Back In The Game?

[Ez Street]

Agreed, but since he HASN'T learned from his past errors, I believe he will try to relieve Wang of his debt. Wang wants out, that much is certain.

The rub would be how the Islanders would get out of their lease. I'm sure Jimmy has his lawyers on it already as he probably did with Phoenix a long time ago.

He won't go away until every avenue has been challenged.

[The_Admiral]

I believe he will try to relieve Wang

Wang wants out,

The rub

lol dick jokes

[Jigga]

You're really reaching lately. I want the vintage TCR!

[tBBP]

Reaching for a wang...

...po' lil' tink-tink.

[Sodboy13]

...po' lil' tink-tink.

Are we allowing that kind of language on this forum now?

[DarkJourney]

Is that damn arena in Brooklyn ever going to get built. It's been mentioned before but the Isles would be perfect for the Barclays Center.

[Brian in Boston]

Agreed, but since he HASN'T learned from his past errors, I believe he will try to relieve Wang of his debt. Wang wants out, that much is certain.

The rub would be how the Islanders would get out of their lease. I'm sure Jimmy has his lawyers on it already as he probably did with Phoenix a long time ago.

He won't go away until every avenue has been challenged.

It doesn't matter whether or not Balsillie tries to relieve Wang of his debt. The result will be the same. He's alienated NHL officials and owners with his efforts to date to land an NHL franchise. Thus, said owners will not approve Balsillie's attempts to buy the Islanders. Wang will have to find another buyer.

Balsillie is now a "no-go" as far as the NHL's owners are concerned.

[Lee.]

Agreed, but since he HASN'T learned from his past errors, I believe he will try to relieve Wang of his debt. Wang wants out, that much is certain.

The rub would be how the Islanders would get out of their lease. I'm sure Jimmy has his lawyers on it already as he probably did with Phoenix a long time ago.

He won't go away until every avenue has been challenged.

It doesn't matter whether or not Balsillie tries to relieve Wang of his debt. The result will be the same. He's alienated NHL officials and owners with his efforts to date to land an NHL franchise. Thus, said owners will not approve Balsillie's attempts to buy the Islanders. Wang will have to find another buyer.

Balsillie is now a "no-go" as far as the NHL's owners are concerned.

However, if he were to drop over $400 million on an expansion franchise for the area, I'm sure they'd welcome him with open arms.

[GMac]

Im starting to agree with BIB... Balsillie is playing fast and loose and has pissed off alot of owners/governors in the league with power, even IF the court rules that he could get the team in good faith it is highly unlikely he will get the majority of 16 to move the team the way this is being played out... and before anyone mentions two-thirds thats on a sale and wont come into play if it goes through the courts... basically he's putting all of his chips on black and playing it doesnt come up red...

if this hits an auction ill bet money that the league will try to out bid him to buy themselves time to find a more "suitable" owner and then sell the franchise then... much like what MLB did with the Expos... not to many independent businessmen will bid more that 217.5 million (which is the minimum anyone can bid over Balsillie's 212.5 million bid) for any NHL franchise that is not the wings, leafs, habs, penguins or maybe rangers...

quick edit... found the forbes value charts... guess whos franchise is dead last for value... here's all the franchises valued more than balsillie's over bid... and then the coyotes...and on a personal not i cant believe that the Kings and the Lightning are more than the Penguins...

1. Toronto Maple Leafs $448 million

2. New York Rangers $411 million

3. Montreal Canadiens $334 million

4. Detroit Red Wings $303 million

5. Philadelphia Flyers $275 million

6. Dallas Stars $273 million

7. Boston Bruins $263 million

8. Vancouver Canucks $236 million

9. Colorado Avalanche $231 million

10. New Jersey Devils $222 million

11. Minnesota Wild $217 million

12. Los Angeles Kings $210 million

13. Ottawa Senators $207 million

14. Chicago Blackhawks $205 million

15. Calgary Flames $203 million

16. Anaheim Ducks $202 million

17. Tampa Bay Lightning $200 million

18. Pittsburgh Penguins $195 million

19. San Jose Sharks $179 million

20. Edmonton Oilers $175 million

21. Buffalo Sabres $169 million

22. Carolina Hurricanes $168 million

23. Nashville Predators $164 million

24. Florida Panthers $163 million

25. St. Louis Blues $162 million

26. Washington Capitals $160 million

27. Atlanta Thrashers $158 million

28. Columbus Blue Jackets $157 million

29. New York Islanders $154 million

30. Phoenix Coyotes $142 million

[Lee.]

