NFL Merry-Go-Round: Relocation Roundelay

[bosrs1]

They'll have to drip that request - they're not getting it from any of the teams likely to relocate.

I thought that was the difference between AEG and Roski's group, who had previously made a controlling interest a condition of the stadium.

That was the difference publicly. AEG had stated they had no problem taking a minority stake. However apparently there was more underneath that assertion than we were led to believe. And if they don't back off that it will be hard for them to get a team signed up by next summer. Particularly their apparently favorite target the Chargers.

[BBTV]

Are there any "successful" teams that don't own (or at least operate) their own stadium? I'm not sure what each team's situation is, just curious.

[The_Admiral]

It's much more common in football than in basketball/hockey, where venue ownership is the reason for the season. Off the top of my head, the Chicago Park District owns/operates Soldier Field (the extent to which the Bears are successful is highly debatable), New Jersey owns the Meadowlands, and Green Bay owns Lambeau. I think we'd find that the majority of NFL stadiums are owned by cities, states, or those insidious "stadium authorities" rather than by the teams themselves.

[BBTV]

It's much more common in football than in basketball/hockey, where venue ownership is the reason for the season. Off the top of my head, the Chicago Park District owns/operates Soldier Field (the extent to which the Bears are successful is highly debatable), New Jersey owns the Meadowlands, and Green Bay owns Lambeau. I think we'd find that the majority of NFL stadiums are owned by cities, states, or those insidious "stadium authorities" rather than by the teams themselves.

I guess when I say "successful", I guess I mean as far as generating revenue as much (if not more) as winning. A team like the Redskins, who always suck, but generate tons of revenue and are always able to fork out the large signing bonuses to attract FAs would be an example, as would the Eagles, who are in very much the same situation except that they actually win.

In the Eagles case, nobody knows who actually "owns" the stadium - it's a huge gray area - but they operate it and take all of the revenue, as well as negotiate with colleges and anyone else who wants to use it, so for all intents and purposes they own it, which (along with the benefits of being in a huge market) accounts for their position as one of the top revenue generating teams. I can't image that it'd be the same story if they were paying a huge lease to a private entity who was keeping all or most of the stadium-related revenue.

[bosrs1]

Are there any "successful" teams that don't own (or at least operate) their own stadium? I'm not sure what each team's situation is, just curious.

Yes, all of them. Every NFL team is making money hand over fist, even the Jaguars.

[BBTV]

Are there any "successful" teams that don't own (or at least operate) their own stadium? I'm not sure what each team's situation is, just curious.

Yes, all of them. Every NFL team is making money hand over fist, even the Jaguars.

So no NFL teams own or operate their own stadiums? You either didn't read my question, or you're just flat out wrong. Also, can we at least attempt to quantify "hand over fist"? Seems to me that there's a big problem in Jacksonville, and a part of it has to do with their stadium arrangement.

[The_Admiral]

Sounds like the Eagles have all the benefits of owning the stadium without having to pay property taxes on it (thus the benefits of renting without actually paying rent). Nice work if you can get it.

[Brian in Boston]

So a few more details coming out of San Diego today. Apparently what AEG is looking for is deal to buy a minority stake in a team now (ie: in the next 12 months) and get the agreement to move to LA. But they also would like to have that minority stake become an option to buy a controlling stake within 5 years.

Where is a quote from any AEG executive corroborating this point? Tim Leiweke, AEG president and point-man on the LA stadium plan, has confirmed that Phil Anschutz has "interest in purchasing a majority share" of an NFL team relocating to the proposed downtown LA stadium. Interest. Leiweke has stated that Anschutz is "prepared to acquire majority ownership in an NFL franchise in order to bring a team to Farmers Field". Prepared. What neither Mr. Leiweke or Mr. Anschutz has said is that construction of Farmers Field is dependent upon AEG obtaining such a majority share. Dependent. In point of fact, they've always maintained that they'd be happy with a minority stake.

This is much ado about nothing. Frankly, it is likely a case of San Diego-based media members grasping at straws and creating a hoped-for stumbling-block in the path of a possible Chargers' move.

Bottom line? Would Anschutz like to own a majority stake of an NFL team calling Farmers Field home? Yes. Would he prefer such a scenario. He very well might. Has he - or, Leiweke - ever made a majority ownership stake in an NFL franchise a prerequisite for moving forward on the Farmers Field project? No, and there's no reason to believe that's the case.

[McCall]

So a few more details coming out of San Diego today. Apparently what AEG is looking for is deal to buy a minority stake in a team now (ie: in the next 12 months) and get the agreement to move to LA. But they also would like to have that minority stake become an option to buy a controlling stake within 5 years.

Where is a quote from any AEG executive corroborating this point? Tim Leiweke, AEG president and point-man on the LA stadium plan, has confirmed that Phil Anschutz has "interest in purchasing a majority share" of an NFL team relocating to the proposed downtown LA stadium. Interest. Leiweke has stated that Anschutz is "prepared to acquire majority ownership in an NFL franchise in order to bring a team to Farmers Field". Prepared. What neither Mr. Leiweke or Mr. Anschutz has said is that construction of Farmers Field is dependent upon AEG obtaining such a majority share. Dependent. In point of fact, they've always maintained that they'd be happy with a minority stake.

This is much ado about nothing. Frankly, it is likely a case of San Diego-based media members grasping at straws and creating a hoped-for stumbling-block in the path of a possible Chargers' move.

Bottom line? Would Anschutz like to own a majority stake of an NFL team calling Farmers Field home? Yes. Would he prefer such a scenario. He very well might. Has he - or, Leiweke - ever made a majority ownership stake in an NFL franchise a prerequisite for moving forward on the Farmers Field project? No, and there's no reason to believe that's the case.

