Charlotte Hornets?

[BShaw20]

What makes this revisionism easier is the fact the team never won anything. If there was a title I doubt this happens.

[IceCap]

Unpopular opinion: I don't mind the historical revisionism.

As a historian I do.

[rams80]

maybe my dream can come true the Minnesota Wild can be renamed the North Stars and get their history back as well.. hey if you can have the st Louis blues and Columbus blue jackets why not the dallas stars and Minnesota north stars?

One comparison uses completely different imagery. The other doesn't. That's why.

[Sport]

Real timeline:

1988

Charlotte Hornets begin play

2002

Charlotte Hornets move to New Orleans and become New Orleans Hornets

2004

Charlotte Bobcats Begin play

2005/2006

Hurricane Katrina forces the New Orleans Hornets to briefly become the Oklahoma City Hornets. The team returns to New Orleans in March of 2006

2013

New Orleans Hornets Change their to New Orleans Pelicans

2014

Charlotte Bobcats change their name to Charlotte Hornets

Revised Timeline:

1988

Charlotte Hornets begin play

2002

Charlotte Hornets go on hiatus

A new team called the New Orleans Hornets begins play

2004

Charlotte Hornets returns from their two year break, but this time they're calling themselves the Charlotte Bobcats

2005/2006

Hurricane Katrina forces the New Orleans Hornets to briefly become the Oklahoma City Hornets. The team returns to New Orleans in March of 2006

2013

New Orleans Hornets change their name to the New Orleans Pelicans

2014

Charlotte Bobcats go back to calling themselves the Charlotte Hornets

one of these things actually happened. The other didn't. I'm still on board with the rebrand because it's a great name and a great color scheme and Bobcats never caught on with the locals in Charlotte. It's a nobrainer. But I don't like that they rewrote the history because now we're ignoring truths and when you write it out it looks really silly.

I wish that the Hornets had changed their name upon first moving to New Orleans. Would've made this whole thing easier.

edit: added time in Oklahoma City

[BShaw20]

What about the time they played in OKC? Is Chris Paul not part of the Hornets or is he a Pelican? What team did he play for?

[rams80]

What about the time they played in OKC? Is Chris Paul not part of the Hornets or is he a Pelican? What team did he play for?

Was Emeka Okafor a lifelong Hornet prior to his trade to the Wizards?

[Sport]

What about the time they played in OKC? Is Chris Paul not part of the Hornets or is he a Pelican? What team did he play for?

He played for the New Orleans Oklahoma City New Orleans Hornetspelicans franchise.

But according to the NBA, Alonzo Mourning, for example, played for the Charlotte Hornetsbobcatshornets franchise

[smith03]

that was some what of a joke but you got white and red sox of course that is a different sport so I guess that make it a bad comparison

[tigerslionspistonshabs]

Real timeline:

1988

Charlotte Hornets begin play

2002

Charlotte Hornets move to New Orleans and become New Orleans Hornets

2004

Charlotte Bobcats Begin play

2005/2006

Hurricane Katrina forces the New Orleans Hornets to briefly become the Oklahoma City Hornets. The team returns to New Orleans in March of 2006

2013

New Orleans Hornets Change their to New Orleans Pelicans

2014

Charlotte Bobcats change their name to Charlotte Hornets

Revised Timeline:

1988

Charlotte Hornets begin play

2002

Charlotte Hornets go on hiatus

A new team called the New Orleans Hornets begins play

2004

Charlotte Hornets returns from their two year break, but this time they're calling themselves the Charlotte Bobcats

2005/2006

Hurricane Katrina forces the New Orleans Hornets to briefly become the Oklahoma City Hornets. The team returns to New Orleans in March of 2006

2013

New Orleans Hornets change their name to the New Orleans Pelicans

2014

Charlotte Bobcats go back to calling themselves the Charlotte Hornets

one of these things actually happened. The other didn't. I'm still on board with the rebrand because it's a great name and a great color scheme and Bobcats never caught on with the locals in Charlotte. It's a nobrainer. But I don't like that they rewrote the history because now we're ignoring truths and when you write it out it looks really silly.

I wish that the Hornets had changed their name upon first moving to New Orleans. Would've made this whole thing easier.

edit: added time in Oklahoma City

[jakepled]

There are several factors as to why this is happening.

