You Can Play

[Braden]

During the Rangers/Bruins game yesterday, a new campaign launched from Leafs GM Brian Burke & son, Flyers Scout Patrick Burke, called You Can Play.

I know that many of you might think that the concept of someone's sexual orientation being irrelevant to one's skills and content of their character is pretty simple. Still to far too many, it's not.

Personally, I really only started playing sports in gay-friendly leagues a couple of years ago, but almost all of my friends and teammates from these leagues had to deal with homophobia growing up. Some were publicly humiliated & even kicked off of their team. Even in 2012, this is common.

Seeing campaigns like this backed by players restores optimism that the tides are changing and gives me pride as a hockey player, NHL fan and a gay man. Hopefully soon enough there will be an environment where a professional athlete can be successful while out of the closet and nobody would care.

Reply or ignore if you like. This is an important issue to me and I felt that it at least needed to be mentioned.

[-kj]

You may remember there being an argument under this original post before. That's been sent to the Graveyard. I expect that all discussion from here on out will be civilized, and people will respond to things that are posted, rather than just the name of the poster. Thank you in advance.

[pianoknight]

Just playing devil's advocate here.

We allow athletes of different races and religions to play sports. And now there's a push for athletes of all sexual orientations. But what about females? Shouldn't females be given the same chance to suit up in MLB, the NBA, NFL, NHL, etc?

If we're going to allow all the other protected classes, why not women?

[charger77]

Just playing devil's advocate here.

We allow athletes of different races and religions to play sports. And now there's a push for athletes of all sexual orientations. But what about females? Shouldn't females be given the same chance to suit up in MLB, the NBA, NFL, NHL, etc?

If we're going to allow all the other protected classes, why not women?

Kinda has happened in the NHL with Mannon Rheaume and is currenlty happening in NASCAR.

Also, not completely the same but didn't the NBA experiment with female referees?

If the talant level is there, the leagues will do it. If I had to guess, the first woman in the Big 4 would be a female kicker in the NFL.

I've also always wondered why there is a PGA and a LPGA in "the real world" there isn't a Ford and a L-Ford. Is the reason because sports isn't "the real world"?

[Kevin W.]

That's a good point. Why don't the leagues allow female referees? A woman isn't going to call Andrew Bynum clotheslining JJ Barea any differently from a man.

[slapshot]

I think more sports will have females involved. I could see a baseball team signing a girl as a specialist (maybe middle relief, junk-ball pitcher). Specialty position over an every day player.

Some positions in sports don't necessarily favor one gender over another. I could see another woman goalie in the future. But since the sports are set up different for men and women (no checking in most women's leagues), it's doubtful you'd see a regular skater or defenseman. Men are just stronger and faster.

For football, it would most likely be a kicker or linesman. A different center of gravity could give a 300+ pound woman an advantage over a rushing defender, or vice versa.

For basketball, hard to say. Height isn't necessarily an advantage is someone is an outside shooter, so a woman could play guard or shooting forward. But not as a center or power forward...they're just not strong enough. It's 2012, and we still rarely see women 6'6"-6'8" dunk or rebound that high, yet men half a foot shorter are easily clearing the rim.

Generally speaking though, women would have to be significantly stronger and faster than a man of the same size to even get a look.

[Lights Out]

That's a good point. Why don't the leagues allow female referees? A woman isn't going to call Andrew Bynum clotheslining JJ Barea any differently from a man.

The NBA already has Violet Palmer. Unfortunately, she's no better at officiating than the male NBA refs.

[slapshot]

That's a good point. Why don't the leagues allow female referees? A woman isn't going to call Andrew Bynum clotheslining JJ Barea any differently from a man.

Interest. There just aren't enough capable women around to fill the spots.

Basketball has a lot of women involved, and they've broken the glass ceiling of the NBA.

My football organization has three or four women out of about 300 officials.

My baseball organization has maybe two. I think they gravitate to softball.

Women seem less likely to officiate a sport that they never played, so that explains the lower numbers in football and baseball.

[RedSox44]

That's a good point. Why don't the leagues allow female referees? A woman isn't going to call Andrew Bynum clotheslining JJ Barea any differently from a man.

Isn't there a female referee in the NBA, though? Didn't the always classy, eloquent and smart Tommy Heinsohn said she needed to "get back in the kitchen" after a foul call against a Celtic.

I thought I read about a female umpire working her way to the majors a few years ago, too.

[McCall]

Would a man ever be allowed to play in a women's league? No. I see no problem with having seperate leagues. It's just the way things are. While some women could probably compete with some men, it's a very low possibility, and it's better just to allow women to excel in their own leagues. It's not sexist, just nature. Golf and racing are different in the way they compete against each other. Other than cars bumping into one another, their's not physical contact and thus, no physical advantage/disadvantage with one over the other. Golf may have a bit of a gap as far as how strong women can swing/hit/drive the ball compared to men, but it can be fairly comparible. Other sports like basketball and football just give too much advantage to size, same can be said for hockey I guess, too. Baseball, while not necessarily having as much physical contact, does lend itself the possibility of having disadvantages.

