Lions uniform changes

[oldschoolvikings]

oldschoolvikings, how can you say that? They are in different background colors, of course it won't have the exact same pattern. That's just a basic thing about any traditional jersey. Usually the stripe widths and layout are the same but obviously the colors change. That's just basic stuff. It doesn't make it not match.

But it absolutely could've had the exact same stripe, colors and all, and very easy. Just change the silver stripe to blue on the home jersey, and the silver stripes to white on the road jersey. Simple. Then they'd have an identical stripe on every part of the uniform. In fact, when Colorwerx first mentioned stripe consistancy as the big hallmark of this uni, I was sure that was what they'd do. To be honest, matching this particular stripe is so easy, I'm shocked they didn't, and its one of the reasons I think this update is slightly dissapointing.

Mmm...like posters before me said, now you are just looking for excuses to hate this. The striping obviously matches throughout. You are looking for the exact continuity seen in the Blue Jackets or UF Gators (even though their width's are messed up). And I think that's nitpicking and asking for a little much.

OK, first off, read my post. Hate? Where did I say hate? I said "slightly dissapointing"... as in "not as nice as it could be". If you're gonna put words in my mouth at least try to make it less obvious. Your broad definition of "matching" is almost forcing me to take a position of ripping on these unis. So far, I haven't done that. These uniforms are OK... an improvement on the most recent ones. I love the new logo.

But...

No, the striping DOES NOT "obviously" match throughout. You can keep saying it, but it won't make it so. If your definition of matching stripes is "the same number of stripes, using some combination of the same colors" then yeah... these stripes match. So do a lot of uniforms. But if the definition of matching is the stripes match then no... not quite. I'm NOT hating... I'm saying there are any number of ways they could've gone to make the stripes match... they didn't . I'm not even saying the should've, just that they didn't.

[McCall]

Here's the principal I use for "consistency" among the different color bases/jerseys:

Beginning on white background, the absence of color (yes, I know white is ALL colors, but in sports, most every team has a white jersey, either as home or road, so in essence, with sports, white can be considered the lack of color).

The basic stripe pattern goes black/silver/blue/silver/black (I'm not notating thin or thick. Look at the pics and you can figure that out easily).

- So on white, you have the basic pattern.

- When you go onto silver (pants/helmet), you swap the white with the stripe of the color of the new background, silver. So the pattern becomes black/white/blue/white/black on silver.

- When you go onto blue (jersey), you first go back to the basic pattern on white, and then from there, again, you swap white with the color of the new base (blue jersey), which makes the pattern go to black/silver/white/silver/black.

That's what it's about, basically. Substituting white in place of the new base color.

If they still had the black jersey, then for consistency, white would swap with black, creating white/silver/blue/silver/white, which may look kind of odd, actually. Then, you might swap some colors within the pattern, if it creates a more appealing look.

The other way, the Florida method as I refer to it, is acceptable, but it's not the ONLY consistant way. There are the 2. I sometimes like the Florida method, but it also does seem to make it appear sometimes that there are actually multiple striping patterns when it is in fact the same, just on different base colors. That can look good or not. That is why, in my opinion, there are the 2 acceptable forms of consistant striping.

[/end my little spiel]

[STL FANATIC]

Bingo, McCall.

Better description than I put forth.

[elliott]

oldschoolvikings, how can you say that? They are in different background colors, of course it won't have the exact same pattern. That's just a basic thing about any traditional jersey. Usually the stripe widths and layout are the same but obviously the colors change. That's just basic stuff. It doesn't make it not match.

But it absolutely could've had the exact same stripe, colors and all, and very easy. Just change the silver stripe to blue on the home jersey, and the silver stripes to white on the road jersey. Simple. Then they'd have an identical stripe on every part of the uniform. In fact, when Colorwerx first mentioned stripe consistancy as the big hallmark of this uni, I was sure that was what they'd do. To be honest, matching this particular stripe is so easy, I'm shocked they didn't, and its one of the reasons I think this update is slightly dissapointing.

Mmm...like posters before me said, now you are just looking for excuses to hate this. The striping obviously matches throughout. You are looking for the exact continuity seen in the Blue Jackets or UF Gators (even though their width's are messed up). And I think that's nitpicking and asking for a little much.

