Expansion game! Expansion game!

[FiddySicks]

Sacramento is ready if need be.  Raley Field (the home for the AAA RiverCats) was built to ready for expansion if need be to lure an MLB team.

Has it ever been suggested that the A's move to Sacramento? I know they often mention San Jose/Santa Clara, but S.F. has that territory.

its been considered but nothing serious

[Gary]

AFL:Cleveland, Little Rock

CBA:Flint, Ft. Wayne

Flint already has a basketball team in the IBL, they are called the Michigan Stones, and will start play in the summer

AFL: Little Rock doesn't have a big enough building for the AFL, but they are well suited for the AF2, which is called the Arkansas Twisters

[GeneralW91]

AFL:Cleveland, Little Rock

CBA:Flint, Ft. Wayne

Flint already has a basketball team in the IBL, they are called the Michigan Stones, and will start play in the summer

AFL: Little Rock doesn't have a big enough building for the AFL, but they are well suited for the AF2, which is called the Arkansas Twisters

Alltel Arena seats 18,000, it's only tenants are the ABA Arkansas RimRockers and either Arkansas or Arkansas-Little Rock play there. otherwise, it's empty.

The IBL plays in the spring(season starts April 8th I believe). Also, the Great Lakes Storm are considering moving to flint, because despite being one of the top teams in the league they are only averaging around 400/game in Birch Run.

[Gary]

but right now, AFL isn't interested in the Little Rock area, they are looking more towards Boston, and Washington D.C., and even the Seattle/Portland area. So right now I would believe Little Rock is better suited for the AF2. But there are teams in Grand Rapids and Austin, Texas, so there is some hope there could be some AFL there. As far as the Storm, i've heard about that. But I don't know if the CBA is right for them, remember the Flint Fuze? I believe they moved after it's inaugural season.

[Breakwood]

MLS : Vancouver or Montreal, (one for Canada) Trust me Toronto doesnt deserve an MLS team (this comming from a huge toronto footy fan). When you only get 4000 at a Lynx game qhile the Limp act get around 10,000 and the Whitecrap get 8000

[GeneralW91]

but right now, AFL isn't interested in the Little Rock area, they are looking more towards Boston, and Washington D.C., and even the Seattle/Portland area. So right now I would believe Little Rock is better suited for the AF2. But there are teams in Grand Rapids and Austin, Texas, so there is some hope there could be some AFL there. As far as the Storm, i've heard about that. But I don't know if the CBA is right for them, remember the Flint Fuze? I believe they moved after it's inaugural season.

There's always Saginaw. I believe Birch Run sits in between Flint and Saginaw.

You're probably right about Arkansas. However, AF2 is waaaaaaaaay to big. Perhaps the new league, the UIF, would be better, since it is made up of all the good NIFL teams.

[Brian in Boston]

Alltel Arena seats 18,000, it's only tenants are the ABA Arkansas RimRockers and either Arkansas or Arkansas-Little Rock play there. otherwise, it's empty.

Alltel Arena is home to the Arkansas Twisters of af2, as well as the Arkansas RimRockers and the University of Arkansas-Little Rock.

[dfwabel]

I will not stay long or possibly reply since HBO Boxing is on and Gatti will be in the ring soon, but a few points.

1- NHL: Why should we talk about expansion if the league will reform in another like? Shouldn't it be more like, "NHL-PL (Post Lockout) or Post-Lockout North American Hockey"?

2-Some cities, whille large media markets by Arbitron, are not necesarily good sites because of the convention business or average income. Louisville, Sacramento, SLC, KC, are meduim convention sites. they typically attract conventions with 1,500 to no more than 10,000 visitors. Any Expansion to arenas or convention halls may not be worth the expense if the team owner receives the $$$. There may not be enough elite hotels, air service, or suite/club level income to make it occur.

3-Look at Louisville, if the NBA re-located, Freedom Hall would have to be replaced for various reasons. The property is located on the KY State Fairgrounds, and I am not sure if a downtown location is available since the AAA team went downtown (unlike OKC, who now has it all within a half mile). Papa John's Cardinal Stadium was privately financed, which is a plus for Louisville, but not NBA sustainable. It was "Memphis without FedEX"; both have gambling very close and a wet zone, but at least Memphis is a hub for NWA (Northwest).

