The Battle of Seattle

[sparkychewbarky]

1 hour ago, IceCap said:

If you wish to DM me then DM me, Don't use your own concepts thread to trash others behind their backs. 

Oh, and there's your greasy little sidekick giving you a big wet ass kiss.

Go :censored: yourself you smarmy weasel.

[IceCap]

1 hour ago, sparky chewbarky said:

Oh, and there's your greasy little sidekick giving you a big wet ass kiss.

Go yourself you smarmy weasel.

What is your problem, man? If this is how you deal with people? More mods than just myself will have to get involved. 

[heavybass]

Anyway back to Hockey..... I'm probably thinking Kraken.

[Jimmy!]

Kraken sucks. No to the Kraken.

[woody86]

6 hours ago, IceCap said:

What is your problem, man? If this is how you deal with people? More mods than just myself will have to get involved. 

I've lurked on these boards for years, commented occasionally. I usually have to really want to say it if I'm going to comment. Now, i don't check out all the forums, so I can't speak to these claims. The only thing I know is that up to this point Sparkys online behavior has been the most professional out of anyone. He replies to every comment. Shows talent and dedication. Practices self-restraint. It's obvious he's motivated by more than just "likes", as many posters are. So, for him to use such language to me means that what's going on on other forums must be pretty egregious. It would be completely out of character if it otherwise, aside from the possibility that Sparky is going through some IRL stuff. Then again, who isn't right now? 

 

So, at the risk of getting backlash from naysayers, I'd implore the Sparky haters to go find another axe to grind. Attacking the class of these boards will only degrade their quality. 

 

Sparky, I wish there was someone who could get you in front of NHL Seattle. You deserve to be noticed, get paid, and to have a legacy such as an iconic sports logo. You've put in the work, have gone through the refining process. Kudos, sir. 

[IceCap]

25 minutes ago, woody86 said:

It's obvious he's motivated by more than just "likes", as many posters are.

I'm not sure anyone is motivated by "Likes." If they are? They probably need to go outside.

 

25 minutes ago, woody86 said:

Attacking the class of these boards will only degrade their quality. 

I say this with no intent of degrading Sparky's character. He's not the class of these boards. And FTR? Neither am I, or anyone else Sparky accused of being in this "mafia" or "Get-Along-Gang" or anything else.

 

25 minutes ago, woody86 said:

Now, i don't check out all the forums, so I can't speak to these claims.

Well I'll do my best to let you know what's going on.

There's a Sports Logos thread, about the NHL in Seattle and their yet to be unveiled identity. The name "Kraken" has caused a bit of a stir, with some people hating it and others loving it. Sparky, as you can tell from this thread, is all-in on the Kraken name. He has gotten into arguments with people who dislike the "Kraken" name. And that's...pretty much a non-event. People argue and debate stuff all the time here, you know? Someone likes something, someone doesn't like that thing, they argue.

 

The problem started when Sparky decided to use this thread- which should be for his conceptual work- to bash people from the NHL Seattle Identity thread who disagreed with him- calling them the above-mentioned "mafia" and "Get-Along-Gang."

I, as a moderator, asked him to either use direct message or the post report function if he felt anyone he was arguing with over the "Kraken" name crossed the line. He chose to reply by telling me to "go yourself," called me a "weasel," and called someone else my "greasy little sidekick."

You want to talk about people attacking Sparky "degrad[ing] their quality"? The behaviour Sparky has shown over this incident has been nothing short of rude, needlessly confrontational, duplicitous, and mean-spirited. He degraded his own quality.

 

25 minutes ago, woody86 said:

Sparky, I wish there was someone who could get you in front of NHL Seattle. You deserve to be noticed, get paid, and to have a legacy such as an iconic sports logo. You've put in the work, have gone through the refining process. Kudos, sir. 

And this is part of the problem, if I'm being honest.

Sparky's a fine contributor to the Concepts section, but really? I'm unsure how much you remember- if anything- about the Las Vegas NHL naming discussion, but Sparky had the idea of the Las Vegas Aces, complete with a winged spade symbol. He did some mockups, and got so far as to start pestering the actual team, pushing for his identity to be adopted. He acted- by his own admission- arrogant and annoying in the identity speculation thread. And now you're encouraging that same sort of behaviour.

Is Sparky good? Yeah, I'd say he's good. Is he G-d's gift to the world of sports design? No. No he's not. And when so many people kiss one guy's ass? It's no wonder they start to think they can act in the manner Sparky acted here.

