Gothamite Posted December 20, 2018 Share Posted December 20, 2018 3 hours ago, Marlins93 said: That's a beef you need to take up with the city and county officials, not Loria. I despise Loria as a whole for his meddling ways, but bottom line is that the Marlins could never have privately financed that ballpark. If Loria didn't make that deal with the city and county, hello Portland Marlins Yes. And that extortion threat is exactly why Loria deserves every last little bit of all the scorn that can be heaped upon his narrow shoulders. The Green Bay Packers Uniform Database! Now in a handy blog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marlinfan Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 People forget MLB had to step in and start new negotiations with the city and county after Loria and Samson burned bridges with local officials after a deal at the Orange Bowl fell apart. That’s when Loria and Samson did their tour of Portland-Oklahoma City and traded Carlos Delgado and the remaining core of the 2003 team after the 2005 season. The current stadium is more Bob DuPuy’s swindle than anybody else’s. MLB restarted negotiations and briefly tried to make a stadium next to the AAA work before going back to the Orange Bowl site. 1997 | 2003 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverBullet1929 Posted December 21, 2018 Author Share Posted December 21, 2018 I don't think Jeter is trying to make the Marlins stuffy and serious like the Yankees are assumed to be. When Stanton was traded he spoke highly of the city and the fanbase but said that too often the organization came off like a circus. I think Jeter is just trying to change that perception that we're a joke of a franchise, the laughingstock of MLB. Jeter is just trying to make this organization respectable... I don't think that necessarily means being boring and "buttoned up" like the Yankees. Jeter has said things like he wants this organization to be a place that players are proud to be part of and that other players want to come to as opposed to "oh man I got traded to the Marlins." I don't think there's anything wrong with that mindset. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBTV Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 25 minutes ago, SilverBullet1929 said: he wants this organization to be a place that players are proud to be part of and that other players want to come to as opposed to "oh man I got traded to the Marlins." I don't think there's anything wrong with that mindset. The best way to do that is to just build a winner. It's funny how players can block out all the hokeyness of a b-level organization if they're consistently winning. The Phillies actually run a pretty classy / professional organization, are in one of the largest markets, have a top-5 (maybe even top-3) budget, but they have to beg and plead for star FAs to sign there, while back in the late 00s/early 10s that's where just about everyone wanted to be. The difference is winning. Among other issues - some out of their control - they remained too loyal to aging players and committed to patching holes rather than moving on and actually filling those holes. They could have extended that run by a few years, and having nearly 10 years straight of being an elite team could have cemented their place as a destination, rather than players viewing them in the same light as they do the Pirates and Brewers. "The views expressed here are mine and do not reflect the official opinion of my employer or the organization through which the Internet was accessed." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverBullet1929 Posted December 21, 2018 Author Share Posted December 21, 2018 2 minutes ago, BringBackTheVet said: The best way to do that is to just build a winner. It's funny how players can block out all the hokeyness of a b-level organization if they're consistently winning. Oh absolutely. This is priority number one. But getting rid of some of the obvious hokeyness along the way sure would be nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBTV Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 A certain degree of hokeyness is fine, especially when you are trying to bring people out to the park and you don’t have a winner. You need goofy promotions for kids, concerts(maybe) and other “things” to drum up some interest, then hope that once you lure them in, their actual experience is good enough to keep them coming back. Not talking about MiLB-level shenanigans, but being all serious when you suck isn’t going to bring anyone out. "The views expressed here are mine and do not reflect the official opinion of my employer or the organization through which the Internet was accessed." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverBullet1929 Posted December 21, 2018 Author Share Posted December 21, 2018 11 minutes ago, BringBackTheVet said: A certain degree of hokeyness is fine, especially when you are trying to bring people out to the park and you don’t have a winner. You need goofy promotions for kids, concerts(maybe) and other “things” to drum up some interest, then hope that once you lure them in, their actual experience is good enough to keep them coming back. Not talking about MiLB-level shenanigans, but being all serious when you suck isn’t going to bring anyone out. This is exactly what I'm trying to say. Derek Jeter isn't trying to be all serious, stuffy, or buttoned up with the Miami Marlins. The hokeyness I'm talking about isn't about goofy promotions to bring people out, the team still has that and will continue to use that. I'm talking about the things that would make fans ashamed of their team and that would make other players hate to be a part of this team. Having a sculpture in center field that looks like a carnival ride... making the GM the manager in the middle of the season... having a logo that players didn't enjoy wearing... Loria thinking he was the GM and demanding baseball moves that the baseball operations department was against... and of course having multiple fire sales. In 2015 Marlins player Jeff Baker was abruptly released mid season because he started wearing a clown nose while playing circus music in the clubhouse. As unprofessional as that is, I'm sure the guy had a reason to do this. While this is one incident and may say more about Jeff Baker than it does about the team, most agree that this behavior didn't appear out of thin air. The Marlins were (and might still be) viewed as a joke of a franchise and Derek Jeter is gonna make sure that aura around the team changes as quickly as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CardsFan79 Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 