Stadium/Arena Saga Omnibus

[McCall]

25 minutes ago, Ferdinand Cesarano said:

 

In every report by Brodie Brazil and Casey Pratt, and in the Oakland mayor's comments to Pratt.

Yeah, none of them are biased.

[Ferdinand Cesarano]

5 minutes ago, McCall said:

30 minutes ago, Ferdinand Cesarano said:

In every report by Brodie Brazil and Casey Pratt, and in the Oakland mayor's comments to Pratt.

Yeah, none of them are biased.

 

Oh, stop. They are serious reporters who back up everything they report. Of course they both are angry that the team will probably move; but their reporting is undeniably credible.

[GDAWG]

31 minutes ago, Ferdinand Cesarano said:

 

In every report by Brodie Brazil and Casey Pratt, and in the Oakland mayor's comments to Pratt.

 

The exact opposite of Zennie Abraham, who blames the City of Oakland instead of the A's and is now in favor of the A's move to Oakland (FWIW, he is a strong supporter of Jameis Winston.  So much so, that he feels that any Winston slander is racist).  He also supports publicly financed stadiums.  

[Ferdinand Cesarano]

8 minutes ago, GDAWG said:

The exact opposite of Zennie Abraham, who blames the City of Oakland instead of the A's and is now in favor of the A's move to Oakland (FWIW, he is a strong supporter of Jameis Winston.  So much so, that he feels that any Winston slander is racist).  He also supports publicly financed stadiums.  

 

Yeah, he's a goofball.  More important, he has no journalistic responsibilities, unlike Brazil and Pratt, who work for network outlets.

[GDAWG]

37 minutes ago, Ferdinand Cesarano said:

 

Yeah, he's a goofball.  More important, he has no journalistic responsibilities, unlike Brazil and Pratt, who work for network outlets.

 

He doesn't live in Oakland anymore either.  He lives in Atlanta to take care of his aging mother.  He also claims to be an expert on how NFL offenses should go (even creating his own offense) and was furious when A's fans directed their anger at John Fisher when they should have directed their anger at the City of Oakland.  Zennie even defended DeShaun Watson and didn't believe that he did anything wrong.  He even made an outrageous claim that he thinks that the Golden State Warriors would be sold and moved to Las Vegas.

 

I don't live out in the Bay Area, but I know that Brodie Brazil hosts A's Pre and Post Game shows for NBC Sports Bay Area because he posts those videos on his YouTube channel, so he has every right to be angry and sad about the situation because he loses one of his sources of income (he does the same with the Sharks) when the A's move to Las Vegas.  

 

Again, I have serious doubts about whether or not John Fisher will actually spend any money on the team once the move is finalized.  He absolutely will not spend like the Rangers did to win the World Series, nor do I think he'll build the A's the same way the Mariners and Astros have done.  I am going to make a bold prediction and say that the Mariners will make it to their first World Series before Fisher spends any money to improve the on-the-field product.  

[throwuascenario]

On 10/27/2023 at 12:23 AM, Walk-Off said:

The last time that I can recall any semblance of an active campaign for a Charlotte MLB team was at least two decades ago.  Since then, I have had an impression that the Charlotte area's business elite, media, and general public have all been resting on their proverbial laurels and assuming rather strongly and stubbornly that their metropolis has had a lock on getting an MLB team either through a relocation or from the next batch of expansion franchises.  To use a metaphor inspired by Aesop, I think that in terms of having a future as the home of an MLB club, Charlotte has been a hare while the likes of Nashville, Portland, Salt Lake City, and -- to use an example from within North Carolina -- Raleigh have all been tortoises.

 

 

The owner of the Carolina Hurricanes has made clear his desire to get an MLB team for NC. He has said that it could be in either Raleigh or Charlotte though.

 

On 11/5/2023 at 7:19 AM, GhostOfNormMacdonald said:

       It’s made all the more stupid that the team’s named after a freaking  state and could just have easily been the Minneapolis Vikings if not to appease Little Brother Across the Mississippi.                           I tried to quote @LMU but the     mobile site is messed up  and keeps randomly deleting stuff.                  as a fan of the first two teams to use a state for its name, I'm fine with teams choosing their geographic marker                As long as it's obvious what state(s*) the team is in                     * see Carolina Panthers            

 

I prefer state over city every time if the city is named for the state. Minnesota Vikings > Minneapolis Vikings. Indiana Colts > Indianapolis Colts. Oklahoma Thunder > Oklahoma City Thunder. And so on and so forth. But other than that, neither way really bothers me. I do think the more encompassing names just make more people feel like fans, which is a good thing. I would assume people in Maine, for exaple, associate more with the New England Patriots than the Boston Celtics even though they're farther away but I could be totally off on that.

