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Everything posted by SFGiants58

  1. Eh, I'm not keen on the logo. Never have been. Honestly, the best take on the logo I've seen is @mcrosby's version: No drop shadows, a distinctive font, and the white keyline can easily become gold on white backgrounds.
  2. I'm torn between the 2010-13 version and a cleaned up version of those (no placket trim, different sleeve logo, etc.). I know @the admiral really doesn't like that script, but I love it. On a not-too-dissimilar note: I do sometimes wish the Giants and Dodgers became the Seals and Angels upon moving, keeping their colors but making some adjustments to "adopt" those old identities (e.g., Angels adding light blue and using red for halos, Seals using cursive scripts and a less rigid "SF," etc.). Of course, the Los Angeles AL team would be the Stars (Hollywood Stars, Los Angeles Stars, California/Anaheim Stars, Inland Empire Stars, etc.) and the A's would be unchanged.
  3. Well, that too, probably more than moving to the suburbs. But the suburbs move definitely didn’t help in that regard. Either way, Benguiat really should be the Hawks’ font again.
  4. Fair point. They’re the ones who white flighted to the suburbs, after all. I still often wish the Braves rebranded upon moving to Atlanta. Atlanta Firebirds always sounded cool to me, what with the whole “Sherman’s fire acting as a big reset on the city” development. That way, both the city and team would “rise” from the ashes of their past. Of course, the Braves’ “A” logo is more of a symbol of “The ATL” than any other sports design (the Pac-Hawk, the Falcons’ logos, and probably United’s crest). It’s weird, as I don’t want to lose that symbol but wouldn’t mind a total rebrand in the ‘60s. The Braves could never really rebrand now. Maybe change the tomahawk to a firefighter’s ax and drop the tomahawk chop out of basic human decency, but the name, colors, and scripts stay.
  5. Maybe as a wordmark font, like the A’s and Futura Condensed Bold?
  6. Indeed it is! Benguiat. Much like how Penumbra Semi-Serif should be the “Toronto Sports Font,” Benguiat should be the “Atlanta Sports Font.”
  7. Well hey, I didn't know many of those guys played for the Cardinals! I did know Jake Plummer played for them, but I think about ASU and the Broncos more with Jake. I'm not passing a test on famous NFL players pre-2000 anytime soon.
  8. Sure as heck doesn’t stop ASU!
  9. Yup. Outside of Larry Fitzgerald, the only other football Cardinal most non-fans know is Pat Tillman or (maybe) Kurt Warner. Heck, when the Cardinals do redesign, I kind of expect them to follow in Arizona State's example of deifying Pat Tillman. Using the home or road jersey from his tenure as a throwback to "honor" him or going for a camo design. Heck, I'm sure the copy writers will invoke Tillman throughout the uniform press release! If it works for ASU, then it must work for the Cardinals, right?
  10. “Man, I should have listened to Perceptor. Simple brains and brute strength is never a good combo.”
  11. Now that I'm aware of your angle, I must say I've grown very fond of your work. Vikings: the elimination of black, making the stripes consistent, and the new striping motif are all fantastic! It makes a good set even better. The alternate could use white numbers for legibility, but the idea behind it is excellent and distinctive. New York Football Giants: I do like the new logo and the whole "perspective" technique on the helmet and numbers (although, as @MJD7 said, it might be a logistical issue). The King Kong design I could give or take, as it is a tad unbalanced. Still, it'd work well as an alternate logo (far better than a "giant player towering over the stadium" design). My one suggestion would be to add a blue outline to the pants stripe, since you use a consistent blue/red/blue stripe throughout the set. Patriots: Your Patriot Pat update is probably the best I've seen to date, while the inclusion of the New England Pine is an inspired touch. The stripes could use some mixing up, with a red/white/navy/white/red design on white backgrounds and navy/white/red/white/navy on navy backgrounds (a la the Patriot Pat jerseys). However, the way they are now certainly works for the team. The alternate is a fantastic vintage design. I wonder how that helmet would look with the primary set. Saints: The new logo could use a tiny refinement to make the side plumes as thick as the football plume in the center. Aside from that, I've really got no complaints about the primary set. The tincture-following design really improves upon anything the Saints have had prior, with no white on gold backgrounds. Maybe adding a black key shape/line to the sleeve logo on the white jerseys would help. The new font is also fantastic, not feeling to gimmicky or crazy. The