2011 NFL Season

[rams80]

There is way too much emphasis on winning when determining how good a player is. There are players who everyone calls great and has very mediocre stats, but are considered great because they are "winners" who have "guts". That's absolute bull. Quaterbacks like that aren't winners because they're good. It's because they're team is good. George Blanda is a great example. The guy threw 277 picks, as opposed to 236 touchdowns. That's terrible. The only reason he's in the hall of fame is because his teams won. Put him on a worse team, and those interception numbers increase, and he's not even close to a hall of famer. The only reason I cold see him still being there is because he was a great kicker, but as a QB he was less than stellar. Then you have David Krieg. He put up some great stats, but isn't in the Hall of Fame because he was a "loser". An even better example would be Randall Cunningham. The dude was a monster, but because he mostly played (with some exceptions, like when the Vikings went 15-1) on bad teams, he's not in the hall. There's also John Brodie, who many people have never heard of because his teams mostly sucked. Now, this isn't to say players can't have great stats and win. Look at Payton Manning, Tom Brady, Joe Montana and the such. But SB wins should not a reason to be in the Hall of Fame.

All this text and no mention of Trent Dilfer? GTFO.

/George Blanda was a badass.

I think Joe Namath would be more appropriate. The guy's entire, below-average (at best) career is ignored because of one game in which he barely cracked 200 yards with no touchdowns.

Wow, I knew his stats weren't as good as people say they were, but I just looked the up and DAMN, he had two season where he threw more TD's than INT'sT Definitely a great example of a player who should not be in the hall.

I don't think any real football fan considers Trent Dilfer a great QB. Even people who think stats are for losers can agree that he was a product of a great team, not a great skill set.

You seemed to miss why I invoked Trent Dilfer's name.

[HedleyLamarr]

What cracks me up is that Trent Dilfer is paid by ESPN to critique quarterback play when he sucked his whole career. That's like having Matt Millen grade every team's draft.

How did your NFL career go?

Didn't have one. I also am not paid by ESPN to criticize NFL players after stinking it up on an NFL field for years. Your point?

My point is that he knows what it takes to be successful in the NFL, whereas you don't.

Sure, he pretty much rode his defense to a Super Bowl, but he did perform better in the NFL than you did.

[Lights Out]

But yet at no point did I compare myself to an NFL player. I compared Dilfer to the players he's paid to critique. I know you have some grudge against me from last year's college football thread but your attempts to start with me over nothing never cease to be pathetic.

[The_Admiral]

Dan Marino is one of the greatest quarterbacks ever, and,

[TheOldRoman]

Sure, Dilfer wasn't a good QB, but I dislike him because he stepped into Sean Sallisbury's "blowhard tough-guy :censored:ty QB who calls out other players for not being tough enough" role.

[pmoehrin]

I think Joe Namath would be more appropriate. The guy's entire, below-average (at best) career is ignored because of one game in which he barely cracked 200 yards with no touchdowns.

Compare Namath's numbers to what everyone else was doing around him. If you can throw more TD's then INT's during the 1960's your probably going to the Pro Bowl. Very few teams threw more TD's then INT's. Most it was either less or about a 1:1 ratio.

I think his numbers by today's standards look bad when now passing for 4000 yards is not a big deal anymore and you need to be passing at least 3500 with a 2:1 TD to INT ratio to ensure you will at least have a job the next year. That's just not how it was when Namath played.

The Jets had by far the most aggressive passing attack in football at the time Namath played, and any team like that was going to see alot of INT's.

I view Namath as the Brett Favre of his era.

Overated, perhaps. But at his peak he's hands down better then at least 3/4 of the QB's in the game and argubly even the best depending on what you look for in a QB. I think he's more overated in his leadership abilities which I think were all but non-existent having listened to what players who played for the Jets have said, then what his playing ability was, which I think was stellar at his best. The problem was he came into the league as damaged goods and I think the fame went straight to his head especially after Super Bowl III, both of which I feel contributed greatly to his shortened career.

[HedleyLamarr]

But yet at no point did I compare myself to an NFL player. I compared Dilfer to the players he's paid to critique. I know you have some grudge against me from last year's college football thread but your attempts to start with me over nothing never cease to be pathetic.

There's no grudge. I'm simply pointing out that I trust the word of a guy who's played in the league over the likes of some guy that lives with his parents and has never played in the NFL.

Granted, I rarely watch ESPN, but from what I've seen of Trent Dilfer's opinions, I've agreed with them more often than not. You don't need to be a great player or have a Hall of Fame career to know what it takes to be successful in the NFL.

Bobby Cox had a lousy pro career, but he sure was a damn good manager.

Wayne Gretzky is the best hockey player of all-time, yet was a lousy coach.

