2022-23 MLB offseason thread

[floydnimrod]

I don't know why we have to be gatekeepers of who gets in the Hall of Fame. I love the whole Hall of Fame process and I find it fascinating, especially as it shifted into electing guys that I saw play. I want Rolen in there. Wagner and Helton, too. Put all the borderline guys in. Celebrate the game before it's dead. We could induct Kenny Lofton and Alex Ochoa tomorrow and I couldn't give less of a :censored:.

[gosioux76]

53 minutes ago, floydnimrod said:

I don't know why we have to be gatekeepers of who gets in the Hall of Fame. I love the whole Hall of Fame process and I find it fascinating, especially as it shifted into electing guys that I saw play. I want Rolen in there. Wagner and Helton, too. Put all the borderline guys in. Celebrate the game before it's dead. We could induct Kenny Lofton and Alex Ochoa tomorrow and I couldn't give less of a :censored:.

 

But in a way, this current system could be viewed as healthy for the game.

 

It's the offseason, we're a month away from spring training beginning, yet every year the HOF issue elicits deeply argued conversations about the validity of whoever got voted in, breaking down that players credentials in comparison with others who were overlooked. 

 

I saw a guy on my Facebook feed write damn near 1,000 words on why Rolen isn't nearly as deserving as the long-overlooked Dave Parker. 

 

Personally, I don't care that much about it. But the veracity of the debate has people talking baseball in the middle of winter. The sport would be missing out if everybody agreed on the process instead of obsessing over how wrong they got it. 

[gosioux76]

9 hours ago, who do you think said:

 

Philly fans have always been a notoriously tough crowd.

 

Yeah, but mostly just in parking lots when they throw things at opposing fans.

[floydnimrod]

9 minutes ago, gosioux76 said:

 

But in a way, this current system could be viewed as healthy for the game.

 

It's the offseason, we're a month away from spring training beginning, yet every year the HOF issue elicits deeply argued conversations about the validity of whoever got voted in, breaking down that players credentials in comparison with others who were overlooked. 

 

I saw a guy on my Facebook feed write damn near 1,000 words on why Rolen isn't nearly as deserving as the long-overlooked Dave Parker. 

 

Personally, I don't care that much about it. But the veracity of the debate has people talking baseball in the middle of winter. The sport would be missing out if everybody agreed on the process instead of obsessing over how wrong they got it. 

The debate part of this is dumbest part!

 

I can't think of a good reason to write a thousand words on this unless I had a vote.

 

I'd honestly be the worst HoF voter of all-time because I would have voted for Sammy Sosa every year, but not Bonds, Clemens, or McGwire.

[gosioux76]

6 minutes ago, floydnimrod said:

I can't think of a good reason to write a thousand words on this unless I had a vote.

 

The people who do that are the ones who give a damn, which is kind of the point. It stirs up debate, which keeps the game front and center at a time when it otherwise might not be. You might think it's dumb, but here you are engaging on the topic. 

[Sport]

17 hours ago, infrared41 said:

 

My reaction will more likely be "who?" because I stopped following MLB about 4 years ago.  Advanced stats may improve your chances of winning or whatever stupid bull- they're supposed to do, but they have sucked every bit of enjoyment out of watching a game.

 

This is what I think of when I see "where actual value in baseball comes from"...

 

• Left handed hitters constantly grounding out to right field
• Strike outs and more strikeouts. And then some more strike outs
• Walks
• Home runs and not much else
• More guys hitting .210 than .280, but hey, their OBP+WAR x Velocity Angle + (y) = Exit velocity x Spin means they might accidentally make contact and accidentally hit a home run so screw the guy who consistently puts the ball in play. Three true outcomes or die, bitches!
• Pitchers who are trying to throw the ball as hard as they can instead of actually, you know, pitching
• A sport where players like Tony Gwynn and Rod Carew would have never made the big leagues
• A sport where a guy like Dave Kingman would now be a superstar

Baseball went from being fun to being like watching a spreadsheet take place in a stadium and you can keep it. I'm not wasting 4 and a half hours of my time watching a game of Microsoft Office Baseball.

 

 

I agree with all of this. I watched fewer than 20 games last year, which would've amazed 2012 me. That was mostly because our Silver Spoon dumbass owner dared me not to watch, but still I wasn't really tuning into any other games around the league. I've tried to get into Ohtani and some other star players and for whatever reason I just don't care anymore.

 

I think the worst thing about baseball right now is so many of the teams aren't doing all they can to win. You have teams in contention who are selling trade pieces at the deadline, actively not trying to make the playoffs. That's a huge problem. Imagine if the Ravens, Steelers, and Browns had done nothing to improve this offseason in order to win a very winnable division. That's the NL Central right now! 4 teams are going to just give it to the Cardinals. 

 

I felt a little bit melancholy when Rolen news came out because it reminded me of the last time the Reds mattered as a civic institution here. Now they feel like an outdated business that you can't believe people still use. Like Jai Alai or a travel agency or something. 

 

 

15 hours ago, ManillaToad said:

 

"Who cares?" is a great mentality to have when putting together a Hall of Fame

 

 

it's my mentality because none of this is serious business. It's just sports. 

