NFL 2022 Changes

[Indigo]

[Indigo]

If Carolina were to just thin the stripe out to a UCLA-ish size, maybe It would allow thm to keep all three elements.

 

(ignore the black helmet)

 

[Sport]

The cat scratch thing has been tried before. 

 

 

So it looks dumb on the Panthers and was tried by a college team in 2008. 

 

Putting scratch marks on a Panthers concept has become such a trope of the concepts board that it's up there with "The Minnesota Twins should wear purple and yellow" or "What if the Broncos 1997 horse head logo was inside of a D?" or "What if Penn State put the oval lion logo on the helmet?"

 

[gosioux76]

1 hour ago, LA Fakers+ LA Snippers said:

If Carolina were to just thin the stripe out to a UCLA-ish size, maybe It would allow thm to keep all three elements.

 

(ignore the black helmet)

 

 

I'll say it again: Why do they need to keep all 3? What function do the TV numbers serve anymore, other than to clutter ever-shrinking sleeves? 

 

I genuinely don't understand the desire to salvage a uniform element whose function has been eclipsed by both technology and fashion.

[BBTV]

Regarding the cat scratch thing, why would you want to look like your mascot attacked you before the game?  You're supposed to be the predator, not the prey.

[HOOVER]

2 hours ago, ripall90 said:

@Volt

1. I never understood this "It doesn't look NFL"/"It looks like Arena football" argument. Also the current panthers stripes are meant to loop like scratch marks. I'm just not a fan of the scratch marks on the current uniforms they look strange. Maybe on the redesign they could change the stripes or get rid of them altogether but they look better than the current uniforms which are too busy even if you remove the TV numbers

2. By that logic the Panthers look like the Raiders. First off Jax needs a complete overhaul. Second the black helmet looks way better than silver imo. Like I said I am not a fan of the silver for the Panthers. The black fits the sleek panther aesthetic much better and makes an illusion of something more than floating head. I also don't mind the number on the helmet. Would it be better to remove it and leave it plain?

3. Again I don't mind. They've already begun moving away from silver. If you want silver as an outline on the numbers or on the pants that is fine I just disagree with you about the Panthers color scheme. Unlike the gold with the Jags, the silver doesn't add much. I've always been of the opinion silver should be a substitute for white. If the numbers and pants were silver I'd be for it. Plus it does look like Panther fur when it is glossy in the sun. But Nike has shown they can't do metallic pants colors so if they move away from the silver I'm  fine. Those images you posted the pants look gray instead of silver. The electric blue is already unique enough.  It still feels like a 90s team even without the silver 

This looks like silver 

4. You cited for teams who wear black as an alt. And look at how many baseball teams use navy and red. Like I said add silver pants that is fine.

5. Jacksonville has block font. Also see earlier in this thread what this guy did for Jax and the Panthers look nothing like them. This is italic. I don't see the comparison. Even then again want to slap a blue and silver outline I am fine with that. 

 

Ultimately I just disagree with your premise. I don't think the Panthers uniforms can be salvaged. They aren't bad they are just really outdated and the Nike template and materials are incompatible. I never really understood why the panthers stuck with these uniforms for so long even when new ownership took over.

1.  If you don't understand the difference between NFL vs Arena Football aesthetics, I'd probably sit by quietly and observe the board for awhile before throwing out outlandish uniform redesign ideas.  The NFL is steeped in tradition, and has, from that tradition, some of the most revered and tried & true uniform design concepts in its history.   New upstart leagues, or colleges trying to win recruits with "icy" and "fire" uniforms, don't have history or notable tradition to adhere to, so they try more trendy design tactics to catch the eyes of 12-20 year olds boys to get them to like their team.  This has resulted in, over the years, some wildly terrible aesthetic design choices.  This trend has crept into the NFL as well, unfortunately, but the best uniforms continue to be those that are timeless.  Let's compare:

 

2.  No, the Panthers do not look like the Raiders, as the Raiders are a 2-color theme and the Panthers are a 3-color team.  The Blue makes the difference, and it's a big one.  Are the Packers the same as the Jets?  How about the Chiefs and Cardinals?  Maybe the Patriots & Texans?  

