2010 LeBron James Sweepstakes

[Cujo]

So lemme get this straight... Because LeBron is requiring a max contract this time around, he and Riley have to coax Bosh and Wade into taking paycuts of $5M per. There's just no way. Not when there are other contending teams out there who would definitely offer the max to both of those two. I hear reports of all three resigning in Miami, but none of it adds up or makes any sense.

[Ateles fusciceps]

LoL...

Nobody is giving D-Wade anywhere near a max deal. He should have opted into his remaining 2-yr $40+mil deal. He won't get anywhere near that, from Miami or anyone else.

[See Red]

LoL...

Nobody is giving D-Wade anywhere near a max deal. He should have opted into his remaining 2-yr $40+mil deal. He won't get anywhere near that, from Miami or anyone else.

No, but surely he'd be giving up a lot of money from what he would have made had he opted in.

[Ateles fusciceps]

LoL...

Nobody is giving D-Wade anywhere near a max deal. He should have opted into his remaining 2-yr $40+mil deal. He won't get anywhere near that, from Miami or anyone else.

No, but surely he'd be giving up a lot of money from what he would have made had he opted in.

He would've made over $40mil the next 2 seasons by opting in. He'll end up making around half of that now. That's a ton of money to give up just to make LeBron happy and give him more money. Wade already has 3 rings and a HOF resume, I would've opted in and told LeBron to kick rocks.

LeBron wants a max deal, he's gonna put a ton of pressure on himself. This year they lost the Finals and everyone blamed Wade and Bosh. Well, next year when you're making max and those guys are making half of that the blame us squarely on you. No excuses if you lose, it's on you.

[BBTV]

Anyone feel like the Heat will have to let one (or two) of the big 3 walk because of Lebron? I don't see Bosh returning next year to Miami.

They need to let Wade walk, he's washed up. His decision to remove his meniscus in college shortened his career.

Also, a little off topic...

Kobe tweeted earlier that Charlotte told him they didn't want him & shipped him to LA.

I'm getting a good laugh at all the Kobe/Lakers fans who are mocking James for leaving Cleveland & possibly leaving Miami now. LeBron played out his contract in both cities, he held up his end of the bargain & is free to make his own decision.

Unlike Kobe, who was a bitch & forced his way to LA. He came into the league a 17-year old high schooler & demanded he would only play in NY or LA. He told Charlotte he would go overseas before he signed with them. Several GMs/office personnel from other teams have done said they wanted Bryant but passed because his agent made it known he would only play in a major market.

Who's really the bitch?

Choosing where to work / live hardly makes anyone a bitch. It's the same right you and I have - except we have no restrictions to overcome. You and anyone who doesn't like it is probably just jealous that you don't have the same leverage that he does - probably because you aren't very good at whatever it is that you do.

[Hat Boy]

Choosing where to work / live hardly makes anyone a bitch. It's the same right you and I have - except we have no restrictions to overcome. You and anyone who doesn't like it is probably just jealous that you don't have the same leverage that he does - probably because you aren't very good at whatever it is that you do.

Are you talking about Lebron or Kobe?

[BBTV]

Choosing where to work / live hardly makes anyone a bitch. It's the same right you and I have - except we have no restrictions to overcome. You and anyone who doesn't like it is probably just jealous that you don't have the same leverage that he does - probably because you aren't very good at whatever it is that you do.

Are you talking about Lebron or Kobe?

Anyone. Eli Manning included. My response was to a point made about Kobe though.

[FiddySicks]

Anyone feel like the Heat will have to let one (or two) of the big 3 walk because of Lebron? I don't see Bosh returning next year to Miami.

They need to let Wade walk, he's washed up. His decision to remove his meniscus in college shortened his career.

Also, a little off topic...

Kobe tweeted earlier that Charlotte told him they didn't want him & shipped him to LA.

