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masterchaoss    89
3 minutes ago, Tracy Jordan said:

 

Including whites? 

 

yes, there are an awful lot of cases of excessive force used by police officers against every race including white people. A lot of people have died in this country because some police officers are too quick to use lethal force when it really isn't necessary, we have a big problem with violent police in this country. 

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Alex Houston    187

Here's a side question in all this: why do we continue to play these anthems in the first place instead of doing team specific songs or chants and dances like the Haka or whatever it was the Iceland soccer team did a while back? I'd fine that way more entertaining and engaging than militaristic pandering.

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Tracy Jordan    89
1 minute ago, masterchaoss said:

yes, there are an awful lot of cases of excessive force used by police officers against every race including white people. A lot of people have died in this country because some police officers are too quick to use lethal force when it really isn't necessary, we have a big problem with violent police in this country. 

 

So it's okay to peacefully protest police violence in this country so long as you don't do it during a football game?

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jmac11281    1,133
14 minutes ago, Alex Houston said:

Here's a side question in all this: why do we continue to play these anthems in the first place instead of doing team specific songs or chants and dances like the Haka or whatever it was the Iceland soccer team did a while back? I'd fine that way more entertaining and engaging than militaristic pandering.

If the below statements are true, blame that on the NFL.

 

 

FB_IMG_1506384193345.jpg

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Rockstar Matt    639

It is true. Before 2009, I only seem to remember teams standing for the national anthem during the Super Bowl and that's it.

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Digby    727
23 minutes ago, Alex Houston said:

Here's a side question in all this: why do we continue to play these anthems in the first place instead of doing team specific songs or chants and dances like the Haka or whatever it was the Iceland soccer team did a while back? I'd fine that way more entertaining and engaging than militaristic pandering.

 

Like so many insufferable things, it began with the 1918 World Series. 

http://www.espn.com/espn/story/_/id/6957582/the-history-national-anthem-sports-espn-magazine

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Red Wolf    854
40 minutes ago, Rockstar Matt said:

You know this whole thing has raised another question for me: when did kneeling become a sign of disrespect?

 

If I remember my history classes correctly, I seem to recall that throughout human history, and in various different cultures, kneeling before something has always been a sign of respect. Isn't that why people kneel during prayer, in the many different forms of religion that still exist today? Or in the sports world, when a player is hurt and unable to get up, players kneel out of respect and not disrespect, correct?

 

I just can't seem to remember when this changed. 

Like most symbols and actions, context matters. I mean, was there a point where you were supposed to kneel or bow for the anthem? As far as I know, it's always been considered a sign of respect to stand during the anthem, so doing the opposite would be disrespectful. 

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Tracy Jordan    89
25 minutes ago, jmac11281 said:

If the below statements are true, blame that on the NFL.

 

 

FB_IMG_1506384193345.jpg

 

Yep. The Department of Defense alone spent over $9 million between 2011-2015 on military tributes. Here's a list of teams that got paid for their "patriotism":

 

Quote

These 10 teams were paid the most for their salutes to the troops:

  1. Atlanta Falcons $879,000
  2. New England Patriots $700,000
  3. Buffalo Bills $650,000
  4. Minnesota Wild $570,000
  5. Baltimore Ravens $534,500
  6. New Orleans Saints $472,875
  7. San Diego Chargers $453,500
  8. Seattle Seahawks $453,500
  9. Atlanta Braves $450,000
  10. Indianapolis Colts $420,000

 

http://deadspin.com/these-teams-earned-the-most-from-the-militarys-paid-pa-1740567338

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Rockstar Matt    639

Jesus this Cowboys team is pathetic. Utterly unimaginative, boring and predictable. 

 

I know it's still early in the season, but this team is clearly not the juggernaut from last year. 

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15 minutes ago, Rockstar Matt said:

Jesus this Cowboys team is pathetic. Utterly unimaginative, boring and predictable. 

 

I know it's still early in the season, butt this team is clearly not the juggernaut from last year. 

 

I know they lost some key defensive players, but the offensive has been quite unimpressive. Early like you said, but I don't think they're winning thirteen games again.

 

EDIT: Oh look, a big run from Elliott. Something's gotta give, right?

