2011NCAA Football Thread

[thespleenenator]

Exactly. It's a little ridiculous to see a fan of another blue-blood BCS program whining that the NCAA is a joke and that they always go to bat for their cash cows. As someone who roots on the other side of the fence, you have no idea how ridiculous the standards are for a non-AQ program without the benefits of a long tradition, a top-flight reputation, and a nationwide following.

It's also ridiculous to see a Boise State fan, a team with little-to-no tradition and no real rivalries, saying that a fanbase is unhappy that their arch-rivals, who have dominated them on and off the field for the past 10 years while committing several severe infractions, is going to get off the hook easier than they should. Pardon me for wishing that all college programs would be treated equally, including my own school (which rightfully got hammered by the NCAA 20 years ago and are just now recovering from it)...

That's not true. While recent history has shown otherwise, the BSU Idaho rivalry was actually dominated by Idaho for a really long time. They hate each other.

[Lights Out]

However, Boise State leads the overall series with the Vandals, 22-17-1. Also, Boise State matched Idaho's series record 12-game winning streak this season. Before Idaho's streak, Boise State led the series 8-2-1. So, I'd say BSU has dominated the rivalry more.

Granted, the BSU/UI rivalry is dead, I think, since Boise isn't playing Idaho anymore with the move to the Mountain West (even though, laughably, Rob Spear tried to lobby for them to move to the MWC as well). Good riddance - no need to have them bringing down BSU's strength of schedule every year.

[GFB]

I'm not going to deny it. Of course it's personal. I mean, think back to when the Fab Five got nailed. I'm sure you wanted fair and deserving justice for that crime. And if the roles were reversed, I'm quite sure Ohio State and their fan base would want to see a fair punishment given to Michigan. No different than Auburn-Alabama, Texas-Oklahoma, etc... but I don't think non-OSU/UM fans realize how intense the rivalry is between us. I think the only thing that comes close to it in all of sports is Red Sox-Yankees. Obviously, if the shoe was on the other foot, I would hope that Michigan would fight the sanctions tooth and nail and get the easiest penalty possible... and OSU fans would be hoping for the severest penalties.

1. No, not really.

2. Regardless of the school involved, I think it's ridiculous that the entire team gets punished for the actions of a few people. My opinion is that you fire the coach (or coaches) and get rid of the players involved. There's no reason the "clean" players should have their season(s) ruined because some of their teammates were stupid.

I think that maybe you are overstating the "intensity" of the rivalry.

1. Then you are the most gentleman-ly OSU alumni and fan that I have ever met (which was probably true to begin with... but just saying)

2. You did not fire your coach. He quit. If you fired him in January when this all came out, then it's a different story. Instead you waited until all the dirty laundry got aired out... by sources outside of the university.

Also, really? Maybe those "clean" players should have cared a little more about their season and program, instead of turning a blind eye to several players on the team. You really think none of Pryor's teammates were suspicious when he's been rolling around Columbus in a new car every 6 months? And after this latest information has come out, it seems like that was not one or two guys on the team, but the whole culture of OSU football.

3. I don't think I am.... even ESPN named it the best rivalry during it's END OF CENTURY programming... Over the likes of UNC vs. Duke, Red Sox vs. Yankees, and Ali vs. Frazier. (http://espn.go.com/endofcentury/s/other/bestrivalries.html)Plus, almost everyone knows that it's one of, if not the best, rivalry in college athletics.

[infrared41]

I'm not going to deny it. Of course it's personal. I mean, think back to when the Fab Five got nailed. I'm sure you wanted fair and deserving justice for that crime. And if the roles were reversed, I'm quite sure Ohio State and their fan base would want to see a fair punishment given to Michigan. No different than Auburn-Alabama, Texas-Oklahoma, etc... but I don't think non-OSU/UM fans realize how intense the rivalry is between us. I think the only thing that comes close to it in all of sports is Red Sox-Yankees. Obviously, if the shoe was on the other foot, I would hope that Michigan would fight the sanctions tooth and nail and get the easiest penalty possible... and OSU fans would be hoping for the severest penalties.

1. No, not really.

2. Regardless of the school involved, I think it's ridiculous that the entire team gets punished for the actions of a few people. My opinion is that you fire the coach (or coaches) and get rid of the players involved. There's no reason the "clean" players should have their season(s) ruined because some of their teammates were stupid.

I think that maybe you are overstating the "intensity" of the rivalry.

