GMac Posted May 9, 2009 Share Posted May 9, 2009 STL, my fellow mod, my buddy, i love you like a brother and as such I wish i could slap you upside the head like I can with my brother... As a lifelong Penguins fan, born and raised in Saskatchewan (and to those of you with out maps thats in Canada) so really I could careless if there are 7 teams in canada cuz I'm Canadian. I just believe Hamilton makes way more sense than a team in Phoenix that is hemorrhaging money. It doesnt necessarily have to be Hamilton or even Canada put the damn team where it doesnt have to be supported by the other franchises. What business model allows for massive money loss by a partner only to be negated from the other 29 partners... cut the dead weight or find a way to make it work and really if it doesnt work in 15 years its not sticking... also allegiance doesnt take a full generation to take hold. Look at the Ottawa Senators when they came in there was a mix of both French and English, Habs and Leafs fans, and now Ottawa has its own fan base when people started accepting the team as their own... did the ducks ruin the Kings market... did the flames ruin the oilers market in a province that only had a population of 2,094,212 in 1980... so really whats the population of southern ontario... dont get me wrong hamilton to me makes sense, but really the point is the team needs to get out of the dessert...yes they have their fans but if they are hockey fans they will still follow the league and maybe even the team like some jets fans i know that became coyote fans, current avs fans that were nords fans, etc... hell the cfl moved out of baltimore where they were successful and there are still people from baltimore that go to every grey cup... GDB... Brothers from other Mothers www.pifflespodcast.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scraw28 Posted May 9, 2009 Share Posted May 9, 2009 Regarding to the PHX situation ,Winnipeg or ElseThe isles will eventually stay in NY because the NHL needs another team in that market in order to flourish like the Kings and Ducks in Southern California, another team in New England would also helpThe lightning will stay in tampa no changesthe Florida panthers wished the moved in the AA Arena with the heat because they are a ghost town in Ft.LaurderdaleGary bettman made a mistake by putting too many expansion teams in non traditional hockey/sports towns and the Owners needs some of the blame by not voting Bettman out years ago starting with the first lockout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youcan'tseeme Posted May 9, 2009 Share Posted May 9, 2009 Didn't the Blues even lose their draft picks during that mess? Hard to imagine Saskatoon as a pro sports city.-DanCould've been the NHL's Packers.But if they go to Hamilton, they should go with Tigers.No, they need to distance themselves from the Tiger Cats as much as possible. The names would be too similar. I would even try to avoid going with a Black & Yellow color scheme to get rid of unnessasary critisism about how they ripped off the Bruins.If they were to name the team the Tigers, it's in honour of the old team. anyone with half a brain towards hockey would not suggest they ripped of the Bruins.Hamilton is 41 miles from Toronto. So I suggest...The Toronto Coyotes of Hamilton!Sounds good!If there were to be a second team in the Greater Toronto Area, and we were to also factor in this nostalgia for the "jets" moniker...Could the team be nicknamed the Arrows in honor of this beauty?That would actually be pretty cool.That sounds really good! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scraw28 Posted May 9, 2009 Share Posted May 9, 2009 God I would love for the Jets to return.This idea isn't too bad either:But if they go to Hamilton, they should go with Tigers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Admiral Posted May 9, 2009 Share Posted May 9, 2009 Has Milwaukee ever received consideration for a NHL team? I always thought they may thrive if givin the chance. That guess is uneducated.Milwaukee was bandied about in the late '80s, early '90s, when the Bradley Center was brand-new. I think Bill Wirtz had a big say in preventing the NHL Admirals since Milwaukee was Blackhawks territory, up there with "the Marlins' colors are black and orange" in the big list of ludicrous claims. Milwaukee would've been nice then, but there's no way to fit 'em in now until the Bucks move. If they were to join the league tomorrow, they'd have to contend with the Packers, the Packers offseason, the Brewers, Badgers football, Badgers basketball, Badgers hockey, Marquette hoops, UWM hoops, the Bucks, and the Packers offseason. I can't see how it would work, honestly.the point is the team needs to get out of the dessertAre we still talking about the former Winnipeg Jets, or did we switch to the Manitoba Mousse? Sorry. I'm mean. I agree with your post, especially the head part. ♫ oh yeah, board goes on, long after the thrill of postin' is gone ♫ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BBM Posted May 9, 2009 Share Posted May 9, 2009 Found this on another board: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rams80 Posted May 9, 2009 Share Posted May 9, 2009 Say what you want, Hamilton hasnt had the chance to show that they can support an NHL team. Phoenix, Atlanta, Nashville, etc. have and they've failed. You cant say whether or not Hamilton is the right decision until theyve been given a chance. Hamilton would pack the house each and every night. As long as people are buying tickets and supporting the team there is nothing wrong.They've been given a chance. The NHL expansion committee reviewed their multiple applications in the 1990s and each time came to the conclusion that other markets would be more beneficial to the NHL. However those markets are now full...which brings me to the next