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OnWis97    2,309

It's good to see that the Wild have NFL-like marketability.

 

Snopes's take on that is a mixed bag, but it does not appear the 2009 change was as big as that makes it out to be and it does not appear the military paid directly to get players on the field.  But the NFL's connection with the military?  We're all paying for it.  If I were fiscally conservative I'd be fairly pissed.

 

http://www.snopes.com/nfl-sideline-anthem/

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ninersdd    370

Not so bold prediction: Niners beat the Cards next week. SF should be able to wreck their O-line next and AZ doesn't have a QB to dodge his way out of everything like Seattle.

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HedleyLamarr    1,387
8 hours ago, BlueSky said:

Are you watching the games? The Falcons are two plays away from being 1-2.  

Yes.  And I saw a championship-quality team make the play at the end of two games and a 3-0 record in the standings.

 

Never seen a team have to apologize for not winning pretty in an NFL road game before.

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Probably up until I was about 14 years old, I was completely obsessed with football, couldn't get enough of it, and knew every single player even the lineman.

 

Every year since then the NFL just seems to make worse rules, make less sense, and involve more nonsense to make money (like wearing pink for a whole :censored:-sucking month, and other political crap). Plus, games being dictated by the ambiguous interference calls.

 

Im just finding it harder to give a darn about football anymore. As a diehard Eagles fan, I just yelled at my screen for Dak to get in the endzone for fantasy reasons and im starting to care about gambling more than the game itself. 

 

Just felt like getting that off my chest. Its been making me sad.

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Lee Noire    343

I'll address the game first. The Cowboys looked like doo early on, but found their stride and kicked butt. No doubt they were helped out by Arizona shooting themselves in the foot, but that's the game I guess. Great bounce back for my boys.

 

And now the veggies. In regards to football being a safe space or an escape? Sure. I get that, but I also understand that those players are people too. They don't just exist for our entertainment. Many of those players come from places where the reality of what a flawed place America can be is on full display. It's selfish for me to look at those guys and say "stick to sports."

 

I love the Cowboys, but I have issues with Jerry Jones. He is shady, and strikes me as plantation owner-ish. I was surprised he kneeled with the rest of the team. I mean leave it to Jerruh to find a loophole and do it before the anthem, but still. It doesn't go unappreciated by me. It does bring me to my older point of the message being muddled though. Jones only did this to save his wallet and avoid controversy. I don't believe he cares all that much about police brutality or racial injustice. But he did something and I didn't think he would. I'm Torn.

 

One thing I'm not torn on is the disrespect of the flag argument. It's BS. The Cowboys demonstrated before the flag was even on the field and the crowd still boo'd. "Real patriots" on twitter still disowned the team and threw away their jerseys. People were pissed that Jerry didn't live up to that fake statement about firing players and kneeled because he was weak. Why? They didn't disrespect the flag. That tells me a lot about where we are really. What the issue REALLY is and it makes Kaepernick's initial kneel mean all the more.

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Magnus    243

Uh oh. Politics thread Part Deux? ;)

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Bucfan56    3,857

Some of you may know this, but Colin Kaepernick is one of my absolute favorite athletes of all time. I've been a Colin Kaepernick fan for a little short of a decade now and I've seen a TON of ups and downs with his career on the field both at Nevada and with the 49ers. I'll admit that I was pretty taken aback when this whole thing started last year, and at first I cringed a bit seeing it. Not because I necessarily disagreed with it or anything, but because it was such a ballsy, divisive move that was sure to piss off so many people. A lot of people already seemed to hate the guy for whatever reason (He's different, a "flash in the pan", his perceived "disrespect" which I found completely unfounded, even before the anthem protest), and it was a move that I knew was going to magnify a lot of that to a CRAZY amount. I've never stopped supporting the guy or what he stands for, but I'll say it did get harder because it added SO much to it that I never really expected to be there. I definitely kinda got a bit more quiet about that support, and again not because I don't like what he's doing, but mostly to avoid conflict with people who were/are SO absolutely hellbent on hating him. It kinda leaves you in a weird place as a fan because it became so much bigger than just football. It caught me off guard because I NEVER expected that to happen. 

