I thought the Jaguars.......

[Survival79]

Few "reputable news sources" will report rumors. Even those that do don't necessarily go further than repeating what's being said elsewhere... on message boards.

Heck, this board has been cited more than once.

So, few reputable news sources report rumors but those that do cite message boards?

All I'm saying is that it does happen. I find it hard to believe that the Rams are seriously discussing/contemplating a move to Los Angeles and that the story has not been picked up by at least one news source. It would be fairly easy to report the rumor (anonymous/unnamed sources, message boards) and ask the organization to comment. Perhaps dig a little more. You know, journalism.

Anyways, I've heard rumors of the Jaguars staying in Jacksonville. I'll have my buddy start a thread in the Sports In General forum that I can reference.

[powersurge]

Do some research before you spout off, Gothamite.

Gothamite quote:

Atlanta? Atlanta is a lousy sports town. Period. Their MLB and NFL teams have had over four decades to build a fanbase, which means that boys who saw games as kids could now conceivably be preparing to take their grandchildren. That's plenty long, and the relative apathy of Atlanta sports fans is nothing short of pathetic.

Ahhhh... watchout there G-mite....do the research before generalizing. I was agreeing with everything you said until this point. I've heard more than one person on this site make that same claim, but I struggle to see where its coming from.

MLB attendance: http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/attendance

NFL attendance: http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/attendance?year=2007

Check all of the years back to 2001 for both teams. The Braves aren't great in attendance, but averaging around 2.5 million a year ain't bad. Thats about average for baseball. The Falcons have been at or around top ten in the NFL for years, so that would make them pretty much above average. Just because the Hawks suck and noone goes to see them doesn't mean all of Atlanta's teams follow suit.

NBA attendance: http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/attendance?year=2007

Gothamite quote:

Should anyone actually be able to consolidate the various groups in LA into to setting ego aside and speaking with one cohesive voice, watch out. Somebody's moving. It may well not happen, but I wouldn't want to bet my team on that.

I agree with that, provided that there is a group of people who can reach into their wallets and provide the $1 Billion that will be needed to build or renovate a football stadium. Lets see if anyone will pony up the dough for that. Lets not hold our collective breath.

[Gothamite]

But you can't prove that they could.

We can, however, prove that Jacksonville can't sell out the stadium they do have, even with the artificially reduced capacity.

Considering the stadium was a key component in their proposal for an NFL franchise, that's a problem for the city and the team. So bad that even the Jaguars' website has to admit that blackouts are "a way of life" for the franchise, and have to beg fans to buy enough tickets to keep the team on television. And I mean beg.

[Gothamite]

The Braves aren't great in attendance, but averaging around 2.5 million a year ain't bad. Thats about average for baseball.

Not being able to sell out playoff games (by a long shot - we've all seen a lot of empty seats at Turmer Field in October) is a significant problem. That's not average for baseball.

I agree with that, provided that there is a group of people who can reach into their wallets and provide the $1 Billion that will be needed to build or renovate a football stadium. Lets see if anyone will pony up the dough for that. Lets not hold our collective breath.

Oh, there are plenty of groups (even local ones, should that mean anything) who, if combined, could do it. The NFL sure gave them plenty of opportunity to do so. But they weren't interested in sharing, only squabbling, and so they lost their shot.

I stand by my assertion that if someone could get those groups to set ego aside and work together, LA would have a team in a heartbeat. I further concede that it's a rather large "if."

Oughtn't be, but I guess it makes sense that the kind of people driven enough to be in a position to become NFL owners don't like to share the steering wheel.

[Gothamite]

whoops- double post.

[powersurge]

Here's my take on this whole LA thing...

..if 'they' really wanted to have a team in LA, there would be one there.

I know that may be a bit trite, but I think it accurately sums up the situation.

BTW, The 'they' that I'm referring to are the NFL commissioner and owners, as well as the city of Los Angeles, the fans and any investing group that has expressed interest in a team.

The NFL is doing fine without an LA franchise....dare I even say it?

"If it ain't broke...."

[Claystation360]

Everyone Remember , when the Jaguars came into the League , it was when FSU,UF,UM,UGA all had a high powered offensives & were winning & national Championships were being played in . the stadium is much larger then what it should be because it being in the south , & used for the Gator Bowl , & Florida Georgia game , & of course had to have so many permeant seats for the college side . and of course in the Jaguars first 5 season they were 49 - 31 that?s a damn good record for a expansion team , plus 2 division titles , going to 2 AFC Championships and hosting one . the Jaguars won far to quick for the fanbase , but looking at the Stadium if you put the RCA Dome in Jville it?s a non factor . look around the NFL there are many other older NFL teams having the same or much more of a problem . Jacksonville is not like Green Bay where all there is to do is Watch the Packers , Freeze your ass off or Freeze your Ass of watching the Packers eating a block of cheese .

[powersurge]

. Jacksonville is not like Green Bay where all there is to do is Watch the Packers , Freeze your ass off or Freeze your Ass of watching the Packers eating a block of cheese .

Gothamite's response in 3.......2.......

[Island_Style]

But you can't prove that they could.

