Forgettable sports teams

[The_Admiral]

Rangers should rebrand as the Dallas Chaparrals, or Chaps for short. It'd be a neat concept, if nothing else. I'll hang up and wait for the Argentine Asswipe to tell me why that's a horrible idea.

[dfwabel]

Rangers should rebrand as the Dallas Chaparrals, or Chaps for short. It'd be a neat concept, if nothing else. I'll hang up and wait for the Argentine Asswipe to tell me why that's a horrible idea.

At the same time, Cleveland should become the "Steamers" and Cincinnati should become the "Bowties".

[The_Admiral]

I don't think "Dallas Chaparral" is a sexual term.

[Jer15]

In Canada at least all six NHL teams qualify as relevant. Yeah, some may not have as broad and national a fanbase as others, but they all get coverage and all are present in the public consciousness to some degree. I've never met a Canadian hockey fan who was unaware of one of the six's existence.

As far as I see it, teams that sell out the arena most nights are relevant. Teams that can have their own cable station or sell pay-per-view for hockey games are relevant. Teams that have won championships are relevant. So, Calgary and Edmonton both fit that bill, and Vancouver does as well, minus a championship.

In the NHL there is one team I think you can all Irrelevant. Florida has gone to a Stanley cup so they even are slightly ahead of this team: Nashville.

Yes, Nashville's been able to have a fairly competitive team the past few years but they've won nothing, they have had horrible ownership, they have problems selling tickets (granted not as badly as Florida and Phoenix). That's how I see it.

I don't know about you guys, but I think whomever says that the Colorado Avalanche are an irrelevant team, is crazy. I'm not going to pick a fight here, cause that's childish, but 2 Stanley cups Patrcik Roy, Alex Tanguay, Joe Sakic, Peter Forsberg, Paul Kariya, Adam Foote, Ray Bourque, Rob Blake...and you can fill in the blanks are not irrelevant. As for the up and coming issue: one name Matt Duchene. Not enough? Wojtec Wolski.

But I digress.

Here's a side question for everyone: With a league like the NFL that constantly makes tons of money can you even consider their "most irrelevant team" irrelevant at all?

[IceCap]

The Nashville to Hamilton story a few years ago, and the headlines now and then about how the Preds are slowly turning their finances around keep them relevant, I think.

[Jer15]

The Nashville to Hamilton story a few years ago, and the headlines now and then about how the Preds are slowly turning their finances around keep them relevant, I think.

I hear you.

But I'm trying to not count that in, seems like any team that might move in the NHL will be another "to Hamilton" story.

[BBTV]

In Canada at least all six NHL teams qualify as relevant. Yeah, some may not have as broad and national a fanbase as others, but they all get coverage and all are present in the public consciousness to some degree. I've never met a Canadian hockey fan who was unaware of one of the six's existence.

As far as I see it, teams that sell out the arena most nights are relevant. Teams that can have their own cable station or sell pay-per-view for hockey games are relevant. Teams that have won championships are relevant. So, Calgary and Edmonton both fit that bill, and Vancouver does as well, minus a championship.

I disagree. The Sacramento Kings have sold out Arco arena for a lot of years, but they're close to (if not already) irrelevant. Also, winning a championship has nothing to do with relevance. There are plenty of teams in all of the sports that have won championships that nobody even pays a bit of attention to or would miss if they were gone. I'm not talking specifically about hockey - I don't feel that any of the Canadian NHL teams are irrelevant, but just in general, winning a championship does not guarantee relevance.

Here's a side question for everyone: With a league like the NFL that constantly makes tons of money can you even consider their "most irrelevant team" irrelevant at all?

Yes. Absolutely yes. The league is set up so that it is hard to achieve irrelevance, but it can happen, and there aren't different degrees of irrelevancy - once you're irrelevant, you ain't relevant. The Jacksonville Jaguars certainly irrelevant, despite being in the most successful league. Their only "hint" of relevancy is their position as a candidate to fill the LA hole. That's not good.

[PittsburghSucks]

NBA - Sacramento Kings

I barely knew this team even existed before the Webber years. Since they're in the gutter again, it's just a matter of time before the team finds yet another city to call home.

MLB - Milwaukee Brewers

The Brewers have been around for 40 years now, and they've won ONE division title. ONE. Plus, Milwaukee is just as much of a "Cubs town" as it is a "Brewers town".

NHL - Phoenix Coyotes

ZERO Stanley Cup Finals in thirty years. Come to think of it, has the Coyotes/Jets franchise even made a Conference Final??

NFL - Cleveland Browns

Since joining the league ten years ago, I can't recall the Browns winning, or even playing in a "big game". The NFL wouldda been better off giving the '99 expansion franchise to L.A.

"The NFL wouldda been better off giving the '99 expansion franchise to L.A." That statement is absurd!!!

They have mostly sucked since returning in 99, but they do have a huge following.

This is what Wikipedia had to say about their fan base.

