"Official" 2007 College Football Thread

[slightly shotgunned]

Every team involved in this played the schedule they were given. Nothing can be done about that. Is the BCS a disaster this year? Yes. But none of that changes the fact that, playoff or not, Missouri, LSU, and West Virginia couldn't take care of business when they had to. A playoff doesn't suddenly make these teams better than they were before they lost games they needed to win. The scenario was simple, win and you're in. They didn't.

The truth is that playoff advocates aren't going to be happy no matter what the outcome is at the end of a season. There will always be some team that "backed in" or some team getting screwed etc. Once we get a 4 team playoff there will be those that bitch because the 5-8 teams played "tougher schedules" or had "better losses" or something. When it hits 8 or 16 teams there will be those that bitch because the MAC or C-USA had a team that went 12-0 and beat a BCS team but can't take a shot at the title (2006 Boise State or 2007 Hawaii.) Until it hits 32 teams there will always be some sort of argument against how the selections are made or who got screwed etc.

So here's my suggestion. Make the regular season 8 games long and go to a 64 team tournament that starts the second week of November. That should do the trick for most everyone.

wrong. the playoff advocates aren't mad about the number of teams that get into a playoff. the playoff advocates are mad about the voting that takes place to determine who the best teams are. there is no place for a vote in sports. any sports.

[McCall]

Okay, yes, we got our @$$#$ handed to us by Oklahoma last night. Congrats to them. They certainly were and are the best team in the Big XII.

But there is not a single valid argument that can be made for Kansas to get the 2nd Big XII BCS Bowl slot over us.

Yes they only lost 1 game, but to MIZZOU. We lost 2 games, but both to OKLAHOMA, including one in the Conference Title game. A game Kansas didn't make it to, because, oh yeah, they lost to MIZZOU.

If you play for your conference title and are ranked within the top 10 or 12, you should automatically get the 2nd spot. Also, considering the fact, that we were #1 going into this game. Plus Kansas played a softer schedule.

There were 3 teams ranked in the top 10 (and at one point all in the top 5) in the BCS from the Big 12. Out of those 3, Kansas was the only one not to win a game against one of the other 2. Oklahoma was 2-0, they're the best in the Conference, no doubt. We were 1-2, with both losses at the hands of OU, the best in the conf. Kansas was 0-1, with that loss to MIZZOU. And Kansas was idle this past week, while Mizzou was, what?, playing for the Conference Championship!!!

Therefore, it makes no sense for them to get the 2nd spot. It'd be one thing if Mizzou was a 3 or 4 loss team who lost all non-conf. games, but won all their Big 12 games to take the North and play for the title while being ranked around 15th or below. Then a Non-Title Playing team with a high BCS ranking, such as Kansas, could be justified in taking the second spot from a much lower-ranked, higher loss total 2nd place Conference team. But that's not the case here.

It goes the same with the LSU/Georgia fiasco. While I may rather see Georgia play for the Nat'l Title, LSU won the SEC, while Georgia didn't even win their division.

How the BCS can use all these polls and computers to decide BCS Match-ups, but can't use simple COMMON SENSE, is beyond me. And is another reason why this system needs some serious fixing.

[Gary]

My BCS Picks

Championship - Ohio State vs. LSU

Rose Bowl - USC vs. Illinois

Fiesta Bowl - Oklahoma vs. Hawaii

Orange Bowl - Virginia Tech vs. West Virginia

Sugar Bowl - Georgia vs. Kansas

I'll agree with that, assuming Hawaii is top 12. If Hawaii is not top 12, please sub out Hawaii and replace with Arizona State. (And no, this isn't as simple as win and they're in, I think that Hawaii might still fall out of the top 12 even with a win.)

Agree with you on Hawaii being replaced by Arizona State which could happen since Hawaii is losing to UW.

I think the Fiesta Bowl will more likely go with Arizona State and Oklahoma and Hawaii looking for another bowl game. Arizona State is a local favorite and the Fiesta Bowl would love for the Sun Devils to be in the Fiesta Bowl

[jkrdevil]

Every team involved in this played the schedule they were given. Nothing can be done about that. Is the BCS a disaster this year? Yes. But none of that changes the fact that, playoff or not, Missouri, LSU, and West Virginia couldn't take care of business when they had to. A playoff doesn't suddenly make these teams better than they were before they lost games they needed to win. The scenario was simple, win and you're in. They didn't.

