Next Move Or Expansion

[rams80]

/Don't forget Prop A passed, which pretty much ends stadium socialism in the state of Missouri.

Which is unfortunate for football fans in St. Louis, since the Rams can bolt by 2015 unless the city builds the Rams a new stadium (or completely overhauls the old one, which amounts to about the same thing).

Do you really think that the Rams are going to simply let St. Louis out of that lease, no matter what the financial cost? Do you really think the NFL will let them void the lease, taking the entire league a step backwards in the publicly-financed stadium game?

Let me get this right.. the St. Louis Rams can leave if the city of St.Louis do not either give them a new building or improve the Edward Jones Dome to make it more revenue-friendly and beyond? Then if the Rams are not satisfied with that they can leave say after the 2014 NFL season? Back to Los Angeles or somewhere?

Yes, technically the Rams can leave after 2014 if they are not in the top 25% of stadiums league-wide. But as I said, Kroenke does not want to move the team.

Maybe. A lot of people don't "want to do" a lot of things and end up doing them anyway. That said, of course he won't publicly say "We gone, y'alls" at this point anyway because that will make the EJD attendance problems worse than they already are.

He will let that pass and let them take some time to figure out a stadium plan, renevations or a new one.

Given the lag time on these things, St. Louis has less time than a lot of you folks think.

Hell, with the Walmart money him and his wife have, they probably wouldn't need really any public money to build one. The Dome is simply a glorified arena. The most popular site for a new one is outside the city (in Fenton) where the old Chrysler plant sits vacant. Plenty of space for a new stadium and parking lots for tailgating.

He didn't make that money by spending it on stadia, and he probably doesn't see a need to start doing so now.

May need to build a new overpass to help with traffic, but it's an ideal situation for people coming from different parts of the state. It's on I-44 near 270, so it's easy to get to from I-70 and I-55 as well.

Wouldn't infrastructure improvements involve a tax hike?

I'm not saying it's a 100% guarantee they're staying, but the odds are definately in favor of them remaining in St. Louis. Plus, now that they're showing signs of being on their way to respectability again, their selling out on a consistent basis.

ROFLCOPTER.

The Rams are eating thousands of tickets a week so as to continue their efforts to be the Tampa Bay Rays of the Midwest, by having legions of fans with benefits who will never support the team in a financially meaningful way.

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TANKLIN-ESQUE CONSPIRACY WARNING

There have been times this season, specifically when the Rams organization has passed up opportunities to plug gaping roster holes, and their general gameday strategies of turtling whenever they get a 2nd half lead (costing them 2 or 3 wins by now), that I honestly suspect the grand PLAN for rebuilding the Rams is designed to build a successful winning playoff team....for their first season in Los Angeles. It certainly seems like whenever the Rams might be building momentum that would positively impact the team off the field, they haul off and shoot themselves in the foot in one way or another. They'll probably finish with a 5-11 or 6-10 schedule, which will be enough for the casual fans to invoke "SOSAR" and not buy tickets. After the nuked 2011 season, the Rams will not have enough time to rebuild fan support (although they will look like they were trying for forms sake) and then haul up the stakes for Los Angeles.

END TANKLIN-ESQUE CONSPIRACY WARNING

[The_Admiral]

How many parts of the state are people coming from, anyway? Seems like once you get into Cletus Country, which is like anything beyond the County, the Rams pretty well give way to Mizzou and the Chiefs.

[rams80]

How many parts of the state are people coming from, anyway? Seems like once you get into Cletus Country, which is like anything beyond the County, the Rams pretty well give way to Mizzou and the Chiefs.

The Frontiere-era Rams never bothered marketing outside of the city proper, so that's the reason why.

[Gothamite]

Never bothered, or just didn't do it well? I've never heard much about it.

[rams80]

Never bothered, or just didn't do it well? I've never heard much about it.

It's more never bothered. At least on our side of the Mississippi.

[Gothamite]

Interesting. Are the Bears entrenched in that area? Who's your team, if the Rams were unable/uninterested in outreach?

[The_Admiral]

I think the Bears have a bigger downstate fanbase than any other teams. The Gridbirds spent so much time being bad or somewhere else that they never seemed to claim central/southern Illinois the way the baseball Cardinals did. In the other direction, I saw lots of Chiefs crap as far east as Eureka, so I assume that if the Rams went away, the Bears and Chiefs' respective territories would ooze their ways into that vacuum and reliably air on Fox and CBS each week there. You'd lose your team, but you'd have a net gain in games aired because there's no blackout against home games.

