How long do you think the current wave of baseball stadiums will last?

[rams80]

I think the bigger problem is that holy crap the Skydome cost like a billion dollars 20 years ago and it's already an outdated eyesore that's not explicitly built for baseball.

Not built specifically for baseball and not big enough for the NFL. Double whammy, that. It looks nice enough from the outside, or when you're watching the roof close from above in the CN Tower, but when you're inside, it's all blue seats and concrete and dimly-lit concourses and holy crap they want to charge me 9 bucks for a Bud Light.

Why are you drinking Bud Light in Canada?

[infrared41]

They might have to significantly rebuild the Wrigley grandstand down the road. Red Sox fans will just crow that they're so intelligent that they don't need to see the field to know what's going on. NO ONE DENIES THIS.

Sounds about right.

[njmeadowlanders]

I think the bigger problem is that holy crap the Skydome cost like a billion dollars 20 years ago and it's already an outdated eyesore that's not explicitly built for baseball.

Not built specifically for baseball and not big enough for the NFL. Double whammy, that. It looks nice enough from the outside, or when you're watching the roof close from above in the CN Tower, but when you're inside, it's all blue seats and concrete and dimly-lit concourses and holy crap they want to charge me 9 bucks for a Bud Light.

Why are you drinking Bud Light in Canada?

It's an import...

[njmeadowlanders]

How exactly do they remove obstruction poles? They did it with yankee stadium.

Is that referencing the mid-1970s "renovation"? If so, they did it by completely gutting the entire structure.

Exactly. The Yanks and Giants played at Shea in 1974 & 75 while Yankee Stadium was basically rebuilt on the same site for all intents and purposes.

That's what "Old Yankee Stadium" meant before they opened the one across the street last year...the pre-'74 renovation incarnation of it.

[Sodboy13]

I think the bigger problem is that holy crap the Skydome cost like a billion dollars 20 years ago and it's already an outdated eyesore that's not explicitly built for baseball.

Not built specifically for baseball and not big enough for the NFL. Double whammy, that. It looks nice enough from the outside, or when you're watching the roof close from above in the CN Tower, but when you're inside, it's all blue seats and concrete and dimly-lit concourses and holy crap they want to charge me 9 bucks for a Bud Light.

Why are you drinking Bud Light in Canada?

Oh, believe me, I wasn't. Bud Light and Labatt Blue appeared to be the only two beers available at the park. My Toronto beer experiences consisted primarily of Steam Whistle.

[gueman]

Right now the thing is to have a "Baseball Only" facility that has a ton of luxury boxes. All it will take is for someone to invent something else (I don't know, floating over-field seating) and for it to become a "must have", and then everyone will complain that they can't compete without that feature, and that these parks can't be retro fitted, then it they'll push for new ones.

I think it also comes down to who runs / maintains the facilities and how well they're maintained. Municipalities vs. private teams can make a big difference there.

Well I think the next evolution of stadias will include condo's. Yep live year round at the stadium with a balcony overlooking the playing field. Hell they could put 50 or so in the warehouse at Camden Yards in the off season. And Ford Field and Soldier Field look like they could have them quickly retro fitted as well. As for how the income would be generated after the initial purchase, think condo fee$$$ and a resell premium. I am sure there would be others I haven't thought of.

[BBTV]

Right now the thing is to have a "Baseball Only" facility that has a ton of luxury boxes. All it will take is for someone to invent something else (I don't know, floating over-field seating) and for it to become a "must have", and then everyone will complain that they can't compete without that feature, and that these parks can't be retro fitted, then it they'll push for new ones.

I think it also comes down to who runs / maintains the facilities and how well they're maintained. Municipalities vs. private teams can make a big difference there.

Well I think the next evolution of stadias will include condo's. Yep live year round at the stadium with a balcony overlooking the playing field. Hell they could put 50 or so in the warehouse at Camden Yards in the off season. And Ford Field and Soldier Field look like they could have them quickly retro fitted as well. As for how the income would be generated after the initial purchase, think condo fee$$ and a resell premium. I am sure there would be others I haven't thought of.

