2014-5 NBA Season Thread: We Are North American Ballerz

[truepg]

I do agree, the west just seems to manage everything better... except the last 4 years in Cleveland. I hate to sound like a homer, but Chris Grant and now David Griffin made tons upon tons of shrewd trades - along with ridiculously good "luck" - to make Cleveland legitimate.

The only thing that has made Cleveland a contender this year is the birthplace of the league's best player

So you think the acquisition of numerous first round picks that allowed the Cavs to trade for expiring contracts, minor pieces, and key rotation players doesn't play into it at all? Or the fact that they drafted decently over the passed 4 years? Just to say that LeBron returning to Cleveland - and nothing else - made the Cavs contenders is extremely ignorant.

No they didn't. Dion freaking Waiters and Tristan Thompson at number 4.

I didn't say they drafted great. As you bolded... they drafted decently. Hindsight being 20-20, there were picks they should have made over Waiters and Thompson. But considering the hit on Kyrie and Wiggins, when, at the time, both drafts were hotly contested between Irving or Williams and Wiggins or Parker. The Bennett pick won't really materialize into anything for another couple of years, but it was one of the worst draft classes in recent memory. Not only that, although Tyler Zeller isn't a stud, he is a nice starting/rotation center. Thompson is having a fantastic year playing his role along side LeBron. And Waiters was turned into Shumpert and JR Smith, who have been 2 perfect additions to the Cavs.

Yes, players like Kennith Farried, Klay Thompson, Jonas Valciunis, Kawhi Leonard, and Andre Drummond fell passed the Cavs... but those players aren't exactly setting the league on fire either. Thompson and Leonard may be the best of the bunch, but I don't think I'd put them in the top 20 players in the league. Its hard to say they drafted poorly over the last 4 years... they didn't hit EVERY pick, but no team ever does.

And that's with me completely forgetting the Bennett pick... Kyrie and Wiggins were quite easy picks, and that's considering the jury's still out on the Wiggins-Parker duo. Tyler Zeller isn't anything other than a reserve center. Yes, Thompson is having a really good year, but still he shouldn't have been drafted anywhere near 4. And although Waiters got us JR and Shumpert, the fact remains that it was an awful pick.

All the players you mentioned except Valanciunas are far better than those two. Also add Oladipo to that list. And Thompson actually IS putting the league on fire, or have you forgotten his 37 points in one quarter, besides being a part of the best backcourt on the best team in the league? The other one was the Finals MVP.

The Cavs have always drafted poorly ever since I became a fan in 2003.

[CLEstones]

I do agree, the west just seems to manage everything better... except the last 4 years in Cleveland. I hate to sound like a homer, but Chris Grant and now David Griffin made tons upon tons of shrewd trades - along with ridiculously good "luck" - to make Cleveland legitimate.

The only thing that has made Cleveland a contender this year is the birthplace of the league's best player

So you think the acquisition of numerous first round picks that allowed the Cavs to trade for expiring contracts, minor pieces, and key rotation players doesn't play into it at all? Or the fact that they drafted decently over the passed 4 years? Just to say that LeBron returning to Cleveland - and nothing else - made the Cavs contenders is extremely ignorant.

No they didn't. Dion freaking Waiters and Tristan Thompson at number 4.

I didn't say they drafted great. As you bolded... they drafted decently. Hindsight being 20-20, there were picks they should have made over Waiters and Thompson. But considering the hit on Kyrie and Wiggins, when, at the time, both drafts were hotly contested between Irving or Williams and Wiggins or Parker. The Bennett pick won't really materialize into anything for another couple of years, but it was one of the worst draft classes in recent memory. Not only that, although Tyler Zeller isn't a stud, he is a nice starting/rotation center. Thompson is having a fantastic year playing his role along side LeBron. And Waiters was turned into Shumpert and JR Smith, who have been 2 perfect additions to the Cavs.

Yes, players like Kennith Farried, Klay Thompson, Jonas Valciunis, Kawhi Leonard, and Andre Drummond fell passed the Cavs... but those players aren't exactly setting the league on fire either. Thompson and Leonard may be the best of the bunch, but I don't think I'd put them in the top 20 players in the league. Its hard to say they drafted poorly over the last 4 years... they didn't hit EVERY pick, but no team ever does.