 

Anyway he's been suspended for six months. And before you get on me? There are eight other moderators who vote, and our votes are tallied to determine punishment length, so this wasn't just my call. Sparky's behaviour wasn't impressing any of us.

 

Just speaking for myself though? I've been called a Nazi twice, by people upset that another suspended member got suspended (I had family that died in the Holocaust, btw, so that was a fun thing to be called). I've been called "the mafia" for disagreeing with one guy's opinion on the name "Seattle Kraken." And I got called a "weasel" by the same guy for daring to tell him to use proper channels to deal with problematic posts. So go on about how Sparky's "the class of the boards" all you like. I'm uninterested given his recent behaviour.

[woody86]

1 hour ago, IceCap said:

I'm not sure anyone is motivated by "Likes." If they are? They probably need to go outside.

 

I say this with no intent of degrading Sparky's character. He's not the class of these boards. And FTR? Neither am I, or anyone else Sparky accused of being in this "mafia" or "Get-Along-Gang" or anything else.

 

Well I'll do my best to let you know what's going on.

There's a Sports Logos thread, about the NHL in Seattle and their yet to be unveiled identity. The name "Kraken" has caused a bit of a stir, with some people hating it and others loving it. Sparky, as you can tell from this thread, is all-in on the Kraken name. He has gotten into arguments with people who dislike the "Kraken" name. And that's...pretty much a non-event. People argue and debate stuff all the time here, you know? Someone likes something, someone doesn't like that thing, they argue.

 

The problem started when Sparky decided to use this thread- which should be for his conceptual work- to bash people from the NHL Seattle Identity thread who disagreed with him- calling them the above-mentioned "mafia" and "Get-Along-Gang."

I, as a moderator, asked him to either use direct message or the post report function if he felt anyone he was arguing with over the "Kraken" name crossed the line. He chose to reply by telling me to "go yourself," called me a "weasel," and called someone else my "greasy little sidekick."

You want to talk about people attacking Sparky "degrad[ing] their quality"? The behaviour Sparky has shown over this incident has been nothing short of rude, needlessly confrontational, duplicitous, and mean-spirited. He degraded his own quality.

 

And this is part of the problem, if I'm being honest.

Sparky's a fine contributor to the Concepts section, but really? I'm unsure how much you remember- if anything- about the Las Vegas NHL naming discussion, but Sparky had the idea of the Las Vegas Aces, complete with a winged spade symbol. He did some mockups, and got so far as to start pestering the actual team, pushing for his identity to be adopted. He acted- by his own admission- arrogant and annoying in the identity speculation thread. And now you're encouraging that same sort of behaviour.

Is Sparky good? Yeah, I'd say he's good. Is he G-d's gift to the world of sports design? No. No he's not. And when so many people kiss one guy's ass? It's no wonder they start to think they can act in the manner Sparky acted here.

 

Anyway he's been suspended for six months. And before you get on me? There are eight other moderators who vote, and our votes are tallied to determine punishment length, so this wasn't just my call. Sparky's behaviour wasn't impressing any of us.

 

Just speaking for myself though? I've been called a Nazi twice, by people upset that another suspended member got suspended (I had family that died in the Holocaust, btw, so that was a fun thing to be called). I've been called "the mafia" for disagreeing with one guy's opinion on the name "Seattle Kraken." And I got called a "weasel" by the same guy for daring to tell him to use proper channels to deal with problematic posts. So go on about how Sparky's "the class of the boards" all you like. I'm uninterested given his recent behaviour.

Thank you for the added context. I consider myself fair person, and it seems that in spite of the vitriol mod actions were fair as well. 

[FCMacbeth]

Is that his true colors or what? He has a great identity to contribute with but I think he pushed it a little too far.

[thaipod]

Yeah, I've been enjoying this thread and his designs, but having been a moderator in another forum before, antagonizing and cursing out mods are crossing the line, no matter how popular you are.  

 

That said, I hope you are flexing your creative muscle during your time-out.  Looking forward to more of your concepts!  

