2009 NCAA Football Thread

[infrared41]

If you insist on referring to Mr. James as "a kid", think of it as "time out".

Bottom line. Mr. James was cleared medically after a minor concussion. The "punishment" may have been unorthodox, but it was the one most fitting Mr. James' physical limitations on the spur of the moment.

I'm 48 years old. You're all kids to me. It's a figure of speech. I'm fully aware of the fact that Adam James is an adult.

The "punishment" wasn't "unorthodox" it was patently absurd at best and imprisonment at worst. In my opinion, anyone who thinks it was no big deal and "normal" has lost some perspective.

As oddball said, change college football coach to parent or freshman high school volleyball coach and let's see the reaction.

Again, if you want to punish the kid make him carry water to his teammates. Make him clean up the equipment. Send him home. Whatever. There are a million better ways to send him a message. Mike Leach should be under arrest but instead we're watching everyone suck his because he's a winning college football coach.

[infrared41]

1. Mr. James was medically cleared to practice. I had a concussion 5 years ago (not really, but let's keep this as a hypothetical). Does that now give me an automatic "get out of jail free" card for any activity I don't wish to do? That'll fly in the adult world. One verbal tirade now might actually get you out of getting fired in 3 years when you have a boss who doesn't buy that excuse. Nobody else in the program ever got to go to the shed, but then I presume that everyone else who was medically cleared didn't show up in Ray Bans and say that the light hurt their eyes or something. This is especially true if this isn't your first offense, but something along the line of your 20th or 30th.

2. Water is typically needed to cool oneself down. If all you are doing is standing, you probably won't be getting too hot. Especially in the building that has been reportedly used by players to cool off in.

3. Being monitored by trainers indicates to me that in the unlikely event that complications arose, they would have been able to deal with it on the scene.

Oh and that makes it OK? It indicates to me that Mike Leach wasn't entirely sure James was out of danger. And yeah, it never gets hot in a shed in Texas. Nothing to worry about there.

I just hope Mike Leach still respects you in the morning.

[logodawg]

ESPN's coverage has been embarrassing. The Craig James interview? Well scripted bs. And did you see the cell video footage from Adam James? Did they even bother to prove it was the actually room Adam was locked in and not some random mechanical room he walked into? And what was he doing at practice with his cell phone?

I'm not saying Leach didn't did it. If anything, Leach has made it very clear in his interviews that he's a crazy and whinny s.o.b.

[rams80]

1. Mr. James was medically cleared to practice. I had a concussion 5 years ago (not really, but let's keep this as a hypothetical). Does that now give me an automatic "get out of jail free" card for any activity I don't wish to do? That'll fly in the adult world. One verbal tirade now might actually get you out of getting fired in 3 years when you have a boss who doesn't buy that excuse. Nobody else in the program ever got to go to the shed, but then I presume that everyone else who was medically cleared didn't show up in Ray Bans and say that the light hurt their eyes or something. This is especially true if this isn't your first offense, but something along the line of your 20th or 30th.

2. Water is typically needed to cool oneself down. If all you are doing is standing, you probably won't be getting too hot. Especially in the building that has been reportedly used by players to cool off in.

3. Being monitored by trainers indicates to me that in the unlikely event that complications arose, they would have been able to deal with it on the scene.

Oh and that makes it OK? It indicates to me that Mike Leach wasn't entirely sure James was out of danger. And yeah, it never gets hot in a shed in Texas. Nothing to worry about there.

I just hope Mike Leach still respects you in the morning.

"conventional" punsihments, such as cleaning up equipment, or humping water, can be done poorly by the punishee as an act of silent protest or subversion, while being sent home is considered a reward by James, not a punishment. Based on player testimony, Adam James made a habit of questioning or undermining the coach and team prior to his visit to the garage, and from that perspective it is clear that 1) Normal corrective measures are not effective and 2) any "unconventional" corrective measure has been earned as a lifetime achievement award by James.

Please consider that this was Decemeber when it took place. I strongly, strongly doubt the shed gets hot enough to be life threatening.

Of course, if standing for two hours is legally prosecutable, I look forward to the landmark indictments of every service industry franchise manager in the history of the country.

[infrared41]

"conventional" punsihments, such as cleaning up equipment, or humping water, can be done poorly by the punishee as an act of silent protest or subversion, while being sent home is considered a reward by James, not a punishment. Based on player testimony, Adam James made a habit of questioning or undermining the coach and team prior to his visit to the garage, and from that perspective it is clear that 1) Normal corrective measures are not effective and 2) any "unconventional" corrective measure has been earned as a lifetime achievement award by James.