As for the Jaguars, we're not talking about them.  They just did a redesign 2-3 seasons ago and have several more to continue wearing them, and their intent when unveiling those uniforms was to not have to redesign them again for a very long time.  So, it makes zero sense for the Panthers to design a new uniform that looks....just like the Jaguars.

The Black helmet looking better than the Silver helmet is your opinion and you're allowed to have it.  I still think it sucks and I think most people with an understanding of balanced uniform design will agree with me that the Silver serves Carolina better, as the Black & Blue contrast extremely well off of it.  There's no reason discussing removing a number from the design, as all helmets should have the logo on each side of the helmet for symmetry's sake.  I don't care of Boise State does it.  They're irrelevant.  They installed Blue turf.  Who wants to be recruited to play football in the state of Idaho?

3.  Did you just say the pants look like....Panther fur?  Jesus.

I'm not going over Silver Nike pants with yet another person.  They can make them.  If they use decades-old dazzle mesh fabric technology, rather than a material that performs better and fits & feels better on the athletes.  Silver/Grey are the same thing.  They don't need to match when crossing mediums; paint is not fabric.

The Silver adds a lot...like a whole level of depth to the design.  It's like thinking 2D & 3D are the same thing.

4.  Yes, multiple teams wear a combination of Black helmets, Black jerseys, and White pants.  Let's not add another.  Only the Patriots & Raiders still have Silver helmets.  There are now 8 total Black helmets in the NFL.  There are 4 Silver helmets, including the Panthers.  We don't need more teams with Black helmets.

5.  I can't translate what your point is here, other than saying that italic number fonts would be an improvement over the most timeless athletic number font in sports history.  I think Lions & Steelers fans would disagree.  And the concept you posted had 1-color numbers, which is what the Jags just did, so yes, at minimum, you'd have to outline them, as that's one of the biggest complaints people have about the Jags unis.

Again, having an opinion is fine.  I believe most people will just disagree with your's.



 

[HOOVER]

1 hour ago, LA Fakers+ LA Snippers said:

If Carolina were to just thin the stripe out to a UCLA-ish size, maybe It would allow thm to keep all three elements.

 

(ignore the black helmet)

 

 

Yes, this worked just fine with the old template.  I suspect it could be done with a new template, but the current one hasn't worked well.  The LA Rams offer the solution if the Panthers have to keep this template, but they'd have to lose the sleeve logos, which is fine.  

Or, as others said, just drop the TV numbers like half of the rest of the league is doing.

[riccirulesall]

I think the only time i've ever liked a gimmicky and very not subtle design like scratch marks are mizzou's old (?) uniforms. it was fairly restrained and closely resembled the tiger head logo. that being said I would never advocate for the panthers or any other NFL team to do it.

 

 

also would never remove silver from the panthers' palette. removing silver leaves black, blue or white helmets to use, which

1) do not work nearly as well or at all with their logo

2) throw off the balance of their color blocking

3) dilute their brand and simply make it more boring and run of the mill

 

 

edit: honorable mention goes to arkansas' hogtooth design in concept, but execution left a lot to be desired

[ripall90]

4 hours ago, PERRIN said:

Calling that a 'fact' isn't just a stretch, it's yoga. I don't see anything remotely resembling a scratch mark; It's a typical shoulder loop. It doesn't even terminate into a point. If anything, current USC or the Brady-era Patriots sets look more like claw marks than anything the Panthers have worn. Jesus Christ my dude what are you smoking

They literally form a point. Either way I don't see the problem with the redesigned uniform 

[ripall90]

2 hours ago, Volt said:

Or, as others said, just drop the TV numbers like half of the rest of the league is doing.

Literally only NE, Cincy, LA Rams and Chargers have dropped the TV numbers. Yeah that isn't "Half the league." Plus Chargers put the numbers on the helmet. Again leaving the shoulders blank looks like college uniforms

Should we removed name plates on the back?