Yeah that's a great idea, but could only be pulled off in a few places - namely, those places where the stadiums are located in desireable areas. For example, Citizens Bank Park is located in the "warehouse" section of South Philadelphia (it's really south of South Philly) where there really isn't anything else there, and certainly nothing that makes it an attractive place to live. The only reason to buy one of those condos would be to see the games, (and obviously host parties), but that's only really a great attraction when the team is good and popular, which obviously isn't going to be all the time. Man, I wish there was room for them to have built a downtown park (even though tailgating is awesome.)

[ElwoodCuse]

The SkyDome certainly suffered the cruelest fate of sports stadiums. In 1989 when it opened it was the FUTURE and totally awesome and the Next Big Thing. And it took only a couple years for Camden Yards to start a new trend and now it's awful and needs to be replaced.

[CubsFanBudMan]

I always envisoned all-suite/club stadiums as the next step.

Cowboys Stadium comes closest, with apparently no sideline access until the upper deck (all "club" seating) and field-level suites that probably can't even see the game. But it's so big it isn't limited to that. So I could see a future of at least the lower decks being suites and traditional seating in the upper deck.

[gueman]

Right now the thing is to have a "Baseball Only" facility that has a ton of luxury boxes. All it will take is for someone to invent something else (I don't know, floating over-field seating) and for it to become a "must have", and then everyone will complain that they can't compete without that feature, and that these parks can't be retro fitted, then it they'll push for new ones.

I think it also comes down to who runs / maintains the facilities and how well they're maintained. Municipalities vs. private teams can make a big difference there.

Well I think the next evolution of stadias will include condo's. Yep live year round at the stadium with a balcony overlooking the playing field. Hell they could put 50 or so in the warehouse at Camden Yards in the off season. And Ford Field and Soldier Field look like they could have them quickly retro fitted as well. As for how the income would be generated after the initial purchase, think condo fee$$ and a resell premium. I am sure there would be others I haven't thought of.

Yeah that's a great idea, but could only be pulled off in a few places - namely, those places where the stadiums are located in desireable areas. For example, Citizens Bank Park is located in the "warehouse" section of South Philadelphia (it's really south of South Philly) where there really isn't anything else there, and certainly nothing that makes it an attractive place to live. The only reason to buy one of those condos would be to see the games, (and obviously host parties), but that's only really a great attraction when the team is good and popular, which obviously isn't going to be all the time. Man, I wish there was room for them to have built a downtown park (even though tailgating is awesome.)

Well you have a point in regards to location. BUT...I think they would be bachelor or dink places and to those groups, as long as it is not a crime infested location it does not matter as much. Plus the condo complex would have a lot of amenities. Also you put the condos, other things follow. I don't know how often you get to Baltimore but when they put upscale condo units on the waterfront to the east of the harbor in Canton the area was given new life. Now I have been to both the Link and CBP, and yea they are in a big open space with 3 sports venues and some warehouses. But even with CBP could have a 10 story condo unit added and the right field stands removed.

To me the only real reason that this hasn't been tried is that where is the yearly revenue stream coming from unless the teams self finance, and I don't think they want to get into the banking biz.

[gueman]

I always envisoned all-suite/club stadiums as the next step.

Cowboys Stadium comes closest, with apparently no sideline access until the upper deck (all "club" seating) and field-level suites that probably can't even see the game. But it's so big it isn't limited to that. So I could see a future of at least the lower decks being suites and traditional seating in the upper deck.

Well isn't Soldier Field and Ford Field set up so that all of the suites are on one side...and it seems it is the side the TV cameras are located on so you don't really see that when you watch the game. So that does appear like the next wave for sure.

[illwauk]

Right now the thing is to have a "Baseball Only" facility that has a ton of luxury boxes. All it will take is for someone to invent something else (I don't know, floating over-field seating) and for it to become a "must have", and then everyone will complain that they can't compete without that feature, and that these parks can't be retro fitted, then it they'll push for new ones.