Please consider that this was Decemeber when it took place. I strongly, strongly doubt the shed gets hot enough to be life threatening.

Of course, if standing for two hours is legally prosecutable, I look forward to the landmark indictments of every service industry franchise manager in the history of the country.

And you know it was a reward how? Is Adam James a friend of yours?

Adam James' attitude isn't the issue here. Neither is making him stand up for tow hours. Locking a player in a room is the issue. So if you piss me off and I decide to lock you in a room for a few hours does the fact that I didn't like your attitude make it OK that I locked you in the room? That logic is the same thing as saying "yeah I beat the daylights out of someone but it's OK because they had it coming." The same thing applies to your "well it was December so it wouldn't get that hot" logic. None of the circumstances change the act itself. This coach is a lunatic and he locked a player in a room. Any defense of the act itself by citing the circumstances that led to it is just a coach worshipping rationalization.

If James was that much of a problem and had earned a "lifetime achievement award" then why wasn't he kicked off the team? If he's such a bad apple then why even bother? And I ask you again, if it isn't a God-like football coach doing what Leach did, what do you think the reaction would be? Let's change football coach to high school drama teacher. As I said before, if the kid was that big a problem then cut him loose. A good coach doesn't need to keep a malcontent around just to prove a point to the rest of his team.

[DG_ThenNowForever]

What's sad is that I'm sure this is hardly an isolated incident. There are any number of deranged ass-hats with marginal authority over others who force people to do terrible and/or degrading things. It's not limited to sports, as you say, and it should be a much bigger deal than it is.

Just because you can doesn't mean you should.

[rams80]

"conventional" punsihments, such as cleaning up equipment, or humping water, can be done poorly by the punishee as an act of silent protest or subversion, while being sent home is considered a reward by James, not a punishment. Based on player testimony, Adam James made a habit of questioning or undermining the coach and team prior to his visit to the garage, and from that perspective it is clear that 1) Normal corrective measures are not effective and 2) any "unconventional" corrective measure has been earned as a lifetime achievement award by James.

Please consider that this was Decemeber when it took place. I strongly, strongly doubt the shed gets hot enough to be life threatening.

Of course, if standing for two hours is legally prosecutable, I look forward to the landmark indictments of every service industry franchise manager in the history of the country.

And you know it was a reward how? Is Adam James a friend of yours?

Adam James' attitude isn't the issue here. Neither is making him stand up for tow hours. Locking a player in a room is the issue. So if you piss me off and I decide to lock you in a room for a few hours does the fact that I didn't like your attitude make it OK that I locked you in the room? That logic is the same thing as saying "yeah I beat the daylights out of someone but it's OK because they had it coming." The same thing applies to your "well it was December so it wouldn't get that hot" logic. None of the circumstances change the act itself. This coach is a lunatic and he locked a player in a room. Any defense of the act itself by citing the circumstances that led to it is just a coach worshipping rationalization.

If James was that much of a problem and had earned a "lifetime achievement award" then why wasn't he kicked off the team? If he's such a bad apple then why even bother? And I ask you again, if it isn't a God-like football coach doing what Leach did, what do you think the reaction would be? Let's change football coach to high school drama teacher. As I said before, if the kid was that big a problem then cut him loose. A good coach doesn't need to keep a malcontent around just to prove a point to the rest of his team.

Doesn't detention also involve the locking of students into a room? Yet that is not frowned upon.

Setting aside the fact that kicking him off helps James, the NCAA disincentivizes kicking players off the team.

Of course, my perspective is different because I wouldn't have a problem with being sequestered away from humanity for a few hours. Granted I wouldn't act out either since I am not the scion of a minor celebrity, but there's the breaks.

[NEW.ERA]

Can't wait for the Fiesta Bowl tomorrow. One of the best offenses versus the Top Defense.

[infrared41]

Doesn't detention also involve the locking of students into a room? Yet that is not frowned upon.

Setting aside the fact that kicking him off helps James, the NCAA disincentivizes kicking players off the team.

Of course, my perspective is different because I wouldn't have a problem with being sequestered away from humanity for a few hours. Granted I wouldn't act out either since I am not the scion of a minor celebrity, but there's the breaks.

This wasn't a simple "detention" and we both know it. That aside, how does kicking James off the team "help him?" Being a malcontent who was kicked off a D-I team is beneficial in what way exactly?

And with regard to being the son of Craig James, don't you think that Craig James would be more tolerant of psycho "coaching" BS since he's played both college and NFL football? It would seem to me that his inclination would be to be more forgiving of psychotic coach behavior not less. And that leads me to believe that he really thought something was out of line.