I'm getting a good laugh at all the Kobe/Lakers fans who are mocking James for leaving Cleveland & possibly leaving Miami now. LeBron played out his contract in both cities, he held up his end of the bargain & is free to make his own decision.

Unlike Kobe, who was a bitch & forced his way to LA. He came into the league a 17-year old high schooler & demanded he would only play in NY or LA. He told Charlotte he would go overseas before he signed with them. Several GMs/office personnel from other teams have done said they wanted Bryant but passed because his agent made it known he would only play in a major market.

Who's really the bitch?

Choosing where to work / live hardly makes anyone a bitch. It's the same right you and I have - except we have no restrictions to overcome. You and anyone who doesn't like it is probably just jealous that you don't have the same leverage that he does - probably because you aren't very good at whatever it is that you do.

That seems like an incredibly lazy cop out to just say "Oh, well you suck at what you do so you wouldn't understand!". In the NBA it's basically set up with the draft so you don't have the right to choose where you work, so there goes that argument. Considering the setup of the NBA (Any sport, for that matter), it obviously is possible to refuse to play somewhere, and some players do have leverage to get away with doing that, but it doesn't make them any less bitch-like, at least from a personal standpoint IMO. It's basically saying you refuse to pay your dues unless it's on your own terms, which is about as unrealistic as you can get.

I'm sorry, Kobe is a little f*****g bitch, for many reasons. He always has been and he always will be. Telling people that they can't feel that way because they probably suck at what they do is ludicrous.

[Saint Zephyr III]

LoL...

Nobody is giving D-Wade anywhere near a max deal. He should have opted into his remaining 2-yr $40+mil deal. He won't get anywhere near that, from Miami or anyone else.

No, but surely he'd be giving up a lot of money from what he would have made had he opted in.

He would've made over $40mil the next 2 seasons by opting in. He'll end up making around half of that now. That's a ton of money to give up just to make LeBron happy and give him more money. Wade already has 3 rings and a HOF resume, I would've opted in and told LeBron to kick rocks.

LeBron wants a max deal, he's gonna put a ton of pressure on himself. This year they lost the Finals and everyone blamed Wade and Bosh. Well, next year when you're making max and those guys are making half of that the blame us squarely on you. No excuses if you lose, it's on you.

I have to imagine that Riley has had some type of private "sitdown" with Wade at some point and said something to the effect of this:

"Look, Dwyane...you're the reason Miami was even a viable free agent destination in the first place. You got our first championship, YOU helped recruit LeBron and Bosh in the single greatest free-agency maneuver in league history, and even though we lost this was our FOURTH straight Finals. But, look, your knees are shot; sorry but they are. You on the wrong side of 32 and you can't be the #2 anymore. If you take this smaller deal, I SWEAR to you that you will always have a role in the franchise from here on out. Coach, president, investor, you name it it's yours down the road. But if you and I are going to ride this out and get a couple more Finals, I mean seriously have you SEEN the rest of the East, then take this hit for now and you'll go out on top."

[BBTV]

Anyone feel like the Heat will have to let one (or two) of the big 3 walk because of Lebron? I don't see Bosh returning next year to Miami.

They need to let Wade walk, he's washed up. His decision to remove his meniscus in college shortened his career.

Also, a little off topic...

Kobe tweeted earlier that Charlotte told him they didn't want him & shipped him to LA.

I'm getting a good laugh at all the Kobe/Lakers fans who are mocking James for leaving Cleveland & possibly leaving Miami now. LeBron played out his contract in both cities, he held up his end of the bargain & is free to make his own decision.

Unlike Kobe, who was a bitch & forced his way to LA. He came into the league a 17-year old high schooler & demanded he would only play in NY or LA. He told Charlotte he would go overseas before he signed with them. Several GMs/office personnel from other teams have done said they wanted Bryant but passed because his agent made it known he would only play in a major market.

Who's really the bitch?