And that's with me completely forgetting the Bennett pick... Kyrie and Wiggins were quite easy picks, and that's considering the jury's still out on the Wiggins-Parker duo. Tyler Zeller isn't anything other than a reserve center. Yes, Thompson is having a really good year, but still he shouldn't have been drafted anywhere near 4. And although Waiters got us JR and Shumpert, the fact remains that it was an awful pick.

All the players you mentioned except Valanciunas are far better than those two. Also add Oladipo to that list. And Thompson actually IS putting the league on fire, or have you forgotten his 37 points in one quarter, besides being a part of the best backcourt on the best team in the league? The other one was the Finals MVP.

The Cavs have always drafted poorly ever since I became a fan in 2003.

At the time, Kyrie and Wiggins were not easy picks. Both drafts were fairly split.

Agreed, Thompson shouldn't have been a top 5 pick, but at the time, the Cavs were in the mentality of draft a wing, draft a big. They were looking at high character guys in the wake of LeBron leaving for Miami. That is what lead them to Irving and Thompson getting selected in that 2011 Draft.

The only player I would put near the top 20 in the league would be Klay Thompson... I agree with that. But again, considering he is only a 1-time All-Star... I wouldn't categorize that as setting the league on fire. Same with Leonard. Yes, he was a NBA Finals MVP, but again, it isn't like he is scorching teams night in and night out.

The Cavs absolutely could have drafted better. But in those 2 years, the Cavs next best player or target were already off the board by the time their picks came up (Kidd-Gilchrist, Beal, Kanter). I agree, Tristan never should have been taken over Klay, but it is hard to compare and quantify 2 vastly different players at different positions.

With hindsight, you can look at ANY team and say who they should have drafted. That being said, the Cavs did turn Zeller and Waiters into Mozgov, Smith, and Shumpert. Hard to say those were bad picks if you got 3 great fits for the team. If you look at strictly player to player comparison, yes the Cavs didn't draft great. But you have to look at them as commodities.

[OaklandIsBack]

Traded Dion Waiters, the 4th overall pick 3 years ago, for at best a late lottery pick in this year's draft

Traded Tyler Zeller, Jarrett Jack, Sergey Karasev, and a 1st round pick for rights to two bottom 5 picks and a 2nd rounder

Traded Henry Sims and two 2nd's for half a year of Spencer Hawes

Traded three future draft picks for half a year of Luol Deng

I will acknowledge their good trades,

Taking advantage of the tanking Knicks this year

The trade with the Clippers in 2011

Drafts

2011- 1st overall-Kyrie Irving- very good

4th overall- Tristan Thompson- terrible

2012-4th overall- Dion Waiters- terrible

24th overall-Jared Cunningham- bad

33rd and 34th picks- Bernard James and Jae Crowder. The next pick…Draymond Green

2013-1st overall-Anthony Bennett-terrible, even in a weak draft

19th-Sergey Karasev- bad

also had two of first 3 picks in round 2 and got nothing out of them

2014- 1st overall- Andrew Wiggins-traded

[truepg]

I do agree, the west just seems to manage everything better... except the last 4 years in Cleveland. I hate to sound like a homer, but Chris Grant and now David Griffin made tons upon tons of shrewd trades - along with ridiculously good "luck" - to make Cleveland legitimate.

The only thing that has made Cleveland a contender this year is the birthplace of the league's best player

So you think the acquisition of numerous first round picks that allowed the Cavs to trade for expiring contracts, minor pieces, and key rotation players doesn't play into it at all? Or the fact that they drafted decently over the passed 4 years? Just to say that LeBron returning to Cleveland - and nothing else - made the Cavs contenders is extremely ignorant.

No they didn't. Dion freaking Waiters and Tristan Thompson at number 4.

I didn't say they drafted great. As you bolded... they drafted decently. Hindsight being 20-20, there were picks they should have made over Waiters and Thompson. But considering the hit on Kyrie and Wiggins, when, at the time, both drafts were hotly contested between Irving or Williams and Wiggins or Parker. The Bennett pick won't really materialize into anything for another couple of years, but it was one of the worst draft classes in recent memory. Not only that, although Tyler Zeller isn't a stud, he is a nice starting/rotation center. Thompson is having a fantastic year playing his role along side LeBron. And Waiters was turned into Shumpert and JR Smith, who have been 2 perfect additions to the Cavs.