 

Damn though, the Raleigh Hurricanes would've been something. Having a major league team legitimizes a city and a metro as a serious large city but all that is a waste if no one knows they're there. Can't tell you how many people I've met assume the Hurricanes play in Charlotte. Doesn't help that the far more known Carolina Panthers share a location name but play in a completely different city. It also doesn't help the city that there's no adequate highway access to downtown Raleigh which has turned the area into sprawl central, but that's a different discussion.

 

But yeah, the city of Raleigh had nothing to do with the financing or building of PNC Arena so they didn't even have a seat at the table for the name discussion. The state financed the entire taxpayer-funded portion of the arena so they had no motive to push for the "Raleigh" name. And I guess the Canes decided they didn't want to be known by a location no one had heard of. Even less so in 1997 than now.

[BBTV]

I'd wager when the average American hears "Raleigh", all they think of "Raleigh-Durham Airport", which would raise the ire of a former member here, but is likely true.

 

Raleigh's population density, while higher than I would have thought (3,148 / sq mi) is still on the low side, if not the lowest in MLB.  On par with the mostly strip-mall cities in the south west.  Without public transit (other than a tiny bus system), asking people who need to drive from sparse suburbs to fill a 40k stadium 81 times a year is a recipe for problems, especially if/when the team isn't doing well (and as we've seen, even when a team is doing well, that doesn't mean anyone will actually show up.)

 

 

[GhostOfNormMacdonald]

                    8 hours ago, throwuascenario said:  I prefer state over city every time if the city is named for the state                          Slightly (okay, super) pedantic, but it allows me to rant about MN history. TheMinnea- in Minneapolis actually comes from the Dakota word for waterfall Mnihaha instead of the Dakota word for water mni (where the Minne- in Minnesota comes from) . The original  spelling of Minneapolis was Minnehapolis, meaning waterfall city. Named after the only waterfall on the Mississippi, which allowed the city to become the milling capital of the US.                 Also, someone please fix typing on mobile    

[Burmy]

I still think that if the Triangle gets an MLB team, they should be called the Durham Bulls.

Recognizable name, full of history, protagonists of the most realistic baseball movie ever...the team doesn't even have to play in the city of Durham for it to work.

[kolob]

1 hour ago, GhostOfNormMacdonald said:

                    8 hours ago, throwuascenario said:  I prefer state over city every time if the city is named for the state                          Slightly (okay, super) pedantic, but it allows me to rant about MN history. TheMinnea- in Minneapolis actually comes from the Dakota word for waterfall Mnihaha instead of the Dakota word for water mni (where the Minne- in Minnesota comes from) . The original  spelling of Minneapolis was Minnehapolis, meaning waterfall city. Named after the only waterfall on the Mississippi, which allowed the city to become the milling capital of the US.                 Also, someone please fix typing on mobile    

 

 

[throwuascenario]

7 hours ago, BBTV said:

I'd wager when the average American hears "Raleigh", all they think of "Raleigh-Durham Airport", which would raise the ire of a former member here, but is likely true.

 

Raleigh's population density, while higher than I would have thought (3,148 / sq mi) is still on the low side, if not the lowest in MLB.  On par with the mostly strip-mall cities in the south west.  Without public transit (other than a tiny bus system), asking people who need to drive from sparse suburbs to fill a 40k stadium 81 times a year is a recipe for problems, especially if/when the team isn't doing well (and as we've seen, even when a team is doing well, that doesn't mean anyone will actually show up.)

 

 

 

I always hated the airport being called Raleigh-Durham. It's not like a DFW or twin cities situation. Durham is not a large or important enough city to necessitate having its name on it.

 

The thing about sparse suburbs though is that practically everyone has a car and driving is very easy. The other thing having a small urban core is that the suburbs are not very far away. And while MLB stadiums hold 40k, very few sell that many tickets. Only 4 teams averaged that or better last year. 13 teams out of 30 averaged 25k or less. I don't think that's that big of a stretch for a city that was top 2 in the league in attendance in the NHL last year.

 

Charlotte would be a better market, but there are other current markets (St. Pete, second team in Chicago, Miami) and prospective markets (Montreal, Portland) that would be worse than Raleigh.

 

4 hours ago, Burmy said:

I still think that if the Triangle gets an MLB team, they should be called the Durham Bulls.

Recognizable name, full of history, protagonists of the most realistic baseball movie ever...the team doesn't even have to play in the city of Durham for it to work.

 

I totally agree. The brand really is that strong. I doubt they would do it though. Especially because any team would likely play in Raleigh and the Bulls would most likely continue to play in AAA. So there would be an MLB Durham Bulls in Raleigh and then a likely-unaffiliated AAA Durham Bulls in Durham. Would be all kinds of confusing.