OK, first off, read my post. Hate? Where did I say hate? I said "slightly dissapointing"... as in "not as nice as it could be". If you're gonna put words in my mouth at least try to make it less obvious. Your broad definition of "matching" is almost forcing me to take a position of ripping on these unis. So far, I haven't done that. These uniforms are OK... an improvement on the most recent ones. I love the new logo.

But...

No, the striping DOES NOT "obviously" match throughout. You can keep saying it, but it won't make it so. If your definition of matching stripes is "the same number of stripes, using some combination of the same colors" then yeah... these stripes match. So do a lot of uniforms. But if the definition of matching is the stripes match then no... not quite. I'm NOT hating... I'm saying there are any number of ways they could've gone to make the stripes match... they didn't . I'm not even saying the should've, just that they didn't.

I will keep saying it, because it is so. They do match. My definition is not that the widths are the same and the number of stripes are the same. These Lions unis match. McCall put a pretty good description out on why both ways work. Under your definition, then teams like the Sharks, (hockey) Panthers, Knicks, Blazers, and Packers (to use a wide variety of examples) don't match at all. When it is quite plain to see to me that they do.

[BBTV]

Here's the principal I use for "consistency" among the different color bases/jerseys:

Beginning on white background, the absence of color (yes, I know white is ALL colors, but in sports, most every team has a white jersey, either as home or road, so in essence, with sports, white can be considered the lack of color).

The basic stripe pattern goes black/silver/blue/silver/black (I'm not notating thin or thick. Look at the pics and you can figure that out easily).

- So on white, you have the basic pattern.

- When you go onto silver (pants/helmet), you swap the white with the stripe of the color of the new background, silver. So the pattern becomes black/white/blue/white/black on silver.

- When you go onto blue (jersey), you first go back to the basic pattern on white, and then from there, again, you swap white with the color of the new base (blue jersey), which makes the pattern go to black/silver/white/silver/black.

That's what it's about, basically. Substituting white in place of the new base color.

If they still had the black jersey, then for consistency, white would swap with black, creating white/silver/blue/silver/white, which may look kind of odd, actually. Then, you might swap some colors within the pattern, if it creates a more appealing look.

The other way, the Florida method as I refer to it, is acceptable, but it's not the ONLY consistant way. There are the 2. I sometimes like the Florida method, but it also does seem to make it appear sometimes that there are actually multiple striping patterns when it is in fact the same, just on different base colors. That can look good or not. That is why, in my opinion, there are the 2 acceptable forms of consistant striping.

[/end my little spiel]

You're certainly not wrong, but I just think that the silver and white are so close that differences (due to logical swapping) stand out too much, and ruin the effect. On more dramatic base color differences (like if they had blue pants or black pants) then I think your and STL's points are totally valid. Not that they're invalid as is, but for the reason I stated I think they should have done it differently.

[The_Admiral]

I just can't get past the numbers. I don't like them at all.

[TruColor]

I just can't get past the numbers. I don't like them at all.

I like 'em. But then again, I like me some funky crap.

[DG_YouKnowWhatThatMeans]

I just can't get past the numbers. I don't like them at all.

I was about to post something similar -- I don't care about the striping minutiae. I just think it's ugly.

[IceCap]

Here's the principal I use for "consistency" among the different color bases/jerseys:

Beginning on white background, the absence of color (yes, I know white is ALL colors, but in sports, most every team has a white jersey, either as home or road, so in essence, with sports, white can be considered the lack of color).

The basic stripe pattern goes black/silver/blue/silver/black (I'm not notating thin or thick. Look at the pics and you can figure that out easily).

- So on white, you have the basic pattern.

- When you go onto silver (pants/helmet), you swap the white with the stripe of the color of the new background, silver. So the pattern becomes black/white/blue/white/black on silver.

- When you go onto blue (jersey), you first go back to the basic pattern on white, and then from there, again, you swap white with the color of the new base (blue jersey), which makes the pattern go to black/silver/white/silver/black.

That's what it's about, basically. Substituting white in place of the new base color.

If they still had the black jersey, then for consistency, white would swap with black, creating white/silver/blue/silver/white, which may look kind of odd, actually. Then, you might swap some colors within the pattern, if it creates a more appealing look.

The other way, the Florida method as I refer to it, is acceptable, but it's not the ONLY consistant way. There are the 2. I sometimes like the Florida method, but it also does seem to make it appear sometimes that there are actually multiple striping patterns when it is in fact the same, just on different base colors. That can look good or not. That is why, in my opinion, there are the 2 acceptable forms of consistant striping.