But can the league afford to run the team while looking for a suitable owner? Considering there are already more than enough teams receiving scads of equalization money, how many other owners are going to want to pump money into a losing cause for as long as it takes to find new ownership that isn't Balsillie?

I'm not saying to give him the franchise outright, but MLB could afford to run the Expos in a league without a salary cap or floor, in a dead market. I don't think the NHL has anywhere near that luxury.

[GMac]

But can the league afford to run the team while looking for a suitable owner? Considering there are already more than enough teams receiving scads of equalization money, how many other owners are going to want to pump money into a losing cause for as long as it takes to find new ownership that isn't Balsillie?

I'm not saying to give him the franchise outright, but MLB could afford to run the Expos in a league without a salary cap or floor, in a dead market. I don't think the NHL has anywhere near that luxury.

what else are they gonna do if it hits auction hes already overbid 70 million on a struggling franchise with a small fan base... what Billionaire is going to look at the coyotes and say oh ya thats what i want... the league is his only competition and if they have to they probably will try to make a go of it based on the Expos/Nationals results... hell MLB made a 200 million dollar profit on that exchange... bought it for 125 sold for 400 and guesstimating possible losses in the Montreal/san juan experiment im sure they came out ahead

[Lee.]

But again, MLB owners generally have the revenue stream and deep enough pockets to weather a short-term money pit. I'm not certain the NHL does.

And even if they did, Bettman needs to be as far away from the ownership selection process as possible. Many of the owners he's helped to bring into the league have been busts, and I'm sure tempers will be running short if the process drags on too long, or if he finds another Boots Del Baggio (sp).

[rams80]

For what it's worth, since it sounds like Glendale becomes a creditor to the tune of $500 million if the Coyotes leave town as an immediate result of the bankruptcy forced sale, the bankruptcy court may choose to award the team to a lower bid than Balsillie's if said bid promises to stay in Phoenix. Just something to keep in mind.

/Also keep in mind that of the many conditions Balsillie placed on his offer, some have already been effectively struck down by the court (equal TV rights to the Leafs and no territorial indemnification to Toronto and Buffalo) and the time limit will likely expire before the sale is concluded.

[IceCap]

But can the league afford to run the team while looking for a suitable owner? Considering there are already more than enough teams receiving scads of equalization money, how many other owners are going to want to pump money into a losing cause for as long as it takes to find new ownership that isn't Balsillie?

I'm not saying to give him the franchise outright, but MLB could afford to run the Expos in a league without a salary cap or floor, in a dead market. I don't think the NHL has anywhere near that luxury.

what else are they gonna do if it hits auction hes already overbid 70 million on a struggling franchise with a small fan base... what Billionaire is going to look at the coyotes and say oh ya thats what i want... the league is his only competition and if they have to they probably will try to make a go of it based on the Expos/Nationals results... hell MLB made a 200 million dollar profit on that exchange... bought it for 125 sold for 400 and guesstimating possible losses in the Montreal/san juan experiment im sure they came out ahead

Jim Balsillie?

The team is struggling to even stay alive in Arizona. They need to move somewhere, anywhere, else. Here's a guy with the passion for the game and the more money than is necessary to set the team up on a path for financial stability. It's simply moronic for the NHL to try and shut him out based purely on a "we don't like your kind" mentality. He has the desire to own a NHL team, a passion for the game, and tons of cash. So what's the problem?

If the only problem is "oh no, he'll be hockey's Mark Cuban," well I have news for you. The NHL could use a Mark Cuban.

