Illinois Protesters End Stand-off

[Waffles]

In case anyone's interested, here's the case of the Syracuse Saltine Warrior:

The Saltine Warrior, an Indian figure named Big Chief Bill Orange, was born in a hoax published in The Syracuse Orange Peel, October 1931. The remains of this 16th century Onondagan chief were supposedly found in the excavations for the new women's gymnasium in 1928.

In 1951, the Senior Class commissioned a statue of the Saltine Warrior to be placed near the "discovery site." The students of the famous Croatian sculptor and SU faculty member, Ivan Mestrovic, competed for the honor. The winner was Louise Kaisch who arranged for a member of the Onondaga Nation to pose for her statue. The Saltine Warrior, cast in bronze, was moved several times, at last finding a resting place on the south-east corner of the quadrangle, next to the Shaffer Art Building.

In the mid-1950's, the father of a Lambda Chi Alpha fraternity brother owned a cheerleading camp. He made a Saltine Warrior costume for his son to wear at S.U. football games. Thus began a nearly forty-year tradition of Lambda Chi brothers serving as S.U.'s mascot. In 1990 however the University opened up the mascot traditions to the entire student body (Daily Orange, February 22, 1990).

In 1978, the members of a Native American student organization headed a protest against using the Saltine Warrior as an athletic mascot. Onondagan Chief Oren Lyons, a 1958 alumnus and former SU lacrosse star, explained that it's "all in the presentation...The thing that offended me when I was there was that guy running around like a nut. That's derogatory" (Daily Orange, March 23, 1976, p. 5). The Saltine Warrior was subsequently "sidelined" and a contest for successor ensued (Daily Orange, February 12, 1978).

And, thus, we have a giant fuzzy fruit for a mascot...

[paynomind]

The thing that offended me when I was there was that guy running around like a nut. That's derogatory

Running around liek a nut.

Thats funny as hell to me!

lol

[tajmccall]

I really do hate this, because the people that are going aftert this are 90% white males with guilt about things they had nothing to do with.

If there was a unified, strong outcry against it from Native American leaders, I think that would be one thing.

The thing that sold me, because i tried to see it both ways, was when a radio station had an advocate for change, they have some BS website im not even going to promote by listing, and the guy had nothing to say besides "Is this the direction we want to go as a society." And "I think its time as a sports community to release the oppresive reign of the white male, and bring other nationalites onto equal footing."

Where is this hypothetical playing field? I mean, Ted Nolan should have a job somewhere, but this is ridiculous.

They then brought on a well spoken professor that didnt understand how a man of german and english decent had such a vested interest, then the man who disagreed mentioned how he was of Native decendants, and he found all but the redskins acceptable, if not an honor. Basically the point he made was if you feel bad about the history of Native Americans , and this is where you got mad, concentrate your time and funds into an issue that makes a difference, not the naming of sports teams. He then got into a very good discussion about how minorities sometimes get caught up in the cosmetic appearances of equality instead of fighting for things in the legislation that could really help, like increased counciling for alchoholism on reservations, and so on.

Im not the most conservitive man in the world, but i hate how Ultra-Leftist types feel the need whine about how white men are to blame for all that is bad. Its such a cop out. Its just not logical to make things equal by putting on a lead vest on whoever is in power to "balance things out." They dont want to balance the opportunities, they want to balance the outcome, so everyones "happy".

[WideRight]

I am deeply offended that someone would use the derogatory phrase "running around like a nut". What does that say to the thousands of Ohio State students

who are now afraid to run, lest they be mocked.

Drank own body weight....Buckeye!!!

Didn't hit hair when vomitting...Buckeye!!!

Made it to class on time the next morning....Buckeye!!!

I miss the ESPN Buckeye sticker commercials, a classic.

[Proc]

A decade or so ago, Eastern Michigan University changed their nickname from the "Hurons" to the "Eagles". The Hurons were the Native American group that lived in the are now known as Ann Arbor/Ypsilanti and really all of southeastern Michigan. It kept their identity alive. Now the Hurons are related to one or two lines in a 7th grade history book...

[MilTownMVP]

The thing is, the Illini is the WORST example that the Native Americans could have gone after. They are named after the state they are in, which is named aftera real tribe. Their mascot is a literal, dignified representation of an Illini chief.

