USFL 2023 Season

[Sykotyk]

2 hours ago, Cruhawk7975 said:

 

 Eh, I wouldn't rule out SHI Stadium until we hear something more definitive on that front - they host  Rutgers' Mens/Women's lacrosse teams and have hosted NJ state HS football championships in the past, but I don't think that would preclude the Generals from getting 5 weekend home dates  between April and June - I'm sure Rutgers's Athletic Dept would be open to another revenue stream since they have a substantial debt to pay. 

 

Penn does host the Penn Relays in late April,  but I do think the Stars could work as a tenant there with some flexibility/backloading for their Home Schedule. 

 

My bet is that Fox does not want to abandon 2 of the top 5 US TV markets  that are also located close enough to each other to develop an actual organic rivalry as well, especially since both have multiple venue options on paper.  

 

This is where the league and their TV overlords will differ. The costs in Philly and NJ are obscene compared to Michigan and Ohio. While TV really wants the viewership numbers in those markets.  Remember, USFL is not a big money endeavor. it's basically The Spring League in an edgar suit.

 

Franklin Field is the most likely possible venue for a Philly team. But then will the TV partners want to host games there. How's the lighting? Press facilities? etc.  Subaru definitely exceeds all requirements for TV but USFL still wants butts in seats because they turn into eyeballs on screens to help fuel the TV numbers.

 

For NJ.... Rutgers is by far the most likely possible venue. If this were XFL, I'd say MetLife. But I can imagine that Rutgers being far cheaper and TV just wants the NJ name with NJ fans watching on TV.  It's  a Big Ten venue. It's going to work fine for TV.  Hell, the red/white colors work great for the Generals, as well. Where MetLife will really look like an intruder on foreign lands.

 

2 hours ago, Cruhawk7975 said:

 

TLDR for the below - My 2024 USFL predictions: 

 

- HOU Gamblers either move into Rice Stadium or relocate to Tulsa, OK as the revived "Oklahoma Outlaws" 

 

- NOLA Breakers: 1) Yulman Stadium, or 2) Lower Bowl-only Superdome 

 

- PITT Maulers: 1) Heinz Field  or 2) relocate to Columbus and play at Mapfre Stadium 

 

- PHI Stars: 1) Franklin Field, 2) Subaru Park 

 

- NJ Generals: 1)SHI Stadium , 2) Red Bull Arena

 

I agree with Houston. TV wants the Houston market right now. But there's no way with the XFL existing they're going to compete head to head. Even in a city the size of Houston. Oklahoma is an untapped market but it's horrible for TV. I could definitely see a complete relocation a la TB and go to somewhere like Denver, Phoenix/Tucson, etc. The USFL does want to keep to USFL names/teams history so those two seem likely. The other could be a return to Florida. Maybe TB comes back from Houston?

 

Philly and NJ I detailed above. I agree with both of your assessments.

 

For Pittsburgh... I just don't see Heinz/Acrisure happening. The one major problem and the one the Steelers absolutely hate is that it runs their grass hybrid field. It's not fully grass. There's a plastic mesh infused into the turf that makes upkeep costly and you can't just replant new sod the way other grass fields do. They tolerate the WPIAL finals being played there but charge a fortune. And that's more political pressure as they used the 'community relations' aspect as part of their plea to build a new stadium to replace Three Rivers.

 

The other is that Pittsburgh is not nearly as big as other markets. They have three major league teams and a surprisingly popular Riverhounds though their numbers are small. Additionally, for a city/metro area as small as it is it's surrounded by a lot of other options for minor league sports not too far away. Wheeling has the Nailers (Pens AA affiliate), Altoona has the Curve (Pirates AA affiliate), Johnstown has two teams (baseball Mill Rats and hockey Tomahawks), Youngstown area has two teams (Mahoning Valley Scrappers draft league team and USHL's Phantoms)... And Pitt is right there with all their ACC sports sapping fan dollars and support. Pittsburgh is a tough market. AFL failed there with the Power when they went hard into the black/gold motif and came off as a 'major league' type team.

