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Pac-10 Expansion


AJM

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Reno and Las Vegas are an 8 hour drive from each other unlike the other pac10 rival schools which are close(except for the Washingtons)

As is Tucson and Tempe, It takes anywhere from 6-8 hours to reach Tucson

Huh? I've been through there a few times and its more like 2-3 from Phoenix to Tucson

Depends on the traffic, no traffic it takes me an hour and a half easily usually takes me medium traffic 3-6 hours, but when it is heavy traffic, it takes 8

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Reno and Las Vegas are an 8 hour drive from each other unlike the other pac10 rival schools which are close(except for the Washingtons)

As is Tucson and Tempe, It takes anywhere from 6-8 hours to reach Tucson

Huh? I've been through there a few times and its more like 2-3 from Phoenix to Tucson

Depends on the traffic, no traffic it takes me an hour and a half easily usually takes me medium traffic 3-6 hours, but when it is heavy traffic, it takes 8

The difference between that and the Nevadas is that its a direct interstate from the two cities. In Nevada you have to use mostly two lane freeways to get to the two major cities, which are obviously slower

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Reno and Las Vegas are an 8 hour drive from each other unlike the other pac10 rival schools which are close(except for the Washingtons)

As is Tucson and Tempe, It takes anywhere from 6-8 hours to reach Tucson

Huh? I've been through there a few times and its more like 2-3 from Phoenix to Tucson

Depends on the traffic, no traffic it takes me an hour and a half easily usually takes me medium traffic 3-6 hours, but when it is heavy traffic, it takes 8

Standard length from Phoenix/Tempe to Tucson is 1.5 to 2 hours with mild traffic, however with Tucson expanding lanes and ramp access on the I-10, it takes longer to get into Tucson because you have to get off on the Orange Grove exit and take surface streets the remainder of the way. Hopefully they finish that project soon.

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Reno and Las Vegas are an 8 hour drive from each other unlike the other pac10 rival schools which are close(except for the Washingtons)

As is Tucson and Tempe, It takes anywhere from 6-8 hours to reach Tucson

Huh? I've been through there a few times and its more like 2-3 from Phoenix to Tucson

Depends on the traffic, no traffic it takes me an hour and a half easily usually takes me medium traffic 3-6 hours, but when it is heavy traffic, it takes 8

Yeah, difference between Tuscon and Phoenix, and Reno and Vegas is distance, not traffic. Reno to Vegas is more comparible to a drive like San Francisco to Los Angeles, even further actually.

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Reno and Las Vegas are an 8 hour drive from each other unlike the other pac10 rival schools which are close(except for the Washingtons)

As is Tucson and Tempe, It takes anywhere from 6-8 hours to reach Tucson

Huh? I've been through there a few times and its more like 2-3 from Phoenix to Tucson

Depends on the traffic, no traffic it takes me an hour and a half easily usually takes me medium traffic 3-6 hours, but when it is heavy traffic, it takes 8

Standard length from Phoenix/Tempe to Tucson is 1.5 to 2 hours with mild traffic, however with Tucson expanding lanes and ramp access on the I-10, it takes longer to get into Tucson because you have to get off on the Orange Grove exit and take surface streets the remainder of the way. Hopefully they finish that project soon.

There is this invention called an "airplane"......

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Reno to Vegas is more comparible to a drive like San Francisco to Los Angeles, even further actually.

Compounded by the fact that the most direct route between Nevada's only two metro areas is mostly two-lane US 95.

Granted, there is no direct interstate connecting San Francisco to Los Angeles either, but the US 101 corridor between those two cities is mostly Interstate-standard freeway.

and there is that other thing......on US 101 there are at least some semi-major cities like Monterey, San Loser Abysmal, Santa Barbara, etc. On US 95 between Reno and Las Vegas is a whole lot of nothing.

O/T - there has been increasing talk of a new north-south Interstate (possibly designated Interstate 11) that would connect the cities from south to north, of Phoenix, Las Vegas, Reno, and Boise. Don't know how close it is to becoming reality though, or given the sparse population density of the Nevada portion of that proposed corridor, that it would make very much sense.

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Reno and Las Vegas are an 8 hour drive from each other unlike the other pac10 rival schools which are close(except for the Washingtons)

As is Tucson and Tempe, It takes anywhere from 6-8 hours to reach Tucson

Huh? I've been through there a few times and its more like 2-3 from Phoenix to Tucson

Depends on the traffic, no traffic it takes me an hour and a half easily usually takes me medium traffic 3-6 hours, but when it is heavy traffic, it takes 8

Standard length from Phoenix/Tempe to Tucson is 1.5 to 2 hours with mild traffic, however with Tucson expanding lanes and ramp access on the I-10, it takes longer to get into Tucson because you have to get off on the Orange Grove exit and take surface streets the remainder of the way. Hopefully they finish that project soon.