The truth is that playoff advocates aren't going to be happy no matter what the outcome is at the end of a season. There will always be some team that "backed in" or some team getting screwed etc. Once we get a 4 team playoff there will be those that bitch because the 5-8 teams played "tougher schedules" or had "better losses" or something. When it hits 8 or 16 teams there will be those that bitch because the MAC or C-USA had a team that went 12-0 and beat a BCS team but can't take a shot at the title (2006 Boise State or 2007 Hawaii.) Until it hits 32 teams there will always be some sort of argument against how the selections are made or who got screwed etc.

So here's my suggestion. Make the regular season 8 games long and go to a 64 team tournament that starts the second week of November. That should do the trick for most everyone.

wrong. the playoff advocates aren't mad about the number of teams that get into a playoff. the playoff advocates are mad about the voting that takes place to determine who the best teams are. there is no place for a vote in sports. any sports.

Agreed which is why College Football needs to go to a 16 team tournament and not anything less. With this tournament each conference champion gets an automatic bid. The remaining 5 bids goes to the 5 remaining teams with the best record with strength of schedule as the tie-breaker. That way it is fair and human opinion is not used to determine who gets in and who is out. Those who get left out can't complain because the should have 1.) won their conference or 2.) put together a tougher schedule.

By the way if a 0 loss Hawaii team gets passed over for a 2 loss team it will be a joke. Of course that will happen because the whole system is in fact joke. A sports championship shouldn't rely on the opinion of biased humans most if not all have an agenda.

[infrared41]

wrong. the playoff advocates aren't mad about the number of teams that get into a playoff. the playoff advocates are mad about the voting that takes place to determine who the best teams are. there is no place for a vote in sports. any sports.

So you've been appointed spokesman for the playoff advocates? I don't think you even care. I think you just like -ing with me. But I'll address your argument...

Bull- . You know that a 4 team playoff will only lead to the argument that 5-8 deserve a shot and son on. If there were a 4 team playoff in place you know that USC and Virginia tech fans would be having a fit because they weren't going to be in it and Georgia would be. So then we'd have to listen to guys like you complain until it was expanded to 8 teams. Then we'd get to hear from Hawaii fans. They won their conference blah blah blah...Then Florida fans would chime in and ask how Kansas can get in when they didn't play anyone while The Gators played an SEC schedule... Then guys like you would bitch some more and we'd get a 16 team playoff. And we'd get to hear from The MAC, C-USA, The WAC etc. on how it's so unfair that Central Michigan went 12-0 and won their conference yet they can't get in the playoff because the big schools control everything etc. So guys like you would whine some more and before we know it we're right where I said we'd be in the post you responded to in the first place...

An 8 game regular season with a 64 team tournament. I am advocating the ultimate playoff. It makes the regular season even more meaningful and it puts all the bowls in play. It can't miss. So your point was?

And there would still be voting involved. I think those shotguns are clouding your perceptions. A playoff wouldn't eliminate voting, no matter how many teams we go to.

Black. Up. Light.

[JQK]

The two best teams in College football right now is USC and LSU. We won't get to see that matchup because of the way this "system" is configured.

"Choosing" who the best is is not the way sports should be, you have to earn the right to be called the best. Every other NCAA sport does it, NCAA Football from Division I-AA to Division III has a playoff. It's just fustrating to see a season like this, a season PERFECTLY set up for a playoff system, and it's wasted because people want to hold on tho these Bowls that have seriously lost all significance.

[Brian in Boston]

What's truly maddening about the entire situation surrounding the Football Bowl Subdivision/BCS Championship format is that the powers-that-be don't need to create some unique system in order to more equitably crown a champion. They simply need to adopt the format that already exists - and works - at the Football Championship Subdivision level.

Sixteen teams make the playoffs. The playoff field and seeding are determined by a combination of regular season poll results and - possibly, if so desired - automatic berths going to conference champions. Four weeks and fifteen games later a true national champion is determined based upon what teams were capable of doing on the field in the playoffs. Period.