[omnivore]

All of the talk earlier in the thread about the NFL's solution in Cleveland when the Browns moved, I thought was a good solution to a bad PR circumstance. Why make a city adopt a new team with no history when their team leaves? I thought it was handled well, it gave Baltimore a fresh start club with a history to cultivate all it's own and gave Cleveland their team back. No, it didn't erase the memory of them leaving, but it did give them a chance to reconnect. It was a smart business decision when they agreed to build a new stadium for the revived Browns and is how sports leagues should've handled these issues in the past. Better late than never, I say.

[njmeadowlanders]

L.A. is south enough that it hosting a franchise in the AFC South would make geographic sense.

Not really.

Yes, it's a "southern" city if you're going by latitude, but look at the other teams in that division...Indy, Tennessee, and Houston...nowhere close to LA.

The logical geographic move would be to include KC in the AFC South and Los Angeles (Jacksonville) in the AFC West.

Of course, KC won't ever leave a division w/ Denver, Oakland, and the LA/SD Chargers, we all know that.

[Lee.]

L.A. is south enough that it hosting a franchise in the AFC South would make geographic sense.

Not really.

Yes, it's a "southern" city if you're going by latitude, but look at the other teams in that division...Indy, Tennessee, and Houston...nowhere close to LA.

The logical geographic move would be to include KC in the AFC South and Los Angeles (Jacksonville) in the AFC West.

Of course, KC won't ever leave a division w/ Denver, Oakland, and the LA/SD Chargers, we all know that.

Considering the Saints and Falcons were in the NFC West for years, I don't put anything past what the League might do.

[no97]

Forgive me for intruding with NHL questions, but I haven't heard anything in a while about the Coyotes. Last I read, they needed a secure local buyer before December 31st to keep the franchise in Phoenix. After the new year, if no local ownership group coould be found, they would look at owners that were interested in moving the team. So, after a quick scan of this site, I can't seem to find anything new. What's the latest? Thanks!

[Still MIGHTY]

Forgive me for intruding with NHL questions, but I haven't heard anything in a while about the Coyotes. Last I read, they needed a secure local buyer before December 31st to keep the franchise in Phoenix. After the new year, if no local ownership group coould be found, they would look at owners that were interested in moving the team. So, after a quick scan of this site, I can't seem to find anything new. What's the latest? Thanks!

Matt Hulsizer, Chicago businessman, is going through the process of buying the Coyotes and plans on keeping them in Phoenix for a while. He's agreed to a deal in principle with the city of Glendale and Jobing.com Arena about the logistics of that nature, and he's working with the NHL to complete the purchase.

[Lee.]

...within the next five days.

[rams80]

I think the Bears have a bigger downstate fanbase than any other teams. The Gridbirds spent so much time being bad or somewhere else that they never seemed to claim central/southern Illinois the way the baseball Cardinals did. In the other direction, I saw lots of Chiefs crap as far east as Eureka, so I assume that if the Rams went away, the Bears and Chiefs' respective territories would ooze their ways into that vacuum and reliably air on Fox and CBS each week there. You'd lose your team, but you'd have a net gain in games aired because there's no blackout against home games.

Additionally, the Packers are the real draw for those with the " the Bears" sentiment in downstate Illinois.

[Camden Crazy]

Forgive me for intruding with NHL questions, but I haven't heard anything in a while about the Coyotes. Last I read, they needed a secure local buyer before December 31st to keep the franchise in Phoenix. After the new year, if no local ownership group coould be found, they would look at owners that were interested in moving the team. So, after a quick scan of this site, I can't seem to find anything new. What's the latest? Thanks!

Matt Hulsizer, Chicago businessman, is going through the process of buying the Coyotes and plans on keeping them in Phoenix for a while. He's agreed to a deal in principle with the city of Glendale and Jobing.com Arena about the logistics of that nature, and he's working with the NHL to complete the purchase.

Idiotic decision. I wish Bettman would just admit his mistake and get them out of there.