[Guest darkpiranha]

I've been following this kerfuffle from afar but had the time to research it tonight.  I've followed and respected Sparky tremendously for years.  He's never been anything but cordial and helpful and has gone above and beyond in both offering great feedback and accepting feedback.  I've never ONCE seen him be anything but classy.  So I was really really shocked to see the above exchange go down.  No question that he snapped and crossed a line.  However... after going back and reading the Seattle NHL Name thread, I have to agree with his assertions that he was being ganged up on there by people that seemed, in my opinion, very very jealous of his having gotten a little bit of attention for his Kraken concept.  Over and over, he was mocked or insulted and he responded with good cheer.  There was one user in particular who went after him a lot, openly insulting him, and I didn't see ONE admonition by a moderator.  IceCap, you were right there in the middle of that, so I know you had to see it, but I didn't see you do anything to bring the temperature down.   Yes, Sparky was happily championing Kraken, and some people found it annoying, but literally ever other potential name had more than one user championing it and bringing it up over and over in just as eager and over-the-top fashion as anything Sparky did.  Sparky has obviously made concepts for each of those potential names, so if anyone is even-handed about which name wins, it's him.  I went back twenty pages in that thread and didn't see a single negative or combative comment from him, but plenty the other direction.   I mean, seriously, except for this one stretch of two or three posts, I ask anyone to point me to any other instance where he was even a little bit snarky or arrogant or combative.  

[IceCap]

On 3/26/2020 at 3:00 PM, darkpiranha said:

IceCap, you were right there in the middle of that, so I know you had to see it, but I didn't see you do anything to bring the temperature down. 

I'm a moderator, but I'm also a member of the community here. Meaning I like to engage in debate and discussion about this stuff as much as anyone else. 
I also apologize for getting to you late, but in fairness? You didn't tag me. I just happened to think to come back to this thread to make sure nothing was afoot. 

 

Anyway to your points-

No, Sparky was not being ganged up on. When someone takes an unpopular opinion? They will have to deal with more than one person. That's how it is everywhere else. My job as a moderator isn't to artificially level the debate stage. If you wanna champion the unpopular thing? You have to accept what that's all about. Part of that will be a lot of people disagreeing with you. 

 

Were there posts in that exchange directed at Sparky that crossed the line? I'll answer that two ways. The first regarding what I said to him, and the second regarding what others said to him. 

 

First, what I said. I was actually staying out of Sparky's way until he mentioned me specifically. And he did it in the same post where he made a number of factually incorrect statements regarding the history of the Kraken legend. I responded to him by clearly outlining the origins of the Kraken myth and how it came to be associated with giant squids. 

Nothing I said crossed any lines, in my opinion. Sparky mentioned me- unprompted- and then stated a number of things that were incorrect. I responded with factual information. 

 

Second, what others said to Sparky. Did others cross the lines of good taste when debating him? As you said, I was there. I didn't see anything questionable. 

With that being said? I fully admit that my involvement in the Kraken debate may have left me in a position to not see some borderline stuff. Which is why I specifically  told Sparky here to use DMs or the forum's Report function to report any posts he felt crossed the line.

There are eight other moderators here besides myself. And doing either of those things would allow for any of the other eight- who had some distance from the debate- to see the posts in question and make an objective judgement call. 

 

What did Sparky say to this advice? He called me a weasel, told me to "go  [my]self," and called someone else a "greasy little sidekick." 

 

Sparky could have reported posts he thought attacked him unfairly and we might be looking at disciplining those individuals. Instead he chose to attack me (why he has a fixation on me I do not know) in as rude a manner as possible. 

I'm sorry man. I know you like his concepts and I know he was always cool to you, but that behaviour is not acceptable. 

 

On 3/26/2020 at 3:00 PM, darkpiranha said:

I mean, seriously, except for this one stretch of two or three posts, I ask anyone to point me to any other instance where he was even a little bit snarky or arrogant or combative.  

I would direct you at Sparky's championing of the Las Vegas Aces name/his logo concept in the old Las Vegas NHL Identity thread. Sparky was, by his own admission no less, annoying regarding that "campaign" of his. 

 

Anyway that's all I'm going to say about this here, so we can leave this thread for Sparky's concepts when he returns. If you or anyone else wish to continue this discussion? My DM box is always open. 

[Meshmaster101]

mod edit

[RichardWitham]

mod edit

[Jake3roo]

I completely agree that sparky was in the wrong here (and who could disagree?), but I can't help but think that @IceCap was instigating a little bit. sparky's first couple posts seemed light-hearted and calling a group of people the 'mafia' really isn't that horrible.