We can, however, prove that Jacksonville can't sell out the stadium they do have, even with the artificially reduced capacity.

Considering the stadium was a key component in their proposal for an NFL franchise, that's a problem for the city and the team. So bad that even the Jaguars' website has to admit that blackouts are "a way of life" for the franchise, and have to beg fans to buy enough tickets to keep the team on television. And I mean beg.

We can also prove that 64,000 tickets are enough to keep a team in a city. Non preamium seats is not that big of a money maker for teams, it is the club seat and luxury boxes. Jacksonville has no trouble selling those.

[powersurge]

But you can't prove that they could.

We can, however, prove that Jacksonville can't sell out the stadium they do have, even with the artificially reduced capacity.

Considering the stadium was a key component in their proposal for an NFL franchise, that's a problem for the city and the team. So bad that even the Jaguars' website has to admit that blackouts are "a way of life" for the franchise, and have to beg fans to buy enough tickets to keep the team on television. And I mean beg.

We can also prove that 64,000 tickets are enough to keep a team in a city. Non preamium seats is not that big of a money maker for teams, it is the club seat and luxury boxes. Jacksonville has no trouble selling those.

Its funny to point out that if the Jags or anyother of these smaller market teams like Green Bay were part of MLB or the NBA they wouldn't have a chance competitively or financially. The fact that the NFL has done such a great job splitting TV and other revenues more evenly among ALL of their clubs and not allowing individual clubs to have their own TV networks (like the ridiculous YES network deal) keeps teams like the Jags somewhat competitive and somewhat financially stable.

[Gothamite]

Agreed.

But didn't I read somewhere that teams who have blackouts forfeit portions of the revenue sharing money?

No wonder the Jags are begging for fans to buy tickets.

[Sodboy13]

Well, if they just do like the Carolina Hurricanes in their Greensboro days and cover up the whole upper tank, they'll be set.

[Sec19Row53]

. Jacksonville is not like Green Bay where all there is to do is Watch the Packers , Freeze your ass off or Freeze your Ass of watching the Packers eating a block of cheese .

Gothamite's response in 3.......2.......

I'll bite.

Given that we have season ticket holders in all 50 states, I'm guessing some of us can find other things to do. We choose not to, though.

Also, since there's the split ticket base of Green Bay and Milwaukee, there are probably in the neighborhood of 90,000 season ticket holders for the Packers. All the more proof that we choose to be there. Not to mention that Lambeau has been sold out to season ticket holders since 1960, and there's a waiting list of some 73,000+ names, and generally speaking, 100 or so tickets turned in annually.

Really, insulting Green Bay to try to bolster the case of any city in the NFL just isn't worth it.

[powersurge]

Well, if they just do like the Carolina Hurricanes in their Greensboro days and cover up the whole upper tank, they'll be set.

...or like the Oakland A's shamelessly did in the in the playoffs a couple of years back where they blanketed the entire upper deck.

Thats awful....just awful....especially for a playoff team.

[Gothamite]

Yeah, that's kind of why I was ignoring it. Desperate swipes don't usually deserve a response.

Interesting historical fact: In the early days of the franchise, Curly Lambeau was successful in luring free agents because Green Bay was known for its... nightlife. Apparently the city fathers didn't really regard enforcing the Volstead Act as a terribly high priority.

[leedsunited]

Agreed.

But didn't I read somewhere that teams who have blackouts forfeit portions of the revenue sharing money?

No wonder the Jags are begging for fans to buy tickets.

If that's the case, the Oakland Raiders would be forfeiting portions left and right.

[Gothamite]

Not necessarily - they could tickets given away to or purchased by corporations. Not limited to actual attendance through turnstyles.

[Claystation360]

I apologize , that was a cheap shot well undeserved . But I do respect the History & tridtion of the Green Bay Packers , But trying to compare Green Bay Fan Bases & Jacksonville Fan Bases are like comparing apples & oranges . Green Bays has been locked in for ages with generations of championships with so much tridtion , Were Jacksonville it has been a College football town for ages , & is just starting to build its NFL entity & with the next generation of fan growing up & watching & having the game in their city it should be come more of a part of the community .

[powersurge]

I apologize , that was a cheap shot well undeserved . But I do respect the History & tridtion of the Green Bay Packers , But trying to compare Green Bay Fan Bases & Jacksonville Fan Bases are like comparing apples & oranges . Green Bays has been locked in for ages with generations of championships with so much tridtion , Were Jacksonville it has been a College football town for ages , & is just starting to build its NFL entity & with the next generation of fan growing up & watching & having the game in their city it should be come more of a part of the community .

FWIW, I give you much respect for writing this reply. There aren't many people on this thread that would do that.

[Island_Style]

Agreed.

But didn't I read somewhere that teams who have blackouts forfeit portions of the revenue sharing money?

No wonder the Jags are begging for fans to buy tickets.

If that is the case then why don't Weaver just buy the remaining tickets? Wouldn't he get more than his share back in revenue sharing? The jags have only been short by 2,000 - 3,000. Again, the Jags are not as bad off as you seem to think. Of course I don't exoect you to know that being thousands of miles away.