Choosing where to work / live hardly makes anyone a bitch. It's the same right you and I have - except we have no restrictions to overcome. You and anyone who doesn't like it is probably just jealous that you don't have the same leverage that he does - probably because you aren't very good at whatever it is that you do.

That seems like an incredibly lazy cop out to just say "Oh, well you suck at what you do so you wouldn't understand!". In the NBA it's basically set up with the draft so you don't have the right to choose where you work, so there goes that argument. Considering the setup of the NBA (Any sport, for that matter), it obviously is possible to refuse to play somewhere, and some players do have leverage to get away with doing that, but it doesn't make them any less bitch-like, at least from a personal standpoint IMO. It's basically saying you refuse to pay your dues unless it's on your own terms, which is about as unrealistic as you can get.

I'm sorry, Kobe is a little f*****g bitch, for many reasons. He always has been and he always will be. Telling people that they can't feel that way because they probably suck at what they do is ludicrous.

That's how the leagues are set up, but that doesn't make it right. If you were told by your boss that you were getting transfered to Cleveland, would you smile and say "cool, I'll pack my bags"? I don't know what you do, but if you were good enough you'd say (assuming you don't want to go to Cleveland, and since nobody wants to go to Cleveland, I'll assume I'm correct) "if you send me there I'll quit", or you'll just take a job with a company in a location that you like. In the former situation, if you're really good, your boss will back down and let you stay because they don't want to lose you.

If you're not good (or at least not so good as to have any leverage), you'll just pack your bags and go to Cleveland.

I'm not sure why people should expect athletes to play by different rules than they do, and why people think that a player shouldn't do what he can to work where he wants to do. Your average rookie doesn't have any leverage, but a star does. Sorry, but life isn't fair - people get treated differently. Think the top sales guy at the copier company doesn't get a lot more leway than the new guy that's only sold one copier in the 6 months he's been with the company?

[FiddySicks]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fancy-stats/wp/2014/07/01/why-phoenix-suns-are-attractive-option-for-lebron-carmelo/

Don’t count out Phoenix as a major player in the free agent sweepstakes, they have the best trainers in the league!

What a waste of time to even write something like this. At least Neil Greenberg's fingers got some exercise, I guess.

[IceCap]

Anyone feel like the Heat will have to let one (or two) of the big 3 walk because of Lebron? I don't see Bosh returning next year to Miami.

They need to let Wade walk, he's washed up. His decision to remove his meniscus in college shortened his career.

Also, a little off topic...

Kobe tweeted earlier that Charlotte told him they didn't want him & shipped him to LA.

I'm getting a good laugh at all the Kobe/Lakers fans who are mocking James for leaving Cleveland & possibly leaving Miami now. LeBron played out his contract in both cities, he held up his end of the bargain & is free to make his own decision.

Unlike Kobe, who was a bitch & forced his way to LA. He came into the league a 17-year old high schooler & demanded he would only play in NY or LA. He told Charlotte he would go overseas before he signed with them. Several GMs/office personnel from other teams have done said they wanted Bryant but passed because his agent made it known he would only play in a major market.

Who's really the bitch?

Choosing where to work / live hardly makes anyone a bitch. It's the same right you and I have - except we have no restrictions to overcome. You and anyone who doesn't like it is probably just jealous that you don't have the same leverage that he does - probably because you aren't very good at whatever it is that you do.

That seems like an incredibly lazy cop out to just say "Oh, well you suck at what you do so you wouldn't understand!". In the NBA it's basically set up with the draft so you don't have the right to choose where you work, so there goes that argument. Considering the setup of the NBA (Any sport, for that matter), it obviously is possible to refuse to play somewhere, and some players do have leverage to get away with doing that, but it doesn't make them any less bitch-like, at least from a personal standpoint IMO. It's basically saying you refuse to pay your dues unless it's on your own terms, which is about as unrealistic as you can get.