If the lesser lights of college football in a given season wish to play in bowl games outside of the playoff structure, so be it. Said bowls could be akin to the role that the post-season NIT plays in collerge basketball. Whether communities, chambers-of-commerce and bowl committees around the country will want to continue hosting such games - or, find it financially lucrative to do so - when faced with the prospect of fading into the shadows created by a true playoff... well, that remains to be seen. If the bowls can't survive, that will be the reality of the marketplace. So be it.

And please, spare me all of the "every game/week is a playoff" nonsense that the FBS/Division 1-A coaches, athletic directors and administrators spout whenever the current BCS format is challenged. Bull! If that were the case, Hawaii would be the national champions. LSU would have been knocked out of consideration with a loss to Arkansas... Ohio State would have been knocked out of consideration with a loss to Illinois... and so on down the line.

Bottom line? The time has come for the top level of college football to get in line with the way that champions are determined in every other level of NCAA football: a playoff.

[infrared41]

The two best teams in College football right now is USC and LSU. We won't get to see that matchup because of the way this "system" is configured.

Isn't that essentially the same type of subjective observation that got The BCS in trouble in the first place?

Just wondering. Oh and for the record, a playoff would hardly guarantee that matchup.

[jkrdevil]

And there would still be voting involved. I think those shotguns are clouding your perceptions. A playoff wouldn't eliminate voting, no matter how many teams we go to.

Black. Up. Light.

Well if you read my post would see there is a possible solution to where you can get a 16 team field without human voting with the exception of seeding, which is different because it doesn't determine who is in or out. Just go by conference champions and team records using a strength of schedule formula as a tie-breaker. I have come up with the possible "playoff field" for the last few years using this method and the at large went to the big conference schools and the smaller conference ones didn't have the records to get an at large. It would still keep the regular season meaningful because 2 losses would mean a team is on the bubble. As for your argument that the no one would watch the early rounds that is bull. Sure they may get a lower audience and those games would probably be on ESPN but they would draw a significant audience because it is a tournament game. You have to realize there is a difference between a early regular season game and a game that is a playoff game. This is to no mention there would some first round match-ups that would be close and draw in a bigger audience.

Would some teams and coaches bitch still. Yes people will always bitch however their complaints won't be as legitimate as they are currently because the criteria for making the tournament is set in advance and is straight forward and doesn't involve politics or the ridiculous notion of "style points."

BTW so one would get a better understanding on how my system works I am currently drawing up the field now since the season is over and the numbers are available. When I'm done I'll post it.

[BlueSky]

No BCS yet, but the AP and USA TODAY polls are out and share the same top 5:

1. Ohio State

2. LSU

3. Oklahoma

4. Georgia

5. Virginia Tech

Missouri fell to #7 in one and #8 in the other.

[infrared41]

Well if you read my post would see there is a possible solution to where you can get a 16 team field without human voting with the exception of seeding, which is different because it doesn't determine who is in or out. Just go by conference champions and team records using a strength of schedule formula as a tie-breaker. I have come up with the possible "playoff field" for the last few years using this method and the at large went to the big conference schools and the smaller conference ones didn't have the records to get an at large. It would still keep the regular season meaningful because 2 losses would mean a team is on the bubble. As for your argument that the no one would watch the early rounds that is bull. Sure they may get a lower audience and those games would probably be on ESPN but they would draw a significant audience because it is a tournament game. You have to realize there is a difference between a early regular season game and a game that is a playoff game. This is to no mention there would some first round match-ups that would be close and draw in a bigger audience.

Would some teams and coaches bitch still. Yes people will always bitch however their complaints won't be as legitimate as they are currently because the criteria for making the tournament is set in advance and is straight forward and doesn't involve politics or the ridiculous notion of "style points."

BTW so one would get a better understanding on how my system works I am currently drawing up the field now since the season is over and the numbers are available. When I'm done I'll post it.

There are a lot of plans similar to yours. It's a good idea but you're leaving out the key element that makes it impossible; money. I went over this in great detail in the BCS Playoff thread so I'll give the quick version here. I don't believe that the big conferences or network TV will ever go for a plan that guarantees a spot to every conference champion. Networks want the schools that pull big ratings. Small conference schools don't do that. So every year you'd be giving 5 spots to teams like CMU or Troy and every year 5 teams like Ohio State or Texas or Florida would be staying home. The money and the power won't allow that. They'll want a BCS style system of picking teams so the big schools always make up the most possible spots in the field. Your plan is fine but it's unrealistic. Money will always be the first consideration in any playoff plan. It's precisely why we have the system we have.