[IceCap]

Trent Dilfer's a guy who seems like he knows what he's talking about, and yeah, his less then stellar career really has nothing to do with his abilities as an annalist.

That being said I find the "character" he plays as an annalist to be rather grating. Though I think this falls less on him and more on ESPN.

[thespleenenator]

I think the fame went straight to his head especially after Super Bowl III, both of which I feel contributed greatly to his shortened career.

No, I'm pretty sure that was the alcohol.

As for the whole "His stats were good for his era", let me introduce you to Bart Starr, Roger Staubach, Len Dawson, Sonny Jurgensen, Bob Griese, Fran Tarkenton, Don Meredith, Roman Gariel, and Johnny Unitas, to name a few. They all had much better stats than Namath. That argument is absolute bull.

[Viper]

Philly loses again. Some dream team. And the Giants are on the losing side of a ten point game against Arizona. If that score holds the Redskins will have the lead in the NFC East. That's a division that's looking to give the NFC West a run for its money.

The way that game went, the Iggles must have thought they were the Vikings or something.

Speaking of the NFC North... let's just say Thanksgiving Day can't get here fast enough.

[DCDuck]

Put Joe Namath in any other city and see how far his "chutzpah" takes him. "Broad Street Joe" doesn't have the same ring to it as "Broadway Joe".

Markets matter. Joe Namath was a product of his big mouth and the fact that there was always a camera and a mic there to record what he had to say. Such is the way of playing in New York.

[NJTank]

Heres a question about Thanksgiving with the Lion and Packers being a the prime match up will the Cowboys versus the SuckforLuck Dolphins be played at 1?

[NEW.ERA]

Heres a question about Thanksgiving with the Lion and Packers being a the prime match up will the Cowboys versus the SuckforLuck Dolphins be played at 1?

I doubt it.

Don't mess with tradition. I actually love the early game on US Thanksgiving.

[DCDuck]

Tradition says that the Redskins and Cowboys should be the teams playing on Thanksgiving. That's the way it used to be, before the NFL decided the Cowboys were "America's Team" and that giving them a random game on their schedule was a bigger draw than matching them up against their bitter rivals.

Also "tradition" went out the window once the NFL went to using a bland, sterile-looking logo template for the Super Bowl and Pro Bowl every year.

[pmoehrin]

I think the fame went straight to his head especially after Super Bowl III, both of which I feel contributed greatly to his shortened career.

No, I'm pretty sure that was the alcohol.

As for the whole "His stats were good for his era", let me introduce you to Bart Starr, Roger Staubach, Len Dawson, Sonny Jurgensen, Bob Griese, Fran Tarkenton, Don Meredith, Roman Gariel, and Johnny Unitas, to name a few. They all had much better stats than Namath. That argument is absolute bull.

I'll say Tarkenton, Unitas, Jurgensen, Uniats, Gabriel and Dawson were better.

But Don Meredith who plays all of six years and is never higher then fourth in passing yards? No. Staubach and Griese didnt' have their best years alongside Namath so I'm not going to compare the two in terms of who was better in the 60's. Staubach I'd say was better overall, Griese I'd say is about equal, just because I think the career track is very similar and I don't see a huge difference between the two in terms of passing efficency compared to their eras and I don't regard the passer rating as a good measure of it. It was easier to throw the ball in the 70's then it was in the 60's as well so I don't read too much into the career difference either.

And the argument I was trying to make wasn't so much that I though Namath was one of the all-time best QB's, which I don't think he is, but that he's not a bad QB to have. He was a better then average QB.

I don't think he's the worst QB in the HOF, that's all I say about it on that topic. You want to throw him out, you gotta take some other guys with him as well.

[infrared41]

Wow, Mike Carey is the worst ref in football.

Welcome to the club. I've been watching Cards - Phillies. How many times have Carey and his crew screwed someone in the game?

[NJTank]

Wow, Mike Carey is the worst ref in football.

Welcome to the club. I've been watching Cards - Phillies. How many times have Carey and his crew screwed someone in the game?

Mike Carey likes throwing flags in National Games more face time

[infrared41]

Wow, Mike Carey is the worst ref in football.

Welcome to the club. I've been watching Cards - Phillies. How many times have Carey and his crew screwed someone in the game?

Mike Carey likes throwing flags in National Games more face time

You got that right. Maybe someone should tell him that he doesn't get paid per penalty.

[IceCap]

I believe he operates under the belief that since the universe is infinite every possible outcome of every action is happening somewhere. So he might as well make the calls.

[infrared41]

I believe he operates under the belief that since the universe is infinite every possible outcome of every action is happening somewhere. So he might as well make the calls.

Best theory yet. And it made me laugh. Nice work.