 

Maulers would be going up against the tail end of a Pens season, the early 'we might still have a good season' Pirates summer, and the all important 'let's save up for Steelers tickets' fans. Steelers have some of the biggest control over their stadium in the NFL. And they really don't want another football team playing there. I just don't see it happening.

 

And the closest venues anywhere near Pittsburgh are high school (Wolvarena in Turtle Creek, Neumann Stadium in Wexford, Wheeling Island Stadium in Wheeling WV, Mihalik-Thompson Stadium at Slippery Rock University, Stambaugh Stadium at Youngstown State, and you could maybe try to argue WVU in Morgantown but that's almost as bad as the Maulers playing in Browns contested territory going into WVU territy for a Pittsburgh named non-Steelers team).

 

I like the idea of the Maulers becoming an Ohio team, but then the black/gold doesn't matter. Mapfre is now Historic Crew Stadium (Mapfre ending their naming rights). And that's definitely a decent venue and perfect size. But Columbus is a ridiculously fickle market. It's taken decades for the Crew and Blue Jackets to establish themselves as an everyday part of the city. If it's not Ohio State it's nothing. Even the Clippers took a shiny new chic stadium for fans to come around.  A minor league football team playing in late spring and summer is just not going to survive there. Unfortunately.

 

Akron/Canton can work but they need to be Ohio or NEO or Canton/Akron labeled, marketed, and themed.  Cleveland isn't happening (not playing at CBS or Progressive, Byers is not capable of hosting a professional team, and that immediately ends any possible options around the city. Best way to describe Canton would be like Winston-Salem NC. Charlotte's the big city in the region. Greensboro (Akron) has a ton of people, some major venues and a better sporting acumen, but Canton/Massillon/Stark County is still a big urban area with a lot of people and a lot of money and a lot of people that travel for sports all around the region. And there is no 'rural' areas from 20 miles west or east of 77, 20 miles south of 30 to the lake, and 20 miles north or south of 76 from Akron to PA. You're constantly minutes from a town and easy access to the cities and major cities in the region. A team could exist anywhere in that area of Ohio and draw

[GDAWG]

4 hours ago, Sykotyk said:

 

This is where the league and their TV overlords will differ. The costs in Philly and NJ are obscene compared to Michigan and Ohio. While TV really wants the viewership numbers in those markets.  Remember, USFL is not a big money endeavor. it's basically The Spring League in an edgar suit.

 

Franklin Field is the most likely possible venue for a Philly team. But then will the TV partners want to host games there. How's the lighting? Press facilities? etc.  Subaru definitely exceeds all requirements for TV but USFL still wants butts in seats because they turn into eyeballs on screens to help fuel the TV numbers.

 

For NJ.... Rutgers is by far the most likely possible venue. If this were XFL, I'd say MetLife. But I can imagine that Rutgers being far cheaper and TV just wants the NJ name with NJ fans watching on TV.  It's  a Big Ten venue. It's going to work fine for TV.  Hell, the red/white colors work great for the Generals, as well. Where MetLife will really look like an intruder on foreign lands.

 

 

I agree with Houston. TV wants the Houston market right now. But there's no way with the XFL existing they're going to compete head to head. Even in a city the size of Houston. Oklahoma is an untapped market but it's horrible for TV. I could definitely see a complete relocation a la TB and go to somewhere like Denver, Phoenix/Tucson, etc. The USFL does want to keep to USFL names/teams history so those two seem likely. The other could be a return to Florida. Maybe TB comes back from Houston?

 

Philly and NJ I detailed above. I agree with both of your assessments.

 

For Pittsburgh... I just don't see Heinz/Acrisure happening. The one major problem and the one the Steelers absolutely hate is that it runs their grass hybrid field. It's not fully grass. There's a plastic mesh infused into the turf that makes upkeep costly and you can't just replant new sod the way other grass fields do. They tolerate the WPIAL finals being played there but charge a fortune. And that's more political pressure as they used the 'community relations' aspect as part of their plea to build a new stadium to replace Three Rivers.