[jkrdevil]

There are a lot of plans similar to yours. It's a good idea but you're leaving out the key element that makes it impossible; money. I went over this in great detail in the BCS Playoff thread so I'll give the quick version here. I don't believe that the big conferences or network TV will ever go for a plan that guarantees a spot to every conference champion. Networks want the schools that pull big ratings. Small conference schools don't do that. So every year you'd be giving 5 spots to teams like CMU or Troy and every year 5 teams like Ohio State or Texas or Florida would be staying home. The money and the power won't allow that. They'll want a BCS style system of picking teams so the big schools always make up the most possible spots in the field. Your plan is fine but it's unrealistic. Money will always be the first consideration in any playoff plan. It's precisely why we have the system we have.

That may be true which is why my idea which I admit is ideal would have to be forced somehow. Still you can go with a system where it's just the top 8 teams by record with strength of schedule as tie-breaker. Again no human voting to determine who gets in and out.

As for my original 16 team playoff format here it is. I got lucky as there were only 4 two loss non-champion teams team ans 1 one loss non champion team so no tie-breaker is needed they all got in as at large. For seeding I went by the AP Rankings however that did no determine who got into the tournament or who was left out. It just determined who plays who. Here are the match ups. Reseed after each round.

1. Ohio State (11-1, Big Ten Champs)

16. Central Michigan (8-5, Mac Champs)

2. LSU (11-2, SEC Champs)

15. Troy (8-4, Sun Belt Champs)

3. Oklahoma (11-2, Big 12 Champs)

14. UCF (10-3, CUSA Champs)

4. Georgia (10-2, At-Large)

13. Boise State (10-2, At-Large)

5. Virginia Tech (11-2, ACC Champs)

12. BYU (10-2, Mountain West Champs)

6. USC (10-2, PAC-10 Champs)

11. Arizona State (10-2, At-large)

7. Missouri (11-2, At-Large)

10. West Virginia (10-2, Big East Champs)

8. Kansas (11-1, At-large)

9. Hawaii (12-0, WAC Champions)

To me that would be fun to watch. With exception of the Ohio State and LSU games all of those games can be won by either team playing. But still as mentioned it will probably be never adopted but to me this is the best system.

[Seadragon76]

I'm reading jrdevil's bracket and I'm thinking 'Didn't Florida Atlantic win the Sun Belt by beating Troy?'

Anyway, if anything a sixteen team playoff also guarentees that the best team wins. The best team isn't always the number one team in the polls, as Northern Iowa proved yesterday in their loss to Delaware. It's about what have you done for me lately.

[See Red]

Any system which has Sun Belt and MAC teams in a playoff playing for a National Title has some serious flaws.

[OMMF]

My BCS Picks

Championship - Ohio State vs. LSU

Rose Bowl - USC vs. Illinois

Fiesta Bowl - Oklahoma vs. Hawaii

Orange Bowl - Virginia Tech vs. West Virginia

Sugar Bowl - Georgia vs. Kansas

I'll agree with that, assuming Hawaii is top 12. If Hawaii is not top 12, please sub out Hawaii and replace with Arizona State. (And no, this isn't as simple as win and they're in, I think that Hawaii might still fall out of the top 12 even with a win.)

Agree with you on Hawaii being replaced by Arizona State which could happen since Hawaii is losing to UW.

I think the Fiesta Bowl will more likely go with Arizona State and Oklahoma and Hawaii looking for another bowl game. Arizona State is a local favorite and the Fiesta Bowl would love for the Sun Devils to be in the Fiesta Bowl

As was pointed out last night on the broadcast, choosing ASU for the Fiesta Bowl doesn't make much financial sense. The ASU fans will be sleeping in their own beds instead of expensive hotel rooms, driving their own cars instead of renting them and making their own meals instead of eating at restaurants. It's, imo, much better for the town and the game to have a team whose fans have to come a little further than down the street to attend.

