Miami Marlins 2019 Rebrand

[IceCap]

3 hours ago, SFGiants58 said:

The 2019 set just seems like trend-chasing, trying to capture that "Hotline Miami"/vaporwave/Miami Heat Vice alternate "A E S T H E T I C" without understanding what makes it work.

See, I don't have a problem with the 80s Miami aesthetic. I've always had a preference for the overall 80s sports aesthetics, but moving to Florida made me realize how much the "Miami Vice" look fits with the brightness and boldness of the state. I wouldn't even be opposed to a full-time Miami Heat "Vice" look because they pull it off so damn well.

The Marlins botched it though. Which is somewhat surprising because at least someone in marketing understand how it can work.

 

 

 

Instead the font they chose for the uniforms feels like it came from the same mid-2000s school of thought that gave us the Black Jays' wordmark. And the decision to reduce the hot red and blue to wisps killed the vaporwave look before it even stood a chance. It's no coincidence that the above pictures that manage the 80s look better than the uniforms aren't shy about showing off the reds and blues.

 

I think the problem goes back to so many issues I have with the Marlins' identity since Jeter came in. 90s teal? Art deco nightlife? 80s Miami Vice? That stuff is all different, but it's all fun. And the Marlins should be fun. They're a team that came onto the scene in the 90s wearing a bright, trendy colour. Look, I love the Yankees, Dodgers, Tigers, and Cardinals' looks more than most. I unapologetically fill out my lists of "top five MLB looks" with classic identities because I think these are strong looks with history that have survived the test of time. And I'm pretty dismissive of "if it was designed today people wouldn't like it" as an argument, as context is not so easily discarded.

That said, there's room in baseball for something different here and there, and the Marlins should embrace what they've been. So this desire to make the Marlins look conservative- even when there are glimpses of a fun identity at work- strike me as looking in the wrong direction.

 

I don't want the team to look like they're wearing clown suites, but there are better ways to use the themes their current identity has then what they're currently wearing.

[The_Admiral]

We should do an "In Praise of Vaporwave" thread in General Design. I love it.

 

Said it once and I'll say it again, the 2012 Marlins redesign needed green and pastel orange. That, matching numbers, and a Marlins script at home would have gone a long way. A team that transcends team colors as we usually conceive of them.

[Marlins93]

I'm for one relieved that the Marlins have never pursued a vaporwave look. I have nothing against it in other contexts but can't imagine it working well for baseball jerseys.

[CaliforniaGlowin]

I'm all for a vaporwave thread! 

[SCL]

The Marlins are a mess from a brand identity standpoint and it all started with the rebrand when they opened the new stadium. The franchise has two fairly recent World Series wins but has somehow managed to erase those memories with two atrocious rebrands. For a natoriously fickle fanbase why would you not call upon the identity of two World Series victories as a selling point?

[The_Admiral]

Not much equity in world championships when you get rid of everyone who won them. The fire sales erased the memories worse than a Futura M did.

[SFGiants58]

33 minutes ago, the admiral said:

Not much equity in world championships when you get rid of everyone who won them. The fire sales erased the memories worse than a Futura M did.

 

Like I’ve said before, South Florida was an excellent place to put a team, given the right ownership. However, it’s been a long line of dirtbag owners who have actively sabotaged the team’s on-field abilities.

 

In hindsight, the NL/MLB should have handled the 90s expansions like this:

 

1993: Colorado/Washington

1998: Arizona/Miami (minus Huizenga)

 

Maybe the Expos would settle somewhere else, I’m not sure. Tampa Bay under different ownership or Portland/Charlotte would work.

 

I do get what @Marlins93 is getting at, though. No matter how terrible the Rockies are, they still look like they did at their various peaks (e.g., Larry Walker, Todd Helton, and the 2007 squad). The awfulness of the Royals for most of the past 35 years (minus the mid-2010s run) has been a bit offset by them still looking like they did during the glory days. That visual connection is important for expansion clubs, which the Marlins have done their best to screw up in favor of Loria’s artistic preferences and a “This is what the kids like these days” redesign that ignores what makes the “Vice” look work. This franchise has a ancient stain on it, one no ownership group can truly fix.

[Gothamite]

Ownership isn’t Tampa Bay’s problem.  They have proven that even a winner can’t draw.  They can be in first place every day of the season, go to a World Series, and still be the third most popular baseball team in town. 

[SFGiants58]

4 minutes ago, Gothamite said:

Ownership isn’t Tampa Bay’s problem.  They have proven that even a winner can’t draw.  They can be in first place every day of the season, go to a World Series, and still be the third most popular baseball team in town. 

