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A Fine Mess


NJTank

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This is starting to go down an ugly path like Sandusky and can see the end of Jim Boeheim who is regretting his defiant defense of his assistant coach.

Syracuse Police investigating

http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/story/_/id/7291739/syracuse-police-turn-information-district-attorney

ESPN not releasing the smoking gun tape

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/11/28/idUS255518159020111128

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Other than a reprimand for the severity of his initial comments, I don't see Boeheim being in any serious trouble. There's no speculation he knew or had any idea anything was going on, unlike Paterno.

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Boeheim's only penalty is looking like a total douchelord.

Pretty much. It's understandable to go to bat for your assistant...but man, after the tape leaked, good freakin grief. Way to end up being completely off-base, there.

Anyways, I hope this guy gets what's coming to him. The more we get people like this out of positions like this, the better.

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I agree that at this point, there is no reason that Boeheim should get more than the bad publicity he earned. He should have realized you don't error on the side of belittling/doubting abuse victims. I'd have seen no problem with going the standard "I don't have a comment" route, as he wanted to believe his friend/coworker.

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I'm a fan of many sports teams, but Syracuse basketball is my favorite. This doesn't "feel" the same as the Penn State situation, as the university appears to have acted in accordance with all police inquiries at the appropriate times. Boeheim made some pretty regrettable comments, but at least had the good sense to sign off on an apology (that couldn't have been more "real," in my opinion).

If it turns out that Boeheim had any inkling of knowledge about Fine, then yes, certainly, he's done. However, if we've seen the worst of it (which I unfortunately doubt), then he's most likely safe.

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I'm a fan of many sports teams, but Syracuse basketball is my favorite. This doesn't "feel" the same as the Penn State situation, as the university appears to have acted in accordance with all police inquiries at the appropriate times. Boeheim made some pretty regrettable comments, but at least had the good sense to sign off on an apology (that couldn't have been more "real," in my opinion).

If it turns out that Boeheim had any inkling of knowledge about Fine, then yes, certainly, he's done. However, if we've seen the worst of it (which I unfortunately doubt), then he's most likely safe.

It does not "feel" the same because it is not the same.

1- Penn State had a Grand Jury investigate Sandusky and the information released from from its report. Nothing here is Syracuse.

2- The (Syracuse) Post-Standard talked to Davis for over 12 hours in 2002 and they did not have enough to find it as journalistic credible to publish.

3-When Davis talked to the Syracuse Police in 2002, it was a five minute conversation when he was in a car driving from Utah.

The release of the 2002 tape with Mrs. Fine was held by ESPN, but now it is corroborated now there is a third victim who come out on Sunday morning.

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The release of the 2002 tape with Mrs. Fine was held by ESPN, but now it is corroborated now there is a third victim who come out on Sunday morning.

Speaking of which, if we're burning down Penn State and everyone associated with it over the Sandusky thing, shouldn't we also put Bristol to the torch?

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The release of the 2002 tape with Mrs. Fine was held by ESPN, but now it is corroborated now there is a third victim who come out on Sunday morning.

Speaking of which, if we're burning down Penn State and everyone associated with it over the Sandusky thing, shouldn't we also put Bristol to the torch?

We should, but Syracuse is right up there in terms of ESPN's love affair with certain teams. No way in hell will they bad-mouth Syracuse if they can help it, nor will ESPN admit to having any sort of role in this.

If it's found out that Syracuse tried their best to cover this up like Penn State tried to, will those that were calling for PSU football to take a year off demand that Syracuse basketball suffer a similar fate?

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I think in 2002, if the newspaper did not have enough to publish it as journalism, then at the time ESPN may have had the same journalistic standards. Since 2002, they have tried to have an "Entertainment Tonight" like show and have lessened their journalistic credibility. They have hired Rick Riley , and gotten rid of Bruce Feldman, Amy J. Nelson, and Pat Forde. Granted, those on camera are not primarily reporters less investigative journalists, but they still have the same impact. The Penn State story is the sports equivalent to Watergate and when everything blew, CNN, New York Times, and the Harrisburg local paper kicked their a$$ and provide them all their information. So much for the World Wide Leader.

This Fine issue was reported to the newspaper and they did find it credible.

Also, if you were the police officer who too Davis' five minute, cell phone call from Utah in 2002, how would you react to it if the story talked about adult sexual encounters in addition to allegations to child sexual abuse? It was a five minute call from a person who was not even in the state, less the county. If an 30 minutes later you were told of a major felony, which would you concentrate on?

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If it's found out that Syracuse tried their best to cover this up like Penn State tried to, will those that were calling for PSU football to take a year off demand that Syracuse basketball suffer a similar fate?

I will.

And I've said that Penn State should get the death penalty. If Syracuse orchestrated a similar coverup with full knowledge of the crimes, then they should get the death penalty as well.

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Penn State vs. ESPN is apples and oranges with the information we have right now. Penn State someone witnessed something and did nothing. We know this because it was admitted to and in the Grand Jury report. ESPN got some information, tried to back it up before they put someone over the fire and couldn't find collaborating evidence. Completly different senerios.

