Lights Out Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 To add on to bruschi's point, opponents have only batted .230 against Jimenez over the last four years, including his spectacular 2010 season where they only batted .207 against him. Even in his crappy season this year, his WHIP is only slightly above last year's league average. POTD: 2/4/12 3/4/12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ESTONES6 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 I think some people here are really underrating Jiminez. I do question the deal for the Indians, but it's more where they are as far as being consistently competitive, and competitive this year, and less about Jiminez's talent. I don't think they consistently compete even with him, and so I question why they would mortgage their future. My guess is he won't see the end of his contract in an Indians contract.He might not be an "Ace", but he's pretty :censored:ing close. FIP's the last four years of 3.83, 3.36, 3.10, and 3.54. At least a 4 fWAR player each year (this year he's at 2.4 so far, but that's on track for about 4), with 2 years over 5. He's entering his prime now, and has learned to pitch in a :censored:ing bandbox like Coors, while maintaining excellent ground ball and home run rates.That's all fine and well... but the Indians aren't ready to win now. The offense is... I mean... I don't even know if you can call it an offense. Offenses are required to score runs. They have 4 KEY players starting that just aren't ready to compete... Kipnis, Chissenhall, Santana and LaPorta. Your other major contributors, Choo and Sizemore - who is the most over-rated player of the last 20 years - are both injured. Sorry but, you don't have any shot at winning a World Series... not with the AL East, not with the Rangers, and not with how much better the Tigers got, not with the Phillies, not with the Giants... they just don't have a shot. So why forfeit Pomz, who by all accounts, has number 1 stuff FROM THE LEFT SIDE OF THE RUBBER, and Alex White, who on average teams is a #1 and on good teams is a great #2.The only other lefty the Indians have at this point is David Huff. Sure he looked good in 2 spot starts this season, but the last 3 years he has been shelled. He wasn't even looking like an OK #5 in the AL. If you were to come to me today and say the Indians sent out Alex White, Drew Pomeranz, Jason Donald, and like a Zac McCalister for Ubaldo Jimenez and Hunter Pence... I wouldn't have been smitten by it, but at least I could say they addressed their most pressing need (a right handed stick), and a somewhat weak area in the starting rotation (which would have been taken care of by next year when White and Pomeranz would be in the rotation with Tomlin, Masterson and Carrasco). Honestly, do you think the Rockies came in the collective pants when the Indians said they would give up White and Pomz? I know I would have. SAINT IGNATIUS WILDCATS | CLEVELAND BROWNS | CLEVELAND CAVALIERS | CLEVELAND INDIANS | THE OHIO STATE BUCKEYES Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dexter Morgan Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 What.You wouldn't trade the highly-overrated Phil Hughes and a couple of prospects for King Felix if that was ever a semi-realistic possibility?I said hard pressed. In the end, I'd likely do it for King Felix, Ubaldo absolutely not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BJBerthiaume Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 Michael Bourn is heading to ATL. Now I don't think I can name another player on the 'Stros besides Carlos Lee. What a pathetic team they have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dexter Morgan Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 Michael Bourn is heading to ATL. Now I don't think I can name another player on the 'Stros besides Carlos Lee. What a pathetic team they have.Is Brett Wallace still there? or did he get traded for 12th time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
infrared41 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 On the Indians: We're talking about a team that started out 30-15 and has gone 23-36 after that. Jimenez won't make much of a difference. They're done. Â Â Â Â Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheClevelandHockey Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 On the Indians: We're talking about a team that started out 30-15 and has gone 23-36 after that. Jimenez won't make much of a difference. They're done.Stop it. We're 1.5 games out of 1st. What really gets me is the "great fan" stuff. It's sad to think of our country as a "Steeler Nation", because that would mean that we're a country of near-sighted inbreds from the mountains that can't speak competent English.Let's go Brownies!You mad because the Tribe is stylin' on you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YessSir32 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 Michael Bourn is heading to ATL. Now I don't think I can name another player on the 'Stros besides Carlos Lee. What a pathetic team they have.Is Brett Wallace still there? or did he get traded for 12th time?Wannd Rodriguez, Brett Myers, JA Happ, Bud Norris, Humberto Quintero, Jason Michaels, Matt Downs. Off the top of my head. Detroit Falcons (NABL) | Detroit Gears (UFL) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ESTONES6 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 On the Indians: We're talking about a team that started out 30-15 and has gone 23-36 after that. Jimenez won't make much of a difference. They're done.Stop it. We're 1.5 games out of 1st.Exactly. What people forget is... what if this is 2007 all over again? If I remember correctly, 2007 was a surprise. The team was built to contend in 2008! What happened in 2008? Big fat fail. Sell off the talent, initiate rebuild process. I understand they are trying to NOT repeat 2007 and 2008 but... but 2012 you have a legitimate chance to at least contend in the division. And if Masterson, Pomeranz, and White are my 1-3 with Tomlin and Carraso 4 and 5... I'm in. I'm in 100%.For this trade to be a success, Ubaldo has got to be a dominant #1 starter. Cy-Young caliber player for the next 3 years. Sorry but #3 starter isn't going to cut it. His .500 record isn't going to cut it, either. SAINT IGNATIUS WILDCATS | CLEVELAND BROWNS | CLEVELAND CAVALIERS | CLEVELAND INDIANS | THE OHIO STATE BUCKEYES Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheClevelandHockey Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 On the Indians: We're talking about a team that started out 30-15 and has gone 23-36 after that. Jimenez won't make much of a difference. They're done.Stop it. We're 1.5 games out of 1st.Exactly. What people forget is... what if this is 2007 all over again?What if we were one game away from the World Series? Pinch me. What really