1. Then you are the most gentleman-ly OSU alumni and fan that I have ever met (which was probably true to begin with... but just saying)

2. You did not fire your coach. He quit. If you fired him in January when this all came out, then it's a different story. Instead you waited until all the dirty laundry got aired out... by sources outside of the university.

Also, really? Maybe those "clean" players should have cared a little more about their season and program, instead of turning a blind eye to several players on the team. You really think none of Pryor's teammates were suspicious when he's been rolling around Columbus in a new car every 6 months? And after this latest information has come out, it seems like that was not one or two guys on the team, but the whole culture of OSU football.

3. I don't think I am.... even ESPN named it the best rivalry during it's END OF CENTURY programming... Over the likes of UNC vs. Duke, Red Sox vs. Yankees, and Ali vs. Frazier. (http://espn.go.com/endofcentury/s/other/bestrivalries.html)Plus, almost everyone knows that it's one of, if not the best, rivalry in college athletics.

1. Let's get something straight here; I didn't do anything. What I said was what I personally would like to see happen. It was not a response to the actions being taken against Ohio State. It was just what I think would be fair.

2. The clean players have made their feelings known on the matter. The truth is, it's not their job to police the program. That responsibility lies with the coaching staff and compliance office. Nine guys out of 80-100 is hardly "the entire culture."

3. So because ESPN calls it a big rivalry, I'm supposed to go around foaming at the mouth at the mere mention of Michigan? Thanks, I'll pass.

I appreciate the gentlemen-ly comment. Thanks.

[Lights Out]

Nine guys out of 80-100 is hardly "the entire culture."

But an eight-year pattern of violations, at least 22 star players involved in the memorabilia ring dating back to Tressel's second year, Tressel rigging raffles at his camps for prize recruits, players driving around in cars they couldn't possibly afford, players getting "jobs" consisting of occasional autograph-signing, etc. is a culture of corruption.

[GFB]

I'm not going to deny it. Of course it's personal. I mean, think back to when the Fab Five got nailed. I'm sure you wanted fair and deserving justice for that crime. And if the roles were reversed, I'm quite sure Ohio State and their fan base would want to see a fair punishment given to Michigan. No different than Auburn-Alabama, Texas-Oklahoma, etc... but I don't think non-OSU/UM fans realize how intense the rivalry is between us. I think the only thing that comes close to it in all of sports is Red Sox-Yankees. Obviously, if the shoe was on the other foot, I would hope that Michigan would fight the sanctions tooth and nail and get the easiest penalty possible... and OSU fans would be hoping for the severest penalties.

1. No, not really.

2. Regardless of the school involved, I think it's ridiculous that the entire team gets punished for the actions of a few people. My opinion is that you fire the coach (or coaches) and get rid of the players involved. There's no reason the "clean" players should have their season(s) ruined because some of their teammates were stupid.

I think that maybe you are overstating the "intensity" of the rivalry.

1. Then you are the most gentleman-ly OSU alumni and fan that I have ever met (which was probably true to begin with... but just saying)

2. You did not fire your coach. He quit. If you fired him in January when this all came out, then it's a different story. Instead you waited until all the dirty laundry got aired out... by sources outside of the university.

Also, really? Maybe those "clean" players should have cared a little more about their season and program, instead of turning a blind eye to several players on the team. You really think none of Pryor's teammates were suspicious when he's been rolling around Columbus in a new car every 6 months? And after this latest information has come out, it seems like that was not one or two guys on the team, but the whole culture of OSU football.

3. I don't think I am.... even ESPN named it the best rivalry during it's END OF CENTURY programming... Over the likes of UNC vs. Duke, Red Sox vs. Yankees, and Ali vs. Frazier. (http://espn.go.com/endofcentury/s/other/bestrivalries.html)Plus, almost everyone knows that it's one of, if not the best, rivalry in college athletics.

1. Let's get something straight here; I didn't do anything. What I said was what I personally would like to see happen. It was not a response to the actions being taken against Ohio State. It was just what I think would be fair.

2. The clean players have made their feelings known on the matter. The truth is, it's not their job to police the program. That responsibility lies with the coaching staff and compliance office. Nine guys out of 80-100 is hardly "the entire culture."

3. So because ESPN calls it a big rivalry, I'm supposed to go around foaming at the mouth at the mere mention of Michigan? Thanks, I'll pass.

I appreciate the gentlemen-ly comment. Thanks.

You know what I was referring to... Of course I didn't mean you personally.