 

The other is that Pittsburgh is not nearly as big as other markets. They have three major league teams and a surprisingly popular Riverhounds though their numbers are small. Additionally, for a city/metro area as small as it is it's surrounded by a lot of other options for minor league sports not too far away. Wheeling has the Nailers (Pens AA affiliate), Altoona has the Curve (Pirates AA affiliate), Johnstown has two teams (baseball Mill Rats and hockey Tomahawks), Youngstown area has two teams (Mahoning Valley Scrappers draft league team and USHL's Phantoms)... And Pitt is right there with all their ACC sports sapping fan dollars and support. Pittsburgh is a tough market. AFL failed there with the Power when they went hard into the black/gold motif and came off as a 'major league' type team.

 

Maulers would be going up against the tail end of a Pens season, the early 'we might still have a good season' Pirates summer, and the all important 'let's save up for Steelers tickets' fans. Steelers have some of the biggest control over their stadium in the NFL. And they really don't want another football team playing there. I just don't see it happening.

 

And the closest venues anywhere near Pittsburgh are high school (Wolvarena in Turtle Creek, Neumann Stadium in Wexford, Wheeling Island Stadium in Wheeling WV, Mihalik-Thompson Stadium at Slippery Rock University, Stambaugh Stadium at Youngstown State, and you could maybe try to argue WVU in Morgantown but that's almost as bad as the Maulers playing in Browns contested territory going into WVU territy for a Pittsburgh named non-Steelers team).

 

I like the idea of the Maulers becoming an Ohio team, but then the black/gold doesn't matter. Mapfre is now Historic Crew Stadium (Mapfre ending their naming rights). And that's definitely a decent venue and perfect size. But Columbus is a ridiculously fickle market. It's taken decades for the Crew and Blue Jackets to establish themselves as an everyday part of the city. If it's not Ohio State it's nothing. Even the Clippers took a shiny new chic stadium for fans to come around.  A minor league football team playing in late spring and summer is just not going to survive there. Unfortunately.

 

Akron/Canton can work but they need to be Ohio or NEO or Canton/Akron labeled, marketed, and themed.  Cleveland isn't happening (not playing at CBS or Progressive, Byers is not capable of hosting a professional team, and that immediately ends any possible options around the city. Best way to describe Canton would be like Winston-Salem NC. Charlotte's the big city in the region. Greensboro (Akron) has a ton of people, some major venues and a better sporting acumen, but Canton/Massillon/Stark County is still a big urban area with a lot of people and a lot of money and a lot of people that travel for sports all around the region. And there is no 'rural' areas from 20 miles west or east of 77, 20 miles south of 30 to the lake, and 20 miles north or south of 76 from Akron to PA. You're constantly minutes from a town and easy access to the cities and major cities in the region. A team could exist anywhere in that area of Ohio and draw

 

TB has really one option, Raymond James Stadium unless they want the Bandits to play at Al Lang Stadium in St. Petersburg, but that only seats 7,500, however that might be enough to sustain, especially if they get 6,000

[McCall]

On 4/17/2023 at 3:04 PM, Sykotyk said:

 

Central Oklahoma in Edmond has a 10k seat stadium. Wonder if some temp bleachers could be brought in to get it up to 15k-20k. Tulsa could be possible and just go with the Oklahoma name and try to draw from the whole state and southwestern Missouri, southeastern Kansas and northwestern Arkansas. Either way, OKC would be the better market, but the stadium limits it. I don't see OU hosting a team. And an 80k stadium is not what any league should want when they're expecting about 20k at best.

Nah, Southwest Missouri would probably be all Battlehawks. They'd possibly draw from right along the border, maybe as far east as Joplin, at best.

[Sodboy13]

Here's a TV ratings breakdown from the first week of XFL + USFL.

 

https://awfulannouncing.com/ratings/usfl-xfl-audience-broadcast-cable-caveats.html

 

USFL drew more eyes, but also had games on free over-the-air TV, which is in more homes than cable/streaming even today.

 

The more important number I see is that, head-to-head in that prime football Sunday afternoon slot, adding the USFL and XFL audiences together basically gets you the 2022 USFL viewership. That suggests a ceiling to me.