[ripall90]

2 hours ago, riccirulesall said:

I think the only time i've ever liked a gimmicky and very not subtle design like scratch marks are mizzou's old (?) uniforms. it was fairly restrained and closely resembled the tiger head logo. that being said I would never advocate for the panthers or any other NFL team to do it.

 

 

also would never remove silver from the panthers' palette. removing silver leaves black, blue or white helmets to use, which

1) do not work nearly as well or at all with their logo

2) throw off the balance of their color blocking

3) dilute their brand and simply make it more boring and run of the mill

 

 

edit: honorable mention goes to arkansas' hogtooth design in concept, but execution left a lot to be desired

You think THAT is less gimmicky and subtle? I sorely disagree

 

1. Black helmet concepts literally look amazing so I disagree. I can't stand their silver helmet

2. Their jerseys have minimal silver

3. I feel the electric blue is more than enough to uphold the brand. Even the logo dropped the silver outline. Silver does nothing for me. Maybe in small use but the helmet looks better in black than silver.

 

Genuine question, besides removing TV numbers, is there anything that Nike did in the last 20 years that improved a team's uniforms? 

[PERRIN]

19 minutes ago, ripall90 said:

They literally form a point. 

Unless you're referring to the pants striping, (which since the move to the Nike Vapor template does not terminate into a point, but gets cut off at the bottom, so wrong on both accounts) you might want to get your eyes checked. The shoulder stripes either terminate straight on like most shoulder stripes or squeeze a bit to fully loop under the armpit, depending on the jersey cut. Either way, neither stripe fully terminates into a point anymore, and even if they did it looks nothing like a panther claw mark. 

The reason other here have compared your statements to Nikespeak is because you're assigning meaning to choices that weren't done with anything in mind. The Panthers original pants striping wasn't supposed to be anything, it just came to a point like was common for pants striping at the time.

 

13 minutes ago, ripall90 said:

I feel the electric blue is more than enough to uphold the brand. 

This might be the first thing you've said regarding the Panthers that I agree with. I don't dislike the silver and would prefer the Panthers keep it to some degree, but I think the Process Blue they use is incredibly striking and unique in a good way. If they're going to overhaul, which I don't quite find necessary, I'd love for them to base any new set around it. Black is overdone, especially in a division with the Falcons and the Saints. That being said, all they need is to ditch the TV numbers, revert the pants stripe back to the correct size and color balance, ditch some uglier combos, and perhaps use a more modern number font. That's all the tweaking they need.

 

13 minutes ago, ripall90 said:

Genuine question, besides removing TV numbers, is there anything that Nike did in the last 20 years that improved a team's uniforms? 

Tighter-fitting uniform templates, the Chargers, Vikings, Bengals, and Lions rebrands (ranked from best to meh in that order, all are massive upgrades), returning the Jets to kelly green, returning the Rams to royal and yellow, and introducing helmet sheens like the Jets and Commanders. Nike has made some truly awful stuff and ruined the looks of a handful of teams, but give credit where credit is due. They've done some good to balance it out.

[ripall90]

2 hours ago, Volt said:

1.  If you don't understand the difference between NFL vs Arena Football aesthetics, I'd probably sit by quietly and observe the board for awhile before throwing out outlandish uniform redesign ideas.  The NFL is steeped in tradition, and has, from that tradition, some of the most revered and tried & true uniform design concepts in its history.   New upstart leagues, or colleges trying to win recruits with "icy" and "fire" uniforms, don't have history or notable tradition to adhere to, so they try more trendy design tactics to catch the eyes of 12-20 year olds boys to get them to like their team.  This has resulted in, over the years, some wildly terrible aesthetic design choices.  This trend has crept into the NFL as well, unfortunately, but the best uniforms continue to be those that are timeless.  Let's compare:

 

First off I would not call the Panthers uniforms timeless. Second you cite two of the oldest NFL teams, two team that have never changed their uniforms. Likewise you cite some flashy arena uniforms. Well how about these arena unis?