alternate is a fantastic take or the Mardi Gras colors, while the stripes look good on the uniform. I wonder how well they'd work on the primary set? Jets: You've done good work in fully unlocking the potential of the latest redesign, going all-in on italics and modern striping. The alternate is also a fantastic take on the "military jets" angle that pops up on the boards every once in a while. Steelers: The new logo is a fantastic and far more original design for the team. The new font and stripes are also good additions to the set. I'd maybe suggest having white as the color of the outer stripes on black and inverting the stripe colors on the white, but that's just personal preference. I love how the alternate incorporates bits of the Pittsburgh crest, which all teams in the city shoudl strive to do. Eagles: It's a beautiful simplification of their current look with an inventive new striping pattern. I would suggest adding silver or white pants with a green/white/green/silver/green pattern, just to avoid monochrome while still preserving the stripe pattern. The vintage alternate is very tasteful and not too bright, like the Yellow Jackets throwbacks. 49ers: This is probably my favorite concept you've done! It's an excellent update of the logo (eliminating the unneeded black), uses a modern font that doesn't stray too far away from the team's established look, restores the proper sleeve stripes, and does an inventive take on the orangey red shade/the helmet stripes. Well done indeed! The alternate is also a fun look, one that doesn't have that dingy aesthetic of the all-black garbage the squad tried to wear. Seahawks: It's a fantastic simplification of their current design, one that really takes advantage of that beautiful lime green and uses silver in all the right places. The updated logo is a fantastic way to work the city initial into the design, while the throwback-like set really improves upon the original bird logo. Buccaneers: You've done well with the new number font and refinement of the logo (eliminating black in favor of pewter accents). The gold/creamsicle orange tooth is a lovely touch. That alternate might be one of my favorite "vintage" designs in this series, with the patterns and the jolly roger. Redtails: This might be my favorite Washington NFL design I've seen in a long time. The logo is particularly beautiful (airmen's badge, DC flag stripes and stars, and Art Deco-like "W"), while the tincture-obeying stripes and lettering are fantastic. The font fits well for the "airmen" theme, while the little dashes of red are an excellent modern touch. The alternate is also a fantastic "city" design, with the expanded plane logo and the fighter-like striping. I think I've come around to it. You've got a fantastic eye for assembling identities and making them feel cohesive and distinctly "your own." Good work all around!
  12. I'd love that design, albeit with a modified Albertus "W." The team really should have stuck by Albertus, as it's perfect for the team. Neutraface (like they use now) or light Futura is good as well, but Albertus really nails it.
  13. Also, with drop shadows, you can have one-color NOB's or drop-shadow NOB's (in a condensed font). Granted, NOB's with shadow often look awful. The Giants' gold shadows, because they blend into the orange, are a bit better than the dark ones. The alternative might not be better. The Lakers one is slightly excusable, due to the outline on the front wordmark. Generally, use one-color NOB's with shadowed or triple-layer numbers.
  14. I'm wearing a fursuit when sporting events with people resume. Let's see how many people judge me when I try to recreate the legendary Carpet Sample suit. I'd also suggest wearing a Kero the Wolf-style suit, but furries in the know will probably attack you.
  15. MOD EDIT: No discussion of Native American naming controversies.
  16. Fair points indeed. I figured that I’m just not the target audience for this series and a lot of the designs simply aren’t my taste. They’re very well made, but don’t appeal to my preferred aesthetic. Ultimately, I’ll back off the harsher stuff and look at them within his aesthetic. After all, all scores should be relative to their respective projects. Heck, I know I have a very specific style in my designs, something that I know won’t appeal to everyone. I want to be more respectful and going forward, I will be.
  17. If we want barberpole, I made a design that was a simplification of @hockey week's Peace Tower concept. This better reflects the name and the history (but I can do without the random stopping of the stripes on the back, now that I think of it). I firmly believe that you either have to go full barberpole or full Roman, with no overlap between the two. Also, if there's no center stripe, what's the point of barberpole?
