NFL Merry-Go-Round: Relocation Roundelay

[dfwabel]

21 hours ago, LA_Angels said:

R.I.P Oakland Raiders.

 

Currently, there hasn't been any state or public money allotted to a venue, nor an actual site. Plus, the Raiders have yet to inform the league an intention to move. 

 

Most importantly, the developer, Majestic Realty, also told the SNTIC today that the local/state tax commitment was all or nothing.

Quote

 

Developers of a proposed NFL stadium in Las Vegas held firm that the public contribution for the project must be $750 million — or no deal.

 

“We are not negotiable,” Las Vegas Sands President Rob Goldstein said during today’s Southern Nevada Tourism Infrastructure Committee meeting. “The numbers aren’t going down. If we can’t get $750 (million), we respectfully thank you and move on.”

Timing is also of the essence, developers said, because the Oakland Raiders need to begin crafting their pitch to the NFL to relocate the team to Las Vegas.

Goldstein’s comments followed a presentation from backers that showcased glitzy renderings of an NFL stadium at two sites: the northwest corner of the Bali Hai golf course and land north of Russell Road and west of Interstate 15.

Those locations offer the best accessibility, developers said, although they noted other proposed locations are not entirely off the table.

 

 

The only new thing about today's news is the stadium design has changed. Origianlly, it was just going to be the same design which Majestic has proposed for UNLV for the past five years.  Now, it looks like the Carson design, but just for the Raiders. 

[TBGKon]

This is essentially CYOA, nothing saying theyre moving, but grabbing the trademark just in case.

[BeerGuyJordan]

Christ, $750 Million? How does a city even justify that? There's almost no way the economic impact of a team could be that great for a city. This public funding for billionaires to have a new stadium garbage is way out of hand.

[dfwabel]

1 hour ago, BeerGuyJordan said:

Christ, $750 Million? How does a city even justify that? There's almost no way the economic impact of a team could be that great for a city. This public funding for billionaires to have a new stadium garbage is way out of hand.

It is a percentage of the hotel tax.

[Gothamite]

It's a percentage of the hotel tax that can't go to tourism efforts or the other things that the hotel tax is supposed to go towards. 

 

It's nothing short of offensive, to give a man like Sheldon Adelson that much public money.  Not to mention an NFL team, which is essentially a license for Davis to print money. 

 

And their demand is "non-negotiable"?

 

 every last one of them.  

[leopard88]

9 minutes ago, Gothamite said:

It's a percentage of the hotel tax that can't go to tourism efforts or the other things that the hotel tax is supposed to go towards. 

 

It's nothing short of offensive, to give a man like Sheldon Adelson that much public money.  Not to mention an NFL team, which is essentially a license for Davis to print money. 

 

And their demand is "non-negotiable"?

 

 every last one of them.  

 

Agreed wholeheartedly.

 

With regard to the bolded text, the "hotel tax" trick is the oldest one in the book.  It is used to support the claim that only out-of-towners are paying the tax, so locals shouldn't worry about it.

 

As Gothamite points out, the source of the revenue is, at best, only part of the issue.  Regardless of where the money comes from, it isn't being used for the benefit of the locals when otherwise it could.

[DG_ThenNowForever]

Potentially ignorant question, but isn't the Strip -- what most people consider to be "Las Vegas" -- not actually in Las Vegas, but instead in Paradise, NV? So would the hotel taxes collected from "Las Vegas" be in old Vegas, or in the newer, more popular not-Vegas?

 

I've long thought of the entire Vegas area as resource drain we'd all be better off without, but there's a $750 million wealth transfer proposed, and I'm curious where specifically the money is going from, and where it could otherwise be allocated. Las Vegas proper? or Paradise?  

 

[TBGKon]

I had read on Football Stadium Digest the following:

Quote

Under a proposal this expected to be presented on Thursday, the committee will unveil a funding model that includes two separate hotel tax increases—one of 0.7% for hotels on the strip, and a reduced 0.5% bump for hotels located within 25 miles of the facility. The plan also calls for the creation of a stadium authority that consists of seven board members that are appointed by a combination of the Governor of Nevada, county commissioners, and developers.

 

It doesn't sound like its necessarily the city, but it might be.

[dfwabel]

It doesn't really matter since the legislature will have the last word.  Any and all of these hotel tax increases are approved at the state level.

 

Majectic did pull a funny in giving the SNTIC a PDF regarding TIF Districts for recent stadium/arena projects and they included two which have been miserable: Columbus and Louisville!