D_G is right. This sort of nonsense goes on all the time. Especially in football. We just like to look the other way because on occasion these whack jobs win games. Well that and some of us deify football coaches.

D_G also summed it up perfectly.

"There are any number of deranged ass-hats with marginal authority..."

Excellent choice of words my friend. You just described far too many football coaches.

[MDC]

Can't wait for the Fiesta Bowl tomorrow. One of the best offenses versus the Top Defense.

Unfortunately though, it is a meaningless game. No matter who wins, we will all be saying 'what if?' If they threw TCU into the National championship to see what they could do against a BCS team. just adding fuel to the fire IMO.

regardless, i'm excited for the game too.

[infrared41]

Can't wait for the Fiesta Bowl tomorrow. One of the best offenses versus the Top Defense.

Unfortunately though, it is a meaningless game. No matter who wins, we will all be saying 'what if?' If they threw TCU into the National championship to see what they could do against a BCS team. just adding fuel to the fire IMO.

regardless, i'm excited for the game too.

I agree. The fact that instead of matching both these teams against "big time" conferences, they made them play each other makes it pretty well meaningless. I suppose in one way it's a show of respect to have these two play each other in a BCS Bowl. Still, what is the point of being a "BCS buster" if you don't get to take a shot at a BCS team? They easily could have put TCU in The Orange Bowl to play Georgia Tech and sent Iowa to The Fiesta to play Boise State.

Since we're talking about bowl games instead of psychotic coaches for a few minutes... I am kind of torn on The Orange Bowl. I want to see The Big Ten have a decent bowl season but I also really like Georgia Tech and that crazy offense of theirs. Ah...screw The Big Ten. Go Yellow Jackets. Ohio State redeemed themselves for at least one season. The Hell with the rest of the conference.

[HedleyLamarr]

I agree. The fact that instead of matching both these teams against "big time" conferences, they made them play each other makes it pretty well meaningless. I suppose in one way it's a show of respect to have these two play each other in a BCS Bowl. Still, what is the point of being a "BCS buster" if you don't get to take a shot at a BCS team? They easily could have put TCU in The Orange Bowl to play Georgia Tech and sent Iowa to The Fiesta to play Boise State.

Since we're talking about bowl games instead of psychotic coaches for a few minutes... I am kind of torn on The Orange Bowl. I want to see The Big Ten have a decent bowl season but I also really like Georgia Tech and that crazy offense of theirs. Ah...screw The Big Ten. Go Yellow Jackets. Ohio State redeemed themselves for at least one season. The Hell with the rest of the conference.

You had it right the first time....pull for the conference. Go Iowa!

I forgot what show I was listening to, but they brought up a good point: As much as fans wanted to see Boise State and TCU play against the big boys, which matchup would really get folks interested? Alabama and Texas were playing each other, as were Ohio State and Oregon, so they're out. Florida could only play one of the three unbeatens (TCU, Boise State, Cincinnati), and so the highest-ranked unbeaten team got their shot at the former #1-ranked Gators. The biggest of the big boys were already matched up. TCU vs. 2-loss Iowa just isn't as compelling as TCU vs. 1-loss Texas/Nebraska or TCU-Ohio State, so the Fiesta Bowl wanted the matchup of the unbeatens.

[Still MIGHTY]

I agree. The fact that instead of matching both these teams against "big time" conferences, they made them play each other makes it pretty well meaningless. I suppose in one way it's a show of respect to have these two play each other in a BCS Bowl. Still, what is the point of being a "BCS buster" if you don't get to take a shot at a BCS team? They easily could have put TCU in The Orange Bowl to play Georgia Tech and sent Iowa to The Fiesta to play Boise State.

Since we're talking about bowl games instead of psychotic coaches for a few minutes... I am kind of torn on The Orange Bowl. I want to see The Big Ten have a decent bowl season but I also really like Georgia Tech and that crazy offense of theirs. Ah...screw The Big Ten. Go Yellow Jackets. Ohio State redeemed themselves for at least one season. The Hell with the rest of the conference.

You had it right the first time....pull for the conference. Go Iowa!

I forgot what show I was listening to, but they brought up a good point: As much as fans wanted to see Boise State and TCU play against the big boys, which matchup would really get folks interested? Alabama and Texas were playing each other, as were Ohio State and Oregon, so they're out. Florida could only play one of the three unbeatens (TCU, Boise State, Cincinnati), and so the highest-ranked unbeaten team got their shot at the former #1-ranked Gators. The biggest of the big boys were already matched up. TCU vs. 2-loss Iowa just isn't as compelling as TCU vs. 1-loss Texas/Nebraska or TCU-Ohio State, so the Fiesta Bowl wanted the matchup of the unbeatens.