[BigMac12]

Forgive me for intruding with NHL questions, but I haven't heard anything in a while about the Coyotes. Last I read, they needed a secure local buyer before December 31st to keep the franchise in Phoenix. After the new year, if no local ownership group coould be found, they would look at owners that were interested in moving the team. So, after a quick scan of this site, I can't seem to find anything new. What's the latest? Thanks!

Matt Hulsizer, Chicago businessman, is going through the process of buying the Coyotes and plans on keeping them in Phoenix for a while. He's agreed to a deal in principle with the city of Glendale and Jobing.com Arena about the logistics of that nature, and he's working with the NHL to complete the purchase.

Idiotic decision. I wish Bettman would just admit his mistake and get them out of there.

As a Coyote fan, I wish that doesn't happen.

[no97]

Forgive me for intruding with NHL questions, but I haven't heard anything in a while about the Coyotes. Last I read, they needed a secure local buyer before December 31st to keep the franchise in Phoenix. After the new year, if no local ownership group coould be found, they would look at owners that were interested in moving the team. So, after a quick scan of this site, I can't seem to find anything new. What's the latest? Thanks!

Matt Hulsizer, Chicago businessman, is going through the process of buying the Coyotes and plans on keeping them in Phoenix for a while. He's agreed to a deal in principle with the city of Glendale and Jobing.com Arena about the logistics of that nature, and he's working with the NHL to complete the purchase.

Idiotic decision. I wish Bettman would just admit his mistake and get them out of there.

As a Coyote fan, I wish that doesn't happen.

I understand and sympathise, however, even with a good team (heck, great team last year at #3 in the west), attendance was embarrassing (less than 12,000 a game and a drop of nearly 3000 from '08-'09?. Not to mention just over 10,000 so far this year for a team in first in their division?). That's not ownership's fault. I mean, really, it's just not working. No fans, a team bleeding money and the NHL bent over backwards to avoid doing the right thing. It's a shame. It's not like this is the Baltimore Colts, where fans were passionate, but the owners screwed them...

[Norva]

Just curious, but why do some of you, as fans of other teams, care about the Coyotes attendance? Does it really effect you at all?

I just don't get comments like "embarrassing" and "get them out of there". Do you all own a stake in the team or something?

[no97]

Just curious, but why do some of you, as fans of other teams, care about the Coyotes attendance? Does it really effect you at all?

I just don't get comments like "embarrassing" and "get them out of there". Do you all own a stake in the team or something?

Because as a fan of the NHL and hockey in general, it's embarrassing to see the sport presented as unpopular, and that hockey can't draw to much more than a half-full building. Meanwhile, a bad owner removed that same franchise from a city that desperatly wants them back and would sell out if they came back tomorrow (the 'Peg averages 8-9000 in a 15,000 seat building for MINOR LEAGUE hockey, while Phoenix barely gets more than that for the 'Yotes).

[Eye]

All of the talk earlier in the thread about the NFL's solution in Cleveland when the Browns moved, I thought was a good solution to a bad PR circumstance. Why make a city adopt a new team with no history when their team leaves? I thought it was handled well, it gave Baltimore a fresh start club with a history to cultivate all it's own and gave Cleveland their team back. No, it didn't erase the memory of them leaving, but it did give them a chance to reconnect. It was a smart business decision when they agreed to build a new stadium for the revived Browns and is how sports leagues should've handled these issues in the past. Better late than never, I say.

The Cleveland Deal is an awful idea. Cleveland didn't get it's team back (they never had one, it was Art Modell's when the team moved, but I digress), they got an expansion team that still sucks to this day, while the real Browns play in Baltimore. Hopefully no more Cleveland Deals happen, ever.

Just curious, but why do some of you, as fans of other teams, care about the Coyotes attendance? Does it really effect you at all?

I just don't get comments like "embarrassing" and "get them out of there". Do you all own a stake in the team or something?

Because as a fan of the NHL and hockey in general, it's embarrassing to see the sport presented as unpopular, and that hockey can't draw to much more than a half-full building. Meanwhile, a bad owner removed that same franchise from a city that desperatly wants them back and would sell out if they came back tomorrow (the 'Peg averages 8-9000 in a 15,000 seat building for MINOR LEAGUE hockey, while Phoenix barely gets more than that for the 'Yotes).

Winnipeg didn't want the Jets enough the first time around, yet had the nerve to cry foul when they left.

http://www.curtiswalker.com/jets/attendance.aspx