When the team initially moved David Stern strongly urged George Shinn to leave the Hornets brand in Charlotte. The NBA did not have the power at the time to force a change, such as the NFL with the Cleveland situation. Shinn took the brand to New Orleans simply to be a dick and spite the city of Charlotte. New laws were created after this fiasco, which helped in keeping the SuperSonics name in Seattle when they relocated to OKC.

When Stern initially told Charlotte city officials that he was going to allow Shinn to relocate he promised Charlotte a new franchise within 2 years and that he would see that they kept their brand. That fell apart horribly. Bob Johnson was a horrible owner and the Bobcats were a bad team with an even worse brand. Add that to fans who were hurt over losing their beloved team and it was a recipe for disaster.

There are whispers starting to leak out that David Stern initiated this rebrand. There is speculation that after Stern took control of the New Orleans franchise he had already determined he was going to push the Hornets back to Charlotte. He knew how popular the moniker was in NC and that it could save a franchise that was in distress. Rumors are that Stern made Benson promise to rebrand if he purchased the team so the Hornets could return to Charlotte.

[BShaw20]

Yeah the Okafor thing:

Emeka Okafor's career before today:

2004-2009 - Charlotte Bobcats

2009-2012 - New Orleans Hornets

From today:

2004-2009 - Charlotte Hornets

2009-2012 - New Orleans Hornets

That makes him a Hornet for 8 seasons, 5 seasons, or 3 seasons?

[Raysfan12]

Historical revisionism. This is why I opposed this whole mess in the first place.

Pretending the Bobcats are now the Hornets of old is disingenuous and absurd.

Exactly. I was the only one who oppose the name change in the first place. The only reason that happened was because the franchise was terrible as the Bobcats. Had they been winning on a consistent basis, this would've never happened. It just seems so disrespectful of the original franchise (now in New Orleans). The old Charlotte Hornets history should stay with the Pelicans. I feel the same way about when the new Cleveland Browns franchise has the old Cleveland Browns history. The latter should have stayed with the Baltimore Ravens (old Browns franchise). This historical revisionism is why I also opposed the name change as well.

[Burmy]

It looks like some of you just want to find an excuse to complain...the city is ECSTATIC to see the Hornets legacy come back home!

Well, the people's work here is done...now to get Houston to take back its Oilers (It's a possibility now that Bud Adams has bought the farm)

[jakepled]

The history isn't that murky. It's quite simple, actually. The New Orleans history is 2003-present. The Charlotte history is 1988-present and includes all teams that played in Charlotte.

The city of Charlotte led the entire NBA in attendance in '88, '90, '91, '92, '93, '94, '95, '96, as well as finishing 2nd in '88, '97. The Hornets finished 20-62 their inaugural season, but still sold out every single game and led the NBA in attendance. A banner was made that read "Charlotte Hornets 1988-89 NBA Attendance Champion 950,064". They set it up during the summer and allowed season ticket holders to sign it. Then on opening night they honored the fans of Charlotte for their support and raised the banner to the rafters. Why should that banner be hanging in the New Orleans rafters instead of the Charlotte rafters?

The purple/teal Hornets that featured Muggsy, LJ, & Zo never played in New Orleans. The brand that is so popular was exclusive to Charlotte. When they moved to New Orleans the colors were changed to blue & yellow, & they later completely revamped the old logo. Why should purple/teal snapbacks & Larry Johnson jerseys be sold in the New Orleans team store instead of the Charlotte team store?

Bobby Phills died while playing in Charlotte. The next season the team held a special ceremony with his family and hung his jersey in the rafters, permanently retiring his jersey number. He died while playing and living in Charlotte, where his family resides to this day. Why should his banner hang in the New Orleans rafters instead of the Charlotte rafters?

The name "Hornets" has ties to Charlotte dating back to the Revolutionary War in 1780, when a General called Charlotte "a hornets nest of rebellion." From 1892-1936 there was a minor league baseball team in Charlotte nicknamed the Hornets. Why should the Hornets brand be locked away by a franchise that didn't want it in New Orleans instead of returning to a city that truly loves it and has a deep history of meaning with it?

Even the mascot is named after a hurricane that tore thru Charlotte in 1989, during the start of the team's 2nd season. Hugo the Hornet was created and named after history involving Charlotte. Why should that mascot be locked away and unused by New Orleans instead of returning home to Charlotte?

The history being taken from the New Orleans franchise and given to the new Charlotte franchise seems really stupid on the surface. However, when you look at the big picture and everything it means the change makes absolutely perfect sense. It has nothing to do with the actual statistical numbers and records. It is everything else. In order to get all that other stuff that is so deeply tied to Charlotte the stats have to be included in the transfer.

New Orleans fans can keep crying and saying Charlotte stole their name. Sorry folks, it was never your name to begin with.

[frosty06306]

How mentally challenged are some of you?

[Xist2inspire]

The history isn't that murky. It's quite simple, actually. The New Orleans history is 2003-present. The Charlotte history is 1988-present and includes all teams that played in Charlotte.

The city of Charlotte led the entire NBA in attendance in '88, '90, '91, '92, '93, '94, '95, '96, as well as finishing 2nd in '88, '97. The Hornets finished 20-62 their inaugural season, but still sold out every single game and led the NBA in attendance. A banner was made that read "Charlotte Hornets 1988-89 NBA Attendance Champion 950,064". They set it up during the summer and allowed season ticket holders to sign it. Then on opening night they honored the fans of Charlotte for their support and raised the banner to the rafters. Why should that banner be hanging in the New Orleans rafters instead of the Charlotte rafters?

The purple/teal Hornets that featured Muggsy, LJ, & Zo never played in New Orleans. The brand that is so popular was exclusive to Charlotte. When they moved to New Orleans the colors were changed to blue & yellow, & they later completely revamped the old logo. Why should purple/teal snapbacks & Larry Johnson jerseys be sold in the New Orleans team store instead of the Charlotte team store?

Bobby Phills died while playing in Charlotte. The next season the team held a special ceremony with his family and hung his jersey in the rafters, permanently retiring his jersey number. He died while playing and living in Charlotte, where his family resides to this day. Why should his banner hang in the New Orleans rafters instead of the Charlotte rafters?

The name "Hornets" has ties to Charlotte dating back to the Revolutionary War in 1780, when a General called Charlotte "a hornets nest of rebellion." From 1892-1936 there was a minor league baseball team in Charlotte nicknamed the Hornets. Why should the Hornets brand be locked away by a franchise that didn't want it in New Orleans instead of returning to a city that truly loves it and has a deep history of meaning with it?

Even the mascot is named after a hurricane that tore thru Charlotte in 1989, during the start of the team's 2nd season. Hugo the Hornet was created and named after history involving Charlotte. Why should that mascot be locked away and unused by New Orleans instead of returning home to Charlotte?

The history being taken from the New Orleans franchise and given to the new Charlotte franchise seems really stupid on the surface. However, when you look at the big picture and everything it means the change makes absolutely perfect sense. It has nothing to do with the actual statistical numbers and records. It is everything else. In order to get all that other stuff that is so deeply tied to Charlotte the stats have to be included in the transfer.

New Orleans fans can keep crying and saying Charlotte stole their name. Sorry folks, it was never your name to begin with.

That's all well and good, except for one simple fact: they're not the same team, period. The original Charlotte Hornets are the Pelicans. The new Hornets are an expansion team. Bobby Phills has no legitimate ties to the former Bobcats. Neither do Muggsy, LJ, and Zo. They have ties to the city, to the memories of the people living there, but as for an actual, concrete connection, there's nothing valid there. Memories are fine, so is nostalgia, so is honoring a legacy. That's what the reclaiming the Hornets name was supposed to be. But twisting and reshaping history to fit the memories and nostalgia of the people? That's wrong and dishonest, plain and simple.

[jakepled]

The only reason that happened was because the franchise was terrible as the Bobcats. Had they been winning on a consistent basis, this would've never happened.

100% wrong

The Charlotte Bobcats could've won the NBA Championship last year after New Orleans announced they were giving up the Hornets name and people would've showed up at the championship parade decked out in purple & teal while lobbying for a rebrand.

Nobody cared about the Bobcats, because they loved their Hornets. Yeah the Bobcats sucked, but so did a lot of Hornets teams that still led the NBA in attendance. There was never excitement around the Cats, even in '08 when they made the playoffs. Nobody cared. But the day David Stern and the NBA took ownership of New Orleans the city of Charlotte began rallying and protesting that they be given their name back. Ever since last year when Michael Jordan announced the team would rebrand this city has been going crazy with Hornets fever.

NC is one of the biggest basketball hotbeds in the world. This entire region has been a sleeping monster for over a decade. Now that they have their brand back it is awakening.

At today's press conference they announced that Charlotte leads the entire NBA in ticket sales for 2014-15. Over 90% of season ticket holders have already renewed and over 5,000 new season ticket holders have already joined. Additionally, since releasing new Charlotte Hornets merchandize on Jan 17th of this year, Charlotte leads the NBA in merchandize sales.

Charlotte will again lead the NBA in attendance and show that they have the most passionate fan base in the entire country. Unless you're from Charlotte or have lived here during the era you wouldn't understand. This city loves the Hornets. It's one of the most passionate, loyal fan bases in any sport in the entire country.

They led the league in attendance 8 of their first 10 seasons. After Shinn got caught in an abuse scandal, sex scandal, money laundering, & tried holding Charlotte ransom for a new arena they turned on him & he left town with the worst attendance in the entire NBA.

[jakepled]

The history isn't that murky. It's quite simple, actually. The New Orleans history is 2003-present. The Charlotte history is 1988-present and includes all teams that played in Charlotte.

The city of Charlotte led the entire NBA in attendance in '88, '90, '91, '92, '93, '94, '95, '96, as well as finishing 2nd in '88, '97. The Hornets finished 20-62 their inaugural season, but still sold out every single game and led the NBA in attendance. A banner was made that read "Charlotte Hornets 1988-89 NBA Attendance Champion 950,064". They set it up during the summer and allowed season ticket holders to sign it. Then on opening night they honored the fans of Charlotte for their support and raised the banner to the rafters. Why should that banner be hanging in the New Orleans rafters instead of the Charlotte rafters?

The purple/teal Hornets that featured Muggsy, LJ, & Zo never played in New Orleans. The brand that is so popular was exclusive to Charlotte. When they moved to New Orleans the colors were changed to blue & yellow, & they later completely revamped the old logo. Why should purple/teal snapbacks & Larry Johnson jerseys be sold in the New Orleans team store instead of the Charlotte team store?

Bobby Phills died while playing in Charlotte. The next season the team held a special ceremony with his family and hung his jersey in the rafters, permanently retiring his jersey number. He died while playing and living in Charlotte, where his family resides to this day. Why should his banner hang in the New Orleans rafters instead of the Charlotte rafters?

The name "Hornets" has ties to Charlotte dating back to the Revolutionary War in 1780, when a General called Charlotte "a hornets nest of rebellion." From 1892-1936 there was a minor league baseball team in Charlotte nicknamed the Hornets. Why should the Hornets brand be locked away by a franchise that didn't want it in New Orleans instead of returning to a city that truly loves it and has a deep history of meaning with it?

Even the mascot is named after a hurricane that tore thru Charlotte in 1989, during the start of the team's 2nd season. Hugo the Hornet was created and named after history involving Charlotte. Why should that mascot be locked away and unused by New Orleans instead of returning home to Charlotte?

The history being taken from the New Orleans franchise and given to the new Charlotte franchise seems really stupid on the surface. However, when you look at the big picture and everything it means the change makes absolutely perfect sense. It has nothing to do with the actual statistical numbers and records. It is everything else. In order to get all that other stuff that is so deeply tied to Charlotte the stats have to be included in the transfer.

New Orleans fans can keep crying and saying Charlotte stole their name. Sorry folks, it was never your name to begin with.

That's all well and good, except for one simple fact: they're not the same team, period. The original Charlotte Hornets are the Pelicans. The new Hornets are an expansion team. Bobby Phills has no legitimate ties to the former Bobcats. Neither do Muggsy, LJ, and Zo. They have ties to the city, to the memories of the people living there, but as for an actual, concrete connection, there's nothing valid there. Memories are fine, so is nostalgia, so is honoring a legacy. That's what the reclaiming the Hornets name was supposed to be. But twisting and reshaping history to fit the memories and nostalgia of the people? That's wrong and dishonest, plain and simple.