 

Oh, I'm not talking about the current ownership. I'm talking about Vince Naimoli salting the earth for the first season of Devil Rays baseball. Jonah Keri went into great detail about that man's dickery in this excerpt from The Extra 2%. Here are some particularly scathing quotes:

 

Quote

Naimoli's Internet boycott continued for several more years. As late as 2003, if a Devil Rays employee wanted to sell group tickets or negotiate sponsorships, he had to buy his own Internet access and send emails from DevilRaysDude99@aol.com. According to data compiled by Northwestern University's Media Management Center, 62.4% of U.S. households had Internet access in 2003. The vast majority of businesses with more than a few employees had access. Every team in baseball was wired. Every team but the Devil Rays.

 

Quote

For all the abuse Naimoli heaped on local businesses, government, and the media, Devil Rays fans remained mostly unaffected—until the team implemented Draconian policies at the Trop. As attendance dwindled, some enterprising fans began looking for ways to sneak down to better seats. Management installed extra ushers all over the stadium, ordering them not only to prevent such seat upgrades but also to loudly chastise any fan who gave the slightest indication he was trying such a move. If the ushers opted to let a sneak-down slide, even in the ninth inning of a blowout game with 5,000 people in the stadium, they risked losing their jobs. Meanwhile, threatening signs dotted the stadium. Do not walk on the field, several signs warned, or you will face criminal prosecution and incarceration.

 

Quote

The Devil Rays also banned outside food. Many other teams had the same policy. But the way personnel enforced the rule, and who did the enforcing, was unique. Not surprisingly, ushers were the first line of defense against the scourge of peanut butter and jelly sandwiches. If they failed to detect the contraband, though, the Devil Rays had a backup plan: Detective Naimoli. The owner sat in the stands for most games, bringing him closer to the action, and to the fans. If he spotted a fan eating outside food, he'd walk over and ask where he entered the stadium. He would then call, find out who was manning that entrance, and have that person fired on the spot.

 

Naimoli's threats turned the D-Rays' stadium crew into unflinching supercops of snack prevention. A group of seniors hopped a bus to one game during that period. One couple within the group approached the stadium entrance, the wife in a wheelchair. Security found a bag of cashews on her and yanked them away. The elderly lady explained that she was diabetic and needed the nuts for her diet. The gate agent yelled back that no exceptions were tolerated. The husband jumped into the fray. After more arguing, the couple finally turned around, and the husband wheeled his wife back to the bus. There they sat for three and a half hours, until the game finally ended and the group returned. Local press got hold of the story. Some reporters might've sat on it, or at least downplayed it, under diffhTerent circumstances. But this was Vince Naimoli. The story came out. Naimoli refused to apologize. By the franchise's fourth season, the fans had completely turned on the Devil Rays' owner. When the team held a send-off ceremony at the Trop for Cal Ripken in 2001, fans serenaded Naimoli with a chorus of boos.

 

"Someone with the Rays once said to me, 'I didn't think one person could keep five thousand fans out of the seats—until I met Vince,' " said Deeson.

 

Never underestimate the ability of a particularly awful owner to destroy the potential for the sport in a market, especially for a young expansion club. Let's remember this too: he could have owned the Giants and run them into the ground like he did to the Rays! That's a horrifying thought.

 

I'd also argue that MLB (specifically Reinsdorf and his promise to move the White Sox to St. Petersburg, which prompted the construction of The Trop after failed referendums), the city leaders of St. Petersburg (e.g., Rick Dodge), and the constant promises of relocated teams/missing the 1993 expansion also killed Tampa Bay baseball in the womb.

 

This is why I'm only half-joking when I say that the Rays and Marlins should merge. Bring Stu Sternberg and his organizational talent to Miami, eliminate the dreadful legacy of the Marlins' ownership, and pay off The Trop from a distance. That's the best way to handle a Florida team (which MLB shouldn't abandon entirely), if there has to be a Florida team.

[Gothamite]

Yes, he was a creep. 

 

But if people let the bad feelings of 1998 keep them away from the best team in the AL in 2008, then that’s on them.  Not on him.  Winning a pennant is a great way to erase poor memories of a club’s beginnings, if the market is even halfway decent. 

 

If ownership was really the problem, then new owners would have solved it.  And they’ve been very good new owners. That the problem lingers so tells us there are other forces at work. 

[_DietDrPepper_]

I really want to like this set, but the black on black doesn’t work like I was hoping it to, and the baseball logo is pitiful. They got so close, in the end they should’ve just gone back to teal

[Marlins93]

 

1 hour ago, BellaSpurs said:

I really want to like this set, but the black on black doesn’t work like I was hoping it to, and the baseball logo is pitiful. They got so close, in the end they should’ve just gone back to teal

Aside from the excessive use of black, the design of the cap logo is by far the most disastrous part of the rebranding for me. The M looks ridiculous and combined with the fish it simply becomes a blobby mess. Much of this is due to there being little contrast between the two separate elements. The fish need not be as detailed as in the original logo, I suppose, but a black silhouette simply doesn't work here. And I still haven't understood the spatial inconsistency of the fish's left tail fin (oriented toward the center of the M)--the way it just disappears even though it is positioned in front of the letter in three-dimensional space.