There is this invention called an "airplane"......

True, but it's more of a convenience to go to Tucson by car. By the time it takes by Airplane you'd already be in Arizona South

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This topic has come up on a few occassions at a college sports board. I had a long drawn out post ready for that site, but the db crashed before saving my post. I never tried again, and can no longer find the data that supported my posts so I can only summarize here with a disclaimer that the information was accurate as of a year ago or so, but I cannot provide supporting evidence. So on to the actual post.

Pac-10 expansion should it occur will need to bring strong academic schools, at least one new major market, and the schools must be strong athletically as well. It must be remembered in the early 90's when PSU joined the Big-10 the Pac-10 sent overtures to Texas and Colorado. Neither school is likely today. In the data I found the exising Pac-10 members were all in the top 80 or so academically in the US. So candidate schools must fit this profile. Most if not all are also top 100 research institutes as well, again this probably needs to be matched as well.

***BYU is a non-starter for the Pac-10. It is not because they are private but rather because they do not play on Sunday. This will not work for Pac-10 scheduling, and is unlikely to change for either instution or conference. BYU was very good academically IIRC, not so much on the research front. They would bring the Salt Lake city market.

***Utah is a very likely candidate, they are getting stronger athletically, probably the best of the non-BCS schools for the revenue sports. I don't know much about their 'Olympic' sports which are important in the Pac-10, perhaps moreso than other conferences. But joining the Pac-10 would allow for gradual improvement of these sports due to more income. Utah ranked very highly in terms of academics and research and therefore fit this requirement very well. They would provide the SLC market as well.

***UC Davis, perhaps a lesser known UC system school that has just recently moved to D1. Athletics are strong for a newly transitioned school but are not even currently WAC level let alone Pac-10. Academics and Research are good to very good. No new market included though this would strengthen the Sacramento market. Doubtful that any 'lesser' UC or Cal State school is ever allowed in as a full member.

***UC San Diego, see UC Davis. Currently D3 non-scholarship, athletic powerhouse. Also a research and academic powerhouse. If this school ever wanted to be D1 it could probably do so easily. No new market, but solidifies the San Diego market. Doubtful that any 'lesser' UC or Cal State school is ever allowed in as a full member. Correction, now D2 with limited scholarships due to D2 by-laws.

***Hawaii, this school has a fantastic location, and a decent sports program. No natural travel partner. Not sure about academics or research, I suspect both are good if not outstanding. One possible advantage is that I believe UH grants in state tuition to all residents of the pacific coast states. Brings the Honolulu market.

***Boise State, this school was a juco in the not to distant past. Rising athletics programs. Not a big academic or research institute at this point as far as I know. This would be a surprise pick.

***San Diego State, part of the Cal State System. Probably just does not offer enough, mediocre athletics, nothing special academically or in research, not likely. Solidifies San Diego market.

***Fresno State, see San Diego State only better athletics. No real market to speak of.

***San Jose State, see SDSU or FSU.

***Colorado State, the Pac-10 wanted CU but that is not going to happen. CSU is strong academically, and fit the research profile as well. Athletics are not as strong as Utah, but could be a good match in time. I think Olympics sports are a bit better off at CSU. Would bring a decent share of the Denver market, CU would still dominate that market, but this would be a toehold for the Pac-10. Would provide a travel partner for Utah, while not rivals the two have been in the same conference since the 60's first the WAC and now the MWC.

***Air Force Academy, this 'school' would probably be an ideal candidate from an academic stand point. Olympic sports are well represented, as I believe the service academies pretty much carry everything. Just not sure the Pac would go for an academy. This school while close to Denver probably does not provide a market to speak of, as the students are much less likely to settle in or around Denver or the Springs post graduation.

***UNLV, would bring the Las Vegas market and a nice trip but nothing else. Athletics are not that good, academics are not great, not sure about research.

***Nevada, nothing special here either. Athletics are improving, but it would take a long time to be competitive in the Pac-10. Academics and research are not bad but are not Pac-10 caliber at this time either.

So in summary Utah is the most logical fit, and assuming BYU is not acceptable, the only non-bcs attached school in the west that could conceivably partner with Utah is Colorado State. Though to be fair I did not look at UNM. But at this time Pac-10 expansion does not seem likely. That could change if the Big-10 ever goes to 12.

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how can travel be to expensive for the PAC 10to go to Hawaii,but not for the WAC? is there anything more "pacific" than Hawaii?