 

All of yesterday's documents can be found HERE

 

[Cosmic]

The Strip is unincorporated, but it still falls under the jurisdiction of its county.

[dfwabel]

8 hours ago, Cosmic said:

The Strip is unincorporated, but it still falls under the jurisdiction of its county.

As written on this thread before, it doesn't matter as this is a state isssue.

 

Recall, the Nevada Legislative meets every odd year and to get the $750M from the state in 2016, a special legislative session is required. The committee results being pushed to September doesn't help Adelson/Raiders. Governor really doesn't want to call a session if those not from southern Nevada will vote in favor.

[The_Admiral]

11 hours ago, leopard88 said:

With regard to the bolded text, the "hotel tax" trick is the oldest one in the book.  It is used to support the claim that only out-of-towners are paying the tax, so locals shouldn't worry about it.

 

People who believe hotel taxes are only a burden on out-of-towners should look at Chicago, its exodus of conventions to bumf-cking Indianoplace, and the pursuant loss of tax revenue.

[Cosmic]

I know this is getting OT, but hotel taxes are the lowest form of scum that other scum scrapes off the bottom of its shoes. Visitors in hotels are hardly some burden on society.  The hotel pays property taxes. Regular sales tax on hotel rooms is fine. Other than that, visitors are seeing tourist attractions and patronizing local businesses. Most people are eating in restaurants or buying prepared food, not buying tax-free groceries. It's honest-to-goodness fresh money coming into your area, and people all over the country place ridiculous taxes on this beneficial activity.

[BBTV]

Until ABnB and similar businesses start being regulated (which I'm sure will happen), cities are going to put hotels out of business with these taxes.  Conventioneers will almost always opt for hotels, as will corporate travelers, but across the world, I know fewer and fewer people under 50 that choose hotels.  The price increases of hotels due to taxes are only adding straws to the camel's back.

 

O/T - what part of Seoul should I get an ABnB in?

[HedleyLamarr]

2 hours ago, Cosmic said:

I know this is getting OT, but hotel taxes are the lowest form of scum that other scum scrapes off the bottom of its shoes. Visitors in hotels are hardly some burden on society.  The hotel pays property taxes. Regular sales tax on hotel rooms is fine. Other than that, visitors are seeing tourist attractions and patronizing local businesses. Most people are eating in restaurants or buying prepared food, not buying tax-free groceries. It's honest-to-goodness fresh money coming into your area, and people all over the country place ridiculous taxes on this beneficial activity.

I think that "Performer's Tax" or "Jock Tax" (some cities/states have taxes on athletes and/or performers that visit a particular place....I believe Nashville/Tennessee has this) is a bigger scam, but the hotel-motel tax isn't far behind.....

[BBTV]

33 minutes ago, HedleyLamarr said:

I think that "Performer's Tax" or "Jock Tax" (some cities/states have taxes on athletes and/or performers that visit a particular place....I believe Nashville/Tennessee has this) is a bigger scam, but the hotel-motel tax isn't far behind.....

 

Is it though?  Technically they're working in that city, even if only for a day or two.  My city wage tax is 4% (and I don't even work in the city!) so shouldn't they be subject to that for the amount they earn while working in the city?

[The_Admiral]

The Tennessee jock tax was structured so that the revenue was sent back to the Crooked Predators, and I believe it was also a flat fee rather than a percentage, so a callup for a visiting team could not only hypothetically lose money by playing in Nashville back when the league minimum was below $500,000, but pay the Perds for the privilege of playing against them. I believe it was deemed unconstitutional and guys got their money back. 

[BBTV]

Yeah, that's ridiculous. 

[dfwabel]

1 hour ago, BringBackTheVet said:

 

O/T - what part of Seoul should I get an ABnB in?

Do what you want, but if you're there on a Friday or Saturday, visit the Bamdokkaebi Night Market at the Yeouido Hangang Park on the Cascade Plaza along the Han.

[HedleyLamarr]

5 hours ago, the admiral said:

The Tennessee jock tax was structured so that the revenue was sent back to the Crooked Predators, and I believe it was also a flat fee rather than a percentage, so a callup for a visiting team could not only hypothetically lose money by playing in Nashville back when the league minimum was below $500,000, but pay the Perds for the privilege of playing against them. I believe it was deemed unconstitutional and guys got their money back. 

I had forgotten about that money going to the team instead of the state (I assume the tax officially went to the owner of the arena, which generally also owns the team).  Dirtier than I thought.