Or these nfl uniforms?

Plus the Panthers are one of the youngest team with little history or tradition. Their colors are also non traditional. So I don't it is fair to compare them to the Packers or Cowboys

2 hours ago, Volt said:

2.  No, the Panthers do not look like the Raiders, as the Raiders are a 2-color theme and the Panthers are a 3-color team.  The Blue makes the difference, and it's a big one.  Are the Packers the same as the Jets?  How about the Chiefs and Cardinals?  Maybe the Patriots & Texans?  

Which is my point removing Silver won't make them look the same as any other team

2 hours ago, Volt said:

The Black helmet looking better than the Silver helmet is your opinion and you're allowed to have it.  I still think it sucks and I think most people with an understanding of balanced uniform design will agree with me that the Silver serves Carolina better, as the Black & Blue contrast extremely well off of it.  There's no reason discussing removing a number from the design, as all helmets should have the logo on each side of the helmet for symmetry's sake.  I don't care of Boise State does it.  They're irrelevant.  They installed Blue turf.  Who wants to be recruited to play football in the state of Idaho?

 

I love how you are acting like everyone agrees with you. Regardless when the Panthers wear their home uniforms sure there is color balance but when they wear white there isn't. Like I said a redesign can have silver but I don't think it is a lost if they do away with it. They even dropped the silver border on their logo

2 hours ago, Volt said:

3.  Did you just say the pants look like....Panther fur?  Jesus.

I'm not going over Silver Nike pants with yet another person.  They can make them.  If they use decades-old dazzle mesh fabric technology, rather than a material that performs better and fits & feels better on the athletes.  Silver/Grey are the same thing.  They don't need to match when crossing mediums; paint is not fabric.

The Silver adds a lot...like a whole level of depth to the design.  It's like thinking 2D & 3D are the same thing.

 

No? I never said it looked like fur. And the shade of silver is ugly. People complain about the Saints gold pants and the Rams previous set under Nike not doing metallic right but here it is okay? Sorry but the gray pants look ugly. I don't think they make the uniforms have more depth. More colors does not make things deeper. There is already a lot of contrast with the black and blue. Now if the Panthers committed to replacing white with silver that'd be different but they don't

2 hours ago, Volt said:

4.  Yes, multiple teams wear a combination of Black helmets, Black jerseys, and White pants.  Let's not add another.  Only the Patriots & Raiders still have Silver helmets.  There are now 8 total Black helmets in the NFL.  There are 4 Silver helmets, including the Panthers.  We don't need more teams with Black helmets.

Considering you constantly sideswipe me saying the majority agrees with you, pray tell why don't more teams use silver helmets? And FYI I want the Patriots to switch to white helmets. Silver can work but for the Panthers and Patriots it doesn't. I don't care if every team wears black helmets. Funny when the Jaguars had half gold helmets people hated them. If someone defended those helmets saying they were unique would you say that is a good argument?

2 hours ago, Volt said:

5.  I can't translate what your point is here, other than saying that italic number fonts would be an improvement over the most timeless athletic number font in sports history.  I think Lions & Steelers fans would disagree.  And the concept you posted had 1-color numbers, which is what the Jags just did, so yes, at minimum, you'd have to outline them, as that's one of the biggest complaints people have about the Jags unis.

Again, having an opinion is fine.  I believe most people will just disagree with your's.

The Lions and Steelers look better and most fans agree with me. I haven't met a single person who likes the old uniforms over the current ones. Even with this number font it is still a block style. It isn't rounded like the Lions or Steelers. 

 

and I'm cool having the wrong opinion.

[TBGKon]

26 minutes ago, ripall90 said:

Literally only NE, Cincy, LA Rams and Chargers have dropped the TV numbers. Yeah that isn't "Half the league." Plus Chargers put the numbers on the helmet. Again leaving the shoulders blank looks like college uniforms

Should we removed name plates on the back?

No, but all of those teams have rebranded in the last few years.  I wouldn't expect existing teams to just remove the TV numbers "just because" but if a team redesigns the uniforms I could see more teams remove the TV numbers moving forward.