I would hate it, but still almost understand if they were protesting in Cleveland to get Wahoo banned, or in Washington to get the Redskins to change. But the Illinios thing? Horrible decision. I guess they just knew the head of the school was open to influencing.

I'll admit, if I was going to go after anything, the Indians and Redskins would be my first choices too. But the reason people go after less overtly offensive logos like the U of I is because then some lawyer couldn't cite precedent and go "howcome you people have no problem with _______?"

And IMO, Chief Wahoo is right up there with blackface, so anything that leads to his removal is fine by me.

That and I'm a Badgers fan who loves seeing U of I fans and alums get mad...

[webdav]

Will Illinois (the state) have to change it's name now? After all - it's named after the Indians (notice how I don't say Native Americans - I was born here too and am just as native as anybody else!)

Political Correctness is anti-Freedom and will be the downfall of this nation!

Besides - who names a team after something if they don't LIKE that thing and admire its traits??? It's not derogetory, it's COMPLIMENTARY!!

[Phil]

I'll admit, if I was going to go after anything, the Indians and Redskins would be my first choices too. But the reason people go after less overtly offensive logos like the U of I is because then some lawyer couldn't cite precedent and go "howcome you people have no problem with _______?"

But wouldn't a stronger precedence be that they are going after the easier, less offensive prey instead of the more ridiculous, bigger fish?

If I'm a judge, I'm wonder more why Chief Wahoo and the 'Skins (sounds like some extremely politically incorrect band, with JQK as frontman... just jokes of course) aren't being attacked while Chief Illiniwek is under assault, as opposed to the other way around.

[mac]

all they are doing by this is sturring up more controversy than the name ever made before. If any one is offended by the name Illini, then they are a jackass.

[winters in buffalo]

Everything offends somebody. As long as the team's not called "We crapped in your shoes" It won't bother me much.

[gosioux76]

I'm always amazed at how divisive this issue becomes. For two years I was editor at the student paper at the University of North Dakota, home of the "Fighting Sioux." Several times i was privately called a racist for not publicly supporting the opposition to the name. On the other side, I heard elected student governement officials say how they feared for their lives for voting against the moniker.

We one time published an cartoonish illustration of a Sioux indian grappling with a Gopher to symbolize the hated hockey rivalry with the University of Minnesota. Within a day I received dozens of phone calls from people complaining of the image of a gopher choking an indian. It was a good lesson for me on how not to handle a sensitive issue like sports icons.

This is truly a polarizing issue. In North Dakota, at least, it seems you're either for the name or against it. There's rarely, if ever, a middle ground. I'm sure it's like that in Illinois and other places.

[-kj]

Perhaps the Sioux should have been chokin' the gopher.

Er, wait....

[Discrim]

priceless

on the PC plop goin on at Illinois-said it before and i'll say it again: Say Hello to Lincolnland. oh, wait, maybe his descendants will be offended it's the team name. the actual tribe is okay with the name. get over it.

next thing ya know PETA's gonna protest UW's use of the name Badgers

[MilTownMVP]

next thing ya know PETA's gonna protest UW's use of the name Badgers

They actually did come after ther Packers a couple years ago. Apparently the name Packers encourages violence against cattle. But I mean, who can blame them with all the crazy, meat cleaver wielding mascots, logos and imagery the Packers use.

/sarcasm

But I was under the impression that the actual Illini were behind this. If they're not, I'd love to slap the politcal grandstanding jerkoff who's behind this. All they do is make it more difficult for people who have real beefs.

And this is coming from someone who wants his hometown to return to its Socialist roots...

[paynomind]

Everything offends somebody. As long as the team's not called "We crapped in your shoes" It won't bother me much.

LLLLLLLLLadies and Gentlemen.... Timberland is proud to introduce...

YOURrrrr... New Jersey "We Crapped in Your Shoes"es!

[winters in buffalo]

Everything offends somebody. As long as the team's not called "We crapped in your shoes" It won't bother me much.

LLLLLLLLLadies and Gentlemen.... Timberland is proud to introduce...

YOURrrrr... New Jersey "We Crapped in Your Shoes"es!

See, now some group of trophy housewives and some hairy dude they met in the park are going to start an organization to protest this.

It's OK, though, because they're legitimate shoecrappers.