 

At least the light blue sort of shows up from a reasonable distance. Probably the only positive thing to be said about the design.

[_DietDrPepper_]

50 minutes ago, Marlins93 said:

 

Aside from the excessive use of black, the design of the cap logo is by far the most disastrous part of the rebranding for me. The M looks ridiculous and combined with the fish it simply becomes a blobby mess. Much of this is due to there being little contrast between the two separate elements. The fish need not be as detailed as in the original logo, I suppose, but a black silhouette simply doesn't work here. And I still haven't understood the spatial inconsistency of the fish's left tail fin (oriented toward the center of the M)--the way it just disappears even though it is positioned in front of the letter in three-dimensional space.

 

At least the light blue sort of shows up from a reasonable distance. Probably the only positive thing to be said about the design.

I don’t mind the m logo, I actually quite like it. It’s a good update to the old rainbow marlin. It still doesn’t compare to the F logo from the teal era tho

[mmajeski06]

My main problem with the uniforms overall is that to appreciate any of the finer details or colors (besides black), you have to be up close. It’s all lost as soon as the camera pans out. Pretty bad when they are showing the Marlins pitcher from the 3rd base view, and the Marlins logo is lost, but the helmet logo on the Padres baserunner on first is perfectly legible. 

[IceCap]

4 hours ago, BellaSpurs said:

It still doesn’t compare to the F logo from the teal era tho

Yes, but “Miami Marlins” is a superior name to “Florida Marlins,” so the F logo is a non-starter. 

[SFGiants58]

4 minutes ago, Ice_Cap said:

Yes, but “Miami Marlins” is a superior name to “Florida Marlins,” so the F logo is a non-starter. 

 

They were almost the "South Florida Marlins," when Huizenga was worried that Tampa Bay would get the other 1993 expansion team. I'd love to see how f'd up the "SF + Marlin" design would be, especially since the "F" is already a complex piece of embroidery.

 

 

If they were going to "Phase 4" this design, losing a couple of key lines and going with a simpler marlin/less sharp "F" would be ideal. The "M" alternate logo, while messy for different reasons, at least had a better approach to key lines and the miter on the marlin's nose.

 

 

I honestly wouldn't mind dropping the marlin from the cap logo, relegating it to a sleeve patch like most other animal teams. A distinctive font is a better approach that the "fish+letter formula."

[Marlins93]

11 minutes ago, Ice_Cap said:

Yes, but “Miami Marlins” is a superior name to “Florida Marlins,” so the F logo is a non-starter. 

Well, more precisely it's a non-starter because the name won't be changing back anytime soon. I can go either way in saying which one is "superior." "Miami Marlins" is more alliterative but "Florida Marlins" rolls off the tongue easier. Having said that, if they wanted to revert to a "Florida Marlins" aesthetic, they could surely come up with an M logo of the similar style. Just something different from the blobby mess they have now.

[_DietDrPepper_]

16 minutes ago, Ice_Cap said:

Yes, but “Miami Marlins” is a superior name to “Florida Marlins,” so the F logo is a non-starter. 

I disagree, most times I would agree, but something about Florida Marlins just sounds better than Miami Marlins

[Marlins93]

7 minutes ago, SFGiants58 said:

 

They were almost the "South Florida Marlins," when Huizenga was worried that Tampa Bay would get the other 1993 expansion team. I'd love to see how f'd up the "SF + Marlin" design would be, especially since the "F" is already a complex piece of embroidery.

 

 

If they were going to "Phase 4" this design, losing a couple of key lines and going with a simpler marlin/less sharp "F" would be ideal. The "M" alternate logo, while messy for different reasons, at least had a better approach to key lines and the miter on the marlin's nose.

 

 

I honestly wouldn't mind dropping the marlin from the cap logo, relegating it to a sleeve patch like most other animal teams. A distinctive font is a better approach that the "fish+letter formula."

 

This is purely personal preference, but I think they need a fish represented somehow on the cap logo. A plain M just wouldn't sit right for the team's identity, especially not the existing (most recent rebranding) M they're wearing. The curious thing about the new set is that the BP cap (fish only) looks 1000x better than the in-game cap. I'm not sure what the solution here is. I'd like to see a slightly more simplified version of the original Marlin.

 

I am really envious of the Diamondbacks insignia. It's neither too complex nor too simple. It perfectly encapsulates both the team's animal mascot and Southwestern aesthetic within a single letter, I wish the Marlins had been able to come up with something as perfect as this from the very beginning.

[IceCap]

1 hour ago, BellaSpurs said:

I disagree, most times I would agree, but something about Florida Marlins just sounds better than Miami Marlins

Only because you’re used to it.

Miami is way too unique and culturally important to have its name discarded in favour of a bland state-wide nickname.