4-I think we need to look at cities which would become 1 team towns with a first calss facility and hotels (also for media) and accomodating airports, like San Antonio. A large metro area without a pro team and a popular college team. Las Vegas is ripe for any pro sport, but MLS!

5-I understand that the economic climate has changed globally and corporations have HQs in citeis which we would have not have thought to be located 20 years ago, when I was 12 (20 years ago), but that does not qualify you as a major league city. Others are able to live off their legacy. Sorry!

If the Gatti fight ends early, I might be able to chat more, unless, I go out! Otherwise, I will look at this tomorrow.

[Cashcleaner]

CFL: Come on Tom Wright, let's get the ball rolling on an Atlantic franchise. Halifax is the perfect site for a new team. 

Given the tedious economic situation in the Maritimes, the lack of a stadium, and a rather lukewarm local reception since the idea has been presented, I wouldn't exactly use "perfect" in describing the location.

That said, I'd love to see it happen, but more than anything, I'd hate to see it fail. Tom, take it slow if that's what it'll mean to do it right.

Tedious economic situation? Not Halifax surely! It's no longer just a Navy and fishing town, but has Dalhousie University and it's prominent physics labs and is the third largest tech manufacturing city in Canada. It's been on a steady increase population-wise since the 80s as well, so I don't think it would be trouble finding a suitable fan-base. As for grounds, they always have Huskies Staduim.

I do agree though, the league will have to take a cautious approach to this. But I think its a very doable endevour. But even moreso in a socio-political argument, Halifax just makes sense as a city to have a professional sports team. It's a well-known port throuhgout the world and is the fourth most visited city for tourists.

[sportsfan331]

nhl

seattle

[Mac the Knife]

NFL:

Hope: Raleigh. Why? Because its my home town, and also because, if placed in the NFC South, within 3-5 years we'd be regularly kicking the plop out of the Panthers.

Think: Los Angeles, but it'll be via relocation rather than expansion. The NFL inexplicably has a hard-on for the market despite there not being a team there in 10 years, nor a desire by Angelinos (sp?) to have one.

MLB:

Hope: Again, Raleigh, but only because I miss not having a team within 250 miles of me.

Think: None. If there's any labor dispute to speak of after 2006, they're liable to contract the Twins and some other team rather than expand. Think Bud has forgotten about contraction? Think again.

NBA:

Hope: Louisville. They had the ABA Kentucky Colonels and are deserving of another shot at pro ball; far moreso than New Orleans or Memphis was, frankly.

Think: St. Louis. While Louisville has tradition, St. Louis has money and someone (Kronke) who is still pursuing a team.

NHL:

Hope: Hartford. In fact, if they want the Hurricanes back, most folks in Raleigh won't miss them nowadays...

Think: None. They're heading toward contraction with every day this work stoppage/lockout/pissing contest goes on.

OTHERS:

Hope: That Arena Football returns to Raleigh, only this time with an ownership group that's worth at least half a plop.

Think: That Arena Football will pick some half-assed city with half-assed ownership; same as they always do.

[FiddySicks]

2-Some cities, whille large media markets by Arbitron, are not necesarily good sites because of the convention business or average income. Louisville, Sacramento, SLC, KC, are meduim convention sites. they typically attract conventions with 1,500 to no more than 10,000 visitors. Any Expansion to arenas or convention halls may not be worth the expense if the team owner receives the $$$. There may not be enough elite hotels, air service, or suite/club level income to make it occur.

yeah but the areas around sacramento could support a team. the rivercats have a regular traveling fanbase as far as lake tahoe, which isnt too far but its a good 100 miles, and finding people (such as myself) to travel 100+ miles for every home minor league baseball game isnt too easy

[Pharos04]

NFL: Los Angeles.  How can the 2nd largest US city not have a professional footbal team?  It's beyond me.