I just don't believe that these events were as isolated as you claim them to be. But if the numbers are indeed as skewed in favor of a clean program as you say they were, then wouldn't have been much easier to police? Then you have to ask if the compliance department was just asleep at the wheel, or were they turning a blind eye all together?

And of course. ESPN is the source of all things factual. Would you like other sources saying that it's a big rivalry? Maybe Fox Sports or Yahoo? You get the idea. I don't expect you to freak out every time you talk about Michigan, but acting like they are any other school is taking the rivalry too lightly IMO.

[thespleenenator]

This argument alone proves the intensity of the OSU Michigan rivalry.

[Seadragon76]

Seeing infrared and GFB talk about their favorite schools reminds me why Ohio State-Michigan is such a great rivalry: The fans. I wouldn't be shocked if Michigan fans aren't laughing at what's going on in Columbus.

To me, there is no greater rivalry in college football then this one, even though I've always seen Michigan as such a pretentious program that thinks they are better then everyone else.

[thespleenenator]

Seeing infrared and GFB talk about their favorite schools reminds me why Ohio State-Michigan is such a great rivalry: The fans. I wouldn't be shocked if Michigan fans aren't laughing at what's going on in Columbus.

To me, there is no greater rivalry in college football then this one, even though I've always seen Michigan as such a pretentious program that thinks they are better then everyone else.

I don't know about the best rivalry. The Civil War can get nasty. Lots of bad blood between those two schools.

[tBBP]

^ Yeah, true...but then, didn't nann one of them schools (Oregon, O-State, Michigan or tOSU) get their sacred trees poisoned by a rival fan now did they!

(And this is coming from someone who's a fan of a whole 'nother bitter-ass archrivalry: Florida/Florida State, which to my knowledge are the only two in-state archrivals to have played each other in a national championship game. I won't talk about the end result of that game though...let's just say it was "sugar sweet" for one of the two.)

[JayJaxon]

^ Yeah, true...but then, didn't nann one of them schools (Oregon, O-State, Michigan or tOSU) get their sacred trees poisoned by a rival fan now did they!

(And this is coming from someone who's a fan of a whole 'nother bitter-ass archrivalry: Florida/Florida State, which to my knowledge are the only two in-state archrivals to have played each other in a national championship game. I won't talk about the end result of that game though...let's just say it was "sugar sweet" for one of the two.)

True True. ;-)

Does it seem like the NCAA waits too long to act though? I mean if they would nail these guys while the stuff is going on (during the season) then it would have more of an impact than waiting to take banners down later.

[dfwabel]

^ Yeah, true...but then, didn't nann one of them schools (Oregon, O-State, Michigan or tOSU) get their sacred trees poisoned by a rival fan now did they!

(And this is coming from someone who's a fan of a whole 'nother bitter-ass archrivalry: Florida/Florida State, which to my knowledge are the only two in-state archrivals to have played each other in a national championship game. I won't talk about the end result of that game though...let's just say it was "sugar sweet" for one of the two.)

True True. ;-)

Does it seem like the NCAA waits too long to act though? I mean if they would nail these guys while the stuff is going on (during the season) then it would have more of an impact than waiting to take banners down later.

It is oftentimes still a question of finding the evidence and since the NCAA does not have subpoena power, most within the scope of an investigation (outside agents like the OSU tattoo shop owner) are not required to talk to them during an investigation. This case was exposed because of a federal investigation against the outside person (like the Fab Five penalties) and the USC/Reggie Bush case was exposed by Yahoo! Sports as a result of an agent scorned. If you have to use "tips" from other sources to investigate, unless you have an investigator/attorney at each institution, it is hard and long to do it all.

[Lights Out]

Terrelle Pryor is the biggest idiot in Ohio State history... and that's saying something, because Andy Katzenmoyer went there.

[HedleyLamarr]

This argument alone proves the intensity of the OSU Michigan rivalry.

Beats the hell out of the penis-waving rivalries of Arizona-Arizona State or, worse.....Idaho-Boise State.

The Ohio State-Michigan rivalry is at least interesting.

[Lights Out]

Beats the hell out of the penis-waving rivalries of Arizona-Arizona State or, worse.....Idaho-Boise State.

Let's be honest now - Idaho doesn't have one to wave.

[thespleenenator]

This argument alone proves the intensity of the OSU Michigan rivalry.

Beats the hell out of the penis-waving rivalries of Arizona-Arizona State or, worse.....Idaho-Boise State.

The Ohio State-Michigan rivalry is at least interesting.