I think it also comes down to who runs / maintains the facilities and how well they're maintained. Municipalities vs. private teams can make a big difference there.

Well I think the next evolution of stadias will include condo's. Yep live year round at the stadium with a balcony overlooking the playing field. Hell they could put 50 or so in the warehouse at Camden Yards in the off season. And Ford Field and Soldier Field look like they could have them quickly retro fitted as well. As for how the income would be generated after the initial purchase, think condo fee$$ and a resell premium. I am sure there would be others I haven't thought of.

Yeah that's a great idea, but could only be pulled off in a few places - namely, those places where the stadiums are located in desireable areas. For example, Citizens Bank Park is located in the "warehouse" section of South Philadelphia (it's really south of South Philly) where there really isn't anything else there, and certainly nothing that makes it an attractive place to live. The only reason to buy one of those condos would be to see the games, (and obviously host parties), but that's only really a great attraction when the team is good and popular, which obviously isn't going to be all the time. Man, I wish there was room for them to have built a downtown park (even though tailgating is awesome.)

That hasn't stopped developers from trying to build condos near Lambeau Field (where it's usually at least a two hour drive to the next closest "something to do"). If there's a market for subdivisioned McMansions in the middle of nowhere then I can't see a reason why ballpark condos (at any ballpark) wouldn't work.

[The_Admiral]

Well, the exurban McMansion thing is basically that the land is cheaper and some people like to have lots of space so they don't have to see their neighbors or even their own family members. Not my cup of tea, I find the whole thing cold and alienating, but I get why it works for some people. Living at Citizens Bank Park doesn't seem worth the invariably astronomical cost. What do you do for the other six months that there's not baseball around you, and when there is, don't your sports synapses get a little fried? Like church and state, we need separation of sports and life.

[The Nation]

I've been to maybe 20 Blue Jays games, and have been on a tour of the Skydome (Refuse to call it Rogers Centre). Here's the thing about the Skydome. IMO, the architecture and design is great. For some reason, I like symmetry, I think it's because of the new gimmick retro parks that have ruined it for me. The sight-lines are ok, and from the outside, the dome looks pretty cool, especially when it's lit at night. Not to mention the awesome location near Front and Spadina.

Here's what I absolutely despise about the Skydome. I know its a multi purpose field and what not...but its just a freaking eyesore on the inside. You don't have to destroy it and build a new park. Like I said, the symmetry, the video screen, the windows restaurant...all really really nice. But I don't get the baseball feel when I'm there. The turf looks like crap, the blue seats look lifeless, the crevice between the outfield walls and the stands reminds me of a factory, the concourse is garbage, the dugouts are makeshift. Essentially, the shell of the Skydome is perfect...its just furnished with $0.33 furniture... It's not hard to make the Skydome look great. In my ideal scenario...I'd have something like this.

- Field turf that looks like grass, and has lawnmower patterns in them and a dirt infield.

- Get new seats in the 500 level. Dark blue, probably better, and the aisle entrances...god..dress them up.

- Do something about the concrete. I know they painted it blue, but that was a feeble attempt.

- Fix the outfield crevices and bullpen area to make it more cozy.

- Revamp the concourses. You know...add lights, some paint too.

- The Renaissance Hotel windows need to look more modern.

- Blue outfield walls seem outdated.

- Cozier dugouts

- Better lighting in the 200 section.

Like I said, the skydome isn't bad.....it's just dressed up really ugly.

[BBTV]

Some of the things that you are recommending do require a brand new stadium to implement properly, or at least a multi-season long "renovation" (along the lines of the Yankee Stadium one.)

[Sodboy13]

Some of the things that you are recommending do require a brand new stadium to implement properly, or at least a multi-season long "renovation" (along the lines of the Yankee Stadium one.)

Actually, from the sound of it, it sounds like something more along the lines of a New Comiskey/U.S. Cellular renovation. That got accomplished over 4 or 5 offseasons, and the stadium remained fully functional between April and October each year. However, I would think that, were Rogers Centre to undergo any sort of major renovation, one of the goals would be to increase its capacity to a level viable for an NFL franchise, and that probably would require doing what was done to Yankee Stadium or Soldier Field.