That's a pretty good point.

As much as we'd all like to see TCU or Boise take on the big boys, the way the bowl selection process played out, this was the only way to make it.

Either way, I'm stoked as hell to go to this game tomorrow. Should be a great match-up with the TCU defense vs the Boise offense. TCU is pulling out those GORGEOUS Pro Combat jerseys for the game. It's my first trip to a bowl game. And even though I don't have a horse in the race, I can't wait to watch these teams and be there for a BCS Bowl. I've always like the Fiesta Bowl. Gonna check out all of the festivities and the pomp and circumstance.

It will also be interesting to check out the University of Phoenix Stadium trasformation. I was at the Cardinals/Packers game today and they already set up the temporary extra bleachers and had some of the Fiesta Bowl signage up in the hallways. They also had the Fiesta Bowl party area all set up as well. But they have to roll out the field, patch-up any holes, get the Cardinals paint off, repaint it for the Fiesta Bowl, set up the Fiesta Bowl tarps outside the stadium, on the playing field, on the walls. All of this between 6:30 pm MST tonight and around 3 pm MST tomorrow. Should be cool to see.

I'm gonna root for TCU.

Love the unis. Love the mascot. Love the logo. And just to annoy the rest of my family who arbitrarily picked Boise.

[infrared41]

I agree. The fact that instead of matching both these teams against "big time" conferences, they made them play each other makes it pretty well meaningless. I suppose in one way it's a show of respect to have these two play each other in a BCS Bowl. Still, what is the point of being a "BCS buster" if you don't get to take a shot at a BCS team? They easily could have put TCU in The Orange Bowl to play Georgia Tech and sent Iowa to The Fiesta to play Boise State.

Since we're talking about bowl games instead of psychotic coaches for a few minutes... I am kind of torn on The Orange Bowl. I want to see The Big Ten have a decent bowl season but I also really like Georgia Tech and that crazy offense of theirs. Ah...screw The Big Ten. Go Yellow Jackets. Ohio State redeemed themselves for at least one season. The Hell with the rest of the conference.

You had it right the first time....pull for the conference. Go Iowa!

I forgot what show I was listening to, but they brought up a good point: As much as fans wanted to see Boise State and TCU play against the big boys, which matchup would really get folks interested? Alabama and Texas were playing each other, as were Ohio State and Oregon, so they're out. Florida could only play one of the three unbeatens (TCU, Boise State, Cincinnati), and so the highest-ranked unbeaten team got their shot at the former #1-ranked Gators. The biggest of the big boys were already matched up. TCU vs. 2-loss Iowa just isn't as compelling as TCU vs. 1-loss Texas/Nebraska or TCU-Ohio State, so the Fiesta Bowl wanted the matchup of the unbeatens.

Imagine my surprise. A Georgia fan telling me I should root for Iowa. I suppose I should stick with the Big Ten. This is the first year in a long time that the conference hasn't been a complete embarrassment during bowl season. Even the losses were very competitive. (For what it's worth, I really like Georgia too. My guess is that liking both teams doesn't happen all that often down your way.)

You make a good point on The Fiesta Bowl. As I said before, I think the fact that they matched these two against each other shows that the gap between the "haves" conferences and the "have nots" conferences must be closing. Not to mention the fact that of the available teams left for The BCS to choose from, Boise and TCU would have destroyed any of them. Does anyone here think that Boise or TCU wouldn't pound the daylights out of Iowa or Georgia Tech? Or Cincinnati? Still, it's just more fun to watch the little guys beat the big guys.

As for the game itself? I think TCU is going to win big. I also think the winner of this game should be co-national champions. Just to piss people off.

[infrared41]

Is it just me or does FOX do a lousy job with college football?

[rams80]

Is it just me or does FOX do a lousy job with college football?

It's not you.

When does ESPN get these games again?

[RyanMcD29]

Is it just me or does FOX do a lousy job with college football?

It's not you.

When does ESPN get these games again?

Next year thank goodness. I swear they show the crowd on these telecasts more than stadiums themselves do on their big screens

[FiddySicks]

This is the first time I've seen TCU's Pro Combat unis on HD. Absolutely beautiful. Hopefully they make these their full time unis.

[dfwabel]

I have a feeling with all the shots of the TCU cheerleaders and ShowGirls (dance team), applications from male students will increase. Especially when the enrollment is around 65/35 female.

[slightly shotgunned]

This is the first time I've seen TCU's Pro Combat unis on HD. Absolutely beautiful. Hopefully they make these their full time unis.

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I say they could use a good, bonfire-style burning

Much lower scoring than I thought it'd be.