[MJWalker45]

12 hours ago, Sykotyk said:

I like the idea of the Maulers becoming an Ohio team, but then the black/gold doesn't matter. Mapfre is now Historic Crew Stadium (Mapfre ending their naming rights). And that's definitely a decent venue and perfect size. But Columbus is a ridiculously fickle market. It's taken decades for the Crew and Blue Jackets to establish themselves as an everyday part of the city. If it's not Ohio State it's nothing. Even the Clippers took a shiny new chic stadium for fans to come around.  A minor league football team playing in late spring and summer is just not going to survive there. Unfortunately.

 

Akron/Canton can work but they need to be Ohio or NEO or Canton/Akron labeled, marketed, and themed. Canton/Massillon/Stark County is still a big urban area with a lot of people and a lot of money and a lot of people that travel for sports all around the region. And there is no 'rural' areas from 20 miles west or east of 77, 20 miles south of 30 to the lake, and 20 miles north or south of 76 from Akron to PA. You're constantly minutes from a town and easy access to the cities and major cities in the region. A team could exist anywhere in that area of Ohio and draw

For the Crew, part of their issues with traction was the previous owner trying to pull a Rachel Phelps, but the new owners are still not hitting all the right notes even when given the playbook ahead of time for how to make the fans sing their tune. Your description of Akron/Canton is spot on. Both are like the middle children between the big kids Cleveland and Cincinnati, and the younger kid Columbus. I think the Maulers could work, but they would have to attach themselves to every other team in the city for months before they first kicked off.  Even for the money that Fox is paying out for spring/summer programming, I don't think you'd see that happen. And if the team stays in Ohio, and Canton is the best place for them anyways, something that fits the old Canton Bulldogs, Jim Thorpe, or the Hall of Fame has to be the new name. They can't stay the Maulers though. 

[TBGKon]

8 hours ago, GDAWG said:

 

TB has really one option, Raymond James Stadium unless they want the Bandits to play at Al Lang Stadium in St. Petersburg, but that only seats 7,500, however that might be enough to sustain, especially if they get 6,000

I think I found out a good reason why we might have seen a Bandits relocation this year.  Between the weekend of April 13-15 (Taylor Swift) and May 20th (Ed Sheeran) the stadium hosted big concerts.  I cant speak for how much time it takes for stage construction and stuff associated but that may have booked up a few available weekends for the USFL.

 

It would be strange, but a return of the Bandits in 2024 if it makes it that far could be an option.

[GDAWG]

2 hours ago, MJWalker45 said:

For the Crew, part of their issues with traction was the previous owner trying to pull a Rachel Phelps, but the new owners are still not hitting all the right notes even when given the playbook ahead of time for how to make the fans sing their tune. Your description of Akron/Canton is spot on. Both are like the middle children between the big kids Cleveland and Cincinnati, and the younger kid Columbus. I think the Maulers could work, but they would have to attach themselves to every other team in the city for months before they first kicked off.  Even for the money that Fox is paying out for spring/summer programming, I don't think you'd see that happen. And if the team stays in Ohio, and Canton is the best place for them anyways, something that fits the old Canton Bulldogs, Jim Thorpe, or the Hall of Fame has to be the new name. They can't stay the Maulers though. 

 

The Crew went from a frat boy (Precourt) to owners who paid a P.O.S Human being a fully guaranteed contract to be their franchise QB for the NFL team that they also own. ...the very same owners who just bought 25% of the Milwaukee Bucks.  

 

Canton could easily embrace their very own USFL team if they were called Canton and not Pittsburgh.

[BBTV]

Watching a minute of a replay of Stars vs Memphis, and they just had a really interesting video replay.  Not only was it cool as hell to hear them talking about it (I guess it was Mike Pererra and the head ref) but apparently they play the whole convo over the stadium PA.

 

I don't know if having the players listening in is the best idea, but conceptually this is absolutely something I'd want in the NFL.  I got to listen to them replay and analyze the play, listen to the questions the ref had for Mike, and what Mike had for the ref, then listen to Mike explain to the ref why there was some complicated situation resulting in a kinda weird all.

 

Kinda curious why the NFL wouldn't go with this (at least for the at-home audience) unless they have something to hide.