[friarcanuck]

I think the bigger problem is that holy crap the Skydome cost like a billion dollars 20 years ago and it's already an outdated eyesore that's not explicitly built for baseball.

Not built specifically for baseball and not big enough for the NFL. Double whammy, that. It looks nice enough from the outside, or when you're watching the roof close from above in the CN Tower, but when you're inside, it's all blue seats and concrete and dimly-lit concourses and holy crap they want to charge me 9 bucks for a Bud Light.

Why are you drinking Bud Light in Canada?

Oh, believe me, I wasn't. Bud Light and Labatt Blue appeared to be the only two beers available at the park. My Toronto beer experiences consisted primarily of Steam Whistle.

Bud and Bud Light are considered "Domestic" at Rogers Centre, while Keith's is considered "Premium" and a $1 more. I started seeing Blue more often near the end of last season. They're all distributed by Labatt's anyway.

As for Steam Whistle, IMO it's near the bottom of the local beers. Amsterdam and Mill Street are way better than Steam Whistle. The Amsterdam brewery is only a quick walk west down Front Street at Bathurst. Sure Steam Whistle is close, but do you want beer or apple juice?

[The Nation]

Some of the things that you are recommending do require a brand new stadium to implement properly, or at least a multi-season long "renovation" (along the lines of the Yankee Stadium one.)

Actually, from the sound of it, it sounds like something more along the lines of a New Comiskey/U.S. Cellular renovation. That got accomplished over 4 or 5 offseasons, and the stadium remained fully functional between April and October each year. However, I would think that, were Rogers Centre to undergo any sort of major renovation, one of the goals would be to increase its capacity to a level viable for an NFL franchise, and that probably would require doing what was done to Yankee Stadium or Soldier Field.

Bingo! Right now the rogers centre is made up with cheap makeup, and thrifty clothing. A Comiskey style do-over is necessary. Nothing structurally is necessary. Just upgrade the crap. I really wish RC was a Baseball-Only park, the fact that it's multi purpose makes it impossible to make it look nice.

As for an NFL sized stadium. The RC isn't the answer. A new 60,000 stadium needs to be built for that, out in the portlands I'd say.

[FiddySicks]

Right now the thing is to have a "Baseball Only" facility that has a ton of luxury boxes. All it will take is for someone to invent something else (I don't know, floating over-field seating) and for it to become a "must have", and then everyone will complain that they can't compete without that feature, and that these parks can't be retro fitted, then it they'll push for new ones.

I think it also comes down to who runs / maintains the facilities and how well they're maintained. Municipalities vs. private teams can make a big difference there.

Well I think the next evolution of stadias will include condo's. Yep live year round at the stadium with a balcony overlooking the playing field. Hell they could put 50 or so in the warehouse at Camden Yards in the off season. And Ford Field and Soldier Field look like they could have them quickly retro fitted as well. As for how the income would be generated after the initial purchase, think condo fee$$$ and a resell premium. I am sure there would be others I haven't thought of.

That's basically what they do with the buildings around PetCo Park in San Diego. I've even heard that the yearly fee people pay on these condos includes the price of season tickets.

[illwauk]

Well, the exurban McMansion thing is basically that the land is cheaper and some people like to have lots of space so they don't have to see their neighbors or even their own family members. Not my cup of tea, I find the whole thing cold and alienating, but I get why it works for some people. Living at Citizens Bank Park doesn't seem worth the invariably astronomical cost. What do you do for the other six months that there's not baseball around you, and when there is, don't your sports synapses get a little fried? Like church and state, we need separation of sports and life.

The reasons you gave would be exactly why I wouldn't be buying a ballpark condo, even if I could afford one. But this isn't necessarily about the logistics... it's about whether or not the Phillies (or whoever) could find however many people who who are either foaming-at-the-mouth fanatics that would pay a premium to literally live at the park or just weirdos with money who'd spend it for the novelty of owning one of the condos. From a completely outside POV, my money would have to say "yes."