Especially with the Chargers. Being the only current SoCal team, I would think the potential of such an immediate high turn out and support from fans would be too much to pass up simply coz they can't own the team. I would assume they'd try and negotiate a stake, but in the end would rather get a prime tenant in there.

[ZapRowsdower8]

This is a stupid question and really jumping the gun, but for those of you familiar with the SoCal area, what percentage of current Chargers season ticket holders do you think would reup if the team moved to L.A. and travel the 2 hours to see them 8 times a year?

[vmd9]

This is a stupid question and really jumping the gun, but for those of you familiar with the SoCal area, what percentage of current Chargers season ticket holders do you think would reup if the team moved to L.A. and travel the 2 hours to see them 8 times a year?

I don't think 2 hours is a big deal. I can't speak for Chargers fans, but I know when I lived in Erie, PA there was a large Browns fanbase in Northwestern PA and most of them went to Cleveland for every game. I feel like it would be easier in CA because they wouldn't have to deal with the horrible Ohio/PA winters.

[bosrs1]

This is a stupid question and really jumping the gun, but for those of you familiar with the SoCal area, what percentage of current Chargers season ticket holders do you think would reup if the team moved to L.A. and travel the 2 hours to see them 8 times a year?

They'd keep less than half would be my estimate based on talking to folks down here. A large number of Chargers fans just don't have that big of an interest in supporting a team that leaves town and even worse a team in LA. That said I'm sure they'd keep a few that just don't care. And that ignores the pain in the butt logistics of driving from SD to LA thanks to the traffic.

[Still MIGHTY]

This is a stupid question and really jumping the gun, but for those of you familiar with the SoCal area, what percentage of current Chargers season ticket holders do you think would reup if the team moved to L.A. and travel the 2 hours to see them 8 times a year?

They'd keep less than half would be my estimate based on talking to folks down here. A large number of Chargers fans just don't have that big of an interest in supporting a team that leaves town and even worse a team in LA. That said I'm sure they'd keep a few that just don't care. And that ignores the pain in the butt logistics of driving from SD to LA thanks to the traffic.

Yeah I'd say that's accurate.

And really you can take the train from SD to LA just as well. Like I said before, I used to take the train from OC (San Juan Capistrano) down to Old Town SD, then take the trolley to Qualcomm. Hell, Amtrak actually had a special package for the football games if I remember right. You could do the same going from SD to LA. Take the train to Union Station and I know that there is a bus or shuttle that goes to Staples/LA Live. I'm sure that when there's a football team there they could have a more regular shuttle schedule on gamedays.

[Gothamite]

Makes sense - Union Station is about two miles from the downtown stadium location.

[FiddySicks]

This is a stupid question and really jumping the gun, but for those of you familiar with the SoCal area, what percentage of current Chargers season ticket holders do you think would reup if the team moved to L.A. and travel the 2 hours to see them 8 times a year?

They'd keep less than half would be my estimate based on talking to folks down here. A large number of Chargers fans just don't have that big of an interest in supporting a team that leaves town and even worse a team in LA. That said I'm sure they'd keep a few that just don't care. And that ignores the pain in the butt logistics of driving from SD to LA thanks to the traffic.

Yeah I'd say that's accurate.

And really you can take the train from SD to LA just as well. Like I said before, I used to take the train from OC (San Juan Capistrano) down to Old Town SD, then take the trolley to Qualcomm. Hell, Amtrak actually had a special package for the football games if I remember right. You could do the same going from SD to LA. Take the train to Union Station and I know that there is a bus or shuttle that goes to Staples/LA Live. I'm sure that when there's a football team there they could have a more regular shuttle schedule on gamedays.

I've done that from Irvine to Old Town and it really was a great way to go to a game. I'd still suspect that a TON of Charger season ticket holders would bail out if they moved due to travel logistics, but it wouldn't even matter. Considering the Chargers are already the local team, will be in a WAY bigger market, and in a new stadium, they'd resell those tickets to people closer to LA faster than they'd get the cancellations processed.

[Gothamite]

True enough. Whatever they lost in SD season ticket holders they'd pick up again soon enough in LA fans.

[Brian in Boston]

I'm sure AEG is assuming that a majority of fans for a relocated Chargers franchise would be based in Los Angeles, Orange and Riverside Counties. That said, when it comes to retaining current San Diego-based Chargers season-ticket-holders, extremely wealthy patrons are the folks that AEG will target should the Bolts move to Farmers Field. You can bet that the marketing materials for luxury condos, hotel suites and time-shares are already being prepared in advance of a full-bore "Make A Weekend of It" sales pitch. A significant part of AEG's plans for the Staples Center/L.A. Live/Farmers Field/Convention Center district involves ancillary development of condominiums and hotels. If wealthy San Diegans on weekend football junkets are filling space in said structures, so be it.

[Gothamite]

Meanwhile, Ed Roski and the Industry plan are trying to stay in the headlines.

[bosrs1]

Meanwhile, Ed Roski and the Industry plan are trying to stay in the headlines.

Honestly I still think Roski's plan has it's merits. Particularly in a place like LA where "downtown" really isn't "downtown." Plus Roski's site does have the tailgating advantage which, let's face it, really is part of the NFL fan experience (particularly in California). The downtown stadium would eliminate that in favor of ESPNZones and Wolfgang Puck, which frankly aren't the kind of overpriced establishments NFL fans want. And this completely ignores the fact Roski could start building tomorrow if a team signed up with him vs the downtown stadium which will undoubtedly hit snags with the public financing and the inevitable lawsuits.

[Gothamite]

Oh, I agree. And as you note, he's much closer to being able to deliver.

But AEG's really good at the PR game, and they've sucked all the oxygen out of the room at the moment. I'm sure they haven't stopped working behind the scenes, and it's smart of Roski to keep the public appearances up as well.