 

He only got out of hand after IceCap accused him of pushing his own concepts in the other thread (which, sure isn't great, but an opinion is an opinion) and compared the mafia comment to some other completely different attack IceCap got (who knows when) that called him a nazi.

 

I don't think IceCap did anything particularly horrible, but he definitely wasn't de-escalating the situation, and this wasn't behavior I would expect from a moderator.

 

[IceCap]

23 minutes ago, Jake3.roo said:

I don't think IceCap did anything particularly horrible, but he definitely wasn't de-escalating the situation...

All I did was tell him to not talk about people behind their back in his concepts thread, and to use DMs or the report function if he felt there issues that deserved moderator attention. I'm not seeing what the issue is on my end.

 

23 minutes ago, Jake3.roo said:

and compared the mafia comment to some other completely different attack IceCap got (who knows when) that called him a nazi.

First off, I don't enjoy being called "the mafia" simply because I had a difference of opinion with Sparky. That's bad enough. Secondly? He called me a member of the "mafia" and "good time gang" just a day or so after two other people called me a Nazi.

The lesson you should take away from this is that being a mod means nothing you do will make everyone happy, and some people really cross the line with their "issues."

 

23 minutes ago, Jake3.roo said:

...and this wasn't behavior I would expect from a moderator.

I'm sorry you feel this way, but I wasn't the one calling other people names and telling them to "go yourself."
It's amazing to me how someone can admit that the person who did all that crossed the line but still ultimately blame the moderator for doing his job.

 

Anyway Jake3.roo, I see you ignored this part from my previous post.

 

20 hours ago, IceCap said:

Anyway that's all I'm going to say about this here, so we can leave this thread for Sparky's concepts when he returns. If you or anyone else wish to continue this discussion? My DM box is always open. 

 

If you have anything else to say to me or about me re: this situation? Send me a direct message on this forum. If you continue to post on this matter in this thread? Warning points all around.

[sparkychewbarky]

Hello everybody...

 

For starters, I hope everyone's doing well and staying safe.

 

The Seattle NHL Team Name Journey has finally meandered its way to a conclusion, so it's time to begin to wrap up The Battle.

Before I do however, I have a few chores to tend to...

 

I sincerely apologize to the CCSL community for my inappropriate remarks on March 15. I fully deserved the 6 month suspension that I received.

I've posted here over 3000 times since joining the Boards, and that's the first (and I promise it'll be the last) time that I've slipped into my "day-time-job" mode.

That kind of language is pretty common-place on the construction site, but it has no place here.

Again, I'm very sorry for my rude, demeaning and inappropriate remarks.

 

I'd also like to thank woody86, Friedrich Stuart Macbeth, thaipod, Jake3roo, and darkpiranha for their kind words that day.

You all commented in the proper and professional way that I should have. Thank you.

 

I've been on the boards for over 11 years and I truly appreciate everyone who has taken the time

to drop by one of my threads to comment, criticize, like, or just have a gander.

I've very much enjoyed your company over the years.

 

 

 

 

[sparkychewbarky]

About 6 months ago, (before the Kraken name announcement) Team Iceland Soccer released this beauty of a promotional video.

It's fantastic! If you haven't seen it...check it out!!!...

 

 

[sparkychewbarky]

Anyway...I loved the story of Iceland's "Protectors"...the Bull, the Eagle, the Giant and the Dragon. Great Stuff...

 

But, wait a minute...

Seattle says... "Hold My Beer!" with its team of titans repping the ocean, the sky and the forest.

I enjoyed the good-natured rivalry during the name discussion between the Kraken, Thunderbirds and Sasquatch camps.

The Iceland branding was an inspiration to unite these forces under a "Guardians" concept.

(I did this up several months ago but have only now, had the chance to share it with you...)

 

 

 

 

[B-mer]

That is a really cool combination of elements for a logo. I’d like to see a Totems/Thunderbirds concept like that. 

[sparkychewbarky]

14 hours ago, B-mer said:

I’d like to see a Totems/Thunderbirds concept like that. 

 

I'll give that a shot if I get some time, B-mer 

 

It's great to see how Seattle has embraced the NHL Kraken.

An interesting off-shoot is that they're talking of acquiring a pro women's team!

Several names including the "Seattle Sirens" have been bandied about, so I gave that identity a shot.

(I apologize for not having a women's hockey template, so I just photoshopped Hilary Knight's head onto an existing one ).

...Might be cool if they shared the same palette as their NHL cousins...