 

To see him go from the first start vs Boise State and all the college success, to the Super Bowl and other success with the Niners was so freakin cool. Then to see the on the field decline after that, and all the hatred he's gotten for his stance has been a lot of the opposite. It's been really sad to see, almost at a weirdly personal level to me. To see it all culminate in this past weekend the way it did is kinda hard for me to wrap my head around. But it is truly incredible to witness. About the time Kaepernick was really breaking out in the NFL was around the same time I was taking a sports history class at ASU that discussed the 1968 Olympic Protest, and Tommie Smith and John Carlos' part in that. It was fascinating to me because these two guys who now have statues up in their honor for defending civil rights were absolutely HATED at the time for doing so. Seeing this Kaepernick issue feels pretty profound because I feel like I've gotten a glimpse into this growing historical figure, and instead of reading about it after the fact, I got to see a lot of it unfold at a really close level in real time.

 

I love history to the point that I decided to spent countless hours and way too much money earning a degree in the subject, despite the fact that the job prospects it opened me up to were kinda foolishly limited. Sometimes I wonder if I was stupid for doing so. Stuff like this, though, reminds me why I did it in the first place. 

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leopard88    1,030
On 9/25/2017 at 8:12 PM, Digby said:

 

Like so many insufferable things, it began with the 1918 World Series. 

http://www.espn.com/espn/story/_/id/6957582/the-history-national-anthem-sports-espn-magazine

 

. . . and "The Star Spangled Banner" wasn't even the National Anthem then.  It wasn't officially adopted until 1931.

 

On 9/25/2017 at 7:20 PM, Tracy Jordan said:

Never forget the greatest premature TD celebration of all-time ...

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fN9bDZ4ej_w

 

 

Leon Lett says hello.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NTeqQY_T2mE

 

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BlueSky    342
14 hours ago, CS85 said:

 

A vote out of spite/contempt/disdain is still a vote.  Write-in, 3rd party, or outright abstention were options. 

 

 

Some choose to cast a wasted vote so they'll feel better, and I respect their choice. I looked at it as two equally unappealing options. If I'm unable to choose based on the candidates, the logical choice is to choose the party that best reflects my views. I'm sure you respect that even if you don't agree. Right? :P

 

14 hours ago, rams80 said:

 

So they chose instead to vote for the guy whose campaign involved enabling white supremacists.  You vote for the guy, you own the platform, congrats.

 

A ridiculous concept. Few even agree with all of any candidate's positions or views. Using the same logic, Hillary supporters would "own" an impressively long laundry list of unpleasantries. 

 

Spewing absurdities because something didn't go your way. Hmmm, you and Trump may have more in common than you realize.

 

12 hours ago, masterchaoss said:

yes, there are an awful lot of cases of excessive force used by police officers against every race including white people. A lot of people have died in this country because some police officers are too quick to use lethal force when it really isn't necessary, we have a big problem with violent police in this country. 

 

Do we? Let me start by saying every officer should be held accountable for his or her actions, and prosecuted where warranted.

 

I'm questioning your "big problem" and "awful lot of cases." Again, one is too many, but what are the numbers as a percentage of all interactions between police and citizens? I ask this because I worked in a metro Atlanta department for 8 years. There were 100 or so officers (I was in communications) and in those 8 years, I recall a handful of complaints but they were general gripes, not excessive force. The most violent outcome we had was an officer shot multiple times by a nut he pulled over for an expired plate. 

 

Accountability and transparency are essential. Equally so is the realization that the large, large majority of police in this country are professionals who follow the law and the rules, and reality is not even close to what many think it is. 

 

8 hours ago, Lenny Dykstra said:

Probably up until I was about 14 years old, I was completely obsessed with football, couldn't get enough of it, and knew every single player even the lineman.

 

Every year since then the NFL just seems to make worse rules, make less sense, and involve more nonsense to make money (like wearing pink for a whole :censored:-sucking month, and other political crap). Plus, games being dictated by the ambiguous interference calls.

 

Im just finding it harder to give a darn about football anymore. As a diehard Eagles fan, I just yelled at my screen for Dak to get in the endzone for fantasy reasons and im starting to care about gambling more than the game itself. 

 

Just felt like getting that off my chest. Its been making me sad.

 

Agree. 

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