 

18 hours ago, BBTV said:

And if you don't think that playing in Philadelphia or New York or Boston is harder than playing in St. Louis or Cincinnati, I just don't know what to tell you.

The extent to which it matters is WAY overblown. Especially by you. I don't know where you got this idea that a guy good enough to make the hall of fame would only able to do it because he didn't have to play in a pressure cooker market, but it's really dumb. I don't know where you got this perception that cities outside of the Northeast are cultureless tumbelweed farms. None of these cities are Cousinfukk, Arkansas, they still have to deal with fan backlash, annoying media questions, and the pressure of performing because the difference between millions and the minors is like 3 hits a week. Also their opponents are the same major leaguers they'd see if they played in New York or Boston. The game's hard everywhere even if you're not being harrassed by 45,000 BBTVs every night. 

 

 

[infrared41]

2 hours ago, Sport said:

Cousinfukk, Arkansas

 

Outstanding.

 

Side Note: If anyone is wondering, Cousinfukk, Arkansas is about 20 miles east of  Left Nut, Arkansas.

[BBTV]

3 hours ago, Sport said:

Cousinfukk, Arkansas

 

I'd support their expansion bid.  Hell - I'd support their Olympic bid.

 

 

3 hours ago, Sport said:

you're not being harrassed by 45,000 BBTVs every night.

 

I don't harass players at games.

[crashcarson15]

4 hours ago, floydnimrod said:

I don't know why we have to be gatekeepers of who gets in the Hall of Fame. I love the whole Hall of Fame process and I find it fascinating, especially as it shifted into electing guys that I saw play. I want Rolen in there. Wagner and Helton, too. Put all the borderline guys in. Celebrate the game before it's dead. We could induct Kenny Lofton and Alex Ochoa tomorrow and I couldn't give less of a :censored:.

I don't know whether either of them should be in the Hall or not, but guys like Jim Edmonds and Kenny Lofton being one-and-done on the ballot is one of the worst byproducts of the BBWAA's dick-measuring contest the last decade on Bonds, Clemens, etc.

 

I'm happy that Scott Rolen got through his first year and got a fair shot at his candidacy. I think it's very cool and fine that he's going into the Hall.

[BBTV]

Regarding the HOF not being a big deal:

 

Baseball is the only sport where I thought that the HOF was a big deal.  It's also the only sport where there used to be magic numbers: 300 wins, 500 HRs, 600 HRs, 714/755 HR, 60/61 HR 3,000 hits, 4,192 hits, etc.

Then Bonds et al made a mockery of the numbers and made it more like football where the old records get bypassed all the time because of rule changes, park changes (in baseball, not football), PEDs, etc.  So I guess that since all the things that made baseball "different" to me are kinda gone now, the HOF shouldn't matter anymore either.

 

It's not on the path of becoming the pro basketball HOF, where I might get in someday despite never having played organized basketball at any level, but the sport itself (like @infrared41 said) is changing, so I guess either I need to change, or just stop caring.

[The_Admiral]

I'm fine with Rolen getting in and Helton out. Helton always just felt like kind of a sideshow attraction: guy who's probably juiced hits lots of home runs for a bad team in Denver. Doesn't mean much to baseball, in my opinion.

[FiddySicks]

20 hours ago, infrared41 said:

 

All due respect, I take WAR almost as seriously as I took Tank's annual suicide threats. That aside, my point was that Williams and Rolen are essentially the same player. And neither of them are Hall of Famers.

I say this as someone who grew up in the Carson City area and played the majority of my high school baseball games at Matt Williams Field: 

 

Oh, come on. 

[Sec19Row53]

4 minutes ago, FiddySicks said:

I say this as someone who grew up in the Carson City area and played the majority of my high school baseball games at Matt Williams Field: 

 

Oh, come on. 

Arguments don't get much more compelling than that 

[infrared41]

26 minutes ago, FiddySicks said:

I say this as someone who grew up in the Carson City area and played the majority of my high school baseball games at Matt Williams Field: 

 

Oh, come on. 

 

Well argued.

[McCall]

1 hour ago, infrared41 said:

 

Outstanding.

 

Side Note: If anyone is wondering, Cousinfukk, Arkansas is about 20 miles east of  Left Nut, Arkansas.

It's also around the corner from Dabutt, Arkansas.

[McCall]

45 minutes ago, FiddySicks said:

I say this as someone who grew up in the Carson City area and played the majority of my high school baseball games at Matt Williams Field: 

 

Oh, come on. 

[TrueYankee26]

Chip Caray confirmed as Cardinals’ new play-by-play announcer

 

https://fox2now.com/sports/st-louis-cardinals/chip-caray-confirmed-as-cardinals-new-play-by-play-announcer/

[infrared41]

Someone is stealing your ideas @BBTV.

 

 

[BBTV]

Not sure if I should be flattered, or get my lawyer on line 1.

 

My lawyer:

[BBTV]

Was unable to find the first proposal of the "gorilla rule" (which I think started in my NFL plan, but eventually did make it to MLB and Soccer), but this made me chuckle: