Pete Rose nearing reinstatement?

[goalieboy82]

i am not talking about that if he get into this or that. he should go into the hall of fame but baseball (and the hof) should let him in after he dies (makes him think that if he didn't bet on baseball he would be in the hof right now).

[BBTV]

my post still addresses your point...

[rams80]

I'm less concerned about re-instatement, but he should be in the HOF.

If the voters stick to their high and mighty guns about potentially steroid tainted players (they shouldn't, but if they're gonna they oughta be consistent) and keep Bonds out, then you've got a baseball Hall of Fame without the Hits and Home Runs leader. Or as I like to call it, a joke.

Ironic, since this is the same crew whose profession is ostensibly about reporting and telling "the truth" whatever that means.

They're part of your history. Whitewashing over it does not tell "the truth" at all.

[Jimmy!]

If you cheat, if you damage the integrity of the game, you should be out. If you let Rose in, but deny Jackson, if you let McGwire in, but not Bonds, any argument about maintaining the reputation of baseball is damaged (but then it's not like baseball's reputation has been stellar the last 20 years). If you let one 'roided up gambler in, let them all in.

[rangerfan94]

Rose, if Im not mistaken, bet on baseball as a manager, not as a player.

The steroids, well baseball had no problem when Mac and Sosa were chasing the Maris H.R. record, as I recall. I saw Macs record breaker on TV and it wasnt even to be broadcasted on the tube. But it was great for baseball at the time, as the game was trying to get fans back after the lockout or strike or whatever.

[GFB]

Rose, if Im not mistaken, bet on baseball as a manager, not as a player.

The steroids, well baseball had no problem when Mac and Sosa were chasing the Maris H.R. record, as I recall. I saw Macs record breaker on TV and it wasnt even to be broadcasted on the tube. But it was great for baseball at the time, as the game was trying to get fans back after the lockout or strike or whatever.

That's a worse offense, IMO. As a player, you can only have minimal effect altering the outcome of a game, and most of it is by chance. IF the ball is hit to you, IF you come up with the bases loaded, etc. A manager oversees all aspects of a team and can potentially set his entire team up to fail.

This may be a dumb question, but was Selig the one who banned Rose in the first place? Or was it another commissioner?

[Waffles]

Rose, if Im not mistaken, bet on baseball as a manager, not as a player.

The steroids, well baseball had no problem when Mac and Sosa were chasing the Maris H.R. record, as I recall. I saw Macs record breaker on TV and it wasnt even to be broadcasted on the tube. But it was great for baseball at the time, as the game was trying to get fans back after the lockout or strike or whatever.

That's a worse offense, IMO. As a player, you can only have minimal effect altering the outcome of a game, and most of it is by chance. IF the ball is hit to you, IF you come up with the bases loaded, etc. A manager oversees all aspects of a team and can potentially set his entire team up to fail.

This may be a dumb question, but was Selig the one who banned Rose in the first place? Or was it another commissioner?

It was A. Bartlett Giamatti (father of actor Paul Giamatti) who suspended Rose. He passed away eight days after handing the punishment down.

[knnhrvy16]

Rose, if Im not mistaken, bet on baseball as a manager, not as a player.

The steroids, well baseball had no problem when Mac and Sosa were chasing the Maris H.R. record, as I recall. I saw Macs record breaker on TV and it wasnt even to be broadcasted on the tube. But it was great for baseball at the time, as the game was trying to get fans back after the lockout or strike or whatever.

That's a worse offense, IMO. As a player, you can only have minimal effect altering the outcome of a game, and most of it is by chance. IF the ball is hit to you, IF you come up with the bases loaded, etc. A manager oversees all aspects of a team and can potentially set his entire team up to fail.

This may be a dumb question, but was Selig the one who banned Rose in the first place? Or was it another commissioner?

Its not a dumb question at all, infact its a very good one. Selig infact, did not ban Rose. It was then-comissioner A. Bartlett Giamatti, who oddly enough died not too long after banning him.

I had read somewhere (cant remember where, unfortunately though) that Giamatti was very mildly considering working things out with Rose later in his term, a sort of compromise, if you will. Not a comlplete lift of the ban, but something better than what Rose had been punished with. Perhaps a reduction of the ban to 20-30 years, I dont know. But it makes you wonder that if there were any truth to this (im honestly quite speculant), and had Giamatti lived, if maybe this would indeed take place and that Rose would be reinstated soon by finishing up the ban or even possibly now?

[GeorgesL]

Well, it's about frickin' time!

[DG_ThenNowForever]

Rose, if Im not mistaken, bet on baseball as a manager, not as a player.

The steroids, well baseball had no problem when Mac and Sosa were chasing the Maris H.R. record, as I recall. I saw Macs record breaker on TV and it wasnt even to be broadcasted on the tube. But it was great for baseball at the time, as the game was trying to get fans back after the lockout or strike or whatever.

That's a worse offense, IMO. As a player, you can only have minimal effect altering the outcome of a game, and most of it is by chance. IF the ball is hit to you, IF you come up with the bases loaded, etc. A manager oversees all aspects of a team and can potentially set his entire team up to fail.