point.That said, if you are hellbent on creating what looks to me as being the NHL's Brewers, the NHL should cut a deal with someone for an expansion team and not take somebody's team just so the Leafs can have a few more home games.Shoot...an expansion team brings even more money in to the league, doesn't force league-wide realignment, and is as good as the Coyotes on the ice at present. Everybody wins! Except for possibly Jim Balsillie....and really, I don't care if he loses. On 8/1/2010 at 4:01 PM, winters in buffalo said: You manage to balance agitation with just enough salient points to keep things interesting. Kind of a low-rent DG_Now. On 1/2/2011 at 9:07 PM, Sodboy13 said: Today, we are all otaku. "The city of Peoria was once the site of the largest distillery in the world and later became the site for mass production of penicillin. So it is safe to assume that present-day Peorians are descended from syphilitic boozehounds."-Stephen Colbert POTD: February 15, 2010, June 20, 2010 The Glorious Bloom State Penguins (NCFAF) 2014: 2-9, 2015: 7-5 (L Pineapple Bowl), 2016: 1-0 (NCFAB) 2014-15: 10-8, 2015-16: 14-5 (SMC Champs, L 1st Round February Frenzy) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rams80 Posted May 9, 2009 Share Posted May 9, 2009 So you can stick a rink there? OK, I wasn't sure, since it seems like you can't in most NBA only arenas.The IHL's Minnesota Moose played there for a few seasons, before making the transition from North Stars Substitute to Jets Substitute. Actually, if you look closely during "Happy Gilmore," you'll see the Moose logo in the background during the scene in the ice arena.*rechecks wikipedia page*Oh...they did play some games there as well as at the St. Paul Civic Center.Whoops, carry on. On 8/1/2010 at 4:01 PM, winters in buffalo said: You manage to balance agitation with just enough salient points to keep things interesting. Kind of a low-rent DG_Now. On 1/2/2011 at 9:07 PM, Sodboy13 said: Today, we are all otaku. "The city of Peoria was once the site of the largest distillery in the world and later became the site for mass production of penicillin. So it is safe to assume that present-day Peorians are descended from syphilitic boozehounds."-Stephen Colbert POTD: February 15, 2010, June 20, 2010 The Glorious Bloom State Penguins (NCFAF) 2014: 2-9, 2015: 7-5 (L Pineapple Bowl), 2016: 1-0 (NCFAB) 2014-15: 10-8, 2015-16: 14-5 (SMC Champs, L 1st Round February Frenzy) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STL FANATIC Posted May 9, 2009 Share Posted May 9, 2009 As a lifelong Penguins fan, born and raised in Saskatchewan (and to those of you with out maps thats in Canada) so really I could careless if there are 7 teams in canada cuz I'm Canadian. I just believe Hamilton makes way more sense than a team in Phoenix that is hemorrhaging money. It doesnt necessarily have to be Hamilton or even Canada put the damn team where it doesnt have to be supported by the other franchises. What business model allows for massive money loss by a partner only to be negated from the other 29 partners... cut the dead weight or find a way to make it work and really if it doesnt work in 15 years its not sticking...The point is that the Phoenix market has not failed. The NHL and it's owners have failed to putforth a legitimate product to the Phoenix fans.Hamilton will fail with the same the effort. Any city would.Give up and say Phoenix won't work if you want to, but the truth is that they've never really tried to make Phoenix work. All they've tried to do was have a Phoenix franchise exist. JUSTIN STRIEBEL | PORTFOLIO | RESUME | CONTACT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tp49 Posted May 9, 2009 Share Posted May 9, 2009 Seems I have more questions than answers. I'll ask a few more.Media contracts are important. For example the New York Islanders make a considerable amount of money from their television contract with then SportsChannel and MSG post merger with SportsChannel.From all the information I am able to find it seems that Toronto and Hamiltion are considered to be part of the same market.How do the Leafs handle televising their games? Are their games aired mainly locally or nationally? Are the games televised on cable or over free television or do they have their own network? How do they handle radio broadcasts?Given this how difficult would it be for a Hamilton team to get a favorable media deal? Would they be able to overcome what I could only thing would be a strenuous objection by the Leafs/Sabres for the encroachment into their territories?Looking at this situation objectively it seems the best comparisons to make would be between the Devils and Rangers and the Islanders and Rangers or the Ducks and the Kings just based on their geographic proximity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CC97 Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 The point is that the Phoenix market has not failed. The NHL and it's owners have failed to putforth a legitimate product to the Phoenix fans.Hamilton will fail with the same the effort. Any city would.I can think of at least six cities that wouldn't --- Chris Creamer Founder/Editor, SportsLogos.Net  "The Mothership" • News • Facebook • X/Twitter • Instagram Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STL FANATIC Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 The point is that the Phoenix market has not failed. The NHL and it's owners have failed to putforth a legitimate product to the Phoenix fans.Hamilton will fail with the same the effort. Any city would.I can think of at least six cities that wouldn'tToronto. Montreal.Who else you got? JUSTIN STRIEBEL | PORTFOLIO | RESUME | CONTACT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TFoA Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 woops   Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GMac Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 The point is that the Phoenix market has not failed. The NHL and it's owners have failed to putforth a legitimate product to the Phoenix fans.Hamilton will fail with the same the effort. Any city would.I can think of at least six cities that wouldn'tToronto. Montreal.Who else you got?Vancouver... never won a stanley cup still successful...Edmonton... almost set a record losing streak and was still selling out games... believe me i paid 150 each for club seats on the game they won to not set the recordOttawa... set a league record for losses their first year and reboundedCalgary... has never been in troublebut that being said... Detroit is okThe rangers have been crap and underachivers and are still ok... hell nashville made one hell of a run a few years ago and that meant nothing to ticket sales... GDB... Brothers from other Mothers www.pifflespodcast.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Admiral Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 Give up and say Phoenix won't work if you want to, but the truth is that they've never really tried to make Phoenix work. All they've tried to do was have a Phoenix franchise exist.They had Jeremy Roenick and Nikolai Khabibulin leading the team to four playoff berths in their first five seasons, which is a notch above merely existing. I'm telling you, though, just let this team stick around for five or six more years until they win a Stanley Cup, and then you'll really see what a hockey mecca Phoenix can be! And then you'll see! You'll all see! ♫ oh yeah, board goes on, long after the thrill of postin' is gone ♫ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TFoA Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 Balsille's gonna have to be quicker if he wants to put a team in Hamilton.Because a Vancouver group wants to buy the Thrashers and move THEM to Hamilton. I don't see this happening, considering that the Thrashers' owners are still in litigation amongst themselves, so they'd have to get THAT settled, then they'd all have to agree, and if they couldn't agree on a basketball trade that resulted in them being in litigation for YEARS, they probably aren't going to agree on this. So yeah, the Coyotes have a MUCH better chance of leaving than the Thrashers, if only because of that stupid assed court battle that they're in. Â Â Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CubsFanBudMan Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 I always liked that old coyote. Doubt we'll ever see him again, but I really liked that for a southwest-themed hockey team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Admiral Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 The Vancouver group will move the Thrashers, secure a lease for Hamilton, thus locking Balsillie out, AND THEN MOVE THEM BACK TO ATLANTA! Haha! Swerve! The Bettman rides again! ♫ oh yeah, board goes on, long after the thrill of postin' is gone ♫ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rams80 Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 Found this on another board:Lets call them the Hamilton Maple Leaves On 8/1/2010 at 4:01 PM, winters in buffalo said: You manage to balance agitation with just enough salient points to keep things interesting. Kind of a low-rent DG_Now. On 1/2/2011 at 9:07 PM, Sodboy13 said: Today, we are all otaku. "The city of Peoria was once the site of the largest distillery in the world and later became the site for mass production of penicillin. So it is safe to assume that present-day Peorians are descended from syphilitic boozehounds."-Stephen Colbert POTD: February 15, 2010, June 20, 2010 The Glorious Bloom State Penguins (NCFAF) 2014: 2-9, 2015: 7-5 (L Pineapple Bowl), 2016: 1-0 (NCFAB) 2014-15: 10-8, 2015-16: 14-5 (SMC Champs, L 1st Round February Frenzy) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
STL FANATIC Posted May 10, 2009 Share Posted May 10, 2009 The point is that the Phoenix market has not failed. The NHL and it's owners have failed to putforth a legitimate product to the Phoenix fans.Hamilton will fail with the same the effort. Any city would.I can think of at least six cities that wouldn'tToronto. Montreal.Who else you got?Vancouver... never won a stanley cup still successful...Edmonton... almost set a record losing streak and was still selling out games... believe me i paid 150 each for club seats on the game they won to not set the recordOttawa... set a league record for losses their first year and reboundedCalgary... has never been in troublebut that being said... Detroit is okThe rangers have been crap and underachivers and are still ok... hell nashville made one hell of a run a few years ago and that meant nothing to ticket sales...Vancouver, Edmonton, Ottawa, and Calgary to an extent, were all struggling similar to the Winnipeg and Quebec franchises in the mid-ninties. Those franchises turned things around and got fans back into it.But they are NOT NOT NOT NOT prone to slumps in attendances with crummy effort. I'm talking about crummy effort over years and years. When those franchises face it, things aren't quite as stable.Nashville also had a one year regular season run and it helped.Then there was a lockout. Nashville has never gone on an exciting playoff run.Why are people surprised that hockey doesn't just magically succeed in markets with little hockey history? It takes a consistent amount of good hockey to create interest. Phoenix, Nashville and Atlanta have all had their moments. None of them have had anything that you could really expect to build on.Give up on them if you want, but don't label them as never being able to support an NHL franchise. JUSTIN STRIEBEL | PORTFOLIO | RESUME | CONTACT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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