Yes, players like Kennith Farried, Klay Thompson, Jonas Valciunis, Kawhi Leonard, and Andre Drummond fell passed the Cavs... but those players aren't exactly setting the league on fire either. Thompson and Leonard may be the best of the bunch, but I don't think I'd put them in the top 20 players in the league. Its hard to say they drafted poorly over the last 4 years... they didn't hit EVERY pick, but no team ever does.

And that's with me completely forgetting the Bennett pick... Kyrie and Wiggins were quite easy picks, and that's considering the jury's still out on the Wiggins-Parker duo. Tyler Zeller isn't anything other than a reserve center. Yes, Thompson is having a really good year, but still he shouldn't have been drafted anywhere near 4. And although Waiters got us JR and Shumpert, the fact remains that it was an awful pick.

All the players you mentioned except Valanciunas are far better than those two. Also add Oladipo to that list. And Thompson actually IS putting the league on fire, or have you forgotten his 37 points in one quarter, besides being a part of the best backcourt on the best team in the league? The other one was the Finals MVP.

The Cavs have always drafted poorly ever since I became a fan in 2003.

At the time, Kyrie and Wiggins were not easy picks. Both drafts were fairly split.

Agreed, Thompson shouldn't have been a top 5 pick, but at the time, the Cavs were in the mentality of draft a wing, draft a big. They were looking at high character guys in the wake of LeBron leaving for Miami. That is what lead them to Irving and Thompson getting selected in that 2011 Draft.

The only player I would put near the top 20 in the league would be Klay Thompson... I agree with that. But again, considering he is only a 1-time All-Star... I wouldn't categorize that as setting the league on fire. Same with Leonard. Yes, he was a NBA Finals MVP, but again, it isn't like he is scorching teams night in and night out.

The Cavs absolutely could have drafted better. But in those 2 years, the Cavs next best player or target were already off the board by the time their picks came up (Kidd-Gilchrist, Beal, Kanter). I agree, Tristan never should have been taken over Klay, but it is hard to compare and quantify 2 vastly different players at different positions.

With hindsight, you can look at ANY team and say who they should have drafted. That being said, the Cavs did turn Zeller and Waiters into Mozgov, Smith, and Shumpert. Hard to say those were bad picks if you got 3 great fits for the team. If you look at strictly player to player comparison, yes the Cavs didn't draft great. But you have to look at them as commodities.

I really like Cavs' latest additions. With that being said, had they used their picks better, there wouldn't have been a need to trade for those guys in the first place.

[CubsFanBudMan]

You'd never know the Cavs have won practically every game since starting 19-20...

/Clevejacked

[patsox]

Guys,

Please don't speak ill of Tyler Zeller.

-Patsox

Chairman of the Tyler Zeller fanclub

Seriously, one of my favorite pickups, not too far behind Isaiah Thomas and Jae Crowder, for the Celtics.

[CLEstones]

Great game last night between San Antonio and Cleveland. Kyrie - and let me preface this by saying I've never used this term before - went HAM last night against the Spurs.

On the other hand, Kevin Love went 2-10 for 8 points. It is staggering and frustrating to me that they cannot figure out a way to better utilize Love's unique skill set.

Oh, and LeBron had 31.

[DG_ThenNowForever]

You'd think a team as skilled and experienced as the Spurs would be able to close out games by now. Last night was really similar to the Game 6 loss against the Heat two years ago -- they had it all but wrapped up, but then allowed a miracle three and then lost. There's no reason Kyrie should have been able to get that shot off -- Charles Barkely (on commentary for some reason) was begging for a foul that never came.

It was a great win by the Cavs for sure; I thought it was over when the Spurs were up 6 or 8 with a minute to go. But Kyrie took over and there it was.

It'll be interesting to see how the Spurs pull it together in the playoffs. I think they want to stay out of Golden State for round one, but I'd give them even odds over anyone else. Maybe they can pick up a few games on the Rockets and end up in the four slot, but the West is so volatile right now.