[WJMorris3]

There are a lot of plans similar to yours. It's a good idea but you're leaving out the key element that makes it impossible; money. I went over this in great detail in the BCS Playoff thread so I'll give the quick version here. I don't believe that the big conferences or network TV will ever go for a plan that guarantees a spot to every conference champion. Networks want the schools that pull big ratings. Small conference schools don't do that. So every year you'd be giving 5 spots to teams like CMU or Troy and every year 5 teams like Ohio State or Texas or Florida would be staying home. The money and the power won't allow that. They'll want a BCS style system of picking teams so the big schools always make up the most possible spots in the field. Your plan is fine but it's unrealistic. Money will always be the first consideration in any playoff plan. It's precisely why we have the system we have.

That may be true which is why my idea which I admit is ideal would have to be forced somehow. Still you can go with a system where it's just the top 8 teams by record with strength of schedule as tie-breaker. Again no human voting to determine who gets in and out.

As for my original 16 team playoff format here it is. I got lucky as there were only 4 two loss non-champion teams team ans 1 one loss non champion team so no tie-breaker is needed they all got in as at large. For seeding I went by the AP Rankings however that did no determine who got into the tournament or who was left out. It just determined who plays who. Here are the match ups. Reseed after each round.

1. Ohio State (11-1, Big Ten Champs)

16. Central Michigan (8-5, Mac Champs)

2. LSU (11-2, SEC Champs)

15. Troy (8-4, Sun Belt Champs)

3. Oklahoma (11-2, Big 12 Champs)

14. UCF (10-3, CUSA Champs)

4. Georgia (10-2, At-Large)

13. Boise State (10-2, At-Large)

5. Virginia Tech (11-2, ACC Champs)

12. BYU (10-2, Mountain West Champs)

6. USC (10-2, PAC-10 Champs)

11. Arizona State (10-2, At-large)

7. Missouri (11-2, At-Large)

10. West Virginia (10-2, Big East Champs)

8. Kansas (11-1, At-large)

9. Hawaii (12-0, WAC Champions)

To me that would be fun to watch. With exception of the Ohio State and LSU games all of those games can be won by either team playing. But still as mentioned it will probably be never adopted but to me this is the best system.

Point of order, Troy did not win the Sun Belt, Florida Atlantic did.

[WJMorris3]

The only projection I will make is that there will be only one unbeaten team in the nation going into the bowls, and that they will NOT be in the title game.

WAY too early for this. At least wait until the end of October. The only thing that's really a lock is USC vs. LSU in the BCS NCG because nobody's beating either one of those teams.

I have LSU using to Florida in the SEC title game, and USC dropping one along the way somewhere. As it is, all I have in FBS as unbeaten is Hawaii, and we both know that if you're not the champ of a BCS conference, you're not going to get a spot in the national title game anymore.

By the way, I believe that qualifies as calling it.

[rams80]

Any system which has Sun Belt and MAC teams in a playoff playing for a National Title has some serious flaws.

I'll direct your objections to the NCAA Basketball Tournament.

Seriously...they won their Conference. That should be rewarding in some way more meaningful than a spiffy banner.

On Hawaii's weak schedule: 1) Were there ANY I-A teams available? Any I-AA teams better than a Northern Colorado squad that was in Division II 4 years ago?

2) Big boys don't want to go into no-win situations. You'd be better off trying to get middle-tier teams who might not be opposed to a home-and-home.

I'm crossing my fingers for Illinois...and if they get in, ROFLMAO at the Champ Sports Bowl for telling Michigan they wouldn't get a bid...and are either going to be forced to or find themselves taking a lower tier Big Ten team.

Also...welcome Coach Pelini! You've got your work cut out for you with the Blackshirts.

[rams80]

Double Post

[OMMF]

The only projection I will make is that there will be only one unbeaten team in the nation going into the bowls, and that they will NOT be in the title game.

WAY too early for this. At least wait until the end of October. The only thing that's really a lock is USC vs. LSU in the BCS NCG because nobody's beating either one of those teams.

I have LSU using to Florida in the SEC title game, and USC dropping one along the way somewhere. As it is, all I have in FBS as unbeaten is Hawaii, and we both know that if you're not the champ of a BCS conference, you're not going to get a spot in the national title game anymore.

By the way, I believe that qualifies as calling it.

Just in case there is an injury from patting yourself on the back.