If ESPN withheld a story because they are close to Syracuse or Fine, that's different. But it doesn't appear to be the case here.

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Penn State vs. ESPN is apples and oranges with the information we have right now. Penn State someone witnessed something and did nothing. We know this because it was admitted to and in the Grand Jury report. ESPN got some information, tried to back it up before they put someone over the fire and couldn't find collaborating evidence. Completly different senerios.

If ESPN withheld a story because they are close to Syracuse or Fine, that's different. But it doesn't appear to be the case here.

No pun intended? :P

As for this situation, yikes it's confusing as hell. Between Fine, Davis, ESPN, the period when the city of Syracuse was going to war with the Onondaga County DA over this.... just a really messy situation. The university's doing a good job of reacting to whatever new developments come out (well, besides getting 3 e-mails every time Chancy Nancy comes out with a new statement), but obviously there's no idea where this is all heading so for now SU as an institution's saying the right things, but that could change as we go along. Boeheim? If he knew about it, say hello to Mike Hopkins as the new head coach. If not, then his statements earlier will go down as one of Boeheim's most infamous soundbites.

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We should, but Syracuse is right up there in terms of ESPN's love affair with certain teams. No way in hell will they bad-mouth Syracuse if they can help it, nor will ESPN admit to having any sort of role in this.

If it's found out that Syracuse tried their best to cover this up like Penn State tried to, will those that were calling for PSU football to take a year off demand that Syracuse basketball suffer a similar fate?

Given ESPN's role in conference realignment issues and their cover-up of sex scandals, I wonder if any government intervention is warranted into their standards and practices. There seems to me to be some real questions about how they're using their market leverage to affect conferences and now criminal investigations.

With regard to your second question, yeah, you'd have to. I personally don't want any part of child abuse cover-up organizations.

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Given ESPN's ... cover-up of sex scandals, I wonder if any government intervention is warranted into their standards and practices.

Are you referring to Syracuse, or something else? Because I'm not seeing that here at all yet.

Typing on my phone so I confess to potentially posting without thinking, but didn't ESPN have prior knowledge of both these scandals before they broke? Not sure of the timeline on Penn State, but seems like ESPN had the Fine info nearly a decade ago. Why didn't they do anything with it? Was anyone else endangered in the intervening years?

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Given ESPN's ... cover-up of sex scandals, I wonder if any government intervention is warranted into their standards and practices.

Are you referring to Syracuse, or something else? Because I'm not seeing that here at all yet.

Typing on my phone so I confess to potentially posting without thinking, but didn't ESPN have prior knowledge of both these scandals before they broke? Not sure of the timeline on Penn State, but seems like ESPN had the Fine info nearly a decade ago. Why didn't they do anything with it? Was anyone else endangered in the intervening years?

It didn't meet "journalistic standards". Now considering ESPN's journalistic standards and credibility (thanks to all those juicy conflicts of interest) at the college level are on par with "crazy street person pushing shopping cart who claims space aliens stuck tater tots up his ass" this is incredibly ludicrous.

More importantly, as the general moral outrage directed at Penn State seems to be taking the stance that if you get any whiff of child molestation its your moral and human duty to tell the police immediately or else you should burn in hell, ummmmm....yeah ESPN needed to give that tape to the cops. Long ago.

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The big stat I keep in mind is its estimated up to 1/3 of all sexual assault cases are fabricated and its because the prosecuting party basically has nothing to lose by pursuing the matter. They can file lawsuit after lawsuit all the while putting the defendants name in the paper while they can be totally anonymous. Laws against people making multiple false claims are virtually non-existent. About the only thing a person making a false claim can be convicted of is wasting police time, which is very hard to prove.

There is something strange going on here whether or not that is Bernie Fine doing what he's being accused of doing, I don't know, but the fact that this case was looked at already and dismissed and is only coming out now when media attention is at its highest leads me to believe that there's at least a 50/50 chance here that this is basically made up. You have two people with aligned intersts and a phone conversation that probably wouldn't make it to a trial as admissible evidence if the matter were to be pursued which it can't be.

The only thing I can say with ESPN and all media outlets, stop playing cop. They're job is to make the sure the police are doing their job, not do it for them. There's very few consequences for a media person/outlet reporting a false story, otherwise Selena Roberts would not still have a job. You can't expect a force that has almost total immunity from the law and a huge financial interst to report bad news to possibly be a reliable source on which to go on in matters like these. Their job is to sell stories, not protect the innocent, and the two are not one in the same, so how can you possibly say they can be a reliable source for these kinds of matters. That doesen't mean you disregard everything the media. They usually do get it right, but it does mean that every story beyond the winning lottery numbers should be viewed with some scrutiny regardless of who's writing it or what its on.

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Wasn't there a third victim who stepped up?

There was. And it was reported by another news organization. Funny how quickly the damning tape emerged then.

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