[/end my little spiel]

This, this, and more this.

oldschoolvikings, yes they do indeed match throughout. The pattern is consistent. The base changes the order of the colours, but it's still the same pattern throughout. It really does seem like you're really looking for a reason to hate these.

Goth, I'm pretty sure striping consistency was a goal of the Lions with this uniform redesign. What they did certainly qualifies as "consistent."

It may not match the definition of the word you favour, but in a broader sense the Lions did indeed introduce striping consistency with the redesign.

Also, when I mean the Pittsburgh Steelers are a terrible case of striping consistency I mean throughout the uniform set. The sleeve striping doesn't match the striping on either the helmet nor the pants. If anything "FAILS" that does*.

*The Steelers still have pretty nice uniforms. I just think it's silly to use them as a case of striping consistency.

[oldschoolvikings]

oldschoolvikings, yes they do indeed match throughout. The pattern is consistent. The base changes the order of the colours, but it's still the same pattern throughout. It really does seem like you're really looking for a reason to hate these.

I'm not saying the stripes don't match because I'm "looking for a reason to hate these" because I DON'T hate these... as I keep saying. Read carefully this time... I think they're OK... no hate.

I'm saying the stripes don't match, because, strictly speaking, they... you know... DON'T.

[Nemesis]

oldschoolvikings, yes they do indeed match throughout. The pattern is consistent. The base changes the order of the colours, but it's still the same pattern throughout. It really does seem like you're really looking for a reason to hate these.

I'm not saying the stripes don't match because I'm "looking for a reason to hate these" because I DON'T hate these... as I keep saying. Read carefully this time... I think they're OK... no hate.

I'm saying the stripes don't match, because, strictly speaking, they... you know... DON'T.

Good debate all around.

I love what they've done and think it's a HUGE step in the right direction.

I'm just wondering how many people will change their opinions when they see the actual uniform.

It's amazing how different things can look when you see them "live" and put together. Seeing them on paper is nice, but until you can get the full on live 3D effect, everything is still just projection and guessing. That goes for depth of color, thickness of striping, etc.

[Bmac]

Has anything official been released?

[umlegend80]

You wanna talk about something that doesn't match, how about the Viking's wordmark! I mean, the "n" is lower case while the rest of the letters are capitalized! What a crock, man. It's terrible!

[logoman]

This has been brought up by many, so it's nothing new. But since we are a visual lot, I thought I would should what true consistency would be.Personally, I have no problem with what they chose to do.Keep in mind, the silver would not be visible on the helmet or pants. This is why I think what they did is acceptable. Consider the numbers on the white jersey are blue with silver and black outlines. And that the numbers on the blue jersey are white with silver and black outlines.My colors are off, but you get the idea.

[Lateral]

Well now that we're done talking about the striping consistancy (I hope).....what color shoes do you think they're going to wear? Black or white?

[elliott]

Well now that we're done talking about the striping consistancy (I hope).....what color shoes do you think they're going to wear? Black or white?

Um why would we be done talking about striping consistency? This is a forum dedicated to logo and jersey design after all. Striping > shoes.

(And personally I'm enjoying all this debating)

Logoman good mockup but I agree with Nordiques, it's a little distracting to look at with all those stripes.

[Gothamite]

Also, when I mean the Pittsburgh Steelers are a terrible case of striping consistency I mean throughout the uniform set. The sleeve striping doesn't match the striping on either the helmet nor the pants. If anything "FAILS" that does*.

*The Steelers still have pretty nice uniforms. I just think it's silly to use them as a case of striping consistency.

Again, that post was responding to the specific claim that a team can't have road jersey sleeve stripes match home jersey sleeve stripes. Demonstrably untrue.

[IceCap]

Also, when I mean the Pittsburgh Steelers are a terrible case of striping consistency I mean throughout the uniform set. The sleeve striping doesn't match the striping on either the helmet nor the pants. If anything "FAILS" that does*.

*The Steelers still have pretty nice uniforms. I just think it's silly to use them as a case of striping consistency.

Again, that post was responding to the specific claim that a team can't have road jersey sleeve stripes match home jersey sleeve stripes. Demonstrably untrue.

Well they can, but at the same time the order of the colours can change and still be "consistent."

oldschoolvikings, yes they do indeed match throughout. The pattern is consistent. The base changes the order of the colours, but it's still the same pattern throughout. It really does seem like you're really looking for a reason to hate these.

