Stadium/Arena Saga Omnibus

[VampyrRabbit]

25 minutes ago, tigerslionspistonshabs said:

Can anyone enlighten on me why we're talking about expansion?  I mean 20 years ago we were talking about contraction. 

Manfred said that expansion wasn't on the cards until the situations with Oakland and Tampa Bay were resolved. Now with the A's heading to Vegas, that's one part done.

[BBTV]

Better than contraction would be "ownership relegation" where the owners of the teams that are consistently uncompetitive and refuse to spend any money are forced to sell.

[kolob]

4 minutes ago, VampyrRabbit said:

Manfred said that expansion wasn't on the cards until the situations with Oakland and Tampa Bay were resolved. Now with the A's heading to Vegas, that's one part done.

 

I haven't heard much out of the Rays outside of the failed TB-Montreal "solution" and sporadic talk about how horrible St. Petersburg is for a ballpark. Is there any talk of relocation outside of the Tampa Bay area?

 

Montreal seems like a logical solution, but Nashville's bid seems strong.

[McCall]

15 minutes ago, kimball said:

 

I haven't heard much out of the Rays outside of the failed TB-Montreal "solution" and sporadic talk about how horrible St. Petersburg is for a ballpark. Is there any talk of relocation outside of the Tampa Bay area?

 

Montreal seems like a logical solution, but Nashville's bid seems strong.

Actually, they're coming along on a plan to build a new one were the Trop currently sits and develop around it... in St. Pete.

 

I mean it's far from a done deal, but that's where the focus seems to be at the moment.

[kolob]

34 minutes ago, McCall said:

Actually, they're coming along on a plan to build a new one were the Trop currently sits and develop around it... in St. Pete.

 

I mean it's far from a done deal, but that's where the focus seems to be at the moment.

 

Huh.

 

This all feels like Oakland 2.0. 

[Burmy]

5 hours ago, kimball said:

 

Huh.

 

This all feels like Oakland 2.0. 

At least the plan there would've seen the A's play at Oracle Park for a couple years while the new park was being built...where would the Rays' temporary home be if this happens?

[Ridleylash]

3 minutes ago, Burmy said:

At least the plan there would've seen the A's play at Oracle Park for a couple years while the new park was being built...where would the Rays' temporary home be if this happens?

Just have them bum with the Marlins, ez /s

[who do you think]

9 hours ago, kimball said:

and sporadic talk about how horrible St. Petersburg is for a ballpark.

 

Less than ideal? Sure. A Glendale/Sunrise situation? Not even close.

 

9 hours ago, kimball said:

Montreal seems like a logical solution,

 

Went poorly last time and nobody important/with money wants to own or build anything MLB-related there.

 

9 hours ago, kimball said:

but Nashville's bid seems strong.

 

Bunch of guys with no money drawing on napkins and making websites.

[TBGKon]

13 hours ago, Burmy said:

At least the plan there would've seen the A's play at Oracle Park for a couple years while the new park was being built...where would the Rays' temporary home be if this happens?

There's room in the parking lot around the Trop to build a new stadium.  If necessary, i could see them extending the lease another year if necessary.  if they can get things rolling in 2024 theres still plenty of time to have a new ballpark ready for opening day 2028.

[LMU]

Everyone forgets that Montreal had three huge issues that killed the Expos outside of the market.

 

1. Olympic Stadium was a pit from the moment it opened in a bad location.

 

2. The fanbase never forgave the league for the 94 strike killing the Expos’ best season in team history.

 

3. Jeffrey Loria.

[DG_YouKnowWhatThatMeans]

28 minutes ago, LMU said:

Jeffrey Loria.

 

Jeffrey Loria actively nuked the Expos. That was a proud franchise that deserved better.

[FiddySicks]

He basically did the same thing with the Marlins, more specifically the city of Miami, too. 
 

Actually the Loria mess has some parallels to the A’s current situation. He couldn’t get the public funding from the city of Montreal, so he just found an even bigger dope in the city of Miami to give him that money. Fisher couldn’t get the money from the city of Oakland, but he found it with Phoenix’s even dopier baby brother. 

[tigerslionspistonshabs]

52 minutes ago, LMU said:

 

 

1. Olympic Stadium was a pit from the moment it opened in a bad location.

 

 

Absolutely. They almost would've been better off renovating/expanding Jarry Park. 