[ripall90]

6 minutes ago, PERRIN said:

Unless you're referring to the pants striping, (which since the move to the Nike Vapor template does not terminate into a point, but gets cut off at the bottom, so wrong on both accounts) you might want to get your eyes checked. The shoulder stripes either terminate straight on like most shoulder stripes or squeeze a bit to fully loop under the armpit, depending on the jersey cut. Either way, neither stripe fully terminates into a point anymore, and even if they did it looks nothing like a panther claw mark. 

The reason other here have compared your statements to Nikespeak is because you're assigning meaning to choices that weren't done with anything in mind. The Panthers original pants striping wasn't supposed to be anything, it just came to a point like was common for pants striping at the time.

 

This might be the first thing you've said regarding the Panthers that I agree with. I don't dislike the silver and would prefer the Panthers keep it to some degree, but I think the Process Blue they use is incredibly striking and unique in a good way. If they're going to overhaul, which I don't quite find necessary, I'd love for them to base any new set around it. Black is overdone, especially in a division with the Falcons and the Saints. That being said, all they need is to ditch the TV numbers, revert the pants stripe back to the correct size and color balance, ditch some uglier combos, and perhaps use a more modern number font. That's all the tweaking they need.

 

Tighter-fitting uniform templates, the Chargers, Vikings, Bengals, and Lions rebrands (ranked from best to meh in that order, all are massive upgrades), returning the Jets to kelly green, returning the Rams to royal and yellow, and introducing helmet sheens like the Jets and Commanders. Nike has made some truly awful stuff and ruined the looks of a handful of teams, but give credit where credit is due. They've done some good to balance it out.

Why do people here hate TV numbers? To me no tv numbers looks like college not the NFL. Might not be egregious on the panthers since the stripe is kinda big. And no even on the old template the stripe on the legs made a point

 

I honestly do not like the stripes on the shoulders along with the panther logo. Honestly just remove the panther logo and place the numbers there. But I think the uniforms need a big update. Just to me it feels too 1990s and none of the pieces work together

 

I don't get the argument black is too common. The saints use a gold helmet. Kinda ironic you imply silver makes it more unique considering pewter is pretty darn close to silver. Sometimes it feels like people here just like older uniforms and never want change

 

As a sidenote I miss the St Louis colors. Also they should have TV numbers on the shoulders

[ripall90]

1 minute ago, TBGKon said:

No, but all of those teams have rebranded in the last few years.  I wouldn't expect existing teams to just remove the TV numbers "just because" but if a team redesigns the uniforms I could see more teams remove the TV numbers moving forward.

Except NE just used their color rush. The Jets and Falcons had redesigns the same time but kept the TV numbers. But I disagree. Again no TV numbers looks like college. It is already bad enough they change the number rules to be stupid and let skill positions wear basically whatever 

[gosioux76]

1 hour ago, ripall90 said:

Why do people here hate TV numbers? To me no tv numbers looks like college not the NFL. Might not be egregious on the panthers since the stripe is kinda big. And no even on the old template the stripe on the legs made a point

 

What purpose do they serve?  

 

Next question: Can they serve whatever that purpose is while occupying increasingly smaller spaces on ever-shrinking jerseys? 

 

No matter what you suggest their purpose is, the answer is going to be "no."

[ripall90]

2 minutes ago, gosioux76 said:

 

What purpose do they serve?  

 

Next question: Can the serve whatever that purpose is while occupying increasingly smaller spaces on ever-shrinking jerseys? 

 

No matter what you suggest their purpose is, the answer is going to be "no."

to see the numbers from overhead. And as someone else said how about move the Nike logo to the chest instead?

And you can't tell me the numbers wouldn't fit just fine on the top of the Rams sleeves

[oldschoolvikings]

15 minutes ago, ripall90 said:

\

The Lions and Steelers look better and most fans agree with me. I haven't met a single person who likes the old uniforms over the current ones.

 

Pleased to meet you. 

[ripall90]

i mean in real life