  18. That's fantastic to hear! Dude, I'm sorry if I was rude or inappropriate. I've been having a bit of a pain getting a VPN working on my computer and it kind of fed into my overall mood. I apologize for anything I did to upset you or attack you.
  19. Indeed it is. You can ignore me as “not getting it,” but I seriously do believe there are more misses than hits. I’d just like to see a more mixed reaction to the designs, with incorporations of critiques into updates. That’s all I want. I was thorough, praised what I liked, and rightfully critiqued the stuff that I didn’t. My language was probably too harsh, but I felt it needed to be said. Which I appreciate and laud, especially when a designer tries out a bunch of critiques and ultimately finds that they improve a design. Sure, but there’s also been the gaslighting or me to try to make me look like a hateful monster. I’m not trying to bring him down, I’m just offering a contrasting opinion. Really? Jealousy? I’m not jealous at all. They’re not pointlessly personal, either. I just felt like I needed to say these things so that he can learn and incorporate these changes into his designs.
  20. OK, I stand corrected. Except that’s not what I said at all. You’re misinterpreting me expressing my issues with the designs and their response. I want you to see room for improvement, not just “bringing you down a peg.” You’re misrepresenting my points. It’s not personal. I think you’re very talented and hard-working, it’s just that I think your designs here can be better. I got personal earlier because I was being attacked a little and got a bit heated. I apologize for that.
  21. I would disagree, as there are a lot of designs that bomb in here. I fully accept that a lot of attempts at distinctive design will miss, but the misses outweigh the hits here. Many of them have baffling decisions that come across as "change for change's sake." While that's certainly a part of it, I do believe there is a legitimately constructive part of it. Hearing 100% praise builds ego and resistance to change/updating your designs. I fundamentally believe that pure praise is worse for designers that straight-up bashing. I'm incorporating plenty of constructive points, trying to highlight what works and what doesn't work in the design. It happens to be that I think a lot of the design elements don't work or are downgrades from extant designs by virtue of being too gimmicky/minor league. Also, I don't think I've seen mcrosby ever listen to criticism on how to improve what he's doing by making updates, at least in this venue. With your "I attack highly-praised designers" point, the only example I can name is Sparky Chewbarky. Like, with Sparky Chewbarky's NHL Seattle designs, I legitimately thought most of them were overdesigned, looked more minor-league than NHL-worthy, and relied too much on small details that would be lost upon resizing. He responded to criticism well enough (actually doing updates), until he got so attached to the Kraken name that he thought it best to attack other posters behind their back. Aside from Chewbarky, what other designers have I "attacked" in this fashion?
  22. On the contrary, you’ve gone hard into the gimmicky category. As I said, the sublimation, neon signage, oversized stripes, some arguably illegible alternates, a few poor design choices, all reek of Brandiose-style gimmicky. I appreciate the bold shapes direction, but you’re getting close to a goofy aesthetic. A lot of these designs would be roasted if they ever took the field. I know that’s a CCSLC paradox (praise it in 2D, but make it real and it’s often disliked), but it’s something I figured I should mention. A greater sense of realism and restraint would be ideal.
  23. On the contrary: you’ve done very well with these next four designs! KC: I love how you’ve handled the beveling in a tasteful way that ties in with the logo (which is an excellent modernization). It’s fantastic. Chargers: It’s good you didn’t divert too much from the excellent update they did. I’d maybe ditch the white panels on the blue and yellow jerseys, but that’s just me. The alternate is also pretty sweet. Raiders: You thankfully didn’t mess too much with the home and road sets. The font is fine, but I still think it needs to be block. The alternate, however, is a fantastic shot at a “neon” design. It’s absolutely unbecoming of the Raiders’ brand, but it’s still a fantastic design that’s not too crazy. Dolphins: I really like the new stripes, the sunburst, and the addition of pink instead of orange. The new logo is similarly fantastic. The vapor wave jersey, despite what my previous post indicates, is a truly fantastic and inspired design. It should never, ever be worn on a football field, but I love it nonetheless. I know this may sound cruel, but I tend to think of your designs as being a bit Brandiose-ish in how gimmicky they can be. While you have plenty of good stuff, there’s also a lot that would and should never work on the football field. Then again, I think that’s kind of the whole point.