gets me is the "great fan" stuff. It's sad to think of our country as a "Steeler Nation", because that would mean that we're a country of near-sighted inbreds from the mountains that can't speak competent English.Let's go Brownies!You mad because the Tribe is stylin' on you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ESTONES6 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 On the Indians: We're talking about a team that started out 30-15 and has gone 23-36 after that. Jimenez won't make much of a difference. They're done.Stop it. We're 1.5 games out of 1st.Exactly. What people forget is... what if this is 2007 all over again?What if we were one game away from the World Series? Pinch me.1 game away from the World Series (based on a fluke, fool's gold season - just like this year) followed by 4 years of terrible baseball? Sorry, I'd rather take chances on TWO young top 40 prospects for the next 4-7 years than ONE big question mark for 3 years. At leas the rebuilding "process" wouldn't be in vain. SAINT IGNATIUS WILDCATS | CLEVELAND BROWNS | CLEVELAND CAVALIERS | CLEVELAND INDIANS | THE OHIO STATE BUCKEYES Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
infrared41 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 On the Indians: We're talking about a team that started out 30-15 and has gone 23-36 after that. Jimenez won't make much of a difference. They're done.Stop it. We're 1.5 games out of 1st.Exactly. What people forget is... what if this is 2007 all over again?What if we were one game away from the World Series? Pinch me.Keep dreaming boys. This team won't finish the season above .500. Â Â Â Â Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 Whatever the Nats do, I do not want them to trade Drew Storen. Unless we get something off the charts good back, DO NOT TRADE STOREN! I dont know much about Denard Span, so I dont want Span for Storen, to me thats too much to give up for him. "I don't understand where you got this idea so deeply ingrained in your head (that this world) is something that you must impress, cause I couldn't care less"http://keepdcunited.org Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dexter Morgan Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 Ken Rosenthal Source: Yankees trying for Astros' Wandy Rodriguez. Somebody give me a run down on this dude. How hard does he throw, what does he throw... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ESTONES6 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 On the Indians: We're talking about a team that started out 30-15 and has gone 23-36 after that. Jimenez won't make much of a difference. They're done.Stop it. We're 1.5 games out of 1st.Exactly. What people forget is... what if this is 2007 all over again?What if we were one game away from the World Series? Pinch me.Keep dreaming boys. This team won't finish the season above .500.Infared... Read my entire comment. When I said 2007... I mean that they caught lightning in a bottle... a fool's gold season. A team that was "built for 2008" and then fell flat on their faces. Had to sell off all the "talent" and begin the 5 year rebuild again.You trade for Ubaldo, and they HAVE to make the playoffs this year or else its a failure. If you keep White and Pomz in your holster... and you don't make the playoffs this year... who cares? You are built for 2012. You have your young guns getting priceless experience... you have a young offense meshing together.Sorry, but I'm sure you remember the 90's when the Indians had offense seeping out of their asses... but couldn't get any pitching to keep them in games. So now we have pitching, we have a bullpen, we don't have offense. So what do they do? They trade away two studs for one question mark in the starting rotation. Sorry... I'm not sold. SAINT IGNATIUS WILDCATS | CLEVELAND BROWNS | CLEVELAND CAVALIERS | CLEVELAND INDIANS | THE OHIO STATE BUCKEYES Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
infrared41 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 On the Indians: We're talking about a team that started out 30-15 and has gone 23-36 after that. Jimenez won't make much of a difference. They're done.Stop it. We're 1.5 games out of 1st.Exactly. What people forget is... what if this is 2007 all over again?What if we were one game away from the World Series? Pinch me.Keep dreaming boys. This team won't finish the season above .500.Infared... Read my entire comment. When I said 2007... I mean that they caught lightning in a bottle... a fool's gold season. A team that was "built for 2008" and then fell flat on their faces. Had to sell off all the "talent" and begin the 5 year rebuild again.You trade for Ubaldo, and they HAVE to make the playoffs this year or else its a failure. If you keep White and Pomz in your holster... and you don't make the playoffs this year... who cares? You are built for 2012. You have your young guns getting priceless experience... you have a young offense meshing together.Sorry, but I'm sure you remember the 90's when the Indians had offense seeping out of their asses... but couldn't get any pitching to keep them in games. So now we have pitching, we have a bullpen, we don't have offense. So what do they do? They trade away two studs for one question mark in the starting rotation. Sorry... I'm not sold.Fair enough. Â Â Â Â Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheClevelandHockey Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 Well I can't fall back onto any other teams, so I'm going to stay behind them. What really gets me is the "great fan" stuff. It's sad to think of our country as a "Steeler Nation", because that would mean that we're a country of near-sighted inbreds from the mountains that can't speak competent English.Let's go Brownies!You mad because the Tribe is stylin' on you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDubK414 Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 If the Astros keep trading guys like this, the line-up card is going to look pretty funky for today's game against the Crew. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJTank Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 Lets face Houston has gotten a problem. www.sportsecyclopedia.com For the best in sports history go to the Sports E-Cyclopedia at http://www.sportsecyclopedia.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mania Posted July 31, 2011 Share Posted July 31, 2011 If the Astros keep trading guys like this, the line-up card is going to look pretty funky for today's game against the Crew.@cfly #Astros lineup: 2B Altuve, SS Barmes, CF Bourgeois, 1B Lee, RF Michaels, LF Martinez, 3B Johnson, C Corporan.That's a line-up that several AAA teams would demolish. Off The Top Rope: A Pro Wrestling Podcast Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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