesthetic. The number font is my modified version of the UNC number font, and the NOB font is Rawlings' block (used by the Orioles and in the past by the Cardinals). 

 

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The home/road alternate is an updated take on the 1908 home uniform, with an "St.L" on the chest and the fleur-de-lis on a piped cap (a pre-1950's design element I'd like to see return). I added a bit more white into the design, for consistency's sake. The Heritage Day alternate is a brown/red fauxback to the 1944 home uniforms (with the addition of the fleur-de-lis on the cap and the modern secondary logo), one of the few bright moments in team history. I replaced the font with the new one, as I wanted more separation between the pre- and post-1950s Browns (also allowing for a straight throwback). This ties the "modern" Browns to the history of the old Browns and their sorta-funky uniforms. 

 

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The dugout jacket is much the same as their Project 32 version, albeit with the new tertiary logo on the back and new striping pattern in the trim.

 

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I think I've improved on my previous design, while also demonstrating how the Browns could have changed up their aesthetics if they outlasted the Cardinals. C+C is appreciated, as always!

 

For the alternate take, let's give them a bit more of an Oriole-ish identity!

I'm loving the Fleur-de-lis logo on the primary jerseys.. I especially like it's coloring.. It helps display the full palette and avoids drawing too much attention from the wordmark.. Very well done

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I really like the one with the red fluers.  Though I'd probably swap the gold and brown outlines since the gold on the outer edge gets lost in the white and gray.

Still, huge improvement.  Can't wait for the alt take.

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11 hours ago, NicDB said:

I really like the one with the red fluers.  Though I'd probably swap the gold and brown outlines since the gold on the outer edge gets lost in the white and gray.

Still, huge improvement.  Can't wait for the alt take.

 

Thanks! I did try out the red/gold/brown, but the gold blurred too much with the red to really work. It's part of why I prefer the gold monogram edition.

 

Anyway, it's alternate take time!

 

ST. LOUIS BROWNS, PT. II - Let's Get Oriole-ized!

 

When brainstorming ideas for the alternate takes, this was one of the first ones that came to mind. What if the Browns, now alone in St. Louis, adopted the aesthetic trappings of the Baltimore Orioles during the 1950s and '60s? This would include brown-orange co-dominance (not unprecedented in the Browns' history), thin cursive scripts, and a cartoon logo on the cap. Inspired by @raysox's work on the @SmilingBirdLogo Twitter account, I set about adapting the Orioles' Wally Bird for the Browns. I opted not to use the Brownie elf, in an attempt to reduce similarities to the NFL team/s. Instead, I chose to produce a cartoon rendering of Louis the IX of France, the namesake of St. Louis. Using these two images as a reference:


VK4aK7L.png

 

I turned the Orioles' bird into a portrait of the crusader, making sure to include the "StL" on his crown (boasting about canonization?). Basically, it's the sports logos equivalent of this bit from Father Ted:

 

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It may be sacrilegious, but it's fun! The primary logo demonstrates the brown/orange split and the FDL detailing, while the vintage "St.L" acts as a tertiary.

 

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The scripts have a thinner weight and slightly reshaped letters, to better mimic the Orioles' current scripts. I opted to use contrast-colored front numbers and NOB's, to get a bit more brown into the design (so you don't feel the temptation to call them the "Oranges" - a mistake of the imitation Browns). The uniform and sock stripes are all off of my Orioles concept, albeit with brown replacing black. The primary is on the sleeve.

 

rPdqU7v.png

 

The alternates are for both home and road use. The brown top comes with an all-brown "StL" cap and a single-color script (but dual layer, like what the Orioles do - same with the single-color cap logo). The orange shirt simply swaps around some colors on the home uniform.

 

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The other alternates include a white-front panel cap (like the Orioles) and a 1944-style throwback (complete with the drop shadow from the main concept). The latter uniform features the brown alternate's cap.

 

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The dugout jacket is a color swap of my Orioles jacket, with the one-color "St. Louis" script as the centerpiece.

 

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This is a little attempt to hybrid the Browns with their successor, which turned out far better than I thought it would. I know the cap logo is a bit silly/maybe inappropriate, but I've come to like it. C+C is appreciated, as always!

 

Up next, what if Bill Veeck had his way in relocation?

Edited by SFGiants58
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Not really feeling the logo, but that's about it.  If you replaced it with the StL monogram, it'd be a timeless mark.

Otherwise, I have no complaints.  Especially love that heritage alt.

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The alternate take looks good! I especially like the primary logo and the brown alternate. That Heritage alt though, that steals the show, it’s simply is a thing of beauty.

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Really nice job on the alt Browns! The uniforms are perfect, other than maybe putting the "St. Louis" script on one of the alts (the brown one?), but that's just a matter of taste. 

 

The cartoony King Louis is great. However, one thing that doesn't really look quite right is the eyes. I think if you moved the nose down and had the eyes touch (like on the Orioles bird), you'd really pull off that cartoony/caricature effect. Here's a really rough sketch of what I mean (I also added a small chin dimple):

 

brownslogo.jpg

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Also a tiny nitpick.. On the Orioles (and other Orioles-inspired) batting helmets, they specifically mimic the front panel cap shape.. The Orioles don't use the traditional "bell curved" batting helmets, so your artwork should more closely resemble the caps..

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I love the Smiling Louis and would love to see some semi-pro St. Louis team adopt it. I like any references to the city's namesake -- I think I've mentioned before that the Apotheosis is a very underrated civic symbol that's been overshadowed by the Arch, and I'd love to see the Blues in particular, whose fanbase seems much less regional than that of the Cardinals, find a place for it. 