It's not about playing in Hawaii, it's having Hawaii go onto the main land. Remember, the WAC is the largest conference in the FBS level in terms of geography (Hawaii to Louisiana). Hawaii has to play four games every year on the road in WAC play and if it includes a trip to Ruston, Louisiana, then that's a good chunk of miles.

 

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All this talk of Pac-10 expansion but how about the Mountain West expanding to 12 schools and becoming an official BCS Conference:

Pacific Division

BYU, Fresno State, Nevada, San Diego State, UNLV, Utah

Mountain Division

Air Force, Boise State, Colorado State, New Mexico, TCU, Wyoming

This would leave the WAC a mess but maybe in 7 or 8 years Sacramento State, UC Davis and Cal Poly might be FBS programs (who knows?) and could join the conference:

WAC (2015):

Cal Poly, Hawaii, Idaho, New Mexico State, Sacramento State, San Jose State, UC Davis, Utah State

Also, Louisiana Tech might be invited to join Conference USA if it loses a program to the Big East

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Is Arizona State one of the greatest institutions in the world when it comes to ACADEMICS AND RESEARCH? No major university is the recipient of more slagging than Arizona State. Except maybe Florida State. My point stands, though.

♫ oh yeah, board goes on, long after the thrill of postin' is gone ♫

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Is Arizona State one of the greatest instututions in the world when it comes to ACADEMICS AND RESEARCH? No major university is the recipient of more slagging than Arizona State. Except maybe Florida State. My point stands, though.

If Academics and Research = Smokin' hot women, ASU and FSU are tops on that list... :D

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Is Arizona State one of the greatest instututions in the world when it comes to ACADEMICS AND RESEARCH? No major university is the recipient of more slagging than Arizona State. Except maybe Florida State. My point stands, though.

Wow you have certainly offended me. I didn't go to Arizona State University to just "party", have you know that it is a great university for ACADEMICS

  • W.P. Carey of Business is ranked one of higher Academically Business Schools in the Nation.
  • Our Education Department is ranked in the top 20 in the nation
  • We have a top notch Engineering Program
  • Our Walter Chronkite School of Journalism and Mass Communication is one of the highest schools for journalism and communication in the nation and the world(which I am a graduate of) As well as our Hugh Downs School of Communication
  • The Sandra Day O' Connor school of Law is one of the most underrated law programs in the nation
  • Our Public Relations Program is top in the Nation
  • College of Design is highly ranked

Also the fact we are the largest Public RESEARCH University in the United States.

Please think about how you think it before you say it. ASU may have the distinction of being of being a party school, but so many students come from out of state to come here to get a better education.

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Just to clarify, but my post above was in no way meant to offend anyone, just to have a little fun. :D

To Clarify, ASU Girls are hot :D, but ASU is a great institution, we may not be PrinC!eton or Yale, but Arizona State is a great institution for students

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how can travel be to expensive for the PAC 10to go to Hawaii,but not for the WAC? is there anything more "pacific" than Hawaii?

It is not just the football expense, but all sports. The pac-10 has for as long as I can remember had natural travel partners. Meaning in hoops you traveled to Arizona and played a game on Thursday and Sunday. That does not work easily with UH.

Just to clarify, but my post above was in no way meant to offend anyone, just to have a little fun. :D

To Clarify, ASU Girls are hot :D, but ASU is a great institution, we may not be PrinC!eton or Yale, but Arizona State is a great institution for students

The simple fact of the matter is that all Pac-10 schools are very highly rated academically, ASU is just blessed with lots of eye candy to boot.

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All this talk of Pac-10 expansion but how about the Mountain West expanding to 12 schools and becoming an official BCS Conference:

Pacific Division

BYU, Fresno State, Nevada, San Diego State, UNLV, Utah

Mountain Division

Air Force, Boise State, Colorado State, New Mexico, TCU, Wyoming

This would leave the WAC a mess but maybe in 7 or 8 years Sacramento State, UC Davis and Cal Poly might be FBS programs (who knows?) and could join the conference:

WAC (2015):

Cal Poly, Hawaii, Idaho, New Mexico State, Sacramento State, San Jose State, UC Davis, Utah State

Also, Louisiana Tech might be invited to join Conference USA if it loses a program to the Big East

Not a bad theory, really. It would make sense for all three to leave the WAC for the MWC.

Also, Sacramento State is already a associate member of the WAC in baseball. I think the only roadblock to this theory is the Big West, which has Cal Poly and UC Davis as members. I really doubt the all California conference would give up two of it's members with another school joining down the road in Cal State Bakersfield (Although that is not official, they would like to join since their old friends are now Big West schools).

 

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