31 minutes ago, BringBackTheVet said: The best way to do that is to just build a winner. It's funny how players can block out all the hokeyness of a b-level organization if they're consistently winning. The Phillies actually run a pretty classy / professional organization, are in one of the largest markets, have a top-5 (maybe even top-3) budget, but they have to beg and plead for star FAs to sign there, while back in the late 00s/early 10s that's where just about everyone wanted to be. The difference is winning. Among other issues - some out of their control - they remained too loyal to aging players and committed to patching holes rather than moving on and actually filling those holes. They could have extended that run by a few years, and having nearly 10 years straight of being an elite team could have cemented their place as a destination, rather than players viewing them in the same light as they do the Pirates and Brewers. This is what worries me about the Cardinals. Patch working together band aid fixes vs. actually taking care of the holes for too long and slipping farther down the desirability scale for players. They need to cement their dedication to being an elite team. Hopefully some of their moves this offseason are steps in the right direction. 2 minutes ago, SilverBullet1929 said: This is exactly what I'm trying to say. Derek Jeter isn't trying to be all serious, stuffy, or buttoned up with the Miami Marlins. The hokeyness I'm talking about isn't about goofy promotions to bring people out, the team still has that and will continue to use that. I'm talking about the things that would make fans ashamed of their team and that would make other players hate to be a part of this team. Having a sculpture in center field that looks like a carnival ride... making the GM the manager in the middle of the season... Loria thinking he was the GM and demanding baseball moves that the baseball operations department was against... and of course having multiple fire sales. In 2015 Marlins player Jeff Baker was abruptly released mid season because he started wearing a clown nose while playing circus music in the clubhouse. As unprofessional as that is, I'm sure the guy had a reason to do this. While this is one incident and may say more about Jeff Baker than it does about the team, most agree that this behavior didn't appear out of thin air. The Marlins were (and might still be) viewed as a joke of a franchise and Derek Jeter is gonna make sure that aura around the team changes as quickly as possible. I had never heard that Jeff Baker story. That's very interesting and shows how far the front office can lose the clubhouse. I'm sure Jeff Baker wasn't the only player who felt that way, maybe just the only one who displayed it in such an outwardly way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THRILLHO Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 It was very surprising to me how quickly the angry mob assembled at Jeter’s doorstep last year. To say Loria was loathed really doesn’t convey how much animosity there is toward him in the community. I think people in close proximity to the team are so conditioned to feel slighted by whoever is in charge that they are quick to blame whoever that person is, and call them cheap. The reality of it though is much different. MLB teams are a scarce resource. There are 30, but really there aren’t 30 available teams. Regardless of the circumstance if you are a person who wants to own a team and one becomes available you bid on it, get in there and figure out how to make it work correctly. The situation that Bruce Sherman purchased (you remember Bruce Sherman….the guy who owns the majority of the team) was in a state of disrepair. That’s not his fault, nor is it minority owner Derek Jeter’s fault. It is their job to fix it, and the process for fixing it has people blaming current ownership when they really should still be blaming Loria for the very long list of mistakes he made during his time as owner. I’m not a Jeter apologist. I’m skeptical that his experience has him properly prepared. I think he’s got the right overall strategy. His execution can’t be evaluated for some time though. But people like to grade transactions right after they happen which is a little ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverBullet1929 Posted December 21, 2018 Author Share Posted December 21, 2018 1 minute ago, THRILLHO said: It was very surprising to me how quickly the angry mob assembled at Jeter’s doorstep last year. To say Loria was loathed really doesn’t convey how much animosity there is toward him in the community. I think people in close proximity to the team are so conditioned to feel slighted by whoever is in charge that they are quick to blame whoever that person is, and call them cheap. The reality of it though is much different. MLB teams are a scarce resource. There are 30, but really there aren’t 30 available teams. Regardless of the circumstance if you are a person who wants to own a team and one becomes available you bid on it, get in there and figure out how to make it work correctly. The situation that Bruce Sherman purchased (you remember Bruce Sherman….the guy who owns the majority of the team) was in a state of disrepair. That’s not his fault, nor is it minority owner Derek Jeter’s fault. It is their job to fix it, and the process for fixing it has people blaming current ownership when they really should still be blaming Loria for the very long list of mistakes he made during his time as owner. I’m not a Jeter apologist. I’m skeptical that his experience has him properly prepared. I think he’s got the right overall strategy. His execution can’t be evaluated for some time though. But people like to grade transactions right after they happen which is a little ridiculous. Amen. To sum it up... Ever walk into a public bathroom and the stench is unbearable because of the previous person, then you use the bathroom and on the way out someone else walks in and looks at you as if to blame you for the smell that was already there? THAT is what's happening to Derek Jeter right now in Miami! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THRILLHO Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 21 minutes ago, SilverBullet1929 said: Amen. To sum it up... Ever walk into a public bathroom and the stench is unbearable because of the previous person, then you use the bathroom and on the way out someone else walks in and looks at you as if to blame you for the smell that was already there? THAT is what's happening to Derek Jeter right now in Miami! Thats good. I was thinking of one where a doctor screws up an operation. The patient goes to a new doctor and the new doctor has to operate again to repair the damage. The family proceeds to yell at the new doctor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pelicanfan Posted December 22, 2018 Share Posted December 22, 2018 Just got into baseball and mlb stuff like a month ago. Decided to be a fan of the Marlins because of the babycakes. Now there’s a rebrand? Can someone explain how it’s been doing and what people have been thinking of it? Because I really liked that orange and other colors. Red and blue seems kinda simple, and there’s so much black to the logo it’s just kinda flat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted December 27, 2018 Share Posted December 27, 2018 On 12/20/2018 at 5:20 PM, KGeeX5 said: Jeter wasn't going to get anywhere the appropriate value for Yelich and likely Realmuto. The Marlins have zero leverage in those trades. Better to get anything then letting them walk for nothing. The Marlins controlled Yelich for 5 more seasons with the contract extension he signed. They absolutely had leverage on that one, but seemed to panic in the "trade everyone we can with money owed" mentality they had last offseason and took an underwhelming deal. That deal still has potential to turn out ok, but after year 1, it doesn't look good. JT is different with only 2 more seasons of control left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KGeeX5 Posted December 27, 2018 Share Posted December 27, 2018 3 hours ago, rmc523 said: The Marlins controlled Yelich for 5 more seasons with the contract extension he signed. They absolutely had leverage on that one, but seemed to panic in the "trade everyone we can with money owed" mentality they had last offseason and took an underwhelming deal. That deal still has potential to turn out ok, but after year 1, it doesn't look good. JT is different with only 2 more seasons of control left. Thing is they were demanding trades, teams knew they had to unload him so there was no way they'd get full value. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rmc523 Posted December 27, 2018 Share Posted December 27, 2018 35 minutes ago, KGeeX5 said: Thing is they were demanding trades, teams knew they had to unload him so there was no way they'd get full value. They can demand all the want. Short of walking away from the team, they're under contract and the Marlins could just keep them if they wanted. --- Anyway, back to the uniforms. Majestic is misprinting logos on their shirts (notice the missing red drop shadow on the second i: I ordered one and sent it back as it was wrong. The second one came the same way. And I went into the team store, all of this particular shirt are like that too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverBullet1929 Posted December 27, 2018 Author Share Posted December 27, 2018 3 hours ago, rmc523 said: 3 hours ago, KGeeX5 said: Thing is they were demanding trades, teams knew they had to unload him so there was no way they'd get full value. They can demand all the want. Short of walking away from the team, they're under contract and the Marlins could just keep them if they wanted. --- Anyway, back to the uniforms. Majestic is misprinting logos on their shirts (notice the missing red drop shadow on the second i: I ordered one and sent it back as it was wrong. The second one came the same way. And I went into the team store, all of this particular shirt are like that too. I ordered two shirts of the same design and got the same error on both. It feels like Majestic hasn't realized what the error actually is. Pretty screwed up if you ask me. And the error is small enough that most people won't even notice it. If someone was really motivated to make a big stink out of this they could since it's not one shirt with an error it's seemingly every shirt so they have the design wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gothamite Posted December 27, 2018 Share Posted December 27, 2018 Considering the Brewers’ retro logo was wrong on merchandise for about twenty-five years before they corrected it, this seems par for the course. The Green Bay Packers Uniform Database! Now in a handy blog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THRILLHO Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 2 hours ago, SilverBullet1929 said: I ordered two shirts of the same design and got the same error on both. It feels like Majestic hasn't realized what the error actually is. Pretty screwed up if you ask me. And the error is small enough that most people won't even notice it. If someone was really motivated to make a big stink out of this they could since it's not one shirt with an error it's seemingly every shirt so they have the design wrong. On Christmas lots of people were tweeting out pictures of their marlins gifts. This shirt showed up a lot and they all had the same error. Made me laugh. Kind of surprising considering it is the primary logo on the first run of a major rebrand Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SilverBullet1929 Posted December 28, 2018 Author Share Posted December 28, 2018 54 minutes ago, THRILLHO said: On Christmas lots of people were tweeting out pictures of their marlins gifts. This shirt showed up a lot and they all had the same error. Made me laugh. Kind of surprising considering it is the primary logo on the first run of a major rebrand If the right person in the Marlins organization is notified of this they could probably make a serious case over this with Majestic because isn't there a point where this isn't ok in terms of proper representation and marketing of the team and their logos? Like, for example the style guide... isn't that made so that licensed manufacturers are forced to use the proper logos to not misrepresent the teams? In that case the Marlins could say that Majestic isn't sticking to the style guide and I'm sure that violates something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THRILLHO Posted December 28, 2018 Share Posted December 28, 2018 18 minutes ago, SilverBullet1929 said: If the right person in the Marlins organization is notified of this they could probably make a serious case over this with Majestic because isn't there a point where this isn't ok in terms of proper representation and marketing of the team and their logos? Like, for example the style guide... isn't that made so that licensed manufacturers are forced to use the proper logos to not misrepresent the teams? In that case the Marlins could say that Majestic isn't sticking to the style guide and I'm sure that violates something. Dimelo Miami! Print your logo correctly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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