 

EDIT: and "Philadelphia's" uniforms should be gold, not yellow.  These uniforms aren't the worst, but could be a lot better.

[Sodboy13]

2 minutes ago, BBTV said:

Watching a minute of a replay of Stars vs Memphis, and they just had a really interesting video replay.  Not only was it cool as hell to hear them talking about it (I guess it was Mike Pererra and the head ref) but apparently they play the whole convo over the stadium PA.

 

I don't know if having the players listening in is the best idea, but conceptually this is absolutely something I'd want in the NFL.  I got to listen to them replay and analyze the play, listen to the questions the ref had for Mike, and what Mike had for the ref, then listen to Mike explain to the ref why there was some complicated situation resulting in a kinda weird all.

 

Kinda curious why the NFL wouldn't go with this (at least for the at-home audience) unless they have something to hide.

This has been the accepted standard for replays in Australia's NRL and AFL for as long as I've watched them, and given how American sports leagues shield their refs and the NFL shields... the shield, I would not be surprised that it doesn't get implemented here as primarily a CYA move.

[Sec19Row53]

11 hours ago, BBTV said:

 

Kinda curious why the NFL wouldn't go with this (at least for the at-home audience) unless they have something to hide.

 

It's way easier to do this when you don't have 8 games all kicking off at 1PM Eastern, and you can devote one person in charge of replay to only one game at a time.

[Ferdinand Cesarano]

On 4/19/2023 at 10:31 PM, BBTV said:

Watching a minute of a replay of Stars vs Memphis, and they just had a really interesting video replay.  Not only was it cool as hell to hear them talking about it (I guess it was Mike Pererra and the head ref)

 

This sure is wonderful.  And the XFL is doing the same thing with Dean Blandino, whose descriptions and explanations are even more thorough than Perrera's.  Also, even when there is no conversation between the referee and Blandino, sometimes the announcers call on Blandino to explain something to them (and to us).

 

 

On 4/19/2023 at 10:31 PM, BBTV said:

apparently they play the whole convo over the stadium PA.

 

Wow.  OK, the XFL is not doing that!

 

 

On 4/19/2023 at 10:36 PM, Sodboy13 said:

This has been the accepted standard for replays in Australia's NRL and AFL for as long as I've watched them

 

The league that started it in the U.S. is another AFL, the Arena Football League.  In that league there was no separate replay official.  The referee himself would go over to the replay screen and ask the truck for various angles, while describing his reasoning for the television audience. 

 

 

This is all very good.  But the only thing that I am uncomfortable with is the limited number of coach's challenges.  Getting the calls right should be a matter of general integrity, not a part of the competition.  But here the philosophical collides with the practical; coach's challenges cannot be totally unlimited, as no one wants a game stopped after every play.  But I don't really like tying it to time-outs.

 

Still, toward the end of the integrity of the officiating, in the XFL, Blandino can overturn any call (or non-call) on his own initiative, without any challenge.  That feels like the right approach. 

 

Also, it's worth noting that in the XFL the coach can be as specific or as general as he wants in the challenge of a non-call.  He can say "face-mask, number 90", or he can say "there was holding somewhere in there".  [Edit: This is wrong.  The coach has to specifiy what he wants the replay official to look for.  I think I heard a sideline comment from St. Louis coach Anthony Becht to the effect that "there has to be something there"; but, by the time he formally put in the challenge, he would have to have refined what exactly he was claiming.]  Indeed, the speculation is that coaches will try to save a time-out so that they can challenge a non-call on the opposition's game-winning touchdown, on the theory that, if you look hard enough, you can call holding on every play.  It will be interesting to see how this plays out during the XFL's final week, the playoffs, and then next season. 

 

Anyway, I know that, practically speaking, we don't want the game to be stopped after every play.  But there is a problem with tying the correctness of the calls to the team's management of timeouts.

 

 

Edited April 23, 2023 by Ferdinand Cesarano
Correction of incorrect assertion.

[BBTV]

28 minutes ago, Sec19Row53 said:

It's way easier to do this when you don't have 8 games all kicking off at 1PM Eastern, and you can devote one person in charge of replay to only one game at a time.