I'm sorry, Kobe is a little f*****g bitch, for many reasons. He always has been and he always will be. Telling people that they can't feel that way because they probably suck at what they do is ludicrous.

That's how the leagues are set up, but that doesn't make it right. If you were told by your boss that you were getting transfered to Cleveland, would you smile and say "cool, I'll pack my bags"? I don't know what you do, but if you were good enough you'd say (assuming you don't want to go to Cleveland, and since nobody wants to go to Cleveland, I'll assume I'm correct) "if you send me there I'll quit", or you'll just take a job with a company in a location that you like. In the former situation, if you're really good, your boss will back down and let you stay because they don't want to lose you.

Like I said elsewhere, you really can't compare an office job with that of a professional athlete. Your boss didn't spend millions to get you to work for him, and people don't pay thousands of dollars each for season ticket packages to watch you sell insurance.

[Hat Boy]

Like I said elsewhere, you really can't compare an office job with that of a professional athlete. Your boss didn't spend millions to get you to work for him, and people don't pay thousands of dollars each for season ticket packages to watch you sell insurance.

That's not a one-for-one, ice_cap. The Hornets didn't pay Kobe anything and no Hornets fan spent a dime to see him play for the team.

The difference in the NBA/office job scenario is that no one is "drafted" by a company to work in an office--all workers are, essentially, free agents. In going to the NBA (or NFL, NHL, etc.), the draft system is set up to distribute new talent. Kobe, Eli Manning, John Elway, Eric Lindros, etc., all circumvented the system.

BBTT, you seem to be at peace with guys doing this, but don't you think it is bad practice? Otherwise, Phillies fans wouldn't hate JD Drew.

[Ateles fusciceps]

LoL...

Nobody is giving D-Wade anywhere near a max deal. He should have opted into his remaining 2-yr $40+mil deal. He won't get anywhere near that, from Miami or anyone else.

No, but surely he'd be giving up a lot of money from what he would have made had he opted in.

He would've made over $40mil the next 2 seasons by opting in. He'll end up making around half of that now. That's a ton of money to give up just to make LeBron happy and give him more money. Wade already has 3 rings and a HOF resume, I would've opted in and told LeBron to kick rocks.

LeBron wants a max deal, he's gonna put a ton of pressure on himself. This year they lost the Finals and everyone blamed Wade and Bosh. Well, next year when you're making max and those guys are making half of that the blame us squarely on you. No excuses if you lose, it's on you.

I have to imagine that Riley has had some type of private "sitdown" with Wade at some point and said something to the effect of this:

"Look, Dwyane...you're the reason Miami was even a viable free agent destination in the first place. You got our first championship, YOU helped recruit LeBron and Bosh in the single greatest free-agency maneuver in league history, and even though we lost this was our FOURTH straight Finals. But, look, your knees are shot; sorry but they are. You on the wrong side of 32 and you can't be the #2 anymore. If you take this smaller deal, I SWEAR to you that you will always have a role in the franchise from here on out. Coach, president, investor, you name it it's yours down the road. But if you and I are going to ride this out and get a couple more Finals, I mean seriously have you SEEN the rest of the East, then take this hit for now and you'll go out on top."

And if I was D-Wade I would've told Riley....

"You are the person who offered me this contract and I'm here to collect it. I'm opting in and collecting my check. Deal with it."

[BBTV]

But that doesn't change things from the employee / player's perspective. Agreed it's totally different, but the fundamental desire to work where you want doesn't change. I'm not saying that the draft is illegal or anything, just that I tend to look at things from the worker's perspective and don't begrudge them for exercising their leverage just like you or I would if we had any. I also feel the same way about contract holdouts and stuff like that.

Sure it sucks from a fan perspective - I get that. As someone who hated JD Drew and Scott Boras for a while, I get that.

But by no means does it make anyone a bitch to do what they feel is best for themselves and their career.