[Brian in Boston]

He has the desire to own a NHL team, a passion for the game, and tons of cash. So what's the problem?

The behavior Balsillie has displayed while pursuing a team strikes the NHL's current owners as indicating that he won't be a "team player" when it comes to cooperating with his fellow franchise-holders. They're not inclined to want to deal with such an individual.

The NHL could use a Mark Cuban.

The folks calling the shots in the NHL don't agree.

[rams80]

But can the league afford to run the team while looking for a suitable owner? Considering there are already more than enough teams receiving scads of equalization money, how many other owners are going to want to pump money into a losing cause for as long as it takes to find new ownership that isn't Balsillie?

I'm not saying to give him the franchise outright, but MLB could afford to run the Expos in a league without a salary cap or floor, in a dead market. I don't think the NHL has anywhere near that luxury.

what else are they gonna do if it hits auction hes already overbid 70 million on a struggling franchise with a small fan base... what Billionaire is going to look at the coyotes and say oh ya thats what i want... the league is his only competition and if they have to they probably will try to make a go of it based on the Expos/Nationals results... hell MLB made a 200 million dollar profit on that exchange... bought it for 125 sold for 400 and guesstimating possible losses in the Montreal/san juan experiment im sure they came out ahead

Jim Balsillie?

The team is struggling to even stay alive in Arizona. They need to move somewhere, anywhere, else. Here's a guy with the passion for the game and the more money than is necessary to set the team up on a path for financial stability. It's simply moronic for the NHL to try and shut him out based purely on a "we don't like your kind" mentality. He has the desire to own a NHL team, a passion for the game, and tons of cash. So what's the problem?

If the only problem is "oh no, he'll be hockey's Mark Cuban," well I have news for you. The NHL could use a Mark Cuban.

Except Mark Cuban was willing to at least work within the NBA's rules regarding franchise ownership, and didn't attempt to drag it into anti-trust court. Plenty other owners are loaded and passionate, yet they don't violate all of the league's ownership rules to get their way.

/Of course, the Jerry Joneses, Dan Snyders, and Mark Cubans of the world haven't been successfully in winning titles for all of their passion as of late either.

//He only really has a passion for something close to take potential RIM clients to.

[IceCap]

He has the desire to own a NHL team, a passion for the game, and tons of cash. So what's the problem?

The behavior Balsillie has displayed while pursuing a team strikes the NHL's current owners as indicating that he won't be a "team player" when it comes to cooperating with his fellow franchise-holders. They're not inclined to want to deal with such an individual.

Jim Bassillie didn't get to where he is by being brain dead. If he gets an NHL team then what is good for the NHL suddenly becomes good for him. If you, or anyone calling the shots in the NHL, thinks he'll go loose cannon once he has a team then you're not thinking clearly. Again, if he becomes an NHL owner, then what's good for the NHL will be what's good for him. No one who has reached the level of success Jim Balsillie has would miss that.

At the very worst he would be an Al Davis or Mark Cuban type, who would be the essentric guy of the bunch, but he wouldn't be any sort of threat to the larger NHL "team player" menatlity.

The NHL could use a Mark Cuban.

The folks calling the shots in the NHL don't agree.

You mean the same folks who think the Coyotes will best be served staying in a location where they haven't made a profit at least once, and who think staying in said location would work out just fine if the team was under league control, ala the Montreal Expos? Yep, that sounds like a real brain trust they have over there

Say what you will about the Mark Cubans and the Al Davis', they both obviously care about the teams they're running and, perhaps more importantly, they generate publicity. Love them or hate them, they cause the average sports fan to take notice, if even momentarily. The NHL could use such controversy.

But can the league afford to run the team while looking for a suitable owner? Considering there are already more than enough teams receiving scads of equalization money, how many other owners are going to want to pump money into a losing cause for as long as it takes to find new ownership that isn't Balsillie?