There doesn’t have to be a single person in charge. Just put one “rules expert” in each booth. Pererra and Blandino are obviously the most recognizable and are decent on TV, but just pair them with the A-Teams and hire other guys for the other groups. It shouldn’t be too tough of a role to hire for. 
 

Curious - how does it work now? I don’t think they still watch it themselves in the little booth and make the call themselves, right? Aren’t they in contact with someone? If so, just put those someones on the broadcast (I’m assuming - could be wrong- that there’s not only one or two of them who have to “queue” other reviews while they’re finishing up their current one). 

Doesn’t even need to literally be a guy physically on the broadcast booth. Just show the zoom call or whatever. 

 

[Sec19Row53]

16 minutes ago, BBTV said:

There doesn’t have to be a single person in charge. Just put one “rules expert” in each booth. Pererra and Blandino are obviously the most recognizable and are decent on TV, but just pair them with the A-Teams and hire other guys for the other groups. It shouldn’t be too tough of a role to hire for. 
 

Curious - how does it work now? I don’t think they still watch it themselves in the little booth and make the call themselves, right? Aren’t they in contact with someone? If so, just put those someones on the broadcast (I’m assuming - could be wrong- that there’s not only one or two of them who have to “queue” other reviews while they’re finishing up their current one). 

Doesn’t even need to literally be a guy physically on the broadcast booth. Just show the zoom call or whatever. 

 

It sort of IS one guy in New York, though. that's the problem. They try to run all replay through whoever that one person is at the moment (it was Alberto Riveron for a bit after Blandino left) in hopes of consistency. Assuming that two replays might happen at once, I'm sure there's some confusion and/or group talking that they wouldn't WANT to be heard.

Keep in mind that this is an NFL function, not a TV function. FOX, ESPN, CBS, Amazon don't have their own replay 'decider', they just have their hired guns who say what they THINK the call ought to be.

[gosioux76]

3 hours ago, Ferdinand Cesarano said:

Wow.  OK, the XFL is not doing that!

 

I wonder, though, if broadcasting this ongoing discussion in-stadium wouldn't just become a muffled distraction. The USFL (and most of the XFL), at the moment, doesn't have a full stadium, so I'm sure this projects just fine, but would you even hear this dialogue in a noisier situation like in St. Louis? 

 

It's hard enough to hear an official explain the results of a video review. I'd think the ongoing back-and-forth would get lost.  

[MJWalker45]

3 hours ago, Ferdinand Cesarano said:

Wow.  OK, the XFL is not doing that!

 

I was going to say this. They'll flash the picture of Blandino discussing the call, but they don't include audio. At least that's been the case for Brahmas games. 

[McCall]

4 hours ago, MJWalker45 said:

I was going to say this. They'll flash the picture of Blandino discussing the call, but they don't include audio. At least that's been the case for Brahmas games. 

All games I've seen show him in the control center reviewing the play, with audio, and have audio of the conversations between him and the officials and between all officials on penalty calls.

[MJWalker45]

10 minutes ago, McCall said:

All games I've seen show him in the control center reviewing the play, with audio, and have audio of the conversations between him and the officials and between all officials on penalty calls.

Yup. At the XFL stadiums they aren't posting audio, but they are at USFL stadiums.

[Sodboy13]

Maybe 300 people watching Breakers-Gamblers in Birmingham right now. The rubber's gotta meet the road on teams playing in their actual markets for season three, and as has been discussed here by others, that is going to be an issue for several of these legacy identities.

[GDAWG]

2 hours ago, Sodboy13 said:

Maybe 300 people watching Breakers-Gamblers in Birmingham right now. The rubber's gotta meet the road on teams playing in their actual markets for season three, and as has been discussed here by others, that is going to be an issue for several of these legacy identities.

 

The USFL could have at least tried to get the Breakers to play in Tulane.  I don't even know if it's something they considered.  

[See Red]

That was a really good game that didn't feel like it because there was no crowd.  Bummer because the actual play feels better than the XFL (imo, anyway) and the broadcasts are better but the empty stadiums just kill my interest.