On the other hand, I get why the league can't have all it's star players in only a few markets, so I don't blame them for challenging the players and at least trying to restrict. I just usually side with labor on these matters, unless the labor ends up killing the league and in turn costs all the other labor their jobs.

[IceCap]

Like I said elsewhere, you really can't compare an office job with that of a professional athlete. Your boss didn't spend millions to get you to work for him, and people don't pay thousands of dollars each for season ticket packages to watch you sell insurance.

That's not a one-for-one, ice_cap. The Hornets didn't pay Kobe anything and no Hornets fan spent a dime to see him play for the team.

You missed my point. I wasn't talking about Kobe Bryant specifically. I was talking about athletes using leverage to play where they want in general.

Sure it sucks from a fan perspective - I get that. As someone who hated JD Drew and Scott Boras for a while, I get that.

But by no means does it make anyone a bitch to do what they feel is best for themselves and their career.

I buy what you're selling here. I wouldn't say Eli Manning's a bitch, but I reserve the right to dislike him as a Chargers fan. Is it entirely logical? Nah, but sports rarely is.

On the other hand, I get why the league can't have all it's star players in only a few markets, so I don't blame them for challenging the players and at least trying to restrict. I just usually side with labor on these matters, unless the labor ends up killing the league and in turn costs all the other labor their jobs.

Well that's the thing. If all the top talent consolidates in a few markets (like what is happening in the NBA) then the whole league can suffer in the long run. I'm not saying I want forced parity but I do think a league is generally healthiest when more fans can see the best play the best instead of seeing the best beat up on a team of second-rate talent.

[Ateles fusciceps]

Kobe refused to play for over 90% of the league back in '96. Kobe told Charlotte they weren't good enough for him and that he would not play there under any circumstance. Now over 18 years later Kobe is running his mouth and implying Charlotte didn't want him and gave him away.

That is why Kobe is a bitch.

Save your breath, nobody cares or wants to hear people defend that jerk and kiss his ass. Kobe is a bitch, and a washed up basketball player.

[See Red]

Is Kobe forcing his way to LA even legitimately what happened? The Hornets agreed to the deal with the Lakers well before they picked Kobe as far as I've read. In fact, a Hornets scout at the time has said the deal was Vlade for a player to be named later and, "If I remember right, they didn't even tell us who they wanted us to pick until about five minutes before the pick was made. So it was never a matter of us actually drafting Kobe."

[Ateles fusciceps]

Is Kobe forcing his way to LA even legitimately what happened? The Hornets agreed to the deal with the Lakers well before they picked Kobe as far as I've read. In fact, a Hornets scout at the time has said the deal was Vlade for a player to be named later and, "If I remember right, they didn't even tell us who they wanted us to pick until about five minutes before the pick was made. So it was never a matter of us actually drafting Kobe."

Charlotte never said whether or not they wanted to keep Kobe. Personally I don't think they ever wanted him, they were looking to replace Mourning at the time. However, Kobe refused to workout for Charlotte & several other teams. Charlotte said that Kobe's agent made it clear he would not sign with them if they did draft him. They were told he would sit out or go overseas before playing in Charlotte. Then about 10 years ago a former front office person from Sacramento (possibly GM, can't remember who) said that the Kings, who picked ahead of Charlotte, really wanted Kobe but his agent had made it clear to the lotto teams that Kobe would only play for LA or another major market. That person said several top teams wanted him but passed because Kobe was refusing to play for small market teams. Charlotte may have wanted Kobe but they knew he wouldn't play for them. So who knows if they would've taken him to keep? Before the draft LA offered Divac for their pick & Charlotte agreed, as they felt he was a better value than anyone they could get at 13 & he filled the void left by Mourning.

[Lee Noire]

Here is an interesting read on LeBron being "selfish."

http://triangleoffense.com/features/lebron-james-is-acting-selfish-and-its-about-damn-time/?utm_campaign=complexmag+socialflow+07+2014&utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social