Mainly because they ran off the Raiders and the Rams.

thank you for someone finally pointing that little factoid out. anyways, here are my thoughts on this:

NFL:Birmingham, AL and i dunno...Oklahoma City? seems like a good size city and also they really seem to enjoy their football down there. I don't think the NFL should expand into Canada with Toronto. definitely CFL territory and no need fo the NFL to go up there.

MLB:Hampton Roads/Greater Norfolk/Tidewater, VA and somewhere in Mexico. Why exacly does it have to be Monterry?

NHL: Winnipeg of course, Seattle, and what about the Dakotas? Seems they might have a hockey tradition or yearn there.

NBA: Don't really watch pro ball but if i had to pick a city or two to expand, St. Louis and Louisville.

Not to agree with just about everyone but a lot seems to be a general conscencious (sp?)

[JamesCraven]

"Think:  St. Louis.  While Louisville has tradition, St. Louis has money and someone (Kronke) who is still pursuing a team."

Stan Kroenke already owns an NBA team.

It's called the Denver Nuggets.

*EDIT: Happy now, poster formerly known as OneManManyFacets?*

[OMMF]

"Think:  St. Louis.  While Louisville has tradition, St. Louis has money and someone (Kronke) who is still pursuing a team."

Stan Kronke already owns an NBA team.

It's called the Denver Nuggets.

No, Stan Kroenke owns the Nuggets.

Stan Kronke is a rich guy in St Louis no one has heard of. Yet.

[Dilbert]

However, AF2 is waaaaaaaaay to big.

Its 20 teams! Thats not too big! Now when they had over thirty teams, that was too big.

[Puckguy14]

MLB: None now that DC has figured to get the Nats. If anywhere? Sacramento?

NFL: NONE! 32 is enough, LA doesn't need a team, they had two and both were itching to get out. Also according to the Raiders they still "own" the LA market so you'll have problems there. And good luck finding a place to play.

NBA: None. Perhaps Las Vegas, seems appropriate.

NHL: After the league contracts Florida, Anaheim, Carolina, and (gasp! Pittsburgh) perhaps Portland (since Seattle doesn't have a decent rink for hockey and Portland does.) Sacramento (could get the Ducks, which has been rumored by the Maloofs when they build Arco Arena 3.) And if they could get an arena deal...Hartford or Winnipeg (but do they have enough seats in the place for it to work?)

[Schoonerville]

NHL - Winnipeg

NBA - St. Louis

MLB - Montreal....

NLL - Boston

NFL - LA

CFL - HALIFAX!!

[FiddySicks]

MLB: None now that DC has figured to get the Nats. If anywhere? Sacramento?

NFL: NONE! 32 is enough, LA doesn't need a team, they had two and both were itching to get out. Also according to the Raiders they still "own" the LA market so you'll have problems there. And good luck finding a place to play.

NBA: None. Perhaps Las Vegas, seems appropriate.

NHL: After the league contracts Florida, Anaheim, Carolina, and (gasp! Pittsburgh) perhaps Portland (since Seattle doesn't have a decent rink for hockey and Portland does.) Sacramento (could get the Ducks, which has been rumored by the Maloofs when they build Arco Arena 3.) And if they could get an arena deal...Hartford or Winnipeg (but do they have enough seats in the place for it to work?)

accually the maloofs are trying to get out of sacto if they cant get a stadium deal done, so it could be two teams or none for sacto depending on the stadium deal

[winters in buffalo]

I didn't read the whole thread, so I don't know if anyone pointed this out yet.

Looking at it in terms of market size, I'd go with:

1. The largest market that isn't in that sport and has two or fewer other Big-4 teams OR 2. the largest market that doesn't yet have a team in that league.

That would leave us with:

NFL

1. Portland

2. LA

NHL

1. San Diego

2. Houston

NBA

1. San Diego (meets both of the above requirements)

MLB

1.Portland (meets both requirements)

OR for any of the leagues, any one of the largest markets in the US with no Big-4 teams:

Providence RI

Norfolk VA

Las Vegas NV

Austin TX

Lousiville, KY

Each of these cities is bigger than cities that already have at least 1 team: Jacksonville(1), Buffalo(2), Salt Lake City(1), Raleigh(1) and of course, Green Bay(1).