 

What's cool about the Browns concept is that the brown/beige/red feels very Germanic in a way that's suited to the very German city of St. Louis. The city's French heritage is hard to miss, of course, but it's pretty damn krauty in Missouri. (It's really just a sweatier, ruder Wisconsin.) There's a little town out by Jefferson City where the street signs are in German.

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Another great series! I noticed someone already mentioned the potential Tampa Bay White Sox. There were also a few other teams that nearly relocated to the Tampa Bay area as well. Most notably the Giants, along with the Mariners, Twins, A's, Rangers, and possibly others. I would love to see how you would tackle a concept for a failed Tampa Bay relocation.

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Thanks, guys!

 

On 6/14/2018 at 2:23 AM, NicDB said:

Not really feeling the logo, but that's about it.  If you replaced it with the StL monogram, it'd be a timeless mark.

Otherwise, I have no complaints.  Especially love that heritage alt.

 

Thanks! Yeah, I figured that The Smilin' Saint wouldn't fly with some people. I've adjusted the roundel and the caps to a non-Louie version, while also creating a roundel to feature the Apotheosis statue. I rather like it, but I still prefer The Smilin' Saint.

 

FEk9q4D.png

 

On 6/14/2018 at 9:46 AM, MJD7 said:

The alternate take looks good! I especially like the primary logo and the brown alternate. That Heritage alt though, that steals the show, it’s simply is a thing of beauty.

 

Thanks! I really enjoyed making the heritage alt and adjusting the set to accommodate the drop shadow.

 

On 6/14/2018 at 9:49 AM, Carolingian Steamroller said:

He's adorable!

On 6/14/2018 at 9:52 AM, Carolingian Steamroller said:

Any chance we could see a Swingin' Louie? 

 

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Thanks! Swingin' Louie is indeed on the table, rendered in a manner similar to that Orioles logo!

 

LTwwyHB.png

 

He's really happy, wouldn't you say?

 

On 6/14/2018 at 10:30 AM, coco1997 said:

Really nice job on the alt Browns! The uniforms are perfect, other than maybe putting the "St. Louis" script on one of the alts (the brown one?), but that's just a matter of taste. 

 

The cartoony King Louis is great. However, one thing that doesn't really look quite right is the eyes. I think if you moved the nose down and had the eyes touch (like on the Orioles bird), you'd really pull off that cartoony/caricature effect. Here's a really rough sketch of what I mean (I also added a small chin dimple):

 

2

 

On 6/14/2018 at 1:09 PM, WavePunter said:

Also a tiny nitpick.. On the Orioles (and other Orioles-inspired) batting helmets, they specifically mimic the front panel cap shape.. The Orioles don't use the traditional "bell curved" batting helmets, so your artwork should more closely resemble the caps..

 

Thanks, guys! I'll be incorporating this C+C into the update.

 

On 6/14/2018 at 4:35 PM, the admiral said:

I love the Smiling Louis and would love to see some semi-pro St. Louis team adopt it. I like any references to the city's namesake -- I think I've mentioned before that the Apotheosis is a very underrated civic symbol that's been overshadowed by the Arch, and I'd love to see the Blues in particular, whose fanbase seems much less regional than that of the Cardinals, find a place for it. 

 

What's cool about the Browns concept is that the brown/beige/red feels very Germanic in a way that's suited to the very German city of St. Louis. The city's French heritage is hard to miss, of course, but it's pretty damn krauty in Missouri. (It's really just a sweatier, ruder Wisconsin.) There's a little town out by Jefferson City where the street signs are in German.

 

Thanks! I really like the Apotheosis as a civic symbol, and I do wish it featured on the Blues' uniforms in some capacity as a patch (file away for NHL series ideas). I did get a nice blend of Germanic and French in the concept, perfect for St. Louis and Missouri (or any city in former New France where German immigrants settled). Missouri really is the Alsace-Lorraine of the South and the Midwest (German/French border blending).

 

On 6/14/2018 at 11:20 PM, grahamkp said:

Another great series! I noticed someone already mentioned the potential Tampa Bay White Sox. There were also a few other teams that nearly relocated to the Tampa Bay area as well. Most notably the Giants, along with the Mariners, Twins, A's, Rangers, and possibly others. I would love to see how you would tackle a concept for a failed Tampa Bay relocation.

 

On 6/15/2018 at 7:47 PM, Jacobseye said:

Any possibility we see the NC Twins?

 

Thanks! Tampa will have an extensive feature in the series, as will the Carolina Twins (have to go state name for the nickname to make sense). 

 

Anyway, here's the Browns update, with a tweaked cartoon logo incorporating @coco1997's and @WavePunter's suggested tweaks!

 

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C+C is appreciated, as always!

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1 hour ago, SFGiants58 said:

Thanks, guys!

 

 

Thanks! Yeah, I figured that The Smilin' Saint wouldn't fly with some people. I've adjusted the roundel and the caps to a non-Louie version, while also creating a roundel to feature the Apotheosis statue. I rather like it, but I still prefer The Smilin' Saint.

 

FEk9q4D.png

 

 

Thanks! I really enjoyed making the heritage alt and adjusting the set to accommodate the drop shadow.

 

 

Thanks! Swingin' Louie is indeed on the table, rendered in a manner similar to that Orioles logo!

 

LTwwyHB.png


Well, now that I see your update I realize the only reason I didn't like Louie is that it was a floating head because your Swingin' Louie is a gem!  Regardless though, I understand why you included it in your package... it makes total sense in context.

Love the updated roundel exactly like I thought I would. I would take the base out of your Apotheosis version, though.  It doesn't really add anything to the logo other than distorting the baseball.

I also wanna say every post in this series is like a new Christmas present.  Can't wait for the next one.  Because if it's the one I think it is, it's the one I've been anticipating the most.

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