According to the NBA, they are the exact same franchise. Period.

[IceCap]

How mentally challenged are some of you?

You seem to take the cake, champ.

The history isn't that murky. It's quite simple, actually.

Not really.

The name "Hornets" has ties to Charlotte dating back to the Revolutionary War in 1780, when a General called Charlotte "a hornets nest of rebellion." From 1892-1936 there was a minor league baseball team in Charlotte nicknamed the Hornets. Why should the Hornets brand be locked away by a franchise that didn't want it in New Orleans instead of returning to a city that truly loves it and has a deep history of meaning with it?

Do you know who the city of Charlotte is named after? Queen Charlotte, beloved wife of George III, the king the American revolutionaries were revolting against. The city even calls itself "the Queen City" in reference to Queen Charlotte. Your "rah rah Revolutionary War reference rah rah" argument would hold more water if your city didn't keep the name of the wife of the guy the Revolution was waged against.

The city of Charlotte led the entire NBA in attendance in '88, '90, '91, '92, '93, '94, '95, '96, as well as finishing 2nd in '88, '97. The Hornets finished 20-62 their inaugural season, but still sold out every single game and led the NBA in attendance. A banner was made that read "Charlotte Hornets 1988-89 NBA Attendance Champion 950,064". They set it up during the summer and allowed season ticket holders to sign it. Then on opening night they honored the fans of Charlotte for their support and raised the banner to the rafters. Why should that banner be hanging in the New Orleans rafters instead of the Charlotte rafters?

It should hang in New Orleans because it's the New Orleans franchise that achieved that record.

Bobby Phills died while playing in Charlotte. The next season the team held a special ceremony with his family and hung his jersey in the rafters, permanently retiring his jersey number. He died while playing and living in Charlotte, where his family resides to this day. Why should his banner hang in the New Orleans rafters instead of the Charlotte rafters?

Again, because the franchise Bobby Phills played for now resides in New Orleans. He may have played for them while they were located in Charlotte, but the franchise's history should stay with the organization. Which means it should say in New Orleans.

New Orleans fans can keep crying and saying Charlotte stole their name. Sorry folks, it was never your name to begin with.

Actually, it was New Orleans' name. For eight years.

I get it, the new "Hornets" are not the OLD "Hornets". But the history of basketball in Charlotte deserves to stay there.

Anyone who thinks the old Hornets history belongs with the Pelicans has their priorities out of whack.

I don't mean for this to sound insulting, but here's why I disagree. Facts mean things.

Fact is the first Charlotte Hornets franchise moved to New Orleans in 2002, where they currently reside under the name "New Orleans Pelicans." The new Charlotte basketball team can use the old Hornets name. That's fine. Actually re-writing history and ignoring the facts of what happened? Orwellian historical revisionism and blatant disregard to the factual historical record.

According to the NBA, they are the exact same franchise. Period.

And that's what's so bothersome. They're not the same franchise. It's obvious. The NBA is simply re-writing history to say they are. And that's not cool.

[The_Admiral]

I'm at the point where I just don't care. Too old. I see both sides, we smart fans know what's up, but if it seems to bring happiness to people, fine, whatever, let people pretend. Santa Claus makes kids happy, too. World keeps turnin'.

The only sport where I think I have some cut-and-dried stance on all this is baseball, owing to the rareness and magnitude of its franchise relocations (for the most part). I think a team should be entitled to civic history and organizational history. That is to say, the Twins get to honor the Washington Senators' history as part of the franchise, the Nats get to honor the Senators' history as part of Washington [iNDEPENDENT] baseball, and also get to honor the Montreal Expos as part of their franchise. Actually, I would say not "get to," but "should." Now obviously for season-by-season record-keeping, Team X isn't Team Y, but teams like the Brewers should be able to freely refer to Milwaukee Braves achievements as part of a greater shared history without dorks on the internet going NO YOU HAVE NO RIGHT TO CLAIM THE MILWAUKEE BRAVES THEY'RE MINE MINE MINE MINE MINE.

I guess the upshot of this is that the Nationals shouldn't have reinstated the Expos' retired numbers, those rat bastards.