[Unocal]

4 Warrior starters getting the night off in Denver for rest.

I'm personally OK with this.

Remember what happened with last year's Pacers? They pushed their guys too hard, too many minutes.

And the Dubs, unlike Indiana a year ago, have a bench.

You don't want to burnout your best players.

Plus, they have a home game Saturday against the Knicks. A road game Friday and home game Saturday is a dangerous spot to go pedal to the metal.

[DG_ThenNowForever]

4 Warrior starters getting the night off in Denver for rest.

I'm personally OK with this.

Remember what happened with last year's Pacers? They pushed their guys too hard, too many minutes.

And the Dubs, unlike Indiana a year ago, have a bench.

You don't want to burnout your best players.

Plus, they have a home game Saturday against the Knicks. A road game Friday and home game Saturday is a dangerous spot to go pedal to the metal.

Are you the guy who hates the Spurs? They pioneered this approach.

[HedleyLamarr]

The Hawks have been doing this a bit this season, too. Whether it be back-to-backs where a road game is involved or just whenever, they've used some road games as rest days for like 2-3 starters.

Having a 10+ game lead allows you to do that.

[MadmanLA]

Another former NBA player from the 80s/90s passed away late yesterday--journeyman Jack Haley; age 51

http://www.ocregister.com/articles/haley-654533-nba-died.html

[2001mark]

Dear America, & the rest of the world... this happened:

http://www.sportsnet.ca/basketball/nba/pm-harper-mistakes-bennett-lowry-tweet/

Prime Minister Harper mistweet. Since deleted of course.

[FinsUp1214]

I'm thoroughly thrilled with the way the Jazz are playing right now. Hiccup vs. Washington aside, they're a solid 12-3 since the All-Star break and really starting to mesh together. Hayward keeps getting better and better, Gobert is mayor of Swat Lake City right now, AND Quin Snyder couldn't be a more perfect coach for this team. I love what he's done to help build this young core. Are they making the playoffs? No. But dang it if I'm not the most excited I've ever been about Jazz basketball - looking forwards to next year - since a certain Gonzaga guy and the Mailman were best buds. It's just so refreshing to see something pan out and look truly promising, instead of those not-too-distant days when Kevin O' Connor had his nuclear "We're rebuilding I promise!!!! It's just a phase!!! Everybody chill out!!!" button-mash on repeat both before and amidst his Grand Master Plan of "Stockton to Malone 2.0" caving in on itself (because Boozer and D-Will...yeah).

Can you tell the last ten years of Jazz fandom haven't treated me well?

[Magnus]

Steve Nash, 2x NBA MVP and probably Canada's most famous NBA player, has announced his retirement.

[2001mark]

Steve Nash, 2x NBA MVP and probably Canada's most famous NBA player, has announced his retirement.

His resume speaks for itself. One book I have they list him Canada's 3rd greatest athlete behind Gretzky & Orr (Terry Fox was unlisted, they honoured him in a separate chapter).

[DaRadniz29]

Man, stepped away from the Warriors/Wizards game - Golden State had an 10-11 point lead. Return ten minutes later and the Warriors are up 24. Now up 29. Sounds like they just went off in. At least one bay area team is playing well.

[CLEstones]

It sucks the Nash's career really just sputtered and died once he left Phoenix. I remember back in the late 90's and early 00's, watching the Nash & Nawitski show. It was awesome. You hate seeing when one of the greats can't go out on a high note and are forced to retire just because of injuries piling up.

There were reports of the Cavs being interested in bringing him in for the playoff run. I think it would have been a great move. He wouldn't have had to log major minutes... maybe in the range of 7-10 minuter per game just to give Kyrie a blow.

[NJTank]

Steve Nash is 40 his career didn't sputter and die, he just got old.

[CLEstones]

Steve Nash is 40 his career didn't sputter and die, he just got old.

He was still one of the best PG's in the league his last year in Phoenix. Once he hit LA, he started to sputter significantly. He career died over the course of 2 years, maybe 2.5 shading into his last year in Phoenix. It sputtered. Now its dead.