This may be a dumb question, but was Selig the one who banned Rose in the first place? Or was it another commissioner?

It was A. Bartlett Giammatti (who I'll forever remember because of the WTF? reaction I had when getting his baseball card), and he died a week later or so. Selig had said he wouldn't reverse it out of respect to Giammatti.

[knnhrvy16]

Another point that should be made is the unfortunate fact that Joe Jackson was given a lifetime ban as well, and he has not been reinstated since his death in 1951, 58 years ago.

To my knowledege, from Jackson's death to today, there have been six commissioners and NONE of them of course have reinstated him.

My point is that perhaps these "lifetime" bans will always be more than what they're supposed to be: lifetime bans.

When Pete Rose passes away, whos to say it wont be another 50 years before the ban is lifted if it hasnt already? No matter who the commissioner may be? If six different commissioners pass on Jackson, then whos to say another six wont pass on Rose?

It's a sad thought and I don't agree with it, but i'm just speaking for reality here. Jackson's lifetime ban has turned into more like two lifetime bans, and its a shame that even 58 years after his ban was supposedly to end that it infact hasnt come close yet.

I'm afraid to say it, but if Rose doesent get reinstated while he's alive, he may not be for a very, VERY long time afterwards.

[rangerfan94]

My point was ,he bet on baseball as a MANAGER, not a player. Rose SHOULD be in as a player.

[BBTV]

It's a freaking museum. Electing him as a member doesn't make him the new jesus.

Not sure how not allowing writers who work for independent news outlets to vote for a guy to get into a club == truly banning him from the game, and never allowing him to manage, coach, or be a bat boy ever again.

I agree that gambling (for or against your team - it's all the same) should get you expelled. I don't think that putting him in the hall in any way means that he's back in the game.

[tp49]

Pete Rose should be in the Hall of Fame due to his accomplishments on the field. As Pete bet on baseball as a manager to me it shouldn't color what he did on the field.

However, I do agree with his ban from baseball. He committed essentially tha baseball "death sentence" by betting not only on the game, but on his own team while a manager.

Though, here's a point to ponder. For years Pete Rose has made his name as the guy who should be in the Hall of Fame but is banished from it. If they allowed Rose into the hall I think it would take away a substantial amount of the income he generates. I tend to believe this is also the reason Pete hasn't made a great push to be reinstated. He makes a lot of money by not being in the Hall of Fame and I'm guessing he figures his income will drop if he were in the Hall.

[BBTV]

Though, here's a point to ponder. For years Pete Rose has made his name as the guy who should be in the Hall of Fame but is banished from it. If they allowed Rose into the hall I think it would take away a substantial amount of the income he generates. I tend to believe this is also the reason Pete hasn't made a great push to be reinstated. He makes a lot of money by not being in the Hall of Fame and I'm guessing he figures his income will drop if he were in the Hall.

But Pete has lobbied to get into the hall. His whole "admission" was part of a plan to eventually get into the hall. His former teammate Mike Schmidt has openly campaigned (pretty aggressively, for a while - presumably with Rose's blessing) to get him put in the hall.

[HedleyLamarr]

Didn't Rose agree to the limetime ban and sign off on it?

[STL FANATIC]

Didn't Rose agree to the limetime ban and sign off on it?

He did so under the condition that he could apply for reinstatement within a year. I believe he did so believing that the Commissioner would one day reinstate him.

But I wasn't around back then, so I have no real idea.

[BBTV]

Didn't Rose agree to the limetime ban and sign off on it?

He did so under the condition that he could apply for reinstatement within a year. I believe he did so believing that the Commissioner would one day reinstate him.

But I wasn't around back then, so I have no real idea.

Yeah, that's pretty much it from what I remember. Had he really been caught, he would just have been banned. Since they never really proved it, he eventually just agreed to the ban without admitting guilt just so that they'd stop fighting. I don't think anyone ever thought that it was really "lifetime", despite the title. Regardless, he had to take that risk when he signed it, and I have no problem with it being upheld. However, I still can't understand how being eligible for the HOF has anything to do with being banned from the game. His bronze bust won't be influencing any games or players.

[Sport]

Didn't Rose agree to the limetime ban and sign off on it?

He did so under the condition that he could apply for reinstatement within a year. I believe he did so believing that the Commissioner would one day reinstate him.

But I wasn't around back then, so I have no real idea.

Yeah, that's pretty much it from what I remember. Had he really been caught, he would just have been banned. Since they never really proved it, he eventually just agreed to the ban without admitting guilt just so that they'd stop fighting. I don't think anyone ever thought that it was really "lifetime", despite the title. Regardless, he had to take that risk when he signed it, and I have no problem with it being upheld. However, I still can't understand how being eligible for the HOF has anything to do with being banned from the game. His bronze bust won't be influencing any games or players.

I'm with you there. It's not even a deterrent either if that's what they're thinking. So very few players make it to the hall of fame that the threat of being excluded from the hall is not going to enter their mind when they place the wager. Put him in the hall, don't let him manage, give him his 5 games he gets from the stands each year and we can more or less end this whole thing. That's all he really wants anyways.

[Joshawaggie]

Not so fast, my friends:

Commish says not under his watch.