[Walk-Off]

On 11/9/2023 at 10:56 AM, Burmy said:

I still think that if the Triangle gets an MLB team, they should be called the Durham Bulls.

Recognizable name, full of history, protagonists of the most realistic baseball movie ever...the team doesn't even have to play in the city of Durham for it to work.

 

On 11/9/2023 at 3:17 PM, throwuascenario said:

The brand really is that strong. I doubt they would do it though. Especially because any team would likely play in Raleigh and the Bulls would most likely continue to play in AAA. So there would be an MLB Durham Bulls in Raleigh and then a likely-unaffiliated AAA Durham Bulls in Durham. Would be all kinds of confusing.

 

If a Major League Baseball team were to play home games in the City of Durham and/or Durham County or in a part of the Raleigh-Durham-Cary Combined Statistical Area that is in neither the City of Durham nor Durham County, but is clearly closer to Durham than to Raleigh, then ... and only then ... could I support such a team being called the Durham Bulls.  On the other hand, should an MLB team be based in the City of Raleigh and/or Wake County or in a section of the Raleigh-Durham-Cary CSA that is outside both the City of Raleigh and Wake County, but is decidedly closer to Raleigh than to Durham (e.g. Zebulon, the Carolina Mudcats' current hometown), then I think that a made-from-scratch, Raleigh-oriented identity would be a far smarter choice.

 

Please think about this for a moment.  How likely is it that a Durham Bulls brand for an MLB team with a home field in either Raleigh proper or a suburb in Raleigh's cultural and economic sphere of influence would be regarded as tone-deaf and dismissively disrespectful by many people in the Durham-focused and Raleigh-centric halves of the region?  If you live in Durham, would you not at least suspect that the regional MLB franchise's ownership thinks that your city is good enough to be represented in the team's name, but not good enough to contain the team's actual home ballpark?  Meanwhile, if Raleigh is your home, would you not feel at least indignant over the MLB team in your proverbial backyard, as opposed to a Durham resident's proverbial backyard, opting to glom onto the history and Hollywood-induced fame of a minor-league baseball brand rooted deeply in "the other big city" in your region?

 

Besides, the major advocacy group for a Raleigh MLB franchise seems to have too much of a Raleigh-first-and-only provincialism to want anything to do with Durham, let alone with the Durham Bulls organization and brand.  For starters, those in charge of the Raleigh MLB group seem to think that their desired team and a still-minor-league Durham Bulls club could coexist with each other easily.  Furthermore, all of the ballpark sites proposed so far by the Raleigh MLB group look to be firmly within the Raleigh city limits.

 

Then again, neither the A's nor the Rays seem to have any interest in moving to Raleigh or any nearby part of North Carolina anytime soon.  Thus, I will try to steer this thread back on topic with a link to a Morgan Wick blog post -- The Blunt Reality Facing Oakland Sports Fans -- that was made in late June, but which I find to be very relevant right now, with MLB owners presumably planning to vote on the 14th, 15th, or 16th of this month as to whether or not to let the A's relocate to the Las Vegas market.

[The_Admiral]

Oh god this is too many words about the prospect of a Major League Baseball team going to a loose constellation of McMansion tracts called "Pine Needle Carriage Estates"

[B-Rich]

On 11/12/2023 at 10:42 AM, the admiral said:

Oh god this is too many words about the prospect of a Major League Baseball team going to a loose constellation of McMansion tracts called "Pine Needle Carriage Estates"

Can't put all the proper emoji responses in,  so I'll just write it out:

 

Though I disagree with Admiral on a lot of things and take umbrage at quite few (Hey, I represent that statement!),  I still can laugh at his biting satire even when it skewers me and mine. 

'the admiral'-- the H.L. Mencken of the Sports logo board. 

[Walk-Off]

The Mercury News: A’s relocation: Teachers union to file lawsuit that could stop public funds for Vegas stadium

[Ridleylash]

1 hour ago, Walk-Off said:

The Mercury News: A’s relocation: Teachers union to file lawsuit that could stop public funds for Vegas stadium

Man, imagine the egg on Fisher's face if this suit actually goes through lmao

[GDAWG]

1 hour ago, Ridleylash said:

Man, imagine the egg on Fisher's face if this suit actually goes through lmao

 

he will send either Dave Kaval or Jeremy "For The Record" Aguero in any lawsuit hearing.

[TrueYankee26]

 

[Cujo]

VIVA!

 

[Walk-Off]

USA Today: It's official: Oakland Athletics' move to Las Vegas unanimously approved by MLB owners

 

This article by USA Today writer Bob Nightengale gives a good in-depth view on the vote and a few of the remaining issues that surround the relocation.