I'm not saying to give him the franchise outright, but MLB could afford to run the Expos in a league without a salary cap or floor, in a dead market. I don't think the NHL has anywhere near that luxury.

what else are they gonna do if it hits auction hes already overbid 70 million on a struggling franchise with a small fan base... what Billionaire is going to look at the coyotes and say oh ya thats what i want... the league is his only competition and if they have to they probably will try to make a go of it based on the Expos/Nationals results... hell MLB made a 200 million dollar profit on that exchange... bought it for 125 sold for 400 and guesstimating possible losses in the Montreal/san juan experiment im sure they came out ahead

Jim Balsillie?

The team is struggling to even stay alive in Arizona. They need to move somewhere, anywhere, else. Here's a guy with the passion for the game and the more money than is necessary to set the team up on a path for financial stability. It's simply moronic for the NHL to try and shut him out based purely on a "we don't like your kind" mentality. He has the desire to own a NHL team, a passion for the game, and tons of cash. So what's the problem?

If the only problem is "oh no, he'll be hockey's Mark Cuban," well I have news for you. The NHL could use a Mark Cuban.

Except Mark Cuban was willing to at least work within the NBA's rules regarding franchise ownership, and didn't attempt to drag it into anti-trust court. Plenty other owners are loaded and passionate, yet they don't violate all of the league's ownership rules to get their way.

Did the NBA fight tooth and nail to shut Cuban out? Not that I'm aware of. So really, the two situations aren't comparible. As for the anti-trust lawsuite? Well whatever it takes to get MLSE to realize that a team in Hamilton would not affect them in the slightest I'm all for.

Here's my opinion on the matter. Owner of Team X wants to sell. He should be able to sell the team to whoever he can sell the team, free from league meddling. If new owner wants to move the team into a location that infringes on the territory of Team Y then he can as long as he pays off the territorial fee.

Really, the owner of the team who wants to sell should have a right to sell his properity to whoever is able to provide the best price. The NHL already has a legal monopoly on major league pro hockey (if not technically then in practice). Anything else like the league telling owners who they can and can't sell to? That's not really something I can look at and agree with.

As for other passionate and loaded owners who are willing to buy into the NHL, where are they?

/Of course, the Jerry Joneses, Dan Snyders, and Mark Cubans of the world haven't been successfully in winning titles for all of their passion as of late either.

And when did championships enter into the discussion? The Leafs haven't won a Stanley Cup since 1967, and the Sabres have never won one. Did I miss something here, or are you simply trying to divert the discussion along a path that really has nothing to do with the topic(s) at hand?

//He only really has a passion for something close to take potential RIM clients to.

Oh come now rams Is this just a case of the "I'll just choose the morally absolute position opposite of the other side" argument like you took with traditional vs non-traditional markets in general?

Really, anyone who's seen the effort he's put behind this, when the NHL clearly doesn't want him, says to me "this is a guy who loves the sport." If he didn't, why would he bother? He loves the game, and he would love to see a seventh team in the country that invented the sport*. Regardless of what you think of him, you can't deny the passion the man has for NHL hockey.

*A country, mind you, who's meger six teams in a 30 team NHL make up 60% of the league's revenue.

[Drew22]

Look at these awesome Hamilton concepts.

http://haveavoice.makeitseven.ca/

[IceCap]

Most of those are pretty bad. An updated tiger head as the primary with the H/Hamilton mark as a secondary would be the best way to go about things.

[Gordie]

A country, mind you, who's meager six teams in a 30 team NHL make up 60% of the league's revenue.

A positive factor for Balsillie, but negative for the league as a whole, and a concrete reason why a lot of NHL governors oppose him.

Many owners don't want another team in Canada right now, especially in southern Ontario, because they don't want another team that will increase league revenues, which in turn increases the salary cap and the minimum that each team must spend on player salaries.

Ironically, saving the Coyotes (or any other franchise) by moving them to Hamilton would hurt the league by making it even harder for other struggling teams to compete financially, and potentially forcing more relocations or retraction. For a league trying to preserve stability in some markets and increase it in others, Balsillie's willingness to put his individual interests ahead of the league's collective interests presents a major threat.