[charger77]

Isn't there a female referee in the NBA, though? Didn't the always classy, eloquent and smart Tommy Heinsohn said she needed to "get back in the kitchen" after a foul call against a Celtic.

I think its safe to assume that the same type of trash talks is thrown at the male refs too.

[pianoknight]

Billie Jean King, anyone?

But yes, especially in physical contact sports, men are naturally stronger and more... violent, I guess?

I can't see a woman version of Ray Lewis. Just ain't happening.

[ninersdd]

Would a man ever be allowed to play in a women's league? No. I see no problem with having seperate leagues. It's just the way things are. While some women could probably compete with some men, it's a very low possibility, and it's better just to allow women to excel in their own leagues. It's not sexist, just nature. Golf and racing are different in the way they compete against each other. Other than cars bumping into one another, their's not

physical contact and thus, no physical advantage/disadvantage with one over the other. Golf may have a bit of a gap as far as how strong women can swing/hit/drive the ball compared to men, but it can be fairly comparible. Other sports like basketball and football just give too much advantage to size, same can be said for

hockey I guess, too. Baseball, while not necessarily having as much physical contact, does lend itself the possibility of having disadvantages.

What are the rules for high school sports? Would a girl be allowed to play on a boys team?(If they are good enough)

[charger77]

Billie Jean King, anyone?

Wasn't she in her prime (30) while Bobby Riggs was much older (55)?

Turns out there were actually 3 Battle of the Sexes matches.

[charger77]

Would a man ever be allowed to play in a women's league? No. I see no problem with having seperate leagues. It's just the way things are. While some women could probably compete with some men, it's a very low possibility, and it's better just to allow women to excel in their own leagues. It's not sexist, just nature. Golf and racing are different in the way they compete against each other. Other than cars bumping into one another, their's not

physical contact and thus, no physical advantage/disadvantage with one over the other. Golf may have a bit of a gap as far as how strong women can swing/hit/drive the ball compared to men, but it can be fairly comparible. Other sports like basketball and football just give too much advantage to size, same can be said for

hockey I guess, too. Baseball, while not necessarily having as much physical contact, does lend itself the possibility of having disadvantages.

What are the rules for high school sports? Would a girl be allowed to play on a boys team?(If they are good enough)

In Michigan they can provided there is a not a girls team for the same sport. That is how it was when I graduated in 1998. However, boys could not join a girls sport even if there wasn't a boys team as well.

Wouldn't this open up a pandoras box of Title IX and "seperate but equal" issues?

Title IX:

No person in the United States shall, on the basis of sex, be excluded from participation in, be denied the benefits of, or be subjected to discrimination under any education program or activity receiving Federal financial assistance...

Majority Opinion of Brown V. Board of Topeka Kansas 1954:

We conclude that, in the field of public education, the doctrine of "separate but equal" has no place. Separate educational facilities are inherently unequal. Therefore, we hold that the plaintiffs and others similarly situated for whom the actions have been brought are, by reason of the segregation complained of, deprived of the equal protection of the laws guaranteed by the Fourteenth Amendment.

The issue would be: Do after school sports count as school or benefits of education?

McCalls statement on contact sports does have merit, but what about the non-contact sports?

[slapshot]

What are the rules for high school sports? Would a girl be allowed to play on a boys team?(If they are good enough)

In Massachusetts, students of either gender are allowed to play on a team of the opposite gender if no such separate sport exists for them.

There are a number of boys playing on girls' field hockey, swimming and gymnastics teams.

Some girls do play baseball, but I don't know any boys playing softball.

There are a few girls playing football as well.

[charger77]

What are the rules for high school sports? Would a girl be allowed to play on a boys team?(If they are good enough)

In Massachusetts, students of either gender are allowed to play on a team of the opposite gender if no such separate sport exists for them.

There are a number of boys playing on girls' field hockey, swimming and gymnastics teams.

Some girls do play baseball, but I don't know any boys playing softball.

There are a few girls playing football as well.

For the simplicity of cost, you may see many high school sports going co-ed.

[Kevin W.]

For the simplicity of cost, you may see many high school sports going co-ed.

Wow, I never thought of it that way. With how education budgets are getting cut, that makes a lot of sense.

[charger77]

For the simplicity of cost, you may see many high school sports going co-ed.

Wow, I never thought of it that way. With how education budgets are getting cut, that makes a lot of sense.

Less coaches, less transportation fees, less liability insurance, less schedules to print, etc...

When you consider the notion of combining after school activities the savings could be quite huge.

[ninersdd]

There are a few problems to that though if they go coed. For example, I've seen coed indoor soccer leagues where a certain amount of girls are required to be on the field, and other rules. There will definitely have to be some rule changes to the sports to require the girls get playing time if a lot of schools go coed. Plus don't forget the inevitability if they go up against an all boys school, where they would be at a disadvantage.