All those rivalries are interesting. Most rivalries are interesting for their own reasons. For instance, The AZ AZ St game last year with the blocked extra points just crushed the moral of the Zona team. You can't tell me that didn't produce some bad blood.

[infrared41]

I just don't believe that these events were as isolated as you claim them to be. But if the numbers are indeed as skewed in favor of a clean program as you say they were, then wouldn't have been much easier to police? Then you have to ask if the compliance department was just asleep at the wheel, or were they turning a blind eye all together?

And of course. ESPN is the source of all things factual. Would you like other sources saying that it's a big rivalry? Maybe Fox Sports or Yahoo? You get the idea. I don't expect you to freak out every time you talk about Michigan, but acting like they are any other school is taking the rivalry too lightly IMO.

OK, we're clearly in the middle of a big misunderstanding here. First off, I'm not saying the events are isolated. If there is in fact a "culture of corruption" (and it sure looks that way right now) then those involved deserve exactly what they get. My point was simply that it's not fair to the players who were "doing it right" to get screwed in the process. It's only fair to punish just those players who were directly involved; be it 10 players or 100. That goes for any school. My point is this; why do the 70 players who weren't involved have to get screwed too? There has to be a better way for the NCAA to handle things like this. That's all.

I've made it very clear from the start that I am not, and will not, defend Ohio State's actions in this mess. Yes, I'm a Buckeyes fan but I'm also an Ohio State alumnus and this mess is embarrassing the entire university. What happens to the football team is hardly my biggest issue with this mess. Those idiots have made us all look bad. They deserve what they get.

On the rivalry; show me one time here where I've ever acted like "Michigan is any other school." If you think I haven't enjoyed kicking the out of you guys for seven straight years then you're sadly mistaken. The upcoming season (and probably a bunch more after that) are lost for us. The only thing we have to look forward to now is beating your asses. If anything, the rivalry takes on even more importance now because it's all we're going to have for a while.

You're mistaking the fact that I wasn't clamoring for Michigan to die a slow death after the fab five fiasco for taking the rivalry too lightly. As an Ohio State fan, I don't take much pleasure in beating the daylights of whatever that was you guys were trying to pass off as a football team for the last seven seasons. It was fun for a while, but of late, it's just been sad to watch. It hasn't been a "rivalry", it's been a second homecoming game for Ohio State. For the rivalry to mean anything to either side, both teams need to be at top form. Sure, the fact that you haven't beaten us is in 2748 days is pretty cool, but it doesn't even compare to ripping your hearts out in 2006 and -ing you out of a shot at the title game. Trust me, it's much more fun to beat you when it means something than it is to beat what has essentially been a well funded a D-II team for the past few seasons.

That's why, should they ever get into this kind of mess, I won't want Michigan to be sanctioned back to the stone age. If you don't get that, then you my friend are the one who doesn't get the rivalry.

We'll survive this and we'll continue to beat your asses.

[infrared41]

Seeing infrared and GFB talk about their favorite schools reminds me why Ohio State-Michigan is such a great rivalry: The fans. I wouldn't be shocked if Michigan fans aren't laughing at what's going on in Columbus.

To me, there is no greater rivalry in college football then this one, even though I've always seen Michigan as such a pretentious program that thinks they are better then everyone else.

Way to go out on a limb with that prediction. I'd be shocked if they weren't. So would everyone else.

[HedleyLamarr]

This argument alone proves the intensity of the OSU Michigan rivalry.

Beats the hell out of the penis-waving rivalries of Arizona-Arizona State or, worse.....Idaho-Boise State.

The Ohio State-Michigan rivalry is at least interesting.

All those rivalries are interesting. Most rivalries are interesting for their own reasons. For instance, The AZ AZ St game last year with the blocked extra points just crushed the moral of the Zona team. You can't tell me that didn't produce some bad blood.

No....they aren't.

[thespleenenator]

This argument alone proves the intensity of the OSU Michigan rivalry.

Beats the hell out of the penis-waving rivalries of Arizona-Arizona State or, worse.....Idaho-Boise State.

The Ohio State-Michigan rivalry is at least interesting.

All those rivalries are interesting. Most rivalries are interesting for their own reasons. For instance, The AZ AZ St game last year with the blocked extra points just crushed the moral of the Zona team. You can't tell me that didn't produce some bad blood.

No....they aren't.

Figures. You're an SEC homer right? Doesn't surprise me. There is only one kind of forum user that I dislike, and that is an SEC homer. Newsflash, college football doesn't revolve around you guys.