I'm not saying the stripes don't match because I'm "looking for a reason to hate these" because I DON'T hate these... as I keep saying. Read carefully this time... I think they're OK... no hate.

I'm saying the stripes don't match, because, strictly speaking, they... you know... DON'T.

Except that they, you know, DO.

The pattern is consistent. You can't say it isn't. Only the order of the colours change. And changing the order of colours on consistent uniform striping is a perfectly acceptable practise within the world of sports uniforms.

[oldschoolvikings]

Also, when I mean the Pittsburgh Steelers are a terrible case of striping consistency I mean throughout the uniform set. The sleeve striping doesn't match the striping on either the helmet nor the pants. If anything "FAILS" that does*.

*The Steelers still have pretty nice uniforms. I just think it's silly to use them as a case of striping consistency.

Again, that post was responding to the specific claim that a team can't have road jersey sleeve stripes match home jersey sleeve stripes. Demonstrably untrue.

Well they can, but at the same time the order of the colours can change and still be "consistent."

oldschoolvikings, yes they do indeed match throughout. The pattern is consistent. The base changes the order of the colours, but it's still the same pattern throughout. It really does seem like you're really looking for a reason to hate these.

I'm not saying the stripes don't match because I'm "looking for a reason to hate these" because I DON'T hate these... as I keep saying. Read carefully this time... I think they're OK... no hate.

I'm saying the stripes don't match, because, strictly speaking, they... you know... DON'T.

Except that they, you know, DO.

The pattern is consistent. You can't say it isn't. Only the order of the colours change. And changing the order of colours on consistent uniform striping is a perfectly acceptable practise within the world of sports uniforms.

So, the stripes match perfectly... except for all the colors changing . If that's your definition of matching great. You know I'm a perect match for Brad Pitt... all our arms and legs are in the same position.

So, no... no match. Consistent size, consistent number of stripes... inconsistent color placement. Two outta three, Meatloaf.

[McCall]

Also, when I mean the Pittsburgh Steelers are a terrible case of striping consistency I mean throughout the uniform set. The sleeve striping doesn't match the striping on either the helmet nor the pants. If anything "FAILS" that does*.

*The Steelers still have pretty nice uniforms. I just think it's silly to use them as a case of striping consistency.

Again, that post was responding to the specific claim that a team can't have road jersey sleeve stripes match home jersey sleeve stripes. Demonstrably untrue.

Well they can, but at the same time the order of the colours can change and still be "consistent."

oldschoolvikings, yes they do indeed match throughout. The pattern is consistent. The base changes the order of the colours, but it's still the same pattern throughout. It really does seem like you're really looking for a reason to hate these.

I'm not saying the stripes don't match because I'm "looking for a reason to hate these" because I DON'T hate these... as I keep saying. Read carefully this time... I think they're OK... no hate.

I'm saying the stripes don't match, because, strictly speaking, they... you know... DON'T.

Except that they, you know, DO.

The pattern is consistent. You can't say it isn't. Only the order of the colours change. And changing the order of colours on consistent uniform striping is a perfectly acceptable practise within the world of sports uniforms.

So, the stripes match perfectly... except for all the colors changing . If that's your definition of matching great. You know I'm a perect match for Brad Pitt... all our arms and legs are in the same position.

So, no... no match. Consistent size, consistent number of stripes... inconsistent color placement. Two outta three, Meatloaf.

Give me a team who's striping matches PERFECTLY throughout the whole uniform. No one does. Not even Florida, cuz while the colors may stay in the same order throughout, the size doesn't, so it's not perfect, which most here seem to be claiming the Lions failed to do. The closest you can get to perfection with uniforms is consistency, and as we've mentioned and discussed to death, there are 2 types of consistency. The Lions DO achieve one of those types. And I know no one here is debating this simply cuz they wanna hate the Lions' uniforms. I don't think anyone here is that petty. But, it does seem they are trying to argue their point too much as if it is the only correct way.

I think the matter of consistency can be put to rest, and simply understand that some of us like the look for the Lions, specifically, and some don't. Simple as that. But the arguing over consistency has now turned in to simply repetitive statements that are getting a little tiring to hear. Both sides have made their point and you can't really go any further than that with it.

[/end my speech]

[/end doing these end bracket thingies cuz I don't really know why I started doing them so much in the first place]

[/end post]

[/dammit]

[/end putting thought in brackets]

[/end... just... END... for the love of god, Matt]