"The most prominent organization of Browns fans is the Browns Backers Worldwide (BBW). The organization has approximately 93,100 members and is considered the largest sports-fan organization in the USA. Browns Backers clubs can be found in every major city in the United States, and in a number of military bases throughout the world, with the largest club being in Phoenix, Arizona. In addition, the organization has a sizable foreign presence in places as far away as Egypt, Australia, Japan, and Sri Lanka. According to The Official Fan Club of the Cleveland Browns, the two largest international fan clubs are in Alon Shvut, Israel and Niagara, Canada, with Alon Shvut having 129 members and Niagara having 310.

A 2006 study conducted by Bizjournal determined that Browns fans are the most loyal fans in the NFL. The study, while not scientific, was largely based on fan loyalty during winning and losing seasons (however, it does not account for the ratio of winning to losing seasons by a team), attendance at games, and challenges confronting fans (such as inclement weather or long-term poor performance of their team). The study noted that Browns fans filled 99.8% of the seats at Cleveland Browns Stadium during the last seven seasons, despite a combined record of 36 wins and 76 losses over that span"

I doubt the Browns being irrelevant with such a huge world wide fan base.

[HedleyLamarr]

Isn't Jigga a part of the BBW fan club?

[The_Admiral]

touchdown!

[Jer15]

Hey, Bring back the vet.

Awesome points about the Jags. I pretty much echo your sentiments but was wondering what the rest of the board would say. Thanks for the response.

I'd also like to say "good point" about the Sacramento Kings. Here's what I'm now feeling about this discussion, as I see your point and I still think that I'm onto something: What is the definition if an irrelevant sport franchise? Do ticket sales count? How about media coverage? (positive or negative, though you'd have to think positive counts for more as media loves negative stories) What is on field of play performance worth in this?

You know what I mean? What are the parameters that define a team as being irrelevant?

To me, it's a combo of a lack of interest (which of course translates into low ticket and merchandise sales), bad (or for that matter, no) advertising in order to increase awareness, performance on the field of play, and having that "something" the team can be remembered for.

Which, is why I'm fully aware of the fact that a team like my beloved Battalion (yes, I know the OHL isn't a pro league) is exactly that: Irrelevant. To me and a pocket of close followers, the Battalion would be horrible to loose and mean alot to us. But the reality of the situation is this; Last year was our first conference championship, that's what we have to show. We generally draw 2,000 fans to games, depending on who's in town. There is NO advertising for the team unless you go to the local beer stores which generally have the team pocket schedule on the counter. Or you decide to watch community TV.

The Brampton Battalion are irrelevant by definition to me. Which sucks hard cause they are my favorite minor or major league sports team.

But that said, that's how I define Irrelevancy, the question is: is that how you define it? Not you personally, bring back the vet, but I'd love to know everyone an this forum's opinion on that.

[IceCap]

Yes. Absolutely yes. The league is set up so that it is hard to achieve irrelevance, but it can happen, and there aren't different degrees of irrelevancy - once you're irrelevant, you ain't relevant. The Jacksonville Jaguars certainly irrelevant, despite being in the most successful league. Their only "hint" of relevancy is their position as a candidate to fill the LA hole. That's not good.

I disagree. The Jags' getting press and air time due to relocation rumours may not be good publicity, but it keeps them relevant. Relevancy doesn't always mean positive. The LA Clippers are known as the punchline of the NBA. It's not positive notoriety, but does keep them relevant. Same for the Jags. The relocation rumours do keep them in the news, thus they're relevant.

As for championships, no they do not directly equal relevancy, but they do help to keep the team in the public consciousness longer, which does help keep them relevant.

[DEAD!]

Which, is why I'm fully aware of the fact that a team like my beloved Battalion (yes, I know the OHL isn't a pro league) is exactly that: Irrelevant. To me and a pocket of close followers, the Battalion would be horrible to loose and mean alot to us. But the reality of the situation is this; Last year was our first conference championship, that's what we have to show. We generally draw 2,000 fans to games, depending on who's in town. There is NO advertising for the team unless you go to the local beer stores which generally have the team pocket schedule on the counter. Or you decide to watch community TV.

The Brampton Battalion are irrelevant by definition to me. Which sucks hard cause they are my favorite minor or major league sports team.

But that said, that's how I define Irrelevancy, the question is: is that how you define it? Not you personally, bring back the vet, but I'd love to know everyone an this forum's opinion on that.

It doesn't help that the arena isn't exactly at the best possible location in Brampton (in my opinion). The Majors don't draw much better, either. I am still perplexed that the Powerade and Hershey Centres are only a short drive (10 minutes) apart.

[BBTV]

Yes. Absolutely yes. The league is set up so that it is hard to achieve irrelevance, but it can happen, and there aren't different degrees of irrelevancy - once you're irrelevant, you ain't relevant. The Jacksonville Jaguars certainly irrelevant, despite being in the most successful league. Their only "hint" of relevancy is their position as a candidate to fill the LA hole. That's not good.