[GDAWG]

There are people locally who want Joe Lacob to buy the A's if Fisher sells.  

[WestCoastBias]

I would love to see Fisher somehow blow this Las Vegas deal and be forced to sell the team. 

 

It seems like a pretty aggressive deadline to try to get $500 million from a state government, especially when there is no guarantee Fisher will actually invest in the team on the field once he gets there. Let's remember this guy has been trying to get a ballpark built for the last 20 years in multiple municipalities and hasn't been able to get it done, and yes not all the blame goes to Fisher but he is the one constant in every negotiation. Joe Lacob, please have your checkbook ready just in case. 

[gosioux76]

8 hours ago, WestCoastBias said:

It seems like a pretty aggressive deadline to try to get $500 million from a state government, especially when there is no guarantee Fisher will actually invest in the team on the field once he gets there. 

 

I don't disagree, but I also think it's helpful to point out here that the A's aren't seeking a straight cash handout from Nevada. The deal is for the state to sell $500M in government bonds, which the team would repay over time from taxes and other revenue tied to the stadium project.

 

So essentially, it's the government using its bonding power to issue the team a loan. 

 

It's risky, considering this is the government putting its credit on the line, but it's far less politically complicated than a direct investment of taxpayer funds

[MJWalker45]

On 4/20/2023 at 7:45 PM, OnWis97 said:

If they get out of Oakland before the Vegas stadium is read, where would they play? I would not think it would be in an outdoor minor-league ballpark in the desert.

What are the chances of them being able to use Allegiant until their stadium is ready? I know the Raiders wouldn't want too many visitors in their new house, but for a one to two year stint it could be useful. 

On 4/21/2023 at 2:14 PM, WestCoastBias said:

 

And not only is Vegas getting the A's but everyone seems content with the Aviators remaining there as well.

 

The area is home to only 2.5 million people, they have NHL, NFL, WNBA, and now MLB. In what world do they need a Triple-A team?? The Aviators play 20 minutes (11 miles) from the property the A's just purchased, I mean c'mon it's just unnecessary.

Would the Aviators really be able to stay though if a MLB team is in the same city? How many of those fans are ditching them for a better class of baseball? Money talks too, and they'll keep the ones that don't want to overpay for the A's, but I think a majority of the fans would switch to the shiny new thing. 

 

On 4/21/2023 at 12:51 PM, OnWis97 said:

I figured they'd avoid the current LV minor league park because of the heat.  Perhaps they'll be playing almost no day games after during the hottest times of the year. (June-Aug???)

They could probably come up with some sort of sun tarping to keep the sun off the players and fans, if it doesn't already exist. I'd agree that any outdoor stadium in LV means no day games from June to the end of August at a minimum. 

[kolob]

13 hours ago, who do you think said:

Less than ideal? Sure. A Glendale/Sunrise situation? Not even close.

 

I get that, but you're also comparing apples to oranges, it different when you're comparing 81 home games to 41.  Plus, I do get the point of St. Pete being on a peninsula that hinders attendance. 

 

 

Based off location it seems easy solution would be a move to Tampa, but what REALLY kills the Rays more than anything is their horrible lease.

 

[kolob]

6 minutes ago, MJWalker45 said:

Would the Aviators really be able to stay though if a MLB team is in the same city? How many of those fans are ditching them for a better class of baseball? Money talks too, and they'll keep the ones that don't want to overpay for the A's, but I think a majority of the fans would switch to the shiny new thing. 

 

You talk like it's an either/or on fandom between the A's and Aviators. They can coexist and I think promotes both clubs well, especially watching players go from the minors to majors.  But, there will always be a market for minor league baseball advertising dollars and companies that are priced out with the big leagues.

[WestCoastBias]

10 minutes ago, MJWalker45 said:

What are the chances of them being able to use Allegiant until their stadium is ready? I know the Raiders wouldn't want too many visitors in their new house, but for a one to two year stint it could be useful. 

 

I'm pretty sure Mark Davis hates Fisher and the A's as they did the Raiders no favors when Davis was trying to get a new stadium at the Coliseum site. 

 

And Allegiant is a football only venue too.