  24. Really, you want to laugh at constructive criticism. Just because I don’t like some of it, I should laughed at?
  25. Cardinals: I appreciate the craftsmanship, the inventive uniform design (that’s not a mess of panels and piping), and the new alternate (the font is also fantastic), but I absolutely dislike the new logo. It’s too squat for my tastes. I’d recommend stripping out the tan as well on the road jersey and helmet, since it just looks kinda muddy. Falcons: your logo is just as ugly as it was when you debuted it, but thankfully you’ve abandoned the volt color. I don’t like the current logo, but even that is better-crafted than your design, which is too jagged and squat for the team’s visual continuity. The uniform design is an upgrade, but the font is still awful. Ravens: I get what you’re going for here, but it could’ve been done in a far more restrained way. The number font is entirely too modern and the purple barely reads on the jerseys. The logo is an upgrade, but it could use a lighter purple. I’d go back to the drawing board for a more subtle direction for the uniforms. Bills: it’s a good modern take on the team, what with the nickel color, updated logo, tying the stripes into the logo, etc. The number font is a definite downgrade for me, as basic block is far more appropriate for the Bills. The alternate is inventive, but maybe using the royal blue of the flag would be better. Panthers: this is a very definite upgrade! The logo doesn’t look nearly as messy as the new panther, while the uniforms have tasteful updates to the original design. The plum purple is a very inspired choice, which I like. Your alternate is a good one, but I’m not sure I can get behind the Panthers doing a racing-style design. My one complaint would be that a white or plum helmet might suit the team better. Bears: I’d make the center stripe and the GSH white, for legibility/to match the road pants. The alternate is a pretty good design. Bengals: you’ve done good work on the logo and jersey front, using panels in a tasteful manner. The black jersey with super low-visibility stripes really doesn’t do it for me. Maybe a throwback or a pure color flip would work? Browns: the enlarging of the stripe and making it consistent on the helmets and jerseys (but not the pants?) really downgrades it from the new uniforms. “Floating stripes” like on the road jersey are invariably ugly, IMO, as are the “englarged” stripes that Nike tries to push in college football. The alternate is good for what it is, trying to do the vintage football aesthetic. Your logo is a decent take on how to do a “CB” insignia with the helmet stripe, but the “C” is too squat for me. Cowboys: you picked the most hideous of the silvers to brand around. The uniforms well-designed (esp. the slab-serif), but incorporating some silver into the home/road stripes would have been welcome. Broncos: it’s a good modernization of the D-horse, but I really can’t go for another revival of the ‘60s sleeves or the overly-thick (and logo-ed!) pants stripes. The side panels really do look so much better, which your alternate shows. I’d base the set off that uniform, instead of the overused sleeve design. Lions: you’ve done a fantastic job with the logo and the “muscle car” design. I do wish the helmet stripe carried over to all the uniform elements. It’s better looking that the thick stripes. The number font could better reflect “muscle car” fonts, instead of being a generic modern number design. The alternate looks good, what with the sublimated chest design. Maybe drop the “Motor City” wordmark to leave that goofiness for the NBA. Packers: using the Bears’ striping pattern on the jerseys was a big mistake. I’d prefer to use the current stripes on the green and current Browns-like stripes on the road (i.e., gold never touches white, basic tincture rules). The updated logo and stencil fonts are fantastic (modern but still traditional-looking), as is the green throwback. Texans: with the old west design, please use the “HT” on the helmet instead of the current logo. The current logo is far too modern for the uniform design. Said modern/vintage design looks fantastic, really carving out an aesthetic niche for the team. The alternate is the best place for the current logo, as it’s more modern overall. Colts: you’ve done good work with the C/horseshoe, as well as the grommet design. Slab-serif is nice to see again (albeit bolder than the Cowboys’ design). The alternate has barely legible numbers and an overly-gimmicky design, but I’m not sure what you’d want to replace it with in the set. Overall, I’m not nearly as bullish as a lot of other posters throwing glowing praise in your direction. You have a lot of good ideas, but so much of it is poorly-realized or overly-gimmicky. I don’t mean to sound rude, but there are downgrades aplenty here. I know you’re a very talented and hard-working designer, but you need to refine this stuff a little bit more.