I disagree. The Jags' getting press and air time due to relocation rumours may not be good publicity, but it keeps them relevant. Relevancy doesn't always mean positive. The LA Clippers are known as the punchline of the NBA. It's not positive notoriety, but does keep them relevant. Same for the Jags. The relocation rumours do keep them in the news, thus they're relevant.

As for championships, no they do not directly equal relevancy, but they do help to keep the team in the public consciousness longer, which does help keep them relevant.

Well the Clippers are punchlines to jokes only to those who seriously follow sports. Your average casual fan or member of the general public probably never even thinks about the Clippers, unless their team is playing them. Same with the Jags. If I wasn't on this board so much, I probably wouldn't know anything about any possible moves to LA, because, while I follow standings, and obviously my teams, I'm not a sports geek who reads everything on ESPN.com, or wherever else news like that would be discussed. So I'd also say that to the casual fan or general public, they are completely irrelevant. If you're going to bring hard-core sports guys into this, then it would be hard to argue that any team is irrelevant.

[IceCap]

I don't read anything on ESPN.com either. It's just that every time I watch a NFL recap/countdown show the Jags' attendance problems and/or their relocation prospects are mentioned at least once. It's not positive, but it keeps the team in the news. Thus, they're relevant.

[Sodboy13]

I don't think "Dallas Chaparral" is a sexual term.

Well, you haven't been to my apartment this weekend.

[Lee.]

I don't think "Dallas Chaparral" is a sexual term.

Well, you haven't been to my apartment this weekend.

Thanks for the Stickam link, btw.

[Sodboy13]

I don't think "Dallas Chaparral" is a sexual term.

Well, you haven't been to my apartment this weekend.

Thanks for the Stickam link, btw.

That reminds me, I got approved for that vacation time for New Orleans. So make sure to read up on that link I sent you about "The Powdered Beignet".

[illwauk]

I can't speak for illwauk, but that season pushed me near the point that I could've sworn off watching basketball for the rest of my life and not missed it. I've never felt such sheer disgust for a team I follow.

Actually, I haven't followed the Bucks much at all since they traded away Ray Allen. And since he became a Celtic, I've been following them just as much (which isn't much at all, since the corporatized version of streetball that the NBA is nowadays bores me to sleep). I've tried to get excited about Brandon Jennings, but I think I've just been burned one too many times by the mind-numbing ineptness of that joke of a franchise. Before this year I've openly advocated for the Bucks to be folded in favor of a MLS or even a NHL team (the BC is built for hockey, which is why it's such a terrible place to see a basketball game). In fact, I would argue that when they moved into the BC, they left their soul at the MECCA because that's the last time I can remember them being as ingrained into the community as the Packers and Brewers. Even now when I need a hoops fix, I'd much rather pay $10 to see the alma mater at the MECCA than pay NBA prices for a team that'll be out of contention by January.

And re: Milwaukee being a "Cubs" town... Milwaukee USED TO have a decent Cubs following back when the Brewers were still in the AL. Much of that following was old folks who grew up on the Braves became Cubs fans when the Braves went down south and wound up keeping their allegiance when the Brewers came along because they preferred the NL style of ball (back when there actually was a difference). But even Milwaukeeans who weren't around for the Braves were more than happy to support the Cubs due to the WGN factor (which, even without cable, could be picked up in Milwaukee with a good enough antenna) and a mutual hatred for the Palehosers. But (and I can't emphasize this enough) the Cubs were ALWAYS a secondary team around here... much like the Sox are in Chicago.

It's a moot point now because once the Brewers switched leagues, the fans who came up from Illinois to see the Cubs in Milwaukee pretty much killed the Cubbies Milwaukee following overnight. Anyone who would tell you that the Cubs EVER had as big a following in Milwaukee as the Brewers, let alone NOW simply does not know what they're talking about and would probably do well to hang out somewhere other than the sportsbars around Marquette next time they visit.

[Jer15]

Which, is why I'm fully aware of the fact that a team like my beloved Battalion (yes, I know the OHL isn't a pro league) is exactly that: Irrelevant. To me and a pocket of close followers, the Battalion would be horrible to loose and mean alot to us. But the reality of the situation is this; Last year was our first conference championship, that's what we have to show. We generally draw 2,000 fans to games, depending on who's in town. There is NO advertising for the team unless you go to the local beer stores which generally have the team pocket schedule on the counter. Or you decide to watch community TV.

The Brampton Battalion are irrelevant by definition to me. Which sucks hard cause they are my favorite minor or major league sports team.

But that said, that's how I define Irrelevancy, the question is: is that how you define it? Not you personally, bring back the vet, but I'd love to know everyone an this forum's opinion on that.

It doesn't help that the arena isn't exactly at the best possible location in Brampton (in my opinion). The Majors don't draw much better, either. I am still perplexed that the Powerade and Hershey Centres are only a short drive (10 minutes) apart.

You nailed that one right on the head! plus the headache of